President Obama: Offshoring Fears Are Outdated, Unwarranted

[durkermaker]

this is a relief, I had been worried about this. And I'm glad he's addressing the worries of Indian outsourcers, I had been concerned about them

President Obama: Offshoring Fears Are Outdated, Unwarranted
By John Ribeiro, IDG News Nov 6, 2010 10:20 am
The perception that Indian call centers and back office operations cost U.S. jobs is an old stereotype that ignores today's reality that two-way trade between the U.S. and India is helping create jobs and raise the standard of living in both countries, U.S. President Barack Obama told a gathering of business executives in Mumbai on Saturday.

President Obama's remarks come after some moves in the U.S. that had Indian outsourcers worried that the U.S. may get protectionist in the wake of job losses in the country. The state of Ohio, for example, banned earlier this year the expenditure of public funds for offshore purposes.

http://www.pcworld.com/article/209970/president_obama_offshoring_fears_are_outdated_unwarranted.html

[TheKentuckian]

1. Free traders are traitors!

[pampango]

17. Then Europe is loaded with traitors (though progressive ones) to their own countries.

They do a lot more "free trade" than we do and their countries are much more progressive and provide better lives to the middle and working classes than the US does.

Also, are white Americans traitors to their race if they "trade freely" with African Americans or Asian Americans or Hispanic Americans? Are straight American males traitors to their own gender or sexual persuasion if they "trade freely" with female or gay Americans?

The answer to all those is, of course, "NO". (200 years ago - or much more recently depending on the "ism" and "phobia" - most Americans would probably have answered "Yes".) The reason is that we now understand (at least liberals do) that racism, sexism, and homophobia are "natural" or valid reasons to divide people into "us" and "them" camps and to discriminate in terms of how we treat them.

Unfortunately, nationalism is one "ism" that is doing just fine, thank you very much, even today in dividing people into "us vs. them" groups and justifying differential treatment for the "thems". Europe has begun to de-emphasize nationalism (undoubtedly because they have plenty of first hand experience with what hyper-nationalism can do) and have opened their trade and immigration borders to each other.

[TheKentuckian]

58. You subscribe to destroying American wages and leaving millions without a way to earn income?

Proud to be an economic nationalist. Trading to each other in Europe is not free trade but fair trade. You are talking about a reasonably equal standard of living from country to country, fairly similar to our states.

If you're talking setting up job funnels to countries with slave wages and little regulation to protect the environment and workers then they are traitors to their people.


We cannot compete with people making a dollar a day where they can just dump their industrial waste in the nearest river and why in the world would we desire too?

Take your neoliberal sell out of your countrymen to the devil. Nothing wrong with a reasonable exchange but what you call for in even more poverty.

Why do you wish for most Americans to be on the streets?

[Starry Messenger]

61. +100,000

[Webster Green]

2. "Old stereotype"?

What a load of crap.

Jeezus, we're fucked. This prez is another corporate tool.

Smooth talker though. :banghead:

[elehhhhna]

50. cliches are cliches because they're oft repeated TRUTH.

Helloooooobama?!! Who writes your speeches?

[Name removed]

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[Name removed]

4. Deleted message

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[Deep13]

5. Sounds like Bill Clinton is back in the WH. nt

[The Backlash Cometh]

16. Yup.

They are going to rip him a new one in the next election. You know, that talk about hispanics taking over their jobs was not far from the truth. In California you have Mexicans to do landscaping and yard work. In Florida, where the education level is crap, blue collar workers depend on lawn work for their livelihood. They own their own hitches and riding mowers. On Thursdays, especially when the rest of the week has been rained out, you can see them all come out to knock out the yards. Each one operates with the same equipment. It's a business industry.

So, Obama is very wrong if he thinks that low level jobs, like call centers, are not desired by Americans.

I think this is why we lost Jacksonville in the Florida elections. I have a friend who lives there. Very blue collar. She is a Democrat but as long as I've known her she has dated rednecks so our relationship has periods where I don't get to see her at all. Anyway, she said she liked Jacksonville better than Orlando because there was lots to do for people who don't have money. She says there are a lot of free concerts to go to and these free concerts are what? Country. Guess what she's hearing for free? Right-wing propaganda.

The irony of all this is that she doesn't particularly like the Central Florida area because the upscale areas are trying to get rid of people like her. They don't appreciate blue-collar workers. It's an irony because it's an upscale Republican City she use to live in that began to make City ordinances that made it harder for blue collar workers to stick around.

So there you have it. The people that these blue collar workers blame for their lack of jobs are Democrats and minorities, even though it's the Republicans and their high and falooting ideals that are making it difficult for them to make ends meet.

If the Democrats can't wrap their minds around this disconnect before the next election, we are lost.

[NCarolinawoman]

52. Except Bill Clinton raised taxes on the rich.

As I remember, Al Gore broke the 50/50 tie. And Bill Clinton appointed a REAL bonafide environmentalist to be Secretary of the Interior.

As regards to outsourcing, you are absolutely right!

[ProSense]

6. It's fun to keep pushing the same propaganda over and over

but in context that is not what the President said.

[jaxx]

8. I wondered why there were no direct quotes in the OP piece.

Looks like the author could only try to spin the words hoping no one would check the real speech. And then it appears on DU as fact. (facepalm)

Thanks for setting it straight.

[earthside]

11. That's exactly what he said.

He mentioned outsourcing and "call centers" in one paragraph and dismissed it as stereotype and caricature.

The rest of the speech is boilerplate "free trade" is great stuff.

Let's all get real here and admit the truth: Barack Obama is a neo-liberal globalist.

[ProSense]

14. No, it isn't

but that's not going to stop the madness.

[dixiegrrrrl]

18. This is what he said. Judge for yourself:

"I realize that for some, this truth may not be readily apparent. I want to be honest. There are many Americans whose only experience with trade and globalization has been a shuttered factory or a job that was shipped overseas. And there still exists a caricature of India as a land of call centers and back offices that cost American jobs. That's a real perception. Here in India, I know that many still see the arrival of American companies and products as a threat to small shopkeepers and to India’s ancient and proud culture.

But these old stereotypes, these old concerns ignore today’s reality: In 2010, trade between our countries is not just a one-way street of American jobs and companies moving to India. It is a dynamic, two-way relationship that is creating jobs, growth, and higher living standards in both our countries. And that is the truth."

http://www.america.gov/st/texttrans-english/2010/November/20101106110917yggep0.0873791.html?CP.rss=true#ixzz14ZPpId4I

[ProSense]

23. I posted the link to his comments

I read them, and in context the OP is spin: "President Obama: Offshoring Fears Are Outdated, Unwarranted"

The President:

"I realize that for some, this truth may not be readily apparent. I want to be honest. There are many Americans whose only experience with trade and globalization has been a shuttered factory or a job that was shipped overseas. And there still exists a caricature of India as a land of call centers and back offices that cost American jobs. That's a real perception. Here in India, I know that many still see the arrival of American companies and products as a threat to small shopkeepers and to India’s ancient and proud culture.

But these old stereotypes, these old concerns ignore today’s reality: In 2010, trade between our countries is not just a one-way street of American jobs and companies moving to India. It is a dynamic, two-way relationship that is creating jobs, growth, and higher living standards in both our countries. And that is the truth."

He said nothing about them being unwarranted or untrue. He made a statement that the stereotypes ignore reality. He said nothing about offshoring not being a problem or a fear.

The President signed a bill increasing taxes on multi-national corporations this summer. He spent the campaign slamming the Chamber of Commerce on the issue.

The OP is spin, but like I said, the facts don't matter.

[treestar]

What fascinates me about that

In India it is a threat to small shopkeepers. The perception in the US is of the Indians gleefully "stealing our jobs" but they may not be so happy with it either.

[durkermaker]

48. US/India trade helps some castes, severely harms others

just like it does in the USA

[chimpymustgo]

64. I'm afraid our President is full of shit: "It is a dynamic, two-way relationship that is creating

"...jobs, growth, and higher living standards in both our countries. And that is the truth."


OMG.

[EOTE]

19. You could have provided the quote yourself.

And then you'd see that's exactly what he said. But I'm happy to provide it for you:

I realize that for some, this truth may not be readily apparent. I want to be honest. There are many Americans whose only experience with trade and globalization has been a shuttered factory or a job that was shipped overseas. And there still exists a caricature of India as a land of call centers and back offices that cost American jobs. That's a real perception. Here in India, I know that many still see the arrival of American companies and products as a threat to small shopkeepers and to India’s ancient and proud culture.

But these old stereotypes, these old concerns ignore today’s reality: In 2010, trade between our countries is not just a one-way street of American jobs and companies moving to India. It is a dynamic, two-way relationship that is creating jobs, growth, and higher living standards in both our countries. And that is the truth. (Applause.)

[Lasher]

21. It is not a direct quote.

But it is a fair characterization of what he said. Obama is a neoliberal free trade proponent. Consider his highly predictable promotion of yet another free trade agreement, this one with South Korea - in preparation for a big push for Congressional ratification when he arrives in Seoul:

Obama Presses to Complete Free-Trade Deal With South Korea

November 8, 2010

WASHINGTON — The White House is intensifying negotiations with South Korea on revising a free-trade agreement negotiated by the Bush administration, even though the accord still faces opposition from Democratic politicians, labor unions and the Ford Motor Company.

The agreement was signed in 2007 but requires approval by Congress, where Democrats have said they will not support it unless barriers to American exports of automobiles and beef are further reduced.

On Monday, the United States trade representative, Ron Kirk, and his Korean counterpart, Kim Jong-hoon, met in Seoul, where their aides have been in face-to-face talks since last week.

<snip>

“Hopefully, by the time he comes we will have an agreement,” Mr. Lee said in an interview Saturday in Seoul. “We will send a very powerful and strong message about maintaining open markets and resist the trend toward protectionism.”

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/11/09/business/global/09trade.html?partner=rss&emc=rss

[Name removed]

32. Deleted message

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[JTFrog]

38. Wanna try that in long hand?

[laughingliberal]

41. Little Blue Linky/Didn't Follow. nt

[Smashcut]

55. I just read it and that is EXACTLY what he said

He said that the idea of Indian call centers and back-office operations killiing US jobs was a "caricature" and that in truth expansion of "free trade" was creating jobs for both countries.

[The2ndWheel]

7. Step into the office of Arthur Jensen

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3BVqIjKyJh0

[Urban Prairie]

9. Two way trade?!?

Yeah, "some" companies have sprung up here over the past decade to help US businesses who wish to outsource their employment, by assisting in the transition from using American employees to employing those from and within India, but our part of the "two way trade" mostly and certainly involves trading our jobs. Obviously Obama has no interest in fair trade as opposed to free trade, so the US will continue to hemmorhage jobs unabated.

[TexasObserver]

10. It's tragic, but the president has almost no understanding of economics.

That's why he's been so easily led around by the free traders.

A week after the election and he thinks he's got to get closer to the side that thoroughly kicked his ass last week. They have controlled the dialogue since he took office, and now he's virtually abdicating.

Unless things change soon, count me in for the primary fight in 2012. I would never have supported him if I had known he was going to be so easily duped by the right.

[EOTE]

20. I think you give him too much credit if you think he's dense on economic issues.

Regardless of what you think about Obama's intentions, he's a pretty brilliant man. To say that he says these things out of ignorance ignores the reality. He's smart enough to know that he's spewing things that no decent economist would acknowledge as truth.

[TexasObserver]

24. I don't think he's dense. I think he's ignorant.

Sorry, but there's been almost nothing he's done the past two years to indicate he really understands economics at all. He's smart, but many people who don't understand economics are smart. Why do you think they rode their 401Ks down from 14k to 7k?

Instead of listening to people like Krugman, he listened to people like Geithner. Instead of pushing through a second stim package and a new jobs program, he had a Cat Food Commission. He failed to take the only actions that might have helped abate unemployment.

I'm done making excuses for him. His lack of empathy for the unemployed and underemployed is pathetic. He's completely forgotten who elected him, and that's why he was repudiated at the polls last week.

[durkermaker]

26. his lack of empathy for unemployed and underemployed is stunning

it's like anyone hurt by outsourcing is an 'unperson' to him

the social transformation of tech workers in the last 12 years has been breathtaking

countless lives ruined by never ending lies, the reality of what's happening never acknowledged

straight out of Orwell or Kafka's "The Metamorphosis", severely punished and shunned for some sin that's never really described or mentioned

[EOTE]

28. Then I don't think you really understand him.

You won't find too many dense people who become the President of the Harvard Law Review at 28 years old. You're done making excuses for him? Saying that he doesn't understand economics is doing exactly that. I'm quite certain that in Obama's heart of hearts, he knows that people like Krugman have been proven right and are currently right about the state of the economy and what needs to be done to save the middle class. If that's where his priorities were, that's exactly what he'd be doing. Sadly, that's not where his priorities are.

[TexasObserver]

35. I don't think you understand him at all.

Frankly, the whole "President of the Harvard Law Review" meme is overdone.

Alberto Gonzalez graduated from Harvard Law School. George W. Bush got a Masters from Harvard.

There are many, many law reviewers in law school who don't have enough economic sense to understand the interplay of government spending and job creation.

He gives a good speech. He was great at stoking hopes and dreams, but since taking office, he's been the worst Democratic president in over 100 years, partly because he has no concept of how to created jobs. He started the process with a stim package, but caved in to the right on demands for deficit reduction study.

[EOTE]

37. Alberto Gonzalez is a very smart man. Bush had family connections.

That pretty much guaranteed he'd get his masters. The problem is that being smart and having good intentions are two very different things. There are a lot of very smart people running some very shady corporations in this country. I wouldn't want any of them to become President.

[TexasObserver]

40. Alberto Gonzalez is not a smart man.

He's a joke and always has been. He's been grossly incompetent in every job he's held.

He makes Clarence Thomas look like Learned Hand.

[EOTE]

44. He's an awful person, for sure.

But I can't call him stupid. Incompetence is in the eye of the beholder. The Bush administration got exactly what they wanted from him. And plausible deniability has kept him from seeing the inside of a prison cell.

[TexasObserver]

47. I've watched him throughout his legal career.

He's been in over his head from day one.

His main claim to fame was being GWB's personal valet. That's what got him all of his government positions.

[w4rma]

67. I'm have come to terms with the fact that Obama is a *very* good liar. (nt)

[durkermaker]

22. oh, i think he understands it pretty well

if you put it in context of who he works for

[treestar]

39. The message from that election would have to be the country

does not want progressive things - can't see how the first sentence of your second paragraph makes any sense.

I think it likely he knows more than most DUers. To me there is too much panic over outsourcing - it existed before unemployment was high. It's likely much more complicated than a few internet posters claiming they "lost their job to India" and never got another one.

[TexasObserver]

43. The message was "don't sell me on one thing and then fail to deliver."

He lost last week because unemployment was so high all year long.

He failed to deliver a second stim package or a new jobs program. He stepped into the sucker punch of "deficit reduction" just when leadership dictated he increase spending.

Outsourcing is one cause of unemployment.

[Octafish]

12. No jobs left to outsource.

Inside Job: Film Brings Us Face to Face with the People Who Nearly Destroyed Our Economy

[OHdem10]

13. No disrespect, Mr President but that line is so 1980s. NO FEAR

NO FEAR NO FEAR.

Now we know the truth and economists are now
willing to say it .

The way our Trade Agreements are written and not
enforced does help business but has not helped
main street.

Mr President that was President Clinton's line
when he signed the Nafta Deal. Like it or
not Nafta lost us Ohio. Ohio sent Free Traders
to DC this time and put a FreeTrader as Governor.
They were able to strike back and convince
the public that there is no difference in
the parties on Trade after all Bill Clinton
promoted and signed Nafta. What a Legacy.

It just might be more believeable to admit
the Business and Corporate Control is so
great that we just better suck up on Free Trade.

[GSLevel9]

15. He knows who butters his bread. Nt

[durkermaker]

25. Americans pay a fortune for defense, yet the middle and working classes are 100% defenseless

in terms of their interests

[Name removed]

27. Deleted message

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[pampango]

30. True, but is that due to trade or to our regressive taxes, shredded safety net, weakened unions,

pathetic health care system and deregulation of markets and the financial industry. If anyone wants to blame all of our problems on trade, they haven't looked around the world and seen how progressive countries handle their affairs.

[laughingliberal]

33. All of the above. nt

[durkermaker]

53. unions are not weakened

they've been completely shreaded into nonexistence, in terms of the average american worker

[bvar22]

29. And people say the Democrats are Anti-Religion.

Belief in a Giant Invisible Hand IS a religion.


All HAIL the Invisible Hand!!!
The Giant Invisible Hand will save us ALL!
Must NOT make the Giant Invisible Hand Angry!
MUST sacrifice the Working Class.
The Invisible Hand DEMANDS it!
All must Bow before the Giant Invisible Hand!!!

If you Work for a Living, do NOT trust ANY politician who expresses a belief in a Giant "Invisible Hand" or a "Free Market".
Neither exists, and that politician is NOT your friend.

[laughingliberal]

42. +1000 nt

[kentuck]

31. What do we have to export to India?

That they don't already have?

Jobs?

[elocs]

34. A thread from Saturday morning that can still be kicked:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x9498978

[brentspeak]

36. Obama apparently has a pathological desire to lose reelection n/t

[Jim Sagle]

46. Nothing pathological about it. Once he leaves politics, he lands a well-paid gig at a bank or an

insurance company. One term is better than two because he gets paid four years sooner.

[fascisthunter]

45. thanks for selling us short

what a bunch of BS...

[durkermaker]

49. well, you have to admit, this is 'change'

they've never been so open about outsourcing jobs

you know what i think would help? giving wall street a lot more free money

[durkermaker]

51. interesting that his pro-outsourcing positions come out AFTER the election

just a coincidence, i'm sure

[Skittles]

63. actually

his cluelessness regarding offshoring has been witnessed a few times

[durkermaker]

54. after years of lying about h-1b visa's role in outsourcing, now that the link is proven

we're told 'well, outsourcing is GOOD!'

h-1b visa and outsourcing

lies from beginning to end

that's one of the things that bugs me the most about this topic, the point of view that it's ok to take everything someone has with lies

i always want to say 'if what you've done is justified, then why the lies?'

[thereismore]

56. Oh? nt

[Newsjock]

57. 'Name removed' sure has a lot to say about outsourcing!

I see him/her/it in abundance every time the topic comes up.

Even if the "offshoring fears" were "outdated, unwarranted," they are REAL, and Mr. Obama is demonstrating a shocking insensitivity by not acknowledging what many average Americans have seen happen to so many jobs.

[OhioChick]

59. 100% in Agreement. n/t

[MisterP]

60. quick! let's all go to wtfhasobamadone and suckle on the teat of the Eternal Sunshine of small

(or fabricated/wildly misrepresented) positive news: we don't need to look at bigger issues if they reflect badly on the President

[Skittles]

62. he needs to spend one night working with me

and experience for himself the humiliation of seeing good people laid off and having to train their nitwit replacements; he needs to talk to the millions of people laid off because of offshoring, and the millions who work daily wondering when it's their job next

[w4rma]

65. I voted against this shit in the primary when I voted against Hillary. (nt)

[durkermaker]

68. the powers that be guarantee that you're always voting for what you're voting against

no matter who you vote for or against

in the wide open priaries in both parties in 2008, you had your choice of a globaist, a globalist, a globalist, a globalist, a globalist, a globalist, or a globalist. Take your pick - it's YOUR choice!


they make their own luck, and they always win

[KharmaTrain]

66. Welcome To The Global Economy...

The horse is long out of the barn...sadly. Most American corporations are multinational now and they'll go wherever the resources are the chepest. Try to put protections on them and they'll find ways around it. Try to tax them and they'll find an offshore haven. The days of the old steel mill and heavy manufacturing have long passed. Their problem is eventually the wage scales will catch up with them. As these third world countries become more prosperous their workers will be wanting and earning more...becoming consumers as well and the multinationals will move on to where their costs are the cheapest.

This country needs to re-invent itself...using green technology and rebuilding infrastructure as a start. Sadly the unions were asleep at the switch when it mattered most.