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seafan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 02:29 PM
Original message
We are repeatedly asked to believe that this administration's rhetoric will match its actions.
Edited on Thu Nov-11-10 02:37 PM by seafan
When it was Summer of 2009, we were asked to believe that this administration's rhetoric would match its actions.




Obama still wants public option for health, September 7, 2010


.....Obama's speech came two days before he is scheduled to address a joint session of Congress on the progress of health care reform, where he is expected to state his bottom-line position on the issue that has led to multimillion ad campaigns for and against and a summer full of public forums. Members of Congress have gotten an earful from those who oppose Obama's call for a government-run alternative to private health insurance.

The president, though, didn't entirely tip his hand on what he will say.

"I want you all to tune in," Obama said, drawing a laugh from the crowd.

But Obama reiterated some core principles of reform in which people wouldn't lose health insurance if they lost their jobs, where there is a cap on out-of-pocket expenses and where people would not be denied coverage because of a pre-existing medical condition.

And he made it clear that he still believes in the "government option."

"And I continue to believe that a public option within the basket of insurance choices would help improve quality and bring down costs," he said.




When this was fresh in our minds:


Senator Max Baucus during health care hearings: 'We Need More Police.', May, 2009

(as discussed near the end of this entry)


.....“There may come a time when we can push for single-payer,” (Max Baucus) said in February. “At this time, it’s not going to get to first base in Congress.”

And helping it not to get to first base was… Max Baucus. It was Baucus’ own committee that held the first round-table discussions on reform. In three days of hearings last May, he invited no fewer than 41 people to speak. The list featured all the usual industry hacks, including big insurers like America’s Health Insurance Plans (AHIP), Blue Cross and Aetna. It’s worth noting that several of the organizations invited—including AHIP and Amgen—employ several former Baucus staffers as lobbyists, including two of his ex-chiefs of staff.

Not one of the 41 witnesses, however, was in favor of single-payer—even though eliminating the insurance companies enjoys broad public support. Leading advocates of single-payer, including doctors from the Physicians for a National Health Program, implored Baucus to allow them to testify. When he refused, a group of eight single-payer activists, including three doctors, stood up during the hearings and asked to be included in the discussion. One of the all-time classic moments in the health care reform movement came when the second protester to stand up, Katie Robbins of Health Care Now, declared, “We need single-payer health care!”

To which Baucus, who looked genuinely frightened, replied, “We need more police!” The eight protesters were led away in handcuffs and spent about seven hours in jail. “It’s funny, the policemen were all telling us their horror stories about health care,” recalls Dr. Margaret Flowers, one of the physicians who was jailed. “One was telling us about his mother who was 62 and lost her job and was uninsured, waiting to get Medicare when she was 65.” The protesters were sentenced to six months’ probation. Baucus later met with them and conceded that not including single-payer advocates in the discussion had been a mistake, although it was “too late” to change that.

Single-payer advocates have had an equally tough time getting a hearing with the president. In March, the White House refused to allow Rep. John Conyers to invite two physicians who support single-payer to the health care summit that Obama was holding to kick off the reform effort. Three months later, a single-payer advocate named David Scheiner, who served as Obama’s physician for 22 years, was mysteriously bumped from a prime-time forum on health care, where he had been invited to ask the president a question.

..... From "Sick and Wrong", by Matt Taibbi, Rolling Stone, April 5, 2010





Taibbi: 'This is a referendum on whether or not we actually have a functioning government.', August 24, 2009


Mr. President, these physicians are pointing out the way., August 26, 2009


We tried to make you hear us, Mr. President.


Poll: Public Says Voice Not Heard In Health Debate, September 30, 2009



But you turned your back on us.



The public option is dead, February 23, 2010

After months on life support, the public option died Tuesday.

The White House and House leaders on Tuesday pronounced the government-run health program dead even as some Democratic senators continued their effort to resurrect it.

.....





Now, it's November of 2010.

We are again asked to believe that this administration's rhetoric will match its actions.


White House Gives In On Bush Tax Cuts, November 11, 2010, by Howard Fineman and Sam Stein, 12:16 AM

WASHINGTON -- President Barack Obama's top adviser suggested to The Huffington Post late Wednesday that the administration is ready to accept an across-the-board, temporary continuation of steep Bush-era tax cuts, including those for the wealthiest taxpayers.

That appears to be the only way, said David Axelrod, that middle-class taxpayers can keep their tax cuts, given the legislative and political realities facing Obama in the aftermath of last week's electoral defeat.

"We have to deal with the world as we find it," Axelrod said during an unusually candid and reflective 90-minute interview in his office, steps away from the Oval Office. "The world of what it takes to get this done."

"There are concerns," he added, that Congress will continue to kick the can down the road in the future by passing temporary extensions for the wealthy time and time again. "But I don't want to trade away security for the middle class in order to make that point."

.....




UPDATE: White House denies giving in on Bush tax cuts, November 11, 2010, by Greg Sargent


The story is overwritten. Nothing has changed from what the President said last week. We believe we need to extend the middle class tax cuts, we cannot afford to borrow 700 billion to pay for extending the tax cuts for the wealthiest Americans, and we are open to compromise and are looking forward to talking to the Congressional leadership next week to discuss how to move forward. Full Stop, period, end of sentence. -----White House comm director Dan Pfeiffer


The question remains, though, whether the White House will hold fast to Obama's demand last week that the extension of the tax cuts for the middle class remain permanent while extending the high end ones temporarily. The main sticking point is that Republicans won't allow the two categories to be extended for different durations, because that would force them to push for just an extension of the cuts for the rich later.



Time will tell who is telling the truth.





The barbarians have reached the gate for our Social Security and Medicare., November 10, 2010

Trumka: The chairmen of the Deficit Commission just told working Americans to ‘Drop Dead.’ , November 10, 2010


The chairmen of the Deficit Commission just told working Americans to ‘Drop Dead.’ Especially in these tough economic times, it is unconscionable to be proposing cuts to the critical economic lifelines for working people, Social Security and Medicare.

Some people are saying this is plan is just a “starting point.” Let me be clear, it is not.

This deficit talk reeks of rank hypocrisy: The very people who want to slash Social Security and Medicare spent this week clamoring for more unpaid Bush tax cuts for millionaires.

What we need to be focusing on now is the jobs deficit. Working families already paid for Wall Street’s party that tanked our economy. If we actually want to address our economic problems, we need to end tax breaks that send American jobs overseas and invest in creating jobs by rebuilding our crumbling infrastructure and green technologies.





Pelosi, political left rip proposal from debt commission chairmen, November 10, 2010

The chairmen of President Obama’s fiscal commission sparked a political firestorm Wednesday with the early release of a report proposing sweeping changes to Social Security, Medicare and the tax code.

The plan would reduce the deficit by nearly $4 trillion over the next decade by making dramatic spending cuts and overhauling the tax code by wiping out deductions, such as the popular tax break on mortgage interest. ((seafan note: Don't miss that one.))

Labor unions and liberal Democrats lit into the preliminary proposal, which the two chairmen touted as the first serious plan to tackle the country’s growing debt.

Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) said it was “simply unacceptable.”

“Any final proposal from the commission should do what is right for our children and grandchildren’s economic security as well as for our nation’s fiscal security, and it must do what is right for our seniors, who are counting on the bedrock promises of Social Security and Medicare,” she said in a statement.

AFL-CIO President Richard Trumka said the chairmen had told “working Americans to ‘Drop Dead,’” while Rep. Raul Grijalva (D-Ariz.) faulted the report for cutting Social Security benefits while reducing corporate and upper-income taxes.

.....




Obama to Congress: Stop shooting down deficit proposals, November 11, 2010

Good morning from The Oval, and happy Veterans Day -- President Obama is in Seoul, South Korea, where today he said lawmakers in the United States should hold off on comments about his fiscal commission's proposals to slash the federal budget deficit through spending cuts, ending tax breaks, and a revamping of the Social Security system.

"Before anybody starts shooting down proposals, I think we need to listen, we need to gather up all the facts," Obama told reporters.

He added: "If people are, in fact, concerned about spending, debt, deficits and the future of our country, then they're going to need to be armed with the information about the kinds of choices that are going to be involved, and we can't just engage in political rhetoric."

Obama said he will await the commission's Dec. 1 formal report before commenting in detail. Members "are trying to round up 14 votes for certain aspects of the recommendations, and I want to make sure that they've got the room and the space to do so," he said.

.....




This is indefensible.

We saw the same cool detachment during the health insurance reform battle.

Not now, Mr. President. You must LEAD.

Why won't you say publicly that this deficit commission's mandate does not include looking at the solvency of SS and Medicare, which makes their calculated threats to SS and Medicare supremely irrelevant?

And why won't you say that you will oppose all of these radical plans aimed at gutting our social safety net by the likes of Alan Simpson, for crying out loud? But, then, you put him on this commission.




Here are the steps that need to be taken NOW.

1. Raise the cap on Social Security.

2. Increase taxes on the wealthy.

3. Let Bush's tax cuts expire at the end of December 2010. (Oh, and jettison this farce of a deficit commission. Looking at SS and Medicare solvency is not part of its mandate anyway.)

4. Expand Medicare for everyone.

5. Slash the "Offense" budget. (And how wise is it to arm both sides of the India-Pakistan conflict?)


These steps would go a long way toward pulling ourselves out of this mire.




As painful as it is to face, this administration is not up to the job of fighting for the people's interests or of resurrecting the now-moribund rule of law.

In a time of great crises affecting our nation, this man just does not have what it takes.

The image that was sold to us was an illusion. The rhetoric does not match the action.



We desperately need more than rhetoric, Mr. President. You are losing us. The people need rapid action, for it is nearly too late to reverse this downward spiral for so many people.





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CaliforniaPeggy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 02:41 PM
Response to Original message
1. A BIG K&R
And with sorrow, for so much hope that has been wasted.

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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 06:15 AM
Response to Reply #1
61. Deleted message
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byrok Donating Member (132 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 12:52 PM
Response to Reply #1
97. I totally concur.
:cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :
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Vincardog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 02:50 PM
Response to Original message
2. K&R we needed RAMBO and got Milton Milktoast
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 05:18 PM
Response to Reply #2
16. Deleted message
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bvar22 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 06:10 PM
Response to Reply #16
20. ....We needed a Churchill,
and got a Chamberlain. :(
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Imagevision Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 10:51 PM
Response to Reply #20
49. What we needed was someone who kept their campaign promises
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leeroysphitz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 12:12 PM
Response to Reply #20
80. ...We needed a Nelson,
and got a Millhouse.
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Lilith Velkor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 11:13 PM
Response to Reply #20
114. We needed an FDR
and got a Tony Blair. x(
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 06:10 PM
Response to Reply #2
21. Deleted message
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DirkGently Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 02:51 PM
Response to Original message
3. Very well said. nt
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jannyk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 02:52 PM
Response to Original message
4. K&R
Add me to the totally disillusioned and angry crowd.
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lib2DaBone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 03:01 PM
Response to Original message
5. You nailed it.. the answers are right there in the open... for all to see...
Except Mr. Obama doesn't want to see. He seems more determined each day to please the Republicans instead of the people who elected him.
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howmad1 Donating Member (959 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 11:12 PM
Response to Reply #5
52. Actually, Obama was the very best thing to happen.........
.....TO THE RETHUGLICAN PARTY. Seems that on Nov. 3, 2008, most pundits were saying the rethuglican party was on its last legs. Funny how in 2.5 years,Obama sure fixed that problem for the rethuglicans.
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pscot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 01:18 PM
Response to Reply #52
101. +1
He brought them back from the brink, didn't he.
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davidwparker Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 12:22 PM
Response to Reply #5
85. though he should see that do so costs votes. Last poll I
saw it was about half who wanted Obama to have a primary. This will increase.

It would behoove the party to have a backup plan.
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chill_wind Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 03:02 PM
Response to Original message
6. K & R.
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HCE SuiGeneris Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 03:05 PM
Response to Original message
7. Summers, Geithner, Holder, Gates, Salazar, Vilsack, LaHood,
You cannot believe that a progressive agenda will be instituted with these pro-corporate hacks at the helm.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 04:10 PM
Response to Reply #7
11. Deleted message
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 03:32 PM
Response to Original message
8. Deleted message
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ladjf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 03:43 PM
Response to Original message
9. The "Ship of State" is firmly under the control of the Rich. They
have successfully used what ever it took to overthrow the Government. I can't even imagine what is going to happen next. With a wimp like Obama in the White House, their job of maintaining control is even easier than if that had a Republican President. This way they control all of the Republicans and most of the Democrats.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 04:08 AM
Response to Reply #9
59. Deleted message
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xchrom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 03:59 PM
Response to Original message
10. Recommend
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MissDeeds Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 04:26 PM
Response to Original message
12. K&R
The rhetoric is not backed up by the actions of this administration.
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LongTomH Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 04:34 PM
Response to Original message
13. Sadly True!
Oh yeah - K&R :kick:
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leftstreet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 04:35 PM
Response to Original message
14. K&R
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Eyerish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 04:58 PM
Response to Original message
15. A big K&R...
Well said!
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Dr.Phool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 05:25 PM
Response to Original message
17. Gimme an "O".......
Stock up on cat food.
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laughingliberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 05:54 PM
Response to Original message
18. K & R nt
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Luminous Animal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 06:01 PM
Response to Original message
19. Kick.
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Dr.Phool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 07:04 PM
Response to Original message
22. Salesmanship video.
How to win friends and influence people.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0j81lWY-VIs
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sabrina 1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 07:13 PM
Response to Original message
23. Why won't he comment? Are they trying to run out the clock
on the Democrats time as the majority?

He commented plenty during the Campaign, opposing the very idea of a Commission on the Deficit, slamming Hillary Clinton for suggesting it, stating, correctly, that such Commissions had only one purpose which was 'to do an end run around Congress' ability to hold open hearings on these matters'.

Then he changed his mind.

Dems need to move fast and slap down these proposals. They are an equal branch of government. The president has made HIS position clear, and it is unacceptable. Now it's Congress' turn.

I feel more and more angry and disillusioned every time a major issue like this, one of the main reasons I supported Obama over Hillary, comes up. At least she was up front about what she would do. I believed him, silly me.
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emilyg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 07:21 PM
Response to Original message
24. k/r
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Tatiana Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 07:28 PM
Response to Original message
25. At this point, the rhetoric does not match the actions taken by this administration.
I don't blame the President for this economy. That was inherited from Bush.

However, after the about-face done on the public option, after the waffling on DADT, after the refusal to give bankruptcy judges the ability to do mortgage "cramdowns," after seeing the recent news that Bank(rupt) of America may end up needing another bailout, after disappointment after disappointment in the area of civil liberties... well, I don't expect anything at all progressive to come out of the next two years of this administration. I'll be ecstatic to eat crow if I'm wrong, but I think we elected a centrist President politically that governs from the center-right and does not have the personal willpower to stand up against powerful interests that seek to destroy the American middle and working classes.
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chill_wind Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 12:22 PM
Response to Reply #25
84. Well said. n/t
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ProudDad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 12:48 PM
Response to Reply #25
95. The laughable Ponzi scheme mis-labeled an "economy"
here in the USAmerican Empire...

Is as fervent an article of faith to Obama as it was to bush...

He's a proud, completely brain-washed product of Harvard Law -- the training ground for defenders of the Status-Quo...

Why the surprise? :shrug:

Why expect the scorpion to act in any way against its nature?
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Catherina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 07:29 PM
Response to Original message
26. Rec'd n/t
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ibegurpard Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 07:35 PM
Response to Original message
27. I think you got it backward
I'd like his actions to match his rhetoric
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 07:38 PM
Response to Original message
28. Deleted message
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Knight Hawk Donating Member (336 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 09:39 PM
Response to Reply #28
43. Yes
I was wondering the same thing.Where are all the three dimensional chess people.I was thrown off this site for saying Obama was not a fighter BEFORE he served one day.
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dflprincess Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 10:16 PM
Response to Reply #28
46. Or they're all busy combing the White House and other web sites
for their TALKING POINTS>


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inna Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 07:40 PM
Response to Original message
29. HUGE K&R.

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Autumn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 08:05 PM
Response to Original message
30. #6 End the fucking wars!! n/t
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leeroysphitz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 12:27 PM
Response to Reply #30
88. +100000000
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Dappleganger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 08:06 PM
Response to Original message
31. BIG K&R
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Dinger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 08:09 PM
Response to Original message
32. Kick & Rec # 73
for the truth:)
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Ignis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 08:15 PM
Response to Original message
33. A disappointed K&R.
More action, less talk. Or if it must be talk, let it be of the fire-breathing, rabble-rousing, pulpit-pounding variety.

Also, here's a flashback: "It's the economy, stupid." :banghead:
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scarletwoman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 08:15 PM
Response to Original message
34. Thank you for laying it out so clearly and well. Big K&R! (nt)
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In Truth We Trust Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 08:34 PM
Response to Original message
35. time to fight back against all the duplicity!!!
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DeSwiss Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 08:35 PM
Response to Original message
36. K&R
"The superior man is the providence of the inferior. He is eyes for the blind, strength for the weak, and a shield for the defenseless. He stands erect by bending above the fallen. He rises by lifting others."

"We need men with moral courage to speak and write their real thoughts, and to stand by their convictions, even to the very death."

~ Robert G. Ingersoll
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felix_numinous Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 08:39 PM
Response to Original message
37. K&R!!
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maritzasolito Donating Member (74 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 08:52 PM
Response to Original message
38. Vote Repuke!!!!!!!
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fascisthunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 09:10 PM
Response to Reply #38
39. no... we plan on taking our democratic party back
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Dinger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 11:06 PM
Response to Reply #39
51. Fuckin' A We Do!
Yes we will!:patriot:
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Celtic Raven Donating Member (415 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 09:29 PM
Response to Reply #38
41. No.
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Starry Messenger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 09:12 PM
Response to Original message
40. k&r
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Celtic Raven Donating Member (415 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 09:34 PM
Response to Original message
42. K&R
Also bookmarking.

Thanks for putting all of this together and laying out your points so well seafan.
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highplainsdem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 09:41 PM
Response to Original message
44. K&R
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amborin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 09:41 PM
Response to Original message
45. K&R
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donheld Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 10:45 PM
Response to Original message
47. K & R
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Poboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 10:47 PM
Response to Original message
48. K to the R -nt
Edited on Thu Nov-11-10 10:47 PM by Poboy
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Imagevision Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 10:53 PM
Response to Original message
50. Obama, WTF happened to "Yes We Can" (?)
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 11:21 PM
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 11:34 AM
Response to Reply #53
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flyarm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 11:25 PM
Response to Original message
54. A huge K&R and thanks for all your work on this, and laying it out clearly!
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OnyxCollie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-10 11:27 PM
Response to Original message
55. K&R. nt
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colsohlibgal Donating Member (670 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 12:21 AM
Response to Original message
56. He Sold Out Right Away
Emmanual. The Rubin Goldman Sachs crowd instead of the Reich populist crowd. Saying he was going to fight for a public option as he dealt that away, along with other important facets of true health care reform, blatant lying, - then making sure pro public option professionals would get the shaft by steering it to faux democrat Baucus.

Still....it's right there for him, the path is clear. Channel FDR and TR instead of Clinton, stand up strong for the people against the rich people, the corporate state. It's good for the bulk of us and a winning strategy, it's a no brainer IMHO. Do I have hope he'll do that? My guess is the chances are slim and none and slim may be about to take off.

The most amazing thing about all this is the labeling from the right calling him a socialist. If only.

If he keeps going weak republican lite I have no doubt that he'll be challenged from the left for the 2012 nomination, just like LBJ was in 1968.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 12:23 AM
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tblue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 12:25 AM
Response to Original message
58. All I know is every time I hear Obama's mulling something over and get my hopes up,
he turns around and does just what progressives DON'T WANT him to do. Not just some times. Almost always! He did hire Elizabeth Warren, but I can't tell if she has any sway. And "signed papers to begin closing Gitmo" does not count as an accomplishment. "It's only been 19 months" is not an excuse when now we have NO MORE MONTHS!!!
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Altoid_Cyclist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 05:49 AM
Response to Original message
60. Moody Blues song with some very appropriate lyrics.
The Democratic leaders had all of the momentum in 2008 and what did they do with it? CAPITULATE every time! If it wasn't capitulation, then it was something worse. That something else would be that they intended to alter the meaning of "change" all along.

You have to watch this video, it's a great series of photos of ice, penguins, polar bears and other things that the global warming deniers say are just fine without adding any protection.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pYVJmXLJMPs&feature=related

Blue World lyrics


Heart and soul took control
Took control of me
Paid my dues spread the news
Hands across the sea
Put me down turned me round
Turned me round to see
Marble halls open doors
Someone found the key
And it's only what you do
That keeps coming back on you
And it's only what you say
That can give yourself away


Underground sight and sound
human Symphony
Heard the voice had no choice
needed to be free
Fly me high touch the sky
Left the earth below
Heard the line saw the sign
Knew which way to go
Cos it's easier to try
Than to prove it can't be done
And it's easier to stay
Than to turn around and run


It's a blue world
It takes somebody to help somebody
Oh it's a blue world
It's a new world
It needs somebody to love somebody
Oh it's a blue world

Heart and soul took control
Took control of me
Paid my dues spread the news
Hands across the sea
Put me down turned me round
Turned me round to see
Marble halls open doors
Someone found the key
And it's only what you do
That keeps coming back on you
And it's only what you say
That can give yourself away
Cos it's easier to try
Than to prove it can't be done
And it's easier to stay
Than to turn around and run


It's a blue world
It takes somebody to help somebody
Oh it's a blue world
It's a new world
It needs somebody to love somebody
Oh it's a blue world
It's a blue world
It takes somebody to help somebody
Oh it's a blue world
It's a new world
It needs somebody to love somebody
Oh it's a blue world
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 06:24 AM
Response to Original message
62. Deleted message
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davidwparker Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 12:29 PM
Response to Reply #62
90. Primary Obama. There does not have to be a lot of debates
Edited on Fri Nov-12-10 12:30 PM by davidwparker
or mud slinging. Just have a primary and put another name next to Obama's.

The rest will take care of itself.

Dennis. Howard. Grayson. Feingold. Hillary. Nader. Gore.

It is yours for the taking.
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laughingliberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 07:10 AM
Response to Original message
63. He wants everyone to pipe down so the commission can get their 14 votes?
Guess it hasn't occurred to him, we don't want them to get their 14 votes. We didn't want this draconian commission and we don't want them to 'finish their work.'

It is the same sort of non-commitment we heard during HCR and it is always a signal he's about to screw us.

He has no problem being clear when he believes something. He had no problem digging his heels in on taxing workers' benefits.
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senseandsensibility Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-13-10 07:10 PM
Response to Reply #63
118. You are completely correct.
Unfortunately. I can only kick this thread now; it is too late to rec.
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travelingtypist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 09:24 AM
Response to Original message
64. And they never, ever do.
Edited on Fri Nov-12-10 09:25 AM by travelingtypist
But Obama's playing chess, don't ya know?

:eyes:

K&R
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BlancheSplanchnik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 09:40 AM
Response to Original message
65. I don't want to let go of my belief in him as a good and brilliant person.
I admit it. It's hard to feel so torn, and I'm also aware that the forces aligned against him/us are so damned huge... (well, fairly aware, as much as a layperson can be, with limited time to absorb so much information)...


I admit to clutching my tendency to hero worship closely.... and that it's not as black and white as someone as thoroughly evil as bush, cheney, evil CEO's et al are.

My hun has hated Obama from the beginning, but a lot of that is racism too and willful ignorance :( So, again, it's really hard for me to acknowledge the things outlined in the OP.

I think it's a very human thing to not know what to do with information that contradicts cherished beliefs, especially when there are also facts that support the cherished beliefs. Again, as I said, when the dualism is not so clear cut, it's difficult to resolve the emotions.......


Maybe we just have to fight for what needs to be fought for (Still. Damn fucking propagandists and con-job-servatives), and at the same time not lose sight of what's been accomplished. I mean, still act wisely even in spite of the conflicts......


(I just had to say this for myself, after reading the thread and the swipes at the "cheerleaders". )
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Javaman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 09:44 AM
Response to Reply #65
67. You know there is a fine line between genius and insane...
Obama keeps trying this compromise bullshit with the fucking repukes.

Each and every time he tries the same damn thing, yet, he expects a different result.

Honestly, I'm beginning to wonder.
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NCarolinawoman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 09:54 AM
Response to Reply #67
68. He courted conservative law students to become editor of the Harvard Law Review.
He ran against many progressives. I honestly don't know what his core beliefs are.:(
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BlancheSplanchnik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 09:56 AM
Response to Reply #67
69. ...
sigh


I just don't know what to say at this point....

to much to deal w ith
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ChiciB1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 10:15 AM
Response to Reply #65
72. I KNOW Many Of Us Wanted To Believe In Him, Want Him To Succeed...
however, when is the time when others realize that HE IS NOT DOING what so many of us felt he was going to do?

It's more than sad, it's heartbreaking. And even if some policies go off the rail, at LEAST he should show some ENTHUSIASM for what he proposes. I don't even KNOW WHAT he believes in anymore, I honestly don't!!

Too many speeches about what needs to be done, then turn, turn... WHOOPS, that's NOT really what was said. Well, I'm done listening to what he says because I can't get on board a ship that seems to be sailing in circles!

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BlancheSplanchnik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 12:28 PM
Response to Reply #72
89. yeah
Edited on Fri Nov-12-10 12:31 PM by BlancheSplanchnik
:(

I'm not quite ready to get that cynical about him yet.

And I'm still looking at the good he has accomplished, AND in the face of such powerful evil, with so many lines of attack against him personally and progressivism as a whole.

Just not ready to turn against him (too heartbreaking)
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dana_b Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 01:17 PM
Response to Reply #65
100. you know what, I don't care about him being a person
that I would like to know in real life because that's never going to happen. What I do care about is his ability to lead with true conviction for the principles that those who got him elected were lead to believe were his also. He may be a "nice guy" and super intelligent however no one is going to give a damn about that if they don't know how they are going to make it until the end of the month, if their social security check is cut and their kids can't find jobs with a living wage. This OP is spot on.
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Javaman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 09:42 AM
Response to Original message
66. K&R What gets me most about the sunset clause on the tax cut for the rich...
it expires on Jan 1st.

Obama and the Dems, who are still the majority, can just do nothing.

Yet, Obama chooses instead to bend over backwards to work out a compromise?

For what???? He's going to get the royal fuck job from the repuke half wits in the house the day after they are sworn in. He still believes in compromise?

Frankly, I'm beginning to think the president is insane. He keeps doing the same thing over and over expecting a different result.

fuck it. just fuck it.

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ChiciB1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 10:05 AM
Response to Original message
70. For My OWN Sanity... I Just Don't Listen To What THEY Are Saying...
To me, it just more and more LIES, and "we the people" just are the pawns. BECAUSE, even here too many simply roll over and say... "well it's okay" and then give a long list of reasons WHY we should STILL support Repuke policies.

I'm not unwilling to compromise because I'm a Liberal, but for crying out loud... GIVE US SOMETHING!

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pscot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 01:32 PM
Response to Reply #70
105. Nixon's advice still holds good:
Edited on Fri Nov-12-10 01:32 PM by pscot
"Don't listen to what we say. Watch what we do," RMN
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raouldukelives Donating Member (945 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 10:07 AM
Response to Original message
71. K&R
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NorthCarolina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 10:19 AM
Response to Original message
73. Voters moved Congress decidedly left in the 2010 election. Perhaps we will have an opportunity
in 2012 to move the White House to the left. Grayson, Dean, Sanders, Kucinich....any one of these fine folks would receive my vote in the primaries without hesitation.
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leeroysphitz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 12:36 PM
Response to Reply #73
92. If Grayson or Dean were to primary him I would vote against Obama.
Hell,at this point I would campaign against Obama.
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NorthCarolina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 01:45 PM
Response to Reply #92
106. Actually, I should have said voters moved House Dems decidedly left,
not Congress. But I do agree with you. I'm not sure what it takes to wake folks up to the fact that as middle class, Obama just isn't that into you. Even if the health insurance giveaway didn't clue you in, or if his actions (or is it in-actions) on DADT haven't opened your eyes, then his creation a Debt Commission, stacked with hand-picked members with a openly vocal hatred for social programs that benefit the masses, should have screamed out to you. Funny how these same elected officials that insist we need to make the tough choices on Social Security and Medicare in order to reduce the deficit, seem to have no qualms about fighting tooth and nail for extensions of the Bush tax cuts for the wealthiest 3% of the nation. Social Security didn't cause the financial crisis we're in, and it shouldn't be sacrificed to solve it.
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peace frog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 10:37 AM
Response to Original message
74. K 'n' R
Thanks.
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alberg Donating Member (324 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 11:02 AM
Response to Original message
75. The single most important thing that the Democrats can do
is to let ALL the Bush Tax Cuts expire.

Let’s call their bluff.

They’ve been telling us for the past year that the most critical issue we face is the large Federal Deficit – OK – letting the tax cuts expire will cut the deficit IN HALF ! There is no other action that either party could take that has as powerful an effect on one of the core issues driving our politics.

As a patriotic American I’m happy to give my $300.00 a year tax break back to our government to balance the budget and make our country stronger. I’m sure all the Billionaires out there are willing to do the same.

We control the Senate so all that is needed to make this happen is to DO NOTHING! The tax cuts expire on December 31.

Most economists agree that the tax cuts were a Republican shame that damaged the economy and the letting them expire will, if coupled with an aggressive jobs creation program, be a big step towards getting us out of this mess.

So, what do you say – are you with me?

Call your Senators and the White House and tell them: Let all the Bush Tax Cuts expire!
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NJmaverick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 11:23 AM
Response to Original message
76. One would have thought losing the House of Representatives would
have been a wake up call that this sort of destructive tearing down and issuing demands only serves to help the GOP.
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blindpig Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 12:29 PM
Response to Reply #76
91. You so funny..

as though the words posted here decided the election.

Nope, firstly and fore mostly it was the actions and inactions of this administration which decided the election. It was the high rhetoric of the campaign contrasted with the insults and abuses received, people don't like being flimflammed.
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NJmaverick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 01:26 PM
Response to Reply #91
104. So you are following the school of thought
that repeating the same actions will produce different results. Good luck with that.


:eyes:
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blindpig Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 01:50 PM
Response to Reply #104
107. Au contraire

That's exactly how I feel about electoral politics.
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Aramchek Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 11:57 AM
Response to Original message
78. Thanks for the shitload of rhetoric you just dumped on us.
If only you worked as hard to help Obama as you do to hobble him.
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inna Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 12:24 PM
Response to Reply #78
86. what a ridiculous and absurd ad hominem.

:shrug:

thanks for the kick though.
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Aramchek Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 01:16 PM
Response to Reply #86
99. you don't really know what ad hominem means, do you?
I admit, it is a flashy term to throw about.

But it doesn't really work its magic unless you comprehend its meaning.
Nice try, though.
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leeroysphitz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 12:41 PM
Response to Reply #78
94. Help him do what exactly?
I think you people are missing the point. Why should we HELP him when he is doing things that we are AGAINST.
Duh.
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femrap Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 12:02 PM
Response to Original message
79. He's a puppet....
TPTB have their hand up his ass. We had 20 months of 'diversity in power.' Pelosi, that "librul 'girl' from San Fran where all the gays live" and the "Black dude who is really a Muslim" are toast.

It's all a set-up. Obama won't find his balls and turn this Lame Duck into something Brilliant. He won't fight.

There is so much Populist Anger out here....and the Teabaggers are just fucking racists who don't offer any answers that help the people....they just help their Corporate Lords.

I want a REAL populist person to speak the Truth and solve problems of the people.

WASF....China is going to kick our ass.
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ChiciB1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 01:12 PM
Response to Reply #79
98. You Can Talk For Me "femrap," But I Have A Question. I'm Not Always Up On ALL
the acronyms, so what does WASF mean?

Wonder how much worse it's going to get, I hear it's going to be a VERY "bumpy" ride. And I'm already on an alternative ride right now! Things in my household are getting worse by the day. Spent my whole day yesterday outside working with a large variety of plants. I seem to have a green thumb and cut, clip, transplant, dig up and put all into new pots. Then come spring I have a large yard sale. I've always been amazed at how quickly they sell, but am now worried that people won't have money to buy them.

Yes, I KNOW it's fall, but here in Florida I can get clippings to root much better right now, and if necessary will take them into my husband's large barn if it gets cold. I'm also gathering up any items that can be sold for extra money.

Cleaning out closets and items from past yard sales to donate to "the needy" around here. I've decided NOT to give them to Goodwill or Salvation Army, but to migrant workers or Spark and places like that. It's my wish that these things will be given away FREE to those that need them. I nees to research the places who give stuff away.

Okay, got off topic... sort of.

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femrap Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 03:50 PM
Response to Reply #98
111. WASF
We Are So Fucked.

I'm with you on giving things to the needy. I don't want them to pay for things....I give lots to Domestic Violence Shelters. I knit throughout the year (until I got 'knitter's wrist') and made lots of scarves...it's cold up here. I also buy socks throughout the year on sale and give those to the Shelters as well. Whenever I find a close-out sale on something basic, I'll buy and set aside for the Shelters.

You sound like you have a green thumb. My garden was awful this year....so, so hot...and very little rain.

I've been stocking up on food....commodity prices, such as soybeans, beef, corn, etc. have all gone up and soon it will hit the consumer. And canned goods as well. The stuff we need will go up in price while the price of yachts will go down!

Gas is already back up to $3/gal up here.

Tax the damn rich.
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ChiciB1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-13-10 08:40 AM
Response to Reply #111
116. Sorry I Didn't Get Back To Reply... Back Outside... Much Work To Do!
Thanks for the info, and it's good to hear that more are thinking of "GIVING" even if it's just a little.

My sister crochets baby outfits, very beautiful work that I envy... I'm the Tomboy in the family of 6 girls, I really SUCKED when my mother taught knitting and crocheting. A very nice thing you are doing!
:loveya:
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femrap Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-13-10 06:57 PM
Response to Reply #116
117. I went to Roots Camp
today where all the Dems discussed what to do next. It was so sad when Mrs. Frances Strickland spoke...she and husband, Ted, will be moving from the Governor's Mansion. And our great Sec'y of State, Jennifer Brunner, spoke as well. I'm hoping someday she will be Ohio's Governor.

Saw lots of old buddies. Ohio is back to Red....shit. I suggest we do as California did to Gray Davis....a Recall and then 'Arnold' took over.

This upcoming governor, Kasich, is a mean, mean person. 'Either get on the bus, or I'll run over you.' That's a felony, dude!:hi:
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earth mom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 02:25 PM
Response to Reply #79
110. You nailed it.
Obama is a puppet doing the dirty work for the powers that be. I've known that for a long time now, and I'm glad that people are waking up to see the truth.

Why did it have to take the threat of them stealing our Social Security for people to realize how badly they are screwing us all?!

Why wasn't the bankster bailout that Obama and Congress participated in enough to wake people up?!
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femrap Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 10:29 PM
Response to Reply #110
113. why wasn't it enough?
I guess because we live in Dumfukistan!!!! Unfortunately.
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indimuse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 12:15 PM
Response to Original message
81. KNR! n/t
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phiddle Donating Member (749 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 12:18 PM
Response to Original message
82. We needed...and we got
Edited on Fri Nov-12-10 12:22 PM by phiddle
We needed Howard Dean at DNC, we got Tim Kaine
We needed Joe Stiglitz as Economic Council Director, we got Larry Summers
We needed Robert Reich at Treasury, we got Tim Geithner
We needed Bobby Kennedy Jr. at Interior, we got Ken Salazar
We needed Jim Hightower at Agriculture, we got Tom Vilsack
We needed Gary Hart at Defense, we got Bob Gates,
etc.

We needed a public health insurance option, we got compulsory private insurance with few cost controls
We needed a large jobs and infrastructure oriented recovery program, we got an insufficient bunch of business tax cuts
We needed to downsize the American Empire and pull our troops back, we got an expanded war in Afghanistan
We needed to expand the social safety net, we got the Catfood Commission
We needed to reinstate Glass-Steagall, we got a maze of regulatory reforms easily gamed and altered
We needed to lift the FICA cap and impose greater taxes on stock transactions, the carry trade and cap gains, we got a tax brawl on Republican terms
We needed to reform the Senate rules, we got a totally dysfunctional institution
We needed to reform campaign finance, we got the big money interests controlling the political process
We needed to strengthen the grip of the Democratic Party, we got a Republican fist in a velvet glove

The list goes on and on.
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ChiciB1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 12:38 PM
Response to Reply #82
93. I Think Your List Is GREAT... But There IS MORE We Need. We Need
Democrats and ESPECIALLY the POTUS to actually stand up and fight for us. I'm going to copy this list, but would LOVE to see more of what WE HAVE NOT GOTTEN!

When talking to people, so many want to know why I feel as I do and generally I can only give them a few particulars. It would be nice to see a compiled list of what we THOUGHT we were going to get, but now haven't gotten.

Yes, the list does go on and on. I'm sure someone has compiled one, just haven't seen it since I come here less and less.

Thanks anyway!
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phiddle Donating Member (749 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 12:49 PM
Response to Reply #93
96. Agreed---We needed a fighter and we got a referee
Above the fray, and wanting only to keep the game going.
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TBF Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 02:19 PM
Response to Reply #96
108. Referees actually make calls - I think we got the scorekeeper. nt
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leeroysphitz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 12:21 PM
Response to Original message
83. The best government that corporate money can buy. n/t
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Tierra_y_Libertad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 12:27 PM
Response to Original message
87. Trust me, Charlie Brown.
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jtown1123 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 01:19 PM
Response to Original message
102. K&R If there is ever a time to raise a big stink, this is it.
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truebrit71 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 01:23 PM
Response to Original message
103. Nailed it. The time for Jedi-mind tricks is over...
The rethugs need to be reminded of why SS is the political 'third rail' otherwise you run the risk of being the most well-spoken one-term president in recent memory..
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earth mom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 02:19 PM
Response to Original message
109. Great post, but I'd bet money that it will fall on deaf ears.
:argh:
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QC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 06:16 PM
Response to Reply #109
112. Looks like it got a lot of people's attention. n/t
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pgodbold Donating Member (953 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-12-10 11:39 PM
Response to Original message
115. K&R.
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donco6 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-13-10 08:02 PM
Response to Original message
119. K but too late to R
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