How do we shift the discussion on taxes away from payroll taxes and to...

[Scuba]

How do we shift the discussion on taxes away from payroll taxes and to a tax platform that has one pay into the system on the basis of wealth?


How do we get the tax burden from the working class to the owner class? Why can't we shift the conversation to the fact that $380,000,000 income on capital gains is taxed at a lower rate than income of $65,000 made by working your butt off?

Why does Paris Hilton get to inherit private jets but the maids who cleaned all those hotel rooms die for lack of health care?

[OHdem10]

1. Keep talking about it.

[dkf]

2. The deficit commission is recommending capital gains be taxed at ordinary income rates.

[Scuba]

3. By "ordinary" do you mean wages and salaries?

[dkf]

6. Exactly.

[zeemike]

4. I favor the oblique method.

I would talk religion and god with them....point out that Jesus predicted that in the end times there would be great inequities..."because inequities abound the love of many will wax cold"...give them a few quotes from Jesus that shows that he had ideas that would be called Marxist, communist, socialist and far left radical.
And the reason I would do this is because there are many on the right that actually do believe in Jesus and the bible, but they have always trusted the preacher to tell him what it said...and if he gets to actually read it it could change his mind....you will never change the mind of those that are in it for greed or because they are just sociopaths.

[Scuba]

5. Your approach has merit and deserves further discussion.

[zeemike]

7. Thanks

I have felt for some time that the left tends to just make fun of what they see as absurdities of religious beliefe....you never see the right do that....the none believers on the right will just string them along if it furthers their cause.

And so as liberals we cut ourselves off from people that may change.

[HillbillyBob]

8. Your post has merit, but I don't have much civil to say to the

haters on the religious right. They have not been civil especially to gay folks like me. I m tired of being called sick, sinner, child molester, etc.
I am none of those things, repeated insults and physical assaults leaves little room even if I were able to forgive I cannot forget. I mean put me in the hospital physical assaults and attempted burning of my home..I know its a portion. I get along fine with sane Christians. The other kind...nah.

PS and the lot that tried to burn my house were all church of gawd, and had been on my door step every Saturday am early(i worked late shift till 1 or 2 on F night, they knew this). I have stated the stuff they pulled from peeking in windows to vandalizing my car. I was civil right up to the night of the attempted cross burning then I answered with a 12 gauge pump.
I know that is extreme, but the way these preachers (not reverend) go on about how evil we are they overlook their own sins..until they get caught in a sex in a park sting. If things like that happened only once or twice it would be different, but its been a pattern of misbehavior for so long.

[zeemike]

10. Hate begets hate and that is why they do it.

Jesus preached about the evils of that too.
It is hard I know for you, but you must understand the power of turning the other cheek...There is a lot of misunderstanding about that...it does not mean back down or run away....it means a willingness to stand your ground, even against their violence and threats of it.
We must speak the truth to them and the truth is in the teachings of Jesus no matter whether you believe in god or not....and that truth has a liberal bias.

[HillbillyBob]

13. After almost 50 yrs of abuse I have turned for the last time.

I am not trying to be harsh. I am even civil to them most of the time and walk away, but if one more lays a finger on me god help them.
I have been put in hospital with kicked in ribs. I have only mentioned a few incidents. But I get off track , they happily pay tithe to churches and does not Jesus say Render up to Ceasar (taxes) ?

[zeemike]

14. It is the sociopaths that do the violence.for them

The so called christian leaders that preach the hate usually keep their hands clean.
But when I was talking about standing your ground I did not mean to put yourself in the way of danger....what I meant is to live your life openly as you are and not shy away from it.
If I were gay and I was walking down a street and saw someone holding a sign that said "God hates fags" I would stop and tell them it is not true and ask them if they know that they are putting themselves in danger of the judgment by saying that....but that is just me....and by the way I pretty much do that at every opertunity....not just about gays but about any thing that is a lie.

[csziggy]

9. Maybe talk about how much "real" hardworking Americans pay in comparison to the rich elite?

Considering even Warren Buffet has talked about how unequal the percentage of what he pays on his income is compared to the percentage his secretary pays on hers, it should be an easy argument to make.

"Hardworking Americans making xx% of their pay in income tax, xx% in Social Security taxes (that they will have to work LONGER to collect!) and xx% in Medicare taxes (that they can't use until they are HOW old?). At the same time, the RICH elite that don't even have to WORK for a living pay less than 10% (or whatever xx% it might be) of their total income and their Social Security payments are capped so they pay very little no matter how many millions they have."

Frame it correctly and it will sound as though we are attacking the mythical "liberal elite" and that should push the low information populace over the edge to support taxing the wealthy more.

[HillbillyBob]

11. Yes reframing might help, then unified dissemination.

That would be the trick.

[csziggy]

12. Yeah, but "unified dissemination" is not something Democrats do

Just seem my sig lines.