A question I have about grocery unions

[Roon]

is it fair that I have no choice but to put up with the glares and dirty looks when I cross the picket line to get my groceries?

I for the most part am pro-union,but when a union interferes with my day to day living, it really makes me angry.

I was crossing a grocery picket line and this guy in a wheelchair was apologizing to the picketers because safeway was the only place he can cash his social security check. When I got into the store there was a big sign at the customer service counter that said,"Due to the strike, we will no longer be cashing checks until further notice." I bet that guy had a different view of unions after that!

[blondeatlast]

1. Yes, it is fair. Liberals/progressives support labor. It's that simple, IMHO. nt

[mediaman007]

2. Sometimes it is uncomfortable to support corporations.

Corporations have every advantage: money, laws, lawyers and for the most part: the court system. Yes, supporting a union is uncomfortable. Supporting a corporation only requires that you sell your conscience.

[earthside]

3. Won't Wal-Mart cash his check?

Because if the union loses and more and more grocery stores become non-union, that is all we're going to have ... Wal-Mart and other versions of Wal-Mart.

[nadinbrzezinski]

4. Can you go somewhere else?

When we had our local strike I went to stores that were not part of the strike.

When it was over I went back and thanked the staff. As to the elderly man in a wheelchair, that's a corporate decision.

[KamaAina]

9. I believe he is transit-dependent

I've been in the same situation. Several years ago I was in danger of losing my job due to a transit strike. At least one person suggested I should be happy to give up my job for the sake of the bus drivers' contract.

The "nearby" store that isn't being picketed may be "only" a mile or two down the road for those of you with cars. For us, it might as well not be there.

[nadinbrzezinski]

10. That is why I asked.

Some cities that is possible with transit, most it is not.

If that's your only choice, even the union folk will get it.

[MedicalAdmin]

24. Speaking as a former union man, that's right.

If you need to cash a check, cash it. If you are disabled and need to use the local picketed store, then use it. Heck - need a hand - I would have been more than happy to help out. I wasn't working.

[JVS]

20. You could have taken a cab or arranged a ride.

Not the cheapest or easiest, but better than losing a job.

[KamaAina]

33. I had a ride. He got laid off.

Fortunately the strike was settled that weekend.

As for cabs, not only are Honolulu cab fares extortionate, but during an island-wide transit strike, pretty much impossible to get.

[CreekDog]

59. It's one thing to cross a picket line --My bigger problem with the OP is blaming the strikers

for being inconvenienced.

if you need to cross a picket line because your health or whatever is in danger for not doing so, then go for it.

but don't gripe that you were uncomfortable. none of those people are being paid to be out there striking (strike pay is not the equivalent of a paycheck).

[MedicalAdmin]

23. Absolutely.

The company decided not to cash checks. Do you somehow magically think that cash checking stopped because the UNION did it? Puhlease.

Epic failure in logic.

[blondeatlast]

5. Why isn't "wheelchair guy" blaming Safeway Corp? That's a management decision,

based on a lack of qualified manpower to perform the service due to the strike that Safeway could have prevented. SAFEWAY made the strike happen by failing to negotiate fairly with the union.

Is that really that difficult to understand?

[laundry_queen]

31. That's what I was thinking.

Complain to management. Tell them you support the workers and won't support a company that won't negotiate in good faith therefore disrupting your life. The more complaints they get, the more likely they are to feel the heat and get back to the negotiating table.

[sufrommich]

6. So go to a different store. You're getting dirty looks because

you're crossing their picket line, what do you expect, flowers?

[Robb]

7. Try not crossing the picket line.

If you are inconvenienced, perhaps you should consider blaming the management of the store for not providing its employees with reasonable compensation for their work.

[MattBaggins]

56. Sneak in the back instead

[CreekDog]

8. I didn't realize people worked for yours and others' charity

I have this silly notion that people are being paid for their labors and are not required to work for less than they feel is fair compensation.

Apparently you think work is PR thing.

:wtf:

[gvstn]

11. Union workers

Only have the tool of a strike as leverage against an employer. The point of a strike is to make customers aware that management is offering a contract that workers find unacceptable. A dirty look may be uncomfortable for you but that is the point. If the strikers smile and wave then there is little chance you will reconsider breaking the picket line.

These days with so few fellow union members it is very likely that few people care about crossing picket lines. Picketing union workers are looked at like fringe crazies rather than organized workers fighting to maintain their standard of living. You should be happy they are willing to actually go out on strike as the contract they win helps keep other employers from trying to cut wages and benefits. If as a group they must give in then what bargaining power does an individual have?

I worked in a grocery store for years. In truth these contract negotiations are over very small amounts of money. 15-25 cents an hour increase per year for 3 years. Or overnight shifts not getting a 10% premium for working the graveyard shift. Or these days more likely increases in copays for medical/prescription coverage. These things matter. And are worth fighting over.

If at all possible you should consider going to another store. If nobody supports the unions then all manual labor jobs would eventually end up paying minimum wage with no benefits. Someone working at a retail job should be able to live modestly and have decent health insurance. If people only supported union shops then even convenience stores would have to pay clerks a living wage and provide insurance benefits. That would be a good thing not a bad thing.

[Starry Messenger]

26. +1000

[Brickbat]

29. This is a great post. Thanks for taking the time to put it together.

:thumbsup: Welcome to DU, sister/brother!

[blondeatlast]

35. Exactly--thank you for a great response. nt

[Tatiana]

39. Well said! n/t

[myrna minx]

72. Excellent post.

:applause:

[NNN0LHI]

12. Friends don't let friends cross picket lines

[pintobean]

13. How are you, for the most part, pro-union?

Crossing a picket line and complaining about a very mild reaction seems anti-union to me.

[TBF]

14. I won't cross a picket line - there are other grocery stores. nt

[Greyhound]

15. Your entire post is founded on not supporting a union, but you're pro-union...

perhaps you are the one that needs to examine your position.
:eyes:
:kick: & U

[JVS]

16. Yes it is fair that you get glares and dirty looks.

If strikes didn't interfere with daily activities, they wouldn't be effective at all. Shop somewhere else.

[Johonny]

17. depends where you live I guess

if you have no choice but to cross the line cause you got to eat then probably not. If you live in an area with options then... depends how liberal you are I guess. When unions ask me to support them by not crossing their lines, I try to help out.

[JVS]

18. How do you feel about politicians who are for the most part pro-LGBTQ rights but angry when it...

could cost them votes to actually do something?

[blondeatlast]

19. Roon, tell us how you've supported unions in the past, if I may ask?

I find your OP puzzling, to say the least. I also note that no one has supported you in this thread yet and am curious as to your reaction to that.

[Brickbat]

21. Yes, it's fair. It's part of the power they have. A strike is not meant to be convenient.

That's the whole point.

[Hannah Bell]

22. oooh, dirty looks when you break a picket line? how terrible for you.

it's *safeway's* choice not to cash the checks. they're still selling groceries, aren't they? if safeway closed their store because it wasn't profitable, would the guy in the wheelchair "have a different view" of safeway? when safeway checkers' pay goes down, that guy's disability check is also threatened.

[CreekDog]

25. You say you are pro-union, you just think people should work no matter the circumstance

and you cite your inconvenience as justification for this.

wow.

[tkmorris]

30. Well stated. Quite succinct.

I've been too busy spluttering over the OP to get my thoughts into words.

[proud2BlibKansan]

32. Wow is correct

[blondeatlast]

36. No kidding.

One of the more :wtf:ish OPs that I've read lately.

[Romulox]

43. That's similar to claiming you are a union-supporter, then bragging on DU about buying a Toyota!

:shrug:

[Codeine]

71. Nobody here would be so tone-deaf as to do THAT!

snort.

[Citizen Worker]

27. The purpose of a strike and picket line is to call to the attention of the public the unfairness on

part of the employer and to ask the public not to patronize until the issues are resolved.

The decision of the store to not cash Social Security checks until the strike ended was a decision reached by management not by Labor and it was made to punish Labor in the eyes of the public.

In 1989 Safeway defensively locked out its workers in response to a targeted strike against another smaller chain. Some stores refused to engage in the lockout and said they would agree to the contract negotiated by the Union and the one or two smaller chain stores. I haven't patronized a Safeway since and I won't. There are any number of alternatives to patronizing an unfair employer.

[earth mom]

28. You should NOT have crossed the picket line in the first place. That is WRONG. nt

[Unrepentant Fenian]

34. Anybody who crosses a picketline deserves what they get!

[lame54]

37. Shouldn't he be pissed at Safeway?

[Name removed]

38. Deleted message

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[laughingliberal]

40. A pro-union poster who doesn't support union action. The double speak is strong in this one .nt

[Dyedinthewoolliberal]

41. Did you forget the

sarcasm thingy?

[Ikonoklast]

42. Holy shit, where do I even start with this one?

I was a UFCW member for twenty-four years, and have walked more than one picket line in my life, and you are angered that you got a few 'dirty looks' as you supported scabs and management as you crossed a picket line?

On some of the lines I was on, if that's all you got, you were lucky. Sorry to ruin your day, as you help management steal my livelihood by supporting strike-breakers.

There are no other retail food outlets to purchase groceries from? You'll starve to death without crossing a picket line?

If you were inconvenienced a tad, TOUGH SHIT. You're only pro-union when it suits you? You are not pro-union in any way that matters.

But, you are the angry one, aren't you, as those employees fight for their paychecks and benefits.

And what does a management decision to stop cashing checks have to do with a strike? Do the striking workers have some sort of magical power to control the check-cashing abilities of the store?

[Romulox]

44. Awwww...just drive the Camry over to Whole Foods. Problem solved!

(MY) Union Yes! :hi:

[CreekDog]

45. you seem to ask this question a lot:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=7235531&mesg_id=7235531

"Roon
Tue Dec-15-09 03:59 PM
Original message
Sorry union grocers..i am not going to walk an extra 3.5 miles

so you can get your .50 raise. I will proudly cross your picket line to get what I need to stay alive.
http://www.9news.com/news/article.aspx?storyid=128878&c...

This thread now goes on ignore."

[Brickbat]

46. Ha, it looks like I put him on ignore in that thread. So why do I see him now?

[Scruffy1]

52. Must have been a long strike lol.

[blondeatlast]

54. Nice work, CD! Thank you, thank you, thank you.

I thought something didn't smell good here...

[myrna minx]

73. Wow - this seems like a very familiar theme with this poster. n/t

[fishwax]

88. ah, but he's for the most part pro-union

[unapatriciated]

47. Why are you crossing the picket line do you really have no other choice?

I worked for Safeway and was in the 03 strike.
Our store was located in Mammoth Lakes (a major ski resort in the CA Sierras) we were the only grocery store in town and the politest picket line due to our unique situation. We got glares from residents, visitors, angry taunts and endured undue harassment from our local police department. Some of the higher ups in our community considered our picket line (during ski season) to be a blight on their town) and did whatever they could to break it using our local bank and police department (both of these are big no no's and backfield on them). Our fight was not just for us but for those who would be hired later during the contract. We did not want a two tier wage and benefit (second class worker) contract for very good reasons. Most of our local working class supported our strike and formed car pools to drive the forty miles to the next town to buy weakly groceries, we had a Rite Aid in town and prescriptions could be filled there. The local working class would also put together monthly trips to Carson City NV (150 miles away) to do larger shopping. You know who crossed our lines? Those locals who could afford to drive the 40 miles to Bishop, they were also the ones to use our police department to harass us, they did not count on us knowing the law regarding strikes and using it. We fought their unjust subpoenas for trespassing and won. I, hubby and others were served with protective stay away orders regarding the picket line (our manager's son was a major football star and a local police lieutenant was the coach). To be a legal strike the line must have at least one picket there during all store hours. They were trying to make our strike illegal and almost succeeded.


At least the guy in the wheelchair understood and sympathized with the strikers, I bet if he had asked one of them to help him find another place to cash his check they would have been glad to help. Too bad you didn't bother to ask one of the strikers why they were on strike, maybe you would have had a different view of them. You do realize the average grocery clerk makes less than 50k a year (gross) and if you think the job is easy think again?

[Raine]

48. No way in hell would I ever cross a picket line

and if I did I deserve to get dirty looks and worse! :mad:

[pintobean]

49. "The grocery union is one union I wouldn't mind seeing fade away."

Roon - Thu Jun-10-10 09:51 AM
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=389&topic_id=8522541#8528711

[Starry Messenger]

51. >:(

Well, there is a non-union Whole Foods in Denver right around the corner from the Safeway. He can go exploit workers and pay outrageously high prices for goat cheese at the same time.

[Name removed]

53. Deleted message

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[mtnester]

81. That's gonna leave a mark...eom

[LWolf]

50. The last time there was a strike going on in my area

was in '04, if I recall. I respected that picket line and went to a grocery store not involved in the strike to get my groceries. I stopped by a few times to chat with, and walk with, the strikers to show my support.

It was the Democratic thing to do. I support labor.

[blondeatlast]

55. POST. RUN. REPEAT. A lot, see CreekDog (post 45) and pintobean's (49) responses above.

Nice work, guys, and I've alerted.

[pintobean]

57. I can't even find when Denver grocery workers were on strike

They came close last year and in '04. My search did find this:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x2328357#2328365

Roon Wed Sep-08-04 10:06 PM
Response to Original message
1. This is exactly why..
I oppose unions. So now I have to cross a picket line to put food in my house. Or I could walk 3 miles to the closest non-union grocery store.
SUPPORT ELITCH WAL-MART!!



Roon Thu Sep-09-04 07:28 AM
Response to Reply #7
9. These bag boys and cashiers

will sneer at me when I try to get something to eat.

[CreekDog]

60. But the OP said they were "generally pro union" but that post you quote says they "oppose unions"

apparently the OP is also angered when there are no picket lines.

[blondeatlast]

63. Note that they still haven't made a single response, either.

Let's see, what kind of critters are afraid of the light?

[CreekDog]

64. Maybe they got delayed --perhaps they've been waiting for customer service at Wal Mart

Non union customer service at Wal Mart is hecka awesome! :eyes:

[blondeatlast]

65. LOL! nt

[CreekDog]

61. Elitch is practically in downtown Denver --I call BS on having to walk 3 miles for groceries

http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&client=firefox-a&hs=mLn&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&q=elitch+,+co&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=wl

what on earth is going on here?

[Starry Messenger]

80. Oh so, there isn't even a strike going on at Denver's Safeway.

Well this thread has been revealing.

[closeupready]

58. I wouldn't cross a picket line.

If I really had no choice, then I guess I would - like a weather-related emergency or some other urgent matter - but I would feel horrible about it. I try to keep myself prepared so that I can exercise more discretion than that, however.

[ProudDad]

62. If you truly care about unions -- find another grocery...

:shrug:

Or join the line and they might feed you...

Working People DON'T cross picket lines...

[EmeraldCityGrl]

66. Refusing to cross a picket line is one of the most simple

ways to support workers rights. No one is asking you to
march in the streets, write your Congress or be proactive
in any other way. Unfortunately, a better life for people
sometimes requires us to "interfere with my day to day living."

[CreekDog]

67. Is anybody able to verify Safeway grocery strikes now and back in June?

is he living in Denver or France?

[coalition_unwilling]

68. You are not pro-union. Welcome to my Ignore list - n/t

[CreekDog]

79. the poster said previously they "oppose unions"

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=104&topic_id=2328357&mesg_id=2328365

"Roon

Wed Sep-08-04 08:06 PM

1. This is exactly why...

I oppose unions"

[DainBramaged]

69. (sigh) Sorry you were inconvenienced

I guess the fight to keep our middle class is not nearly as important as your grocery shopping.


You have NO idea how angry posts like this make me.

:mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :puke:

and as with many others here, you deserve to be permanently ignored.

Buh bye, when lower wages become the norm, I truly hope you are at the top of the list.

[Codeine]

70. Which side are you on, boys? Which side are you on?

Pro-union Democrats do not cross picket lines.

[Iggo]

75. We had grocery store strikes here in SoCal 5 or 6 years ago.

One chain was the designated neutral, and we had to shop there. Granted, it's a lot easier to do in suburban SoCal than some other places. Still, because we are pro union, we shopped where the union said it was okay and didn't shop where they said it wasn't okay. That's the way it is.

[Raine]

83. Yes and it went on for several months and over the holidays

I have a market across the street but it had a picket line so I went much farther to a store that was acceptable to the union. No way would I have crossed that picket line even though shopping there was much more convenient for me.

[blondeatlast]

76. B,b,but this is a GROCERY union! It's different! Grocery workers

live and breathe to serve Roon and his (black/Jewish/gay/handicappedfemale) friend. How on earth could anyone fail to see that considering his history of posting against GROCERY unions?

(See pintobean and CreekDog's posts with links above.)

[JVS]

89. This topic really needs one of those cartoons from theonion by Kelly

[tinkerbell41]

74. Really?

I find it fascinating that you use a pink triangle as your avatar, and I assume you are gay and or support gay rights. So, equality for some and none for others??? This is a question I've had for years, being a union member myself, the guys I work with support worker rights, but you can vote no
on supporting civil rights, women's rights, really any and all progressive causes.
To me, if you consider yourself a lefty, progressive, then you must support any and all of those causes. I myself find abortion to be wrong, but I would fight to the death for a woman's right to choose, including myself. You really need to rethink your values, or start reading up on labor history.

[Gold Metal Flake]

77. H I T____A N D____R U N____P O S T E R !

One to watch.

[Raine]

84. Yup

never responded even once hmmmm :yoiks:

[Gold Metal Flake]

78. Unrec...nt

[cap]

82. if you are pro-union,

aren't you supposed to not cross a picket line and suffer the inconvenience and go to another grocery store?

Strikes are MEANT to be inconvenient. Yes, the guy in the wheelchair is supposed to go somewhere else to cash his social security check. Safeway is not the only place that cashes these checks. If he has a bank account, his bank will cash the check.

Solidarity for ever!

[boppers]

85. Enough evidence to ignore.

Kicking for others to see.

[blondeatlast]

86. K for SOME response from the OP, who has recently posted in another thread. nt

[NNN0LHI]

90. I'd say let it die

It may have not been the OP original intent but this turned into an educational thread. Not so much about the posters subject either. More about how much credence we should give to someone on an anonymous web site.

Over the years I have learned that you have to really be picky about whether to believe what someone says on the internet or not. And you know something? Even knowing that I still get burned occasionally.

My opinion is that this thread, and the others by the same OP, were for nothing more than reinforcing someone else's incorrect preconceived notions. Propaganda for short.

Don

Edit because I forgot this: :hi:

[fishwax]

87. why be angry at the union rather than management?

:shrug:

[Missy Vixen]

91. We're about to have a grocery strike here

We are fortunate enough to be able to pre-plan for most of our needs, for the short term. We also made a trip to the local grocery store last night to assure those we know that work there that we will not be crossing the picket line, and we support them.

Collective bargaining is the way to go, and it's one of the bedrocks of the Democratic Party - support for the working man.