A few suggestions for those who are flying for Thanksgiving:

[MineralMan]

As we've all seen, this new screening strategy is generating a lot of anger and insecurity. If you're going to travel by air this Thanksgiving, you're going to want to minimize the hassle and get through security with a minimum of fuss, I'm sure. Here are a few suggestions to help that happen, from a very experienced traveler:

1. Be extra careful in your preparations and packing for the flight. Double check your carry-on bags and purses for prohibited items. This is not a good week to forget something.

2. Dress for the flight. Avoid pants with metal buttons. Zippers should be OK, but if you're concerned, wear something like running warm-up pants. In fact, lots of travelers wear running outfits to fly. They're comfy, warm, and don't beep the metal detector. Forget the clever TSA joke t-shirts and other such things. They aren't as funny as you think, and will get extra attention. For women, skirts aren't working out well with the x-ray scanner, and may get you a secondary body search. Leave the underwire bra at home or pack it. Wear something with no metal in it, instead. Minimize jewelry and other items that may show up on the scan and send you to the secondary pat-down. If you have joint replacements, you're going to get the pat-down, so expect it. If you have body piercings that can't be removed, you're going to get a pat-down. If they can be removed easily, it's a good idea to do so. If you have one of those cool document carriers that hangs around your neck, take it off and hold it in your hand as you approach the x-ray scanner. If it's hanging there, you'll get a pat-down.

3. Have your boarding pass and photo ID in your hand as you approach the ID check. Just hand it to the checker with a smile and keep looking in his or her direction. They check to make sure it's you. You can put the ID away, once it's checked, but keep the boarding pass where you can instantly get it to show other TSA workers.

4. Try to avoid looking panicky, annoyed, angry, or fearful. All of these could get you "patted down." Just be business-like and follow all the instructional signs and listen to what the TSA folks are saying. Be attentive and efficient, even if you're an infrequent traveller. Watch the people ahead of you and familiarize yourself with the procedures, so you won't have to fumble around if you lack experience. There's plenty of time. The lines move slowly. At every stage of the screening process, look at and pay attention to the TSA people you encounter. They may tell you something you need to do. If you aren't paying attention, they have to repeat it. You aren't getting through the security screening until whatever needs to be done is done.

5. Keep smart comments, wisecracks, TSA jokes, and angry insults to yourself. Words like "grope," "porno-scanner" and "Jack-booted thugs" are not a good idea, and will get you unwanted attention. Sharing them with TSA personnel won't help smooth your screening one bit. On those busy travel days, and with the increase screening attention, they'll have heard it all and will be very, very tired of it. You don't want their frustrations to be vented on you for any reason. Try to smile and be as polite as you can. If you have an uneventful screening, a polite thank you to whomever is interacting with you will be welcome. It's a tough day for the screeners, too, and they'll be happy to select you for additional screening if you act like a jerk. That's guaranteed.

6. If you are selected for additional screening, or if you opt not to go through the x-ray scanner, just follow whatever instructions are given and keep a relaxed and calm demeanor. You haven't done anything wrong, so there's nothing to worry about. Your carry-on items could get searched and swabbed, as could your hands. If you end up getting the enhanced body search, it'll be over in a very short time, and you'll be on your way.

7. Gather your stuff from the x-ray machine belt and carry it out of the screening area. You'll find seats just outside the area where you can put your shoes back on and get everything where it belongs. Don't hang around inside the screening area. It just slows down the process for everyone else.

8. Go to your gate, get a snack, buy a magazine, and get ready to enjoy your flight.

You don't like this screening stuff? Join the crowd. I don't either. Nobody does. What you do will determine how smoothly it goes. So, you might as well get it over with the least hassle possible, right? If you fly, you have to cope with it. There's no other option.

[MadHound]

1. BE GOOD LITTLE SHEEPLE. n/t

Those who trade liberty for security deserve neither.

[MineralMan]

6. If you're going to fly, my advice will get you through the screening

uneventfully. If you're not going to fly, it doesn't matter. The procedures are in place. You're not flying until you go through them. It is that simple. If you fly, you might as well make it as simple for yourself as possible. I understand that you're not flying. You don't need the information, then.

[MadHound]

11. No, I'm not flying, and I urge everyone else not to fly either,

And while your list of tips is helpful, it is the fact that you are so willing to submit to whatever outrageous actions TSA comes up with that I find so laughably galling. It is nothing more than instructions for being good sheeple. Congratulations, Osama won.

[MineralMan]

16. Whatever, Madhound. I'm going to visit my 86-year-old parents.

Could be the last time I ever see them. I will do what's necessary to do that. You may choose to do as you wish. My tips are not for you. You're not flying.

[sufrommich]

32. So anyone who wants to be with faraway loved ones on

Thanksgiving is "sheeple" now? Got it.

[nadinbrzezinski]

60. When I do, it will be THROUGH A FOREIGN AIRPORT

I got that option, and while inconvenient as hell... I refuse to get assaulted for the privilege.

Oh and their security is not theater.

If anybody has that option... it is worth considering.

I also highly recommend people contact congress and raise hell, oh and the airlines and POINT OUT why you are NOT flying into or out or in the US.

[jberryhill]

67. Security Theater!

Whose turn is it to take the shot?

[Manifestor_of_Light]

96. Take the bus to Mexico.

Houston to Monterey -- 12 hours -- leaves 5 times a day $53.00 one way.

www.gruposenda.com

Houston to Mexico City -- $112.00 one way.

[nadinbrzezinski]

111. Oh trust me, there are reasons I would not

they have to do with the war on drugs. Hell, it is not my favorite thing to do TJ due to it, but...

[a la izquierda]

171. Do you have any, ANY idea how stupid this suggestion is?

It is incredibly dangerous to cross the border anywhere is south Texas right now. My neighbors are Mexican and they will not be traveling south for Christmas, as they have to cross at Brownsville.
The university I attend is routinely discouraging travel to northern Mexico, and denying travel funds to certain spots.

So no thanks, when I go to Mexico in January, I think I'll fly. I fly out of an airport that has neither enhanced patdowns nor full-body scanners. And when I fly in from Mexico, they actually screen people properly.

[krabigirl]

160. agree with you.

[HuckleB]

13. +1

[Bonobo]

136. Not necessarily true, but I can understand why a caucasian might get that fallacious idea.

nt

[ZombieHorde]

144. Oh, you little fibber.

You said n/t, but there is text! Shame upon you, shame upon your house, shame upon your lineage!

[End Of The Road]

2. I agree with all but one thing...

And that's the sweatsuit. No way am I going to wear anything with an elastic waist, due to reports that TSA agents have actually put their hands inside the pants of some wearing sweatsuits. I've got slacks with nylon zipper, no metal, and I think I'm opting for those.

But I've been thinking about how I'm going to handle things next week, and you've certainly brought up some ideas I hadn't yet thought about. THANKS!

[MineralMan]

9. Those will work fine. I wear an uncharacteristic set of dress slacks

when I fly, just for that reason. There is zero metal on me when I go through security. Zero. Nothing but underwear and outerwear. Pockets are empty, too. I haven't gotten beeped for years.

[CreekDog]

140. Well at least you can take all the metal off you...many of us can't

and get checked for explosives because we set off metal detectors.

hello?

unpleasant? you decide. but either way it's just the most mind-numbingly stupid procedures ever.

:banghead:

[woo me with science]

3. Better yet, take Amtrak. nt

[End Of The Road]

5. ...and arrive at your destination after the holiday is over... nt

[PeaceNikki]

18. Hardly ever realistic. Milwaukee to Orlando on Amtrak?

2 days worth of travel at triple the cost.

[leftstreet]

4. You make TSA workers sound like das Gestapo

Nothing could be further from the truth

You sure you're an experienced traveler?

[MineralMan]

14. Not at all. I've found the TSA workers to be professional, helpful,

and polite on every flight I've taken. It's the passengers who are inattentive, unprepared, and sometimes insolent and rude. The TSA workers are fine. They're trying to get people through the screening as efficiently as they can. They're not your buddy or your enemy...they're just doing what's required.

And I'm a very experienced flyer, thanks.

[LisaL]

21. If only we could get rid of passengers.

Just think how happy everybody would be.

[MineralMan]

29. As you please, LisaL. If you've been on a flight, you know that

what I'm saying is true. 90% of the slowdowns in security screening are caused by passengers, not the TSA. Just watch sometime. It's people not paying attention or blustering that slow everything down. The smart traveler just goes through security and into the departure area with no muss and no fuss. If everyone did that, it would all go a lot smoother.

[CreekDog]

142. Wrong. It's taking 10 minutes inspecting old ladies in wheelchairs

and guys with knee replacements and so forth and so on.

[TheWatcher]

168. but he's never seen that with his own eyes, nor heard of it happening

So it doesn't exist.

[Pholus]

88. Well they got rid of me as a passenger. Prediction: Airlines beg congress for another bailout.

[leftstreet]

36. But you blathered on for hours up there about not looking 'wrong' at workers

Not attracting their sinister attention!

??

NOW you change your perspective?

[sally cat]

52. Yeah. Don't make eye contact, they think that's a challenge and will grope even harder.

[LisaL]

56. But if you don't look at them wouldn't they think you are hiding

something?

[nadinbrzezinski]

63. This raises an important point

they SHOULD look at you in the eye...

[LisaL]

65. Before or after pat down?

[nadinbrzezinski]

68. Without sexual battery or scatter x-rays or any of this bullshit

basic security, which we do not have.

Ok it is better than before 9.11, they do check some cargo

Now if they insist on this bullshit, at least buy dinner.

[jberryhill]

69. Because you may get the one that is having a bad day

The one YOU get will be the one that had a fight with his/her spouse that morning, ran out of gas on the way to work, and had three guys call him an "asshole".

That guy - he's the one for whom you are next.

[CreekDog]

143. take the inspections in public view and if anything untoward is happening demand help

.

[pipi_k]

176. I got one of those on my way back into the US from Canada back in 1989....

On the border between Canada and Vermont.

The guy had a real shitty attitude to start. My companion and I just looked at each other like, WTF???

Asshole customs agent decides we're "suspicious" and becomes an even bigger asshole, which causes my friend and I to look even more puzzled.

Finally he tells us to pull over for closer inspection. They tear the car apart and get even more suspicious when they can't get the trunk of the car open because my friend doesn't have the key...they go through the back seat and find nothing except a bunch of motor oil that we couldn't even get to which was why we only spent one night in Canada, because the car was leaking oil and it was $5.00 per liter then and getting expensive so we decided to come back home.

In the meantime, we each get taken to a little area where we're told to undress down to our underwear and even though my friend got a man and I got a woman, it was still embarrassing.

What did they find?

NOTHING.

Harassment of US citizens trying to get back home.

We just barely got an apology.

All because one fucking jerk had a hair across his ass that day.

Meanwhile, I'll bet that at least three people who HAD done something illegal probably slid right through while Customs were harassing us.

Brilliant.

[hedgehog]

78. I agree with your commnets here and the OP. Thanks for taking some of the heat!

[jberryhill]

24. I can imagine that a few of them may be a little tense over the holiday

With a lot of inexperience travelers, and probably more than a few "snappy" comments, there are enough TSA employees that, statistically, a few of them might lose their perspective near the end of a shift.

[flpab]

45. I work at an airport

We had 24 wheel chairs the other night on an MD88, Grandparents visiting for the holiday. There are tons of people that are rookies this time of the year but we are use to it. I work at a great small airport and if your nice to us we will bend over backwards to help you with anything. I have seen some real jerks though be rude and mean to gate agents, tsa, car rental agents, the skycaps, flight attendants, etc. Tip those skycaps, feel bad when they have a huge person with tons of stuff, an animal, can't put their own shoes back on etc and give them a dollar or nothing. Pack your bag and then take half out. Why do people pack like there are no washing machines in the hotel or laundry service. 25.00 for that first checked bag unless you are flying southwest.
I love Amtrak also.

[jberryhill]

71. The special services transport people ROCK!

My blind daughter travels with her partner who has MS and is in a wheelchair.

Together the two of them are pretty mobile. My daughter pushes and her partner navigates.

But they get fantastic assistance from the special services transport folks.

[MineralMan]

97. They do rock! My mother-in-law is 82, has two knee replacments,

and walks with canes. She flies a couple of times a year to her old home town to visit old friends. My wife gets a pass to accompany her to her gate, but the nice people at MSP are great. They show up with a wheelchair, and she gets checked in a room with some privacy. My wife says the TSA people have never been anything but respectful and polite to her. She gets help through the entire process by someone. She's a real sweetie, but they seem to go out of their way to help the old folks deal with the process. A similar thing happens at the other airport when she returns. Maybe it's the midwest or something, but the TSA here in the Twin Cities is great. Very professional and courteous.

[CreekDog]

141. Every year TSA workers subject me to more unpleasant screening

and I'm no more a threat than I was a decade ago.

i get the once, twice and three times over each time i fly and somehow it just gets worse each year and after a couple of months ago, i didn't think it could get much worse --but it has.

i don't really care who or what kind of people TSA workers are, one can't generalize anyway...the point is i hate being around them with a passion because i'm selected for increasingly unpleasant inspections while they let people who can get thru the metal detector thru without and cargo as well.

so not only is it unpleasant, and some of the workers mean and rude, it's serving no purpose in keeping me safe.

[saigon68]

172. They can be rude---I've seen it

Many couldn't pour piss out of a boot if the instructions were written on the heel

[spooked911]

173. you're saying they aren't???

They are certainly fucking acting like it, lately.

[veganlush]

7. good advice.

[CaliforniaPeggy]

8. Good thoughts, my dear MineralMan...

And not just for Thanksgiving.

In the meantime, let's raise holy hell to our Congresscritters about the goddamn tactics of the TSA. We need that stuff changed.

:hi:

[LisaL]

10. Well if everybody follows the MM suggestions and doesn't make

waves, why would anything change?

[CaliforniaPeggy]

17. Because change won't happen there, at the scanners.

Change has to come from the Congress.

That's why.

I did say we need to get in touch with our Congresscritters, because they have the power to change these procedures.

[LisaL]

19. If everybody is happy, meekly follows directions and doesn't

complain, why exactly would Congress want to do anything?

[HuckleB]

23. So what should people do at the TSA check points?

What are you suggesting?

:shrug:

[LisaL]

28. They can be patting each other down?

[HuckleB]

30. Uh huh.

That's your big plan?

[CaliforniaPeggy]

39. Obviously, not everybody is happy...

If you're reading, or watching the news, you know that the security measures have caused a lot of complaints.

I'm hopeful that the Congress will listen.

[FreeJoe]

170. Exactly...

Don't make it easy for them. Make it a challenge. Where a cup. Complain loudly and bitterly. You have a first amendment right to tell them what you think. If everyone just bows, whimpers, and does what they're told, nothing will change. If people stand up to them, they'll eventually back down.

[MineralMan]

20. The time to make waves is between flights. Nothing you do the

day you fly will change a thing. You either want to get through security smoothly or you don't. Most people just want to get on with their trip.

When I'm not flying, I'll try to get things changed. On the day I fly, I do as I described. You can do as you please, but could you please get behind me in line? I don't really want the hassle of being slowed up. Thanks.

[LisaL]

26. That's too bad, because I have decided not to get into the

x-ray scanner after seeing reports of passengers being scanned and then patted anyway. So if being scanned doesn't guarantee no pat down, I am just going to start with pat down, and if that slows you down, so be it.

[MineralMan]

33. Do as you please. I'm making suggestions, not giving orders.

Everyone will do as they please. I don't really care what you do, frankly. Enjoy your trip.

[jberryhill]

43. That's only if you are selected

One thing I haven't seen are numbers on percentage selected.

I find the choice between "new x-ray device" and "uncomfortable frisk" to be distasteful to the extent that I feel stupid even having to make a choice like that.

I guess I would flip a coin... oh shit, I don't have any coins in my pocket.

[LisaL]

53. You better not have a coin in your pocket.

Because if you are x-rayed and it shows a coin in your pocket you will be patted down as well.

[MineralMan]

93. See my suggestions. Empty your pockets and put everything in

one of the outside pockets of your carry-on. Simple.

[jberryhill]

158. If you think about it

The scan can't be a guarantee of not being patted down.

The point of the scan is to find items in or under clothing. Quite obviously if it looks like there may be a suspicious item, then there is going to be a physical step of locating it and determining what it is

[jberryhill]

40. There are plenty of waves being made

I believe we are going to see hearings on this in pretty short order.

People ARE complaining to their representatives.

And, if not that, there will be a suit for injunctive relief in short order.

Raising a ruckus at the checkpoint is, in my opinion, not a good idea for a number of reasons.

He's not saying "don't make waves". He is saying "this list may be helpful to you at the checkpoint".

Absolutely make waves. If you have not actually called your senators' and representative's office, that's a wave you can make - right now.

[damntexdem]

12. And remember: turkeys can't fly.

So they don't get groped.

;-)

[readmoreoften]

15. No. Don't wear running pants. You'll feel the hands of the TSA agents. Wear heavy fabrics.

I'm not wearing cloth pants and underwear so I can feel every wiggle of their fingertips on my junk. I'm wearing thick jeans and thick, tight underwear.

[MineralMan]

22. That's fine, I suppose. I'm not particularly sensitive about being

touched. The jeans, though, may have enough metal in them to be a problem. They've done that for me, and I wear jeans most of the time.

[readmoreoften]

83. Yeah, well, I'm not into being touched genitally by strangers. I'd rather not feel it, thanks.

[Codeine]

34. If they're touching me I might as well feel it.

Gotta get something out of it. :evilgrin:

[LisaL]

58. Then, if you are female, wear a short skirt.

Kilt if male.

[SoCalDem]

25. and

stop packing so much damned stuff to take with you!!

Most people pack like they are going to be marooned for a month.

Wherever you are going (most places, at least), there will be someplace where you can buy shampoo, toothbrushes, and just about anything you could possibly need.

* "poor" people who cannot afford to buy the small size of their favorite "stuff" at their destination, are usually not flying much these days.

Leave your "gems" & watches at home..
...wear them and you'll have to keep removing them
...pack them, and someone might steal them
...the people at your destination won't love you less because you are not fully-adorned

[HuckleB]

27. +1,00,000,000,000 ....

[Codeine]

37. Fucking wisdom, SoCalDem.

People haul a metric shitload of stuff everywhere they go. Simplify!

[CreekDog]

145. that won't do me a damned bit of good

sorry. if anything i'm expert at this and all that advice in the OP and from you...none of it speeds me up and NONE of it gets me anything less than the full workover from TSA --at least as far as my body.

and i used to be quite pleasant about it, and then these past couple years, it's gotten so ridiculous that i can't grin and be chummy while it's going on because i hate it.

[Warren DeMontague]

151. Business travelers refusing to check their bags and laptops have really fucked things up.

I know, I know this goes on, because I know a bunch of them. Absolutely, positively, refuse to check anything on an airplane. Ever. So you have this battle to the death for the overhead bin space.

[jberryhill]

31. Laptop removed from bag and in a separate bin by itself

I can't imagine what shouting that for eight hours does to a person.

[MineralMan]

35. Really. How long has that been the rule? You'd think we'd know it by heart.

There are signs everywhere, too. And yet...

[TwilightGardener]

47. Well...er...some of us haven't been on a plane since 1994...

I wouldn't know what to do with a laptop.

[MineralMan]

99. There will be signs in the airport telling you that you need to

remove it and place it in its own bin. There will probably be a TSA agent near the belt to the xray machine who will remind you if you forget. That's what normally happens.

[CreekDog]

147. there's a lot to remember while people are barking at you

and some of us are also preparing for the inevitable pat down too.

in my case, that involves having NOTHING on me or in my pockets before the metal detector, which is quite a trick considering moments before i need to have my id and papers out to get through that check.

[sally cat]

57. What? You really don't fly much, do you? Yet you lecture on and on about this.

[jberryhill]

73. I think you need to read the words with a different emphasis

As in:

Really? (people don't know this)

How long has this been the rule? (as in, people should know this by now)

[MineralMan]

100. You misread my post. I was remarking on how odd it was that

people didn't know about that rule. There are signs all over the place telling you that, as well. You misunderstood me, so I must not have been clear enough.

[jberryhill]

62. They could do a better job of providing instructions

You know that some airports are better than others at that.

Most of the checkpoints at Frankfurt have big screen TV's with an animated loop illustrating procedures and not dependent on knowing any particular language.

Vegas has celebrities in their video, which is attention getting and funny, but English only.

The critical path, in terms of speed, is people who either don't know the laptop rule, incorrectly estimate the number of bins they need, or stay at the bin stack until they are done.

If you are going to need three bins - (a) jacket, glasses, watch, purse, shoes; (b) carry on bag (c) laptop - then if you take three as a stack, keep moving, fill each as you go, things can move pretty smoothly.

Another item I would add is avoid contact with the side of the metal detector, and aim for the center. Close proximity or contact with the side is likely to trigger a false positive.

But, really, habits you've picked up that make it a relatively low-hassle process, are things that people are just not born knowing, and which are not communicated clearly. As a reaction, they get tense, and things go downhill from there. It's not a natural environment, any more than learning some tap dance routine from a movie adaptation of a Kafka story.

People also have different cognitive and interpretive style. Simple rule - "No liquids" - right? Well, there was a thread a while back where someone had bought a snow globe as a gift on a trip, and had it taken by the TSA. That's a shame, since she figured "Well, sure it has liquid, but it is obviously a snow globe, and is totally sealed anyway". I can understand that, because most people just see things from their own POV, and are not going to look at the other side of it and realize that nobody can make a list of all of the things in the world that contain liquid, for the definitive list of "things that have liquid in them but are still okay". One can never be too clear.

Then there is the whole category of specialized equipment. My son took a flight to, of all things, a paintball competition. Now, I ask you, between the combat clothing, a gun like object and spare parts, a compressed gas cylinder, etc. do you know, off the top of your head, what's going to work as carry-on or not be seized as checked luggage? The paintball organizations, fortunately, have specific information on their sites, but I can easily see someone putting their paintball gun in a carry-on thinking, "it's not a firearm".

There are a lot of people flying, and collectively they carry a lot of weird stuff with them.

[CreekDog]

146. and yelling at people to take off their shoes when in fact they don't need to

but yell at them anyway. talk to us like we're stupid.

not all tsa is like this...but how many does it take?

:eyes:

[jberryhill]

157. Flip side of the coin...

Is that a lot of self absorbed people - not in the bad way, but just lost in their thoughts - didn't actually hear it when it was shouted several times, and don't take off their shoes when they get there. The TSAoids are shouting it so that people further back in the line hear it, and probably do get the impression that, collectively, people are stupid or they are not shouting loud enough.

But to depend on people to have to keep shouting the same thing, instead of a calm voice on a recorded loop, is a mind boggler.

[CreekDog]

177. no they made eye contact with me and i was paying close attention to them

there was no need to yell at me to take off shoes when i'm not required to do so.

and did they listen when i told them that...no.

one TSA employees out of all the ones i've dealt with apologized on behalf of her coworkers when i took off my shoes and she told me i didn't need to and i explained to her that TSA agents command me to take them off and are have given me a hard time, i just deal with it.

that's what we're dealing with.

don't apologize for them, i know what i'm talking about.

[peace13]

38. My mother had a lumpectomy last week. What are your suggestions?

She is totally petrified of even showing up at the airport. My guess is that she will stay home!

[sufrommich]

42. I've had a lumpectomy. Tell your mom to explain that to them

ahead of time. Or call the airport yourself and explain the situation.

[End Of The Road]

44. She probably has dissolving stitches

and I wouldn't think they would be any problem -- no metal. But these days, who knows.

[sufrommich]

51. One week after a lumpectomy there is still a lot of

tenderness. Personally, I'd be on the phone with the airport asking them exactly what my mom could expect and whether there are exceptions for post surgery passengers.

[flpab]

49. lumpectomy

Have her tell the person manning the scanner, if it is just a wtmd then she will be ok unless she has a hip or knee replacement. If she alarms then she needs to tell whoever is patting her down that she has a sensitive area. they are suppose to ask her before they start the procedure but if they don't then tell her to tell them.

[jberryhill]

66. In addition to the other suggestions

A note from the doctor wouldn't be a bad idea either.

Not *everyone* gets the full Monte, which I think is a point lost in the discussion. And, no, that doesn't make the search okay, but I think some folks believe this is being done to every passenger. It is a random process, and then adds in people who are selected on specific behaviors.

But as the other said, nobody just jumps on the passenger in a sudden surprise move. I've been secondaried, and they do tell you what they are going to do, and there is an opportunity to explain any special conditions.

[kath]

154. From what I've read, it's NOT random - refuse the Rapiscan, you get the Full Monty Grope -

no exceptions.
Have a knee replacement, Full Monty Grope.

Etc.

[jberryhill]

163. Sigh... Selection for secondary IN THE FIRST PLACE is random

I'll try again.

Not every passenger is being asked to do either of these things. Most passengers are doing the SAME thing that has been going on for years.

Selection for secondary - ie selection for "scan or frisk?" is based on:

1 random selection
2 objective selection factors

The reasons why are results of particular case law on administrative searches.

Okay, so, if you are not selected at random, and if you do not trigger an objective factor (eg set off metal detector twice), then you are not going to be given any choice of secondary at all - you are going to proceed to your gate.

A lot of posts make it seem as if the new procedures are being applied to every passenger. They aren't.

[HuckleB]

82. She should be able to get a physician's letter/explanation.

My MIL did recently. She went through with no problems.

[MineralMan]

116. She should just tell them about it. They understand. People with

recent surgeries travel all the time. She shouldn't be afraid. It'll be fine.

[ProdigalJunkMail]

41. strip naked...tape your boarding pass and ID to your chest

don't even breathe and you MIGHT get past security...oh, but make sure you have had a good bowel movement and empty your bladder before going through so the density of your waste organs don't cause suspicion for 'enhanced' screenings (sounds a bit like enhanced interrogation...does it not?)


sP

[somone]

50. No erections either

Erection = high testosterone = aggressiveness

Maybe people should be blindfolded, to prevent them from looking at other naked people

[Pholus]

89. Sorry, sir. I've heard that the boarding pass has to go through separate too.

[superduperfarleft]

46. Gee thanks, dad. n/t

[remember2000forever]

48. There's $ To Be Made in a "Flying" Outfit

Kinda like the scrubs prisoners wear. Draw string waist, loose top and no metal. Perhaps they could also emblazen the back of this uniform with
PROPERTY OF TSA

[LisaL]

54. With very thick fabric.

[ixion]

55. And remember: There's always time for lubricant.

Enjoy your groping!

[jberryhill]

75. Only if less than three ounces and in a gallon ziplock bag

Otherwise, you're going to have to put your lube in your checked bag.

[MineralMan]

115. Nope. It has to be in a quart bag, not a gallon bag.

If you forget, though, they have the quart bags available for you. No charge. You can transfer your lube to one of those. :rofl:

[jberryhill]

Yeah... Which is why I don't bother with liquids

I pick up lube when I get there.

It's put a damper on the mile high club.

[jberryhill]

133. Yeah... Which is why I don't bother with liquids

I pick up lube when I get there.

It's put a damper on the mile high club.

[Tsiyu]

59. Oh Happy Day

Another "Eat your shit sandwich with a Big Ol Smile!" post.


I'd laugh if I wasn't crying...

[de novo]

61. It is such a bullshit facade of false security.

The new and improved unnecessary measures have open the door to anger, discomfort and complaints. The TSA has brought the consternation and distrust upon themselves. And, we are none the safer for it.

[nadinbrzezinski]

64. The problem is not the tips

and for the record the shoes have some of a reason... sexual battery does not.

The problem is that this is sheer theater that obviously makes MM feel better.

[TheWatcher]

167. It's like a religion with this guy.

it's almost like he's taken on this creepy role of some Loving, Parental, Nanny State Self-Help Sage, to Shepherd all the Lambs through the Hoops and help us not to only accept Big Brother, but even Love Big Brother and the wonderful work it's doing on our Behalf.

The Tony Robbins of the Police State.



The only thing scarier is the people that lap it up like milk in a saucer and follow like adoring puppies.

It is frightening to see what this country is evolving into.

Because the one thing that the Authoritarian Worshipers don't seem to get is that it's not going to stop here.

It will only expand and get more invasive, and incrementally worse.

He says there is a line in the sand for him.

I'll believe it when I see it.

I'd LOVE to hear his tips for transgender individuals, who are very likely to be harassed and abused by this system, and there are already stories of it happening. (All conspiracy kookery, made up, doesn't exist, and exceptions to the rule that should be blissfully ignored so that the TSA can be properly worshiped, of course)

THAT would be a hoot.

[Bonobo]

179. .

:rofl:


:applause:


:patriot:

[Xithras]

70. Screw that. Jam the system.

The best way to get something replaced is to break it.

The TSA is the enemy. Treat them that way.

[remember2000forever]

72. Yeah, And Why Shouldn't We Wear A Protest Tee Shirt?

Oh, I forgot....Baaaaa

[MineralMan]

94. You're not flying, are you? Your suggestion will jam something,

but it will be you that gets jammed. Not my idea of a great start for a trip. I'm betting that if you fly, you'll not jam up anything.

[Xithras]

101. Just get there extra early.

TSA can't boot you for wasting their time.

But no, I'll be driving from the SF Bay Area to Portland specifically because I don't want to deal with the modern bullshit that is air travel. More than anything, I'm protesting with my pocketbook.

But I'll be flying to Atlanta in January. I intend to be annoying as possible then :evilgrin:

Never cooperate with fascism, or the brownshirts who do its dirty work.

[remember2000forever]

129. I was a Flight Attendant for 25 years

AND...Went thru those metal scanners thru-out the world. Guess What! In Saudi they had Dogs for sniffing out explosives. Also...in Morocco.

Guess our new technology is for the betterment of the US people 25 years later?

Be Afraid...Be very afraid....

I did like not the "Baksheesh" thing in the Arab countries. They would send you thru a secondary agent in a small room, after the airport initial security, and she, (being I was a female,) would not let me enter the airline gate before going thru my on board stuff, without me giving the compulsory pack of american cigarettes. She would slowly detain you till you did "Baksheesh". (It didn't have to be cigarettes, perhaps maybe even candy). Still, I'd rather do that today. And that's really a total Bribe! I do miss the old days! That was outragious... however.... No one EVER touched me.

So what's the bribe now? No real physical thefts, except for our personal privacy.

This is a more modern form of Baksheesh! With our modern day airports.....we continue with Baksheech. I gladly gave Morocco my pack of cigarettes to leave me alone. But, it was all in the "shame" of airport security back then. But...Wow! How USA /TSA has evolved! Now it's our privacy that we give behind the curtain.

[Bonobo]

180. Great post. nt

[LibDemAlways]

156. "The TSA is the enemy" Absolutely. Anyone who

advocates meekly submitting to these goons is the kind of person who would have told the people who found themselves on railroad cars heading toward Auschwitz everything was going to be fine if they just obeyed their captors. (I am absolutely not equating the two experiences - just trying to stress that going meekly along is never a good idea when an injustice is being perpetrated.)

[Agony]

74. "You haven't done anything wrong, so there's nothing to worry about."

That statement is about as shallow as it gets.

[Warren DeMontague]

76. And the MOST ridiculous line in the whole ridiculous OP? .... "get ready to enjoy your flight. "

get ready to enjoy your root canal, while you're at it.

It's awful. The amount of money and energy this nation expends on travel, the Powers-that-be could be treating us a little bit more decently. A little bit like human beings.

I may have to fly at some point in the future, but I'm sure as hell going to avoid it at all costs. It just plain sucks, and don't try to tell me "that's just the way it is". They don't need to treat people like garbage. They don't need to cram a bajillion people into the stupid planes. They don't need to use the fasten seat belt sign for crowd control, until half the plane is ready to piss their pants. They don't need to give two bathrooms to the 6 people in First class, and then one half-working one and one broken one in the back of the plane to the rest of us.

The whole think sucks, and if it continues to suck worse and worse, people WILL NOT FLY. Which will HURT THE ECONOMY.

[jberryhill]

79. "They don't need to cram a bajillion people into the stupid planes"

That happens because people will, unfailingly, take the $X savings on a 28 inch seat pitch instead of a somewhat humane 33 inch seat pitch.

People go to cheaptickets.com or whatever website, punch in their trip, and will, without fail, click on the lowest price.

Those site don't even bother to list the aircraft and seating dimensions, so the only thing airlines can compete on, and stay alive, is price.

If you can carry 300 people from LGA-LAX at $120, and I can carry 200 MUCH more comfortable people from LGA-LAX at $180, then you and I are going to make the same amount of money per trip, but I'm going to be out of business in a month.

There is NO way that people will click on that $180, when that $120 is right next to it on the menu, no matter how much more space is on the plane.

Remember the "victory" of airline de-regulation? Yeah.

[Warren DeMontague]

108. I understand the economics.

But it is reaching a point where people are deciding not to fly at all. So they don't get the $180, they also don't get the $120.

There is a point at which the cost-cutting is going to prove counterproductive.

[jberryhill]

132. That's probably true

[MineralMan]

123. Actually, I usually do enjoy my flights. A little cramped, but

it's only for three or four hours. I like the view out the window, too. I rarely have to use the restroom in that period of time, so that's not really an issue. The hardest thing for me is not smoking for several hours, but I manage.

I wear the seatbelt all the time, anyhow, after a plane I was on hit a deep downdraft. It's really safer.

But, the best thing of all is getting off the plane and finding my 86-year-old parents waiting for me at the airport. I just don't see them often enough. Whatever the hassle, that's worth it...every time.

If you don't fly, OK, but I do, and I've enjoyed most of the flights I've been on. I plan to enjoy this one, too. Have a nice day.

[Warren DeMontague]

150. I'm of the decided opinion that it's gotten a lot worse. And I used to really like it.

Now, I can't stand it.

Yes, you should wear the seatbelt the whole time you're in your seat, but expecting people to sit in their seats for 2-3 hours after takeoff when there's no turbulence is simply unrealistic. People need to urinate. And the seatbelt sign is clearly used for crowd control, b/c some flight attendants consider having people in the aisles on a crowded flight too much of a pain in the ass. I've seen it.

[LibDemAlways]

155. + 1000

In the first place after going through all the security shit I am in a rotten mood and not at all anxious to be herded aboard some overcrowded aircraft with no leg room and about a half inch on each side from being cheek to cheek with a stranger. ( I'm short so I can only imagine the agony tall people endure.) Then, inevitably, there's a screaming child right behind me - a tired, cranky baby who simply does not let up. (I am not blaming the baby. I am only relating my typical flying experience.) By now my head is throbbing. Then, just as I'm hoping the thing will take off on time, the pilot announces some sort of delay - the co-pilot hasn't shown up, there's a mechanical problem - could be just about anything, but guaranteed it will happen. The whole thing is just a nightmare.

And, boy did you nail it on the bathrooms. I hate the "First class bathrooms are for first class passengers only" spiel. At any given time 10 or 12 people are doing a dance in the aisle desperately waiting their turn while two bathrooms up front are empty. Just another goddamn indignity.

Between the terrible treatment by the airlines themselves and the sexual perversion of the tsa, I have lost all interest in flying. Both the corporations and the government seem bound and determined to make the entire experience as hellish and horrific as possible.

[krabigirl]

161. Sometimes I think "they" know that the oil is running out, so they are doing this so people fly less

[librechik]

77. you have learned your lesson well, MineralMan

always obey the authorities. In fact, make it as easy as possible for them to continue to oppress you.

Although, I can't think of an alternative that wouldn't get you thrown in the tank.

When the trains come to pick you up for the camps, be extra helpful for your captors, too. There's hardly a difference.In fact, TSA line is just a warmup.

[jberryhill]

81. "I can't think of an alternative that wouldn't get you thrown in the tank"

One alternative might be - contact your representative and senators.

[KoKo]

181. Yes....The Good German analogy does go a bit to explain how people can be lulled into

behavior that doesn't question but goes calmly into the train and others who thought the showers were good for them...de-licing.

It won't stop with this.

[Name removed]

80. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[TroglodyteScholar]

84. When I travel for Xmas, I'm getting the pat down. Gonna do my level best to get a blatant hardon.n/t

[TexasObserver]

85. "Go gentle into that good night."

It may have been "Do not go gentle into that good night," but hey, that was BEFORE 9-11.

[bergie321]

86. ...

1. Buy extra-large dog carrier
2. Check yourself as luggage

[Pholus]

87. The BEST suggestion I read on flyertalk: Get behind a women's college team. You're invisible then.

[roody]

90. I prefer to strip rather than be x-rayed or groped.

Is this an option?

[LisaL]

92. No.

[MineralMan]

95. Nope. We don't do strip searches in the USA. At least not

at the airport.

[CreekDog]

149. They do them through your clothing

:eyes:

[sarcasmo]

91. OBEY!

[Glassunion]

98. IOW... How to suffer gross indignity at the hands of your government in 8 easy steps.

When you are done you can go to the terminal restroom and wipe your ass with the 4th Amendment.

[Lucian]

102. So everyone should just comply with the gropings and the invasion of privacy.

Check.

:eyes:

This would be the perfect time to hassle the TSA to change their rules. The cool t-shirts and comments are a must next week.

[Subdivisions]

103. Yes, and don't use the word "sheeple". The over-used term police are on patrol n/t

[MineralMan]

104. You're not flying next week, are you? If you are, be sure to

take some photos of you in your t-shirt, and record those comments for us. Thanks.

[Lucian]

106. I don't want my junk touched by the large hands of Hank.

So no, I'm not flying. I'm driving the 1,000 miles I need to go.

I will not allow myself to be legally groped and harassed.

[Warren DeMontague]

109. ***

[HuckleB]

112. And you hadn't planned to fly in the first place.

:eyes:

[Lucian]

128. Oh I did.

Until this stuff came to light.

But thanks for playing.

[HuckleB]

138. And you made the claim we all knew you would make.

And we all know it's BS.

Thanks for playing. You're not fooling anyone.

[Lucian]

152. It's funny...

I don't remember you being with me while I'm away from DU. You have no idea where I'm from, what I do, or how I do it. Yet you assume I have nothing else better to do than to come online and lie about shit.

You fail.

[MineralMan]

114. Well, you won't need my suggestions, then.

Have a nice drive, and enjoy your trip. I'll do the same.

[sufrommich]

105. Who is taking away your choice not to comply? nt

[LisaL]

107. Once you get to the search area, if you don't comply, you are

facing an 11,000 $ fine.

[walldude]

110. Jeeze man, you try to help

and get your head bit off.. It's all your fault I'm getting groped! ;rofl:


Funny, this is the one week I am driving. To expensive to fly the whole family... Don't have another flight till January. Maybe they'll make some changes before then...

[MineralMan]

113. No big deal. I hope my tips help some people. They work

pretty well. For those who aren't flying, I'm not really sure why my tips are an issue for them. :shrug:

[texastoast]

118. The issue is that you have to post them

It's not that you didn't do an excellent job. When I fly, I'll keep a copy and gover it before I pack up the family. Meanwhile, if I can take a bus or drive, I will. Fooking 1984 and the Americans are down with it.

[MineralMan]

124. Yeah, it's too bad. But, for those who are flying, for whatever

reason, there are ways to make it as hassle-free as possible. That was my reason for posting. For those who aren't flying who took umbrage at my suggestions, I have no answers. I'm surprised that they bothered to read the thread at all. :shrug:

[texastoast]

117. Not flying

Could, but won't. I'll have to reserve my tolerance level for travel that REQUIRES flight.

Fuck THIS SHIT!

[MineralMan]

120. Well, then, my suggestions won't be of much use to you right away.

Maybe when you do have to fly they'll help. Of course, I suspect this will have been scaled back by then.

[TheWatcher]

119. Thank you SO MUCH for the loving, timely advice, Mr. O' Brien.

Now, before I forget I wanted to ask one more thing.

Do I tell them four fingers, or five?

I always struggle with that one.


Thanks in advance for taking time from your busy, busy schedule to chat with us lowly proles.

We'll be Good, Compliant, Lock Step Little Angels this holiday.

We'll make you Proud.

You'll See!

Hugs And Kisses for Big Brother!

With Love,

Winston

[MineralMan]

125. Thanks for replying to my post.

You seem to have missed its point, however, but that's OK. I appreciate the reply anyhow.

[TheWatcher]

134. No, No. I see Five Fingers, i swear. I've completely seen the light.

And I'm prepared to love the Police State and be a complete advocate, just like you.

You've inspired me to be a Good American, and I won't let you down.

There are a couple of threads in DIRE need of your wisdom though.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x4621768

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x9587019

Get on over there and set The Rabble straight before they get us all killed by Al Qaeda!

And again, Thank You SO Much.

Viva Big Brother!

[CreekDog]

148. Yesterday, the OP was telling a woman to wear different underwear the day she flies

MineralMan

Thu Nov-18-10 09:35 AM
Response to Reply #28
40. Ah, well, then I suggest a different style of undies if you're flying.

...

I imagine that most women own a suitable pair of panties that won't allow that string to dangle, don't you?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=9582460&mesg_id=9583479

[TheWatcher]

164. So helpful and Loving!

Maybe he can write a Police State Self-Help Book and become a Millionaire.

After all, Fear, and The Police State, along with Bankster Fraud and Mindless Escapism, are the biggest Growth Industries in our country right now.

Perfect time to get in on the ground floor!

[Bluenorthwest]

121. For infomation from travel experts, people can go to

Frommer's-Security Checkpoint Tips http://www.frommers.com/articles/6631.html

Specific Airport Tips- http://www.frommers.com/articles/6603.html

About the new stuff- http://www.frommers.com/articles/7064.html

That is if they have to fly at this time and want to know the best method for dealing with Security Theater USA.

[HuckleB]

122. What makes the PR writers for Frommer's experts?

:shrug:

[WolverineDG]

126. Baaaaaaa

"you haven't done anything wrong, so there's nothing to worry about" = one of the world's biggest lies, 2nd only to "I'll call you in the morning."

dg

[nadinbrzezinski]

127. I wonder if that will be a promise too

and hell, they'd better buy dinner!

[WolverineDG]

178. If they want to play with my lady parts

they'd better. ;)

dg

[Lucian]

137. That's what the Republicans said about the Patriot Act.

For some reason, the OP can't see how authoritarian this is.

[krabigirl]

162. but it's all OK now that "our guy" is in charge! lol

[TheWatcher]

165. Or MAYBE he Knows PERFECTLY WELL.....

And I'll just leave it at that.

[annabanana]

130. Go Greyhound!. .It's sounding better and better!.. . n/t

[Caretha]

169. It's coming to Greyhound too

Watch this, the Greyhound in Tampa is at the end of the video. Anyone who watches this video will have no doubt about the complete BS that the TSA and other alphabet agencies are enforcing is dangerous to the democracy of the United States.

It will completely discredit everything MM has posted about cooperation with the TSA authorities.

Compilation of news videos of TSA search abuses-
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RhkQoiaf7Uc

Watch it if you dare MM, and don't forget karma is a *itch.

[mrs_p]

131. i'm choosing the pat-down b/c

i'm pregnant and don't want to expose my baby to untested radiation. but all these TSA posts are making me really, really nervous. i HAVE to fly to a conference the week after thanksgiving and thru DIA which has these scanners. so, any advice for already uncomfortable pregnant women?

[Bonobo]

135. "What you do will determine how smoothly it goes."

This sentence is a perfect illustration of where you are wrong and go wrong.

Because you start with this flawed assumption, every other wrong thing you say flows from that.

[cags]

139. Simply taking it will not change a thing. Allowing the injustice without even a small protest will..

only make it worse.

News must be made, complains must be lodged, making a scene must be done for anyone in power to take notice and do something about the TSA letting the terrorists take a big ol' shit on our freedom.

So I applaud all those who will inconvenience themselves and take the time out to protest the injustices being done to everyday americans. You are patriots, and I thank you.

[kath]

153. So it looks my 79-year-old mother-in-law, just because she's had a knee replacement, will be subject

to the Full Monty Grope Experience when she comes to visit us at Christmas.
It makes me so incredibly angry to think of her being put through this. :mad: :grr:

[krabigirl]

159. sorry, that's just a bit much just to travel. I'd prefer to take a train or drive.

If i have to go overseas, I am not sure what I will do..hopefully by the time I have to go, things will change. I have no need to fly other than those trips, which I don't take more than once every 2-3 yrs.

[nadine_mn]

166. I am sorry for the negative comments - you make valid points. Its not about being Sheeple

The answer is not to stop flying - the answer is to demand this shit stop.

Like others have said, being an ass at the airport is not going to get you there any sooner. But when you are not flying - you need to be on the phone to (and I quote CalPeg) "your Congresscritters" to complain.

People who say don't fly - isn't that just another way of being a sheeple - to say take this privilege away too?

The OP isn't saying he likes it, he approves or whatever - but until it changes its the best way to see family and loved ones without hassle.

And bitching and moaning on the internet is not nearly as effective as bitching and moaning to your Congresspeople.

Or better yet organize protests - imagine the fun of hundreds of passengers on Thanksgiving weekend united in a sit in or refusal to be scanned or groped.

[seabeyond]

175. if people stop flying, airlines lose money, things change. so some of us will stop flying

losing our "privilege" of easy travel in the hopes it is enough of us to cause a problem, as other continue following the abusive rules. people should have put foot down years ago what was acceptable instead of waiting to this point. if people continue to fly, then govt says, we got this one past, bring on the next. where are peoples lines... before they just say no

[hobbit709]

174. Some words from 1967 that apply today.

"Paranoia strikes deep
Into your life it will creep
It starts when you're always afraid
You step out of line, the man come and take you away"

And these
And it was "Hey you, keep your head down
Don't you look around, please don't make a sound
If they should find you now
The Man will shoot you down"