This is how TSA treats children:

[LibDemAlways]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=skkCpnCm7iM

Listen to the observers' comments.

[rug]

1. Good grief. Another week of this and cell phones with cameras will be banned.

[Initech]

3. Seriously, at the rate this is going!

[saigon68]

204. Bushes new Pet Goat book to read to his grand children

[awoke_in_2003]

231. We are headed that way...

I wonder what the likes of Patrick Henry would say about this. One day the American public is going to wake the fuck up- it will not be a pretty day.

[targetpractice]

22. Snort!!

I totally laughed heartily at that... Then I became really sad for us all.

[targetpractice]

23. self-delete

hiccup

[Matariki]

62. And 'private rooms' will be required - no witnesses that way.

[FirstLight]

2. I would actually be screaming

telling the guy he is NOT allowed to touch my children

that is just so NOT okay, don;t care about 'security' it's bullshit...they are making a big show about how they are keeping us *safe*

then bombing families in afganistan and pakistan and wondering why everyone hates us

the world is so crazy

[spooked911]

253. exactly

it's all bullshit and disgusting

[LisaL]

4. Why was this child's top taken off?

[LibDemAlways]

6. Who knows? The TSA can do as it damn well pleases, including

undressing kids in public. Creepy that the agent put the shirt back on rather than handing it to the father. Notice how the kid reflexively tries to move away from the guy's grope when it reaches the front of his pants.

Parents and teachers make a huge point of telling kids this sort of thing is absolutely not ok. And then the government comes along and does it to them. Sick sick sick.

[ChairmanAgnostic]

218. because they can.

[jberryhill]

49. Probably because it looks like two pieces, but isn't

When the child walks away, it looks like a longsleeve white hooded thing under a shirtsleeve blue thing.

The agent seems to take a closer look at it as if he's trying to find something in it.

[saigon68]

173. Pedophiles like seeing Naked Children

[kurtzapril4]

258. Yeah, all of a sudden...

at the flip of a switch, ALL TSA agents are now pederasts. These peons are out to get, and get off on, you and your family. Especially your children. Please.

And comparing them to Nazis? That's so sick it's not even funny. Based on race, religion, sexual orientation, educational level, the TSA agents are herding passengers into "de-lousing" chambers, and over there on the left, they're conducting medical experiments. Why, the airports have installed heavy duty incinerators for the refuseniks! Right.

And you people comparing this to rape. As a rape survivor, I totally call bullshit. Bull. Shit. If you'd like to know what being violently raped is like, please feel free to e-mail me.

I'm so sad that air travel has come to this. I hate that a government agency has decided that their agents get to see me naked, or grope me. However, I'm sure that most TSA agents didn't sign on for anything like this. I'm sure that the vast majority don't want to touch your junk, either. Blame it on your hero, OBama, who still won't back down.

See how easy it is to fall into the blame it on the little guy meme? It ain't just a Republican thing.

[Atypical Liberal]

265. They are enablers.

Look, as far as I'm concerned, if you sign up to work for the TSA you are as much an enabler as people who volunteer for military service are enabling these wars in Iraq and Afghanistan.

This sort of invasive searching of people is certainly not rape. But it most certainly is invasive, and is over the line.

[kurtzapril4]

259. Yeah, all of a sudden...

Sorry, dupe.

[_ed_]

177. Because the TSA agent is a pervert

and has the support of the government, up to Obama?

[awoke_in_2003]

233. Obama is Pistole's boss...

and he can fire him at any time. Won't happen, though.

[FourScore]

282. The father did it.

The metal alarms went off when the kid went through the metal detector. The Dad wanted to expedite the pat-down and took the kids shirt off. He then handed the shirt to the TSA officials. But nobody wants to hear this. It's much easier to get angry.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/yblog_thelookout/20101122/ts_yblog_thelookout/more-tsa-horror-stories-emerge-while-agency-ponders-what-to-do

[originalpckelly]

5. That would be it for me.

I would have ripped their motherfucking heads off if they did that to my kid.

HOW MUCH MORE DOES IT TAKE PEOPLE? AT WHAT POINT MUST WE BRING AN END TO THIS? HOW MANY KIDS HAVE TO GO THROUGH THIS?

[LibDemAlways]

8. I found this video on an anti-tsa site. It already has dozens of

comments over there. It's this sort of thing that really brings home to people how far off the rails tsa is. I hope it goes viral.

[originalpckelly]

11. Let's help it do that! Everyone rec this, maybe it will get on Crooks and Liars...

then hopefully Keith or someone else will pick it up on Monday. This is really just one of those things that goes over the line.

[intheflow]

29. Rec it on YouTube, too. n/t

[originalpckelly]

48. Yep, I've done it there too...

[Matariki]

66. Which site?

I've been reading threads at flyertalk.com - which has been very interesting. Lots of frequent flyers and a couple of people who claim to be TSA agents.

[LibDemAlways]

71. This one:

http://www.reddit.com/r/OperationGrabAss


There are some annoying right wingers who pop up occasionally, but some of the posters are on the ball and get new outrages up right away.

[LisaL]

13. I really feel bad for the child's father.

[originalpckelly]

18. The shirt being off is not that bad.

It's the groping of the kids crotch that's bad, in my opinion. This wasn't a full on strip search, but damn, I'd never let someone touch my child there if they weren't a doctor or nurse, or someone else in the medical field.

[LisaL]

19. I don't see anywhere on TSA website that their agents are allowed

to take off people's shirts in order to inspect these people.

[tblue37]

51. Yeah, that was uber-weird, wasn't it? Why on earth did he partially

undress the kid? And would a small girl be subject to similar stripping, since she ewould not have breasts yet? Would an adult male or female be stripped of his or her shirt? If not, then why is it okay to do that to a little boy--and in full view of the public?

[jberryhill]

55. It looks like two items of clothing - asking would have been a good idea

Normally, they will ask people wearing an outer layer, like a zippered sweatshirt to remove it.

When the child walks away, it looks like one of those things with two fabrics sewn to look like two layers.

[Matariki]

89. Right - the kid was wearing deceptive clothing. Serves him right.

:eyes:

[awoke_in_2003]

235. she shouldn't have worn...

a mini-skirt and high heels if she didn't want to get raped.

:sarcasm: just in case

[TatonkaJames]

207. That already happened

I believe I saw the video on DU. The girl child was crying hysterically in her mothers arms
while she was patted down. Doesn't anyone in the TSA have "intuition" as to who might be a threat ?
I'd like to go to the local airport and watch how many old women, handicapped and children have to
endure this while they play the P.C. game and allow the bearded terrorist looking guy to go through without
at least a reach around.
Time to read and understand that document that begins with "We The People" and the power we yield.
Those days are actually gone. Twenty years ago when I was clamoring for continuous days of rebellious
demonstrations against our government we could have done this. Now they have us where they wanted us; in fear
of doing anything that might lead to losing our jobs that are no where to be found these days. So we've
voted ourselves into the submissive pet they wanted for so many years.
Hmmm, sounds like the old Soviet Union.

[tblue37]

208. No, I am talking about the actual stripping off of the child's shirt in public while

patting him down. That was not done to the little girl, but if it could be done to a boy child, there is no logical reason why it could not be done to a girl child or a man. The only reason it could be forbidden to be done to a woman is that breasts are considered sexual. But if a boy child can be forced to have his shirt stripped off in public, then an undeveloped girl child or a man could, too. There is no logical reason why not.

[TatonkaJames]

210. You're right

It's just a sad thing to see in America.

[LisaL]

241. Apparently the same video was uploaded with an explanation

that the man with the child (presumably the father) was the one who took the shirt off the child.
Whoever posted the video did not hear the conversation between the presumed father and the TSA agent.

[LibDemAlways]

269. The dad apparently only took it off when the child refused to

cooperate, and then it was done out of exasperation.

The agent should have absolutely insisted that the father put the shirt back on before the unnecessary, stupid, and unconstitutional search continued.

That kid has more smarts that 99% of the population that meekly goes along with this shit. If that was my kid I'd be sitting in jail right now for what I would have done to that goon.

[seabeyond]

41. taking off shirt is bad. we think kids, boy, not a deal. but that little, and in public

it is all opposed to norm. and it is uncomfortable for a little kid. but the groping of crotch is bad.

tsa dude tried to make lite of it.... for kids comfort, but it is still what it is.

[sabrina 1]

59. No stranger is going to take the shirt off any child I am responsible

for. NO ONE. This is an outrage! I hope the father sues. Any government that approves of this abuse, needs to be strongly opposed and then removed asap. Who is acually responsible for these atrocious policies? They need to start naming names. Who sat around and discussed fondling and stripping children going on a trip? I want to know who they are!! They need to be fired, and then treated psychologically for what is clearly a deviant personality problem.

[Jamastiene]

154. They need to be charged with child molestation.

This is going WAY WAY WAY too far.

[sabrina 1]

280. That may be why they are now backing off children under 12.

Too late though, as I said above. Any person who would have abused children and citizens this way and back off only when the outrage is so great and the threat of prosecution a good possibility, need to be fired asap.

In Britain, these machines have been declared to violate child molestation laws. Part of their laws state that any image of a child showing the child naked, made by any person including computer images, and any parent giving consent, is a prosecutable crime. So, that created a dilemma for both the security workers and parents, who had participated in photographing children and given their consent. I hope these laws stay in place and that they don't manage to get around them.

To think the public put their trust in these authoritarian abusive sickos. It disgusts me.

[dickthegrouch]

211. Janet Napolitano, Barack Obama are the first names you want

I would support the Dems and Obama in almost anything.
NOT THIS.

[awoke_in_2003]

237. don't forget John Pistole. nt

[sabrina 1]

279. Yes, a step too far. I believe they are backing off children in response

to the outrage. But it is too late, imo. They have shown themselves to be people who cannot be trusted by the American people. The whole fake police state needs to be dismantled.

[adamuu]

140. and if it were a girl? n/t

[Javaman]

222. Just when will it get bad to you?

pants off? underwear?

Good god.

[Arctic Dave]

7. WTF. TSA are shitbag scum. Fuck every single one of them.

[originalpckelly]

9. Anyone who believes in liberty should quit if they work for the TSA.

[NutmegYankee]

27. Really? You think people will just quit in this economy?

They may hate the hell out of what they have to do, but like most people, they need the income.

[CreekDog]

28. I think I'd have to quit

If that was your job, could you actually perform it?

[NutmegYankee]

53. I wouldn't have taken it to begin with. I hate theater. nt

[Sen. Walter Sobchak]

38. People have refused to do less with much greater consequences

than unemployment,

[NutmegYankee]

60. Bluster aside, you know it's not a viable option for most people.

People have children to feed and other requirements. The TSA workers are no exception. Remember that quitting a job does not carry unemployment benefits.

I'm a civil libertarian, but I'm also rational and realistic about the workers. The problem lies with the higher levels of the TSA and Government.

[Sen. Walter Sobchak]

64. Enron employees gave the exact same excuse,

What other crimes should be allowed to perpetuate for the sake of job security?

[NutmegYankee]

67. Here's an idea, stop bitching and starting complaining to the folks in charge!

Blaming the workers is counterproductive. Go after the heads of the agency, torture your congressman's secretary by calling every day, and file complaints with the TSA after each trip. Make the agency and government reconsider this policy. The leaders are the people who we should be angry at.

[Sen. Walter Sobchak]

70. If they don't want to be blamed, get their hands off my dick

They know what they are a part of,

[scentopine]

69. bullshit - are you saying there is no other job

in this land for people who don't want to fondle testicles of children and adults? That this is all there is in life? Police state employment?

If I am not comfortable fondling testicles of old and young, I won't do it. I shouldn't have to do it. My family would think less of me for doing it.

These people don't have to do this. They are not opposed to the process. That's why they do it. They do it because they just don't give a shit. There is always a market for these qualities in a police state.

In fact, I assure you they enjoy it on average. It is an authority position. Some people are attracted to control positions of power. They do it because they love it.

It is too bad our president invests so much into war and our police state. He has faith in the corrupt institutions dragging us under.

No bluster here. Most people do not have to fondle testicles of children for a living unless they are a doctor. They do it because they want to do it.

[NutmegYankee]

75. What do you call a 10% unemployment rate?

[scentopine]

81. It means 10% of people are smart enough to not fondle testicles for a living -nt

[NutmegYankee]

99. It isn't an excuse - it's reality.

I bet if we went down and talked with these people most of them would be normal folks providing for themselves or their family. Only a small subset would be authoritarian types.

You are blasting out at people with a lot of emotion, and losing sight of the fact that quitting a job like TSA would put them on the street in a 10% unemployment market. There are 5 job-seekers for every position. Most TSA workers do not have a college degree, and it's unlikely a service position would provide the pay that several years at the TSA would have. Add to that the loss of Health care benefits for the family and a rational person is going to hunker down and deal with a shitty job rather than just quit.

I can't blame them. I hate the policy, and I've already sent out mail to my senators and congressman to attack it, but I'm not going to shit all over blue collar workers.

[Odin2005]

151. A lot of the supporters of the Nazis were "good, ordinary people", too.

This is a classic example of the Banality of Evil.

[scentopine]

79. dupe

[NutmegYankee]

88. double dupe. nt

[scentopine]

103. I will blame them. Emotion is exactly the right response

what I don't get about all the sensible democrats is how ineffective they are. When is something so wrong that it is deserving of emotion?

War? No.

Slaughter of children in Afghanistan? No.

Bank fraud? No.

Torture? No.

Oil spill? No.

Jesus? Is there anything so wrong that emotion is the right response. Sensible democrats have run the party into the ground.

Principals and emotion go one in one. Anger is the most important emotion.

As far as unemployment? My hat is off to the 10% who have decided fondling children is not acceptable. They are doing the right thing. If their family is mad at them for not applying for a job inspecting genitals, then they should leave their families.

Some things are so wrong in the pursuit of money, that you do not do your family any favors by sacrificing principals. Or are you saying that principals are just an emotion that should be ignored and accepting a job fondling children is the sensible thing to do because it pays well? Is meoney the incentive to push past quaint ideas of freedom and liberty? Do these principals fall into the same area as torture? Just quaint ideas?

Your letter will be filed in the trash. Here is what will matter - corporations will not tolerate this because it will interfere with business travel. Watch. Money talks. Non-corporate constituents aren't worth shit.

[NutmegYankee]

113. Acting on anger often leads to outcomes we regret.

A lesson I learned after the stupidity of my youth.

As for principles, never underestimate the power of rationalization. These workers doing the "enhanced pat-downs" don't think of themselves as fondling someones nuts, they sincerely think they are looking for plastic explosives strapped into underwear and justify their actions accordingly. I doubt they enjoy it (and another thread highlights how miserable it is for them based on interviews to back that point up. Imagine having to feel inside the folds of an obese person, eeww gross.) at all.

[LisaL]

119. What's gross is a post like this. Obese persons do not ask

to be groped.

[NutmegYankee]

131. It sucks for obese people. They get screened because the scanner cannot see under a fold.

So if you have several rolls of flab on the abdomen, they fail the rapistscan and are subjected to the screening. Sorry if I offended you, I'm admittedly not that physically fit myself. I just find the thought of probing around another guys body to be quite disgusting. My point was that the job sucks for both parties and is a stupid policy.

[scentopine]

121. Ending Slavery? Right toVote? Civil Rights? Justice? War?

Sensible democrats have screwed up. I do not accept that these people don't know exactly what they are doing. They signed up for it because they wanted to, not out of economic hardship. They should deal with the consequences.

Obama was elected by a lot of angry people. Obama and his sensible democrats will be tossed out on their asses just as fast for extreme and rigid emotionless and unrelenting attacks against good people whose only crime is not being rich enough to buy a vote in congress or the white house.

Anger is legitimate and deserved here. You may be inclined to bend over and take it for the team, I'm not.

[NutmegYankee]

128. Actually - Most of these workers joined the TSA before the new screening methods. nt

[Chulanowa]

158. And what are they doing to protest the methods they have to use?

I would think that more than a few would be trying to organize some sort of "Hell nope, we won't grope" action, if doing the job is that unbearable.

[Name removed]

217. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[sabrina 1]

94. What they are doing is not a viable option for any decent person

There are worse things than being without a job temporarily. The first TSA worker who quits for moral reasons, will be a hero in this country. So far, no heroes have stepped forward that I am aware of. What a sad country this has become.

[NutmegYankee]

97. People I know have been unemployed for almost 2 years.

There is no guarantee it would be "temporary". Just to make it clear - I'm not defending the policy, I'm just stating what should be obvious to a rational observer.

[jberryhill]

104. It's a universal irony that people with the strongest moral fiber

...never seem to be the ones in a position to use it.

[sabrina 1]

136. Not necessarily. I know people with moral fiber who were in positions

to use it, and did. Eg, during the Bush administration, many Republicans in the DOJ quit rather than be complicit in the law-breaking they witnessed there. We don't hear much about them, but an excellent article in Rolling Stone several years ago, took an in-depth look at those who gave up careers rather than support Gonzalez/Bush/Cheney spying on the American people.

Then there were the military prosecutors, who quit their jobs after becoming aware that whole process was corrupt and they could not in all conscience, participate in the prosecution of people who may well have been innocent and who were being denied basic rights.

Others who quit the Bush gang's criminal organization, the Ambassador to Greece who could not support or pretend to support the War in Iraq. Journalists, like Ashley Banfield, who risked and lost her whole career to tell the truth.

We never talk about those who stand up and support them, at least not as much as we should. That is probably why it seems that no one actually does stand up.

[sabrina 1]

123. Brown shirts had the same excuse. They too needed jobs in a bad

economy. There are worse things than being unemployed, such as contributing to the creeping totalitarianism of a country you want your children to grow up in.

[NutmegYankee]

126. Godwin's. NT

[sabrina 1]

130. I'm not a believer in the interpretation of Godwin's law. I'm a believer

in learning from history and not repeating those parts of it that resulted in the promise 'never again'. I'm also a believer in not waiting, as they did in Germany, until it is too late to stop the inevitable results of creeping totalitarianism.

If the shoe fits, if the excuses made back then, seem familiar now, then we have a duty to point them out. Iow, I do not care about Godwin's law.

[NutmegYankee]

133. The brownshirts (SA) were active party members.

They were not just people employed to do a job. Your take on the slide of freedom is correct, but you assign the blame to the wrong people.

I do not like the new policy, whether rapist scanner or molestation screening. I just commented that the problem lies with people who implemented this policy and have publicly stated it will continue. Attack them!

[sabrina 1]

138. Well, I agree that the blame mostly goes to those who implemented

these sick rules, obviously the product of disturbed minds and designed to force people not to opt out of using the very profitable machines.

But party members and employees who carry out those rules, are also complicit. The civilized world decided several decades ago, and we live according to what was then decided, or are supposed to, that following orders for any reason, and in those times, NOT doing so would probably have had far worse consequences than just losing a job, was not an excuse for supporting abuses against human beings.

So, civilized societies joined together to state that even if the consequences were as dire as they probably were for anyone refusing to follow orders in those times, they would still be held accountable.

We are not asking anyone to risk their lives today, just to stand up and say 'no', with the worst consequence being the loss of a job. There are far worse things in this world than the loss of a job, especially one that is aiding and abetting the continued destruction of the Constitutional rights of all Americans.

[LibDemAlways]

111. The first TSA worker who quits for moral reasons will have no

trouble at all finding another job - especially if he/she goes public. I'm sure there are many employers out there who would be willing to take on a principled individual who refuses to grope children's genitals for a living.

[sabrina 1]

127. Exactly, I hope it happens soon and that person leads the way

for others to stand up for this country. Because we badly need someone to do so.

[pecwae]

163. Hopefully one will step forward soon.

Until then I don't intend to give them a pass for "just following orders".

[KoKo]

236. Agree....there are times you have to stand up for Human Kindness .. and I'd rather

be a greeter at Wall Mart than body probe innocent Women, Children and Men Travelers.

It's possible they didn't know what they were getting into, though, since these NEW, HARSH REGULATIONS just went into effect because CIA said there was CHATTER that there might be another "underwear bomber" for TG and XMAS HOLIDAYS this year. NEXT YEAR...BinLaden will do a video and it will be a worse "crack down" to see how far they can go in terrorizing our Chertoff Government!

The new hires probably didn't know the "extreme measures" they would have to do because the whole "Terra Threat" is elevated and the new Scanners had been delivered with more on the way throughout 2011!

I don't blame the TSA new employees...because I'm sure they weren't told what it was all about that would be effective for Holiday Seasion 2010! It's our Government that's at falt and our Congress for giving funds to Chertoff from the "Stimulous Money" to institute this new policy and pay for the scanners and if you don't get scanned they will go for your KIDS, WIFE and your MALE APARATUS! Lots of probably questionable people will stay with the program who have no sensitivity about PRIVACY. Those employees will be retained...the others will leave because of the shame of the employment and find something more worthwhile that they feel they are at least doing "honest days work" and not working for some authoritarian cabal that causes trauma to passengers who have to fly on holidays to keep family relations together.

[sabrina 1]

284. I agree with everything you said.

I hope some of them do decide to publicly quit in protest. It worked for the Pilots, who are now exempt from these abuses, but it took one man, then one more, a woman this time, to express outrage and to take a leave of absence without pay to get the support they needed from their unions and of course, the public. Standing up can be a very liberating thing. But otoh, I have read that some of these TSA workers think they are 'serving the country'. I guess they don't know about the Constitution.

[originalpckelly]

44. That's what it all comes down to, and that's what might keep us subservient longer.

[customerserviceguy]

46. Then they're 'whores'

and I don't mean to refer to sex workers, who at least leave a smile on people's faces when they're done with their work.

If they don't quit, then they deserve our scorn. I was good natured about it on my last trip, when the jackboot had to swipe down my five pound sack of Snoqualmie Falls Pancake mix, because there weren't many people, and he had nothing better to do, but this time, I'm gonna get militant in what I have to say to them.

They're Nazis and perverts, and they need to be told that by every American while they're treating us like criminal terrorists.

[grahamhgreen]

83. Yes. There are some things that you can never undo.

[AnArmyVeteran]

172. I know this is over the top and extreme but...

The same thing could be said about the Germans who led Jewish men, women and children into ovens.

I'm SO SICK of people who work for companies who totally submit themselves to their masters. Ive heard people say "Im only doing my job, etc..." when they are part of a corporate attack against you. It happened again just Friday when an electric company representative mindlessly recited from their company line. The person sounded like a robot and WOULD NOT talk with me as a human being. (btw, The company committed fraud)

I have never worked anywhere where I didn't speak out when I saw an injustice. And I was never terrified to give out my entire name. Now you talk to anonymous people in secret places using fake names or ID numbers. I would NEVER sell myself out, as I see so many others doing. I'd rather be unemployed that to be a tool for corporate control or corruption. And I'd rather be homeless than to harm another human being.

[Renew Deal]

68. Is it the agents or the policy?

I still think the policy is the real problem.

[NutmegYankee]

78. I tried to make that argument.

It has failed since it's easier to hate the underpaid workers than blame a policy.

[_ed_]

178. Both

one can't exist without the other.

[Arctic Dave]

212. If you go along with the"policy" the you are a piece of shit. nt

[sabrina 1]

92. Yes, they should. Anyone who willingly goes along with this

is a pervert. No job is worth doing this dirty work which is designed to force people into using the rape machines. Because if people keep opting out of those machines, then they are not needed and that means big money people like Chertoff. So this sexual assault routine is meant to scare people into choosing the machines.

We have very evil people in our government. This is sick and people need to stop flying until the sickos are identified, the ones who thought this up, and fired.

[TheWatcher]

10. Again where are the defenders of the TSA, who lecture us daily about how this is no big deal?

Come on, Set us straight!

Manage Our Perception so we will be safe from Faux Qaeda!

:crazy:

[originalpckelly]

12. And what about that President of ours who came out in support of this?

I hope people jam up the works this Thanksgiving. I feel a disturbance in the force, as if a thousand people cried out in unison, "WE'RE MAD AS HELL AND WE'RE NOT GOING TO TAKE THIS ANYMORE!"

[BlueIris]

39. The president's support for this travesty is awful.

Just fucking awful.

[Chulanowa]

159. And what alternative do you suggest he take, BlueIris?

His choices are either
A) "This is an inconveniance we must endure"
or
B) if some whacko DOES blow shit up, guess who's fault it is?

It's kind of a rock and a hard place for the guy. No move he can make on this is a "good one"

[Bluenorthwest]

168. Choice C would involve leadership

If he supports these invasions, he should go on TV with his family, and do both forms of screening live. The whole family groped, then scanned. The Bidens as well. That would show that they are actually comfortable with this.
He's all talk. No action. Show us, Mr President, how comfy you are with this by taking your own family through the whole thing, using TSA agents picked by Republicans.

[_ed_]

180. Maybe he should do the right thing?

The oath of office is "to support and defend the Constitution..." There's not one word in there about keeping scared, stupid people "safe" from "terrorism."

[donheld]

101. "Where are the defenders of the TSA?" In the White House.

[Swamp Rat]

216. Watching child porn?

:puke:

[originalpckelly]

14. Keep this thread at the top of the discussion...

let's rec this as much as possible. To the top of the greatest this thread should go.

[coti]

15. Totally unnecessary and unacceptable. This is morphing into an unintended Milgram experiment.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milgram_experiment

Change the goddamned policy and do it right.

[customerserviceguy]

65. Wow, I'd forgotten about that

Thanks for taking me back to Psych 101 from 1974. I still faintly remember Zimbardo in a film that our professor showed us.

I sure learned a lot about what human beings were capable of back in that class. I guess I've drank to forget a lot of it.

[TorchTheWitch]

155. UNintended?

No way. The ONLY reason they've been doing any of this crap since 9/11 is fully intended to strip away rights and control the populace. And it's been working and still is working.

[awoke_in_2003]

238. yep...

the Patriot Act was the final nail in the coffin of our "Great Experiment"

[Sen. Walter Sobchak]

16. It is things like this that make the offer of a permanent job in Canada seem attractive

Even as I sit here in Calgary where it is ONE degree outside and it took me half an hour to scrape my car of ice and snow after going to Costco this afternoon.

The ONLY appropriate response from a father to what occurred in that video is extreme physical violence upon the man molesting his son. If that was me as a child in the 1970's my father would have implanted the creeps jaw into his brain stem.

When I first began working in Canada four years ago I couldn't imagine wanting to stay here. One year into the mission I was offered a permanent transfer to Ottawa and declined it without a second thought. Now I find myself in a country that remains prosperous and not fucking insane looking back at a wasteland of paranoid impoverished cowards more outraged by ballot box stuffing on Dancing with the Has-beens and Never-weres than institutionalized sex crimes against the traveling public.

[LisaL]

21. No doubt the father would have arrested and never made it

to his destination, and likely charged with assault, etc, etc.

[LibDemAlways]

24. For the past several years I have been planning on taking my

daughter to Europe as a graduation present next June. I live in Southern Cal. and there is no way I would subject her and myself to either an x-ray or body groping as a prerequisite to travel. So, I will take an extra few days, drive to Canada, and fly out of Vancouver.

It's a damn shame that Americans are no longer free to travel by air without being sexually assaulted.

By the way, my husband, who has lived in So. Cal. all his life, absolutely loves Canada and would move in a heartbeat if the opportunity presented itself.

[LisaL]

25. You better check to make sure canadian airport doesn't have

the same scanners.

[LibDemAlways]

31. It's my understanding that the machines are only used in Canada for

secondary screening - not for everybody as is rapidly becoming the case here.

[Sen. Walter Sobchak]

33. Only for flights to the USA, and even then not really.

In Calgary there is only one of them, just don't get in that security line.

[LibDemAlways]

35. Thanks for the clarification.

[laundry_queen]

194. Half an hour?

Dude, you just need more practice. ;) Don't worry, with time it becomes second nature. Takes me 2 minutes tops. And you don't have to scrape off the entire vehicle. You just drive real fast and hope most of the snow flies off. :P

But seriously, I'm very glad that a)I'm Canadian and b)I don't fly when I hear all these TSA stories. I have children and think I'd be on the verge of homicide if they did that to my kids.

[awoke_in_2003]

239. Dude, take the permanent job...

this country is not going to get any better. Both parties are guilty of taking away our rights, and they will not give them up peacefully. Enjoy life in a civilized country. Snow sucks, but so do body cavity searches (sure to be the next thing)

[Sen. Walter Sobchak]

257. still torn,

My entire life is in Orange County - and I do have a job I can come back to that I really do love. But watching Americans mindlessly comply with every escalation of security insanity is the single most depressing sight I have ever seen.

[awoke_in_2003]

260. If I had the chance I would bail...

this place is getting too insane. What the american public will tolerate silently is disgusting.

[AspenRose]

281. You're lucky to have options.

[StarsInHerHair]

17. a video on the side Jesse Ventura will no longer fly again

he's got metal in his body from a bone fracture or some such & he says no more of this. The new scanners pick up on the metal in the body, old airport metal detectors did not? Again, he was pulled over for a patdown because of medical devices-the tsa is singling out people with artificial medical devices. So the Fourth Amendment & the Americans With Disabilities Act are being violated.

[LibDemAlways]

26. I also have a few pins in my ankle from an old surgery, so I, too,

would be subject to a full on grope. Will not do it. No more flying out of US airports until this shit ends.

[tblue37]

54. I have flown three times in the past eleven months, to visit with my kids.

I won't fly again until this nonsense is stopped.

[awoke_in_2003]

240. no, the old machines...

picked up the metal, but then you were subjected to a wanding. Now you get sexually assaulted.

[Danger Mouse]

20. I refuse to watch that. I can fill in the blanks.

:puke:

[sabrina 1]

142. I haven't watched it either. It gives me a pain in my stomach

just reading the comments of those who did watch it. To do this to a child and this is the second report of child abuse in the past couple of days, is a crime.

And I would like to know what sick minds thought this up. They need to be named and fired asap.

[pipi_k]

30. OK it was bad enough the kid had his shirt taken off...

but when the TSA guy felt the kid up, I seriously wanted to smack him.

Totally unacceptable!!!

[CreekDog]

32. make it go viral people

looks like this was Salt Lake City (overhead "Flight 2706 to Oakland" on the video)

they can figure out who did this, it WILL be a newstory if we can make sure it gets out there.

it looks like this video was just posted in the past day.

[customerserviceguy]

91. In Utah

people are conditioned to "obey". Even if you're non-Mormon, you deal with an oppressive state every day.

[CreekDog]

95. I know. I lived there.

:banghead:

[customerserviceguy]

112. Yeah, spent the first six months of 2005 there

It was the worst decade of my life.

[Sen. Walter Sobchak]

152. That is Concourse B at SLC

the sheer whiteness of the crowd is also a dead giveaway,

[CreekDog]

229. Thanks...I hope we'll be hearing about this on the news sometime soon

:hi:

[LibDemAlways]

270. There was a story in the Salt Lake paper yesterday with

an explanation from the guy who took the video.

The child did not set off the metal detector. Instead, he was pulled aside for a pat down for no reason at all. When he refused to cooperate (has more common sense than most) the father pulled the shirt off - most likely out of pure exasperation and to send a message to the goons.

Anyhow, after the entire horrible incident was over, the guy who took the video attempted to speak with the father and son and was pulled aside by tsa, who then questioned him about the video and what he intended to do with it. They obviously knew they were in deep shit if it ended up on YouTube. Oh, and want a laugh? They told him they were concerned for the kid's privacy!! Government goons who had just given this kid a public groping were now concerned for his fucking privacy.

Anyhow, they sent four or five goons over to the gate area to keep an eye on the guy who took the video before he finally boarded his flight.

[Subdivisions]

34. I would have been hauled out of there on a goddamned stretcher! n/t

[earthside]

36. Pres. Obama, Stop This!!! n/t

[LisaL]

37. He is in full support of TSA, so don't expect any help from him.

[CreekDog]

52. I thought he said better you than me

:rofl:

(i'm paraphrasing...)

[BlueIris]

40. One of the more pointless posts I've seen tonight.

He has proven himself capable of stopping roughly nothing, and the abusive TSA practices are actually something he condones.

[readmoreoften]

63. +1. I'd appeal to God before I'd appeal to Obama for anything. And I'm an atheist.

[SammyWinstonJack]

108. He won't. It's just an 'inconvenience for us all' according to him.

Who is he kidding? :puke:

[_ed_]

181. "Inconvenience for all"

except his family. What a jerk. I want his daughters to be stripped and groped by the pederast goons in the TSA.

[awoke_in_2003]

242. I am pissed at Obama...

but would not wish this on his children EVER

[pipi_k]

186. Here's the problem as I see it...

If Obama were to stop this, he would, perversely, be accused of being "soft on terrorism". Something the Republicans would use to their advantage in 2012.

It would probably also cause lots of people who might otherwise have voted for him to vote for someone who isn't "soft on terrorism" (i.e. any Republican opponent able to use our fears against us). Because we, as a nation, have been sufficiently scared for the past 9 years.

Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

[demwing]

191. Exactly - I, for one, would like to be among the 1st to offer up my child to pedo-abuse

to ensure our President gets re-elected. It is my god damned duty as a good corporate citizen.

do I really need the sarcasm tag here?

[blaze]

42. Haven't children been used as weapons?

God help me for asking this question.

I am totally conflicted on this.

[ohheckyeah]

43. Seriously? n/t

[blaze]

50. I'm sorry

Really.

I hated to even ask the question.

Haven't children been strapped with explosives....

God I hate this discussion.

[Danger Mouse]

57. Haven't people shoved things up their ass before?

Should the TSA then start shoving their hands up people's asses, just to make absolutely sure?

[awoke_in_2003]

244. it is the only safe way....

(I hope you know I don't mean that one bit) :hi:

[seabeyond]

58. i believe once, in the middle east somewhere. so, you gonna allow your shirt pulled off in front of

everyone. or just kids....

[scentopine]

61. One time a pizza guy had a bomb around his neck.... one time a drunk driver

killed someone in an accident. Shouldn't we lower the speed limit? Or force people to use breathalyzer before starting a car and have the results emailed to local police where they can approve?

You could drive your car into a propane truck and kill innocent people.

My penis and/or vagina and/or breasts are yours, Mr. President. I do it to support the troops.

Shouldn't we demand that all delivery men strip naked before approaching us? What if there is a bomb in that pizza and he is delivering it to an airport?

There are so many more risks in this country that we could spend time and money on. The government was made to look foolish with 9/11. Now they are trying to cover their asses by stripping every last dignity away. I am stunned that anyone would consider this a prudent measure.

(I am going to be probably a bit cranky here, but this really pisses me off. And the fact that people have trouble with the morality and common sense outrage over this is more frightening than a $7/hr rent-a-cop jack-off fondling a 12 year old's dick or breasts).

Please.

[sabrina 1]

96. Exactly, but you are using logic. The sickos who are behind this

are counting on the fearful among us not to use logic, but to become compliant sheep who will do anything to feel 'safe'. They are hoping they won't say 'hey, wait a minute, I am in more danger from a mugger or a drunken driver than I am from a terrorist'. Fear is their weapon, I am glad to see though, that maybe, finally, they have gone too far.

[awoke_in_2003]

247. we are in greater danger...

of slipping in the shower and cracking our skulls open. No more showers- especially prior to flying :)

[awoke_in_2003]

245. The pizza guy stripping is fine...

but what if put Anthrax or Ebola on the pizza? We need anthrax (and Ebola) sniffing dogs to screen every pizza man- and if the dog is hungry and grabs a piece- that is the price of freedom :)

[ohheckyeah]

137. Vietnam....

about 1969.

[seabeyond]

45. when was the last time you heard a kid took down a plane? nt

[npk]

84. Agree with you.

It's just a dog and pony show.

It's par for the course in this country.

First we FUCK UP, then WE overreact.

Yep sounds like America to me.

[CreekDog]

47. you are conflicted about a kid being disrobed and groped in an airport terminal

by employees of he government.

you are conflicted? :wow:

maybe your conflict is the problem.

[_ed_]

183. Bingo

I'm really getting sick of seeing people throw their liberty in the trash because of bullshit "threats." The modern slack-jawed, fearful, stupid American makes me sick. What time is Dancing with the Stars on?

[awoke_in_2003]

248. it will be on...

right after the "Two Minute Hate"

[_ed_]

182. It's a false choice

between safety and liberty. The Israelis have likely the biggest threat to their airlines. They don't use xrays, they don't pat your crotch for fun, and they don't profile. And they are extremely successful.

Anyone arguing that this makes us safe is simply wrong.

[nadinbrzezinski]

234. When did the civil war actually start?

For the record they have...in war zones.

[liberal N proud]

56. Did I see that right? - They took the kids shirt off?

Enough already, this is not necessary. PERIOD!

[Matariki]

72. Disgusting.

Doubly disgusting in light of Obama's flippant comments today.

[woo me with science]

125. "Love pats"

per Claire McCaskill (D-Missouri)

Senators and TSA Defend "Love Pats" at Airports
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2010/11/17/national/main7063414.shtml

[awoke_in_2003]

249. unreal...

the clowns have ZERO connection with the real world.

[AspenRose]

285. I can't begin to describe how offensive that is.

Seriously. There are no words.

How could these people be so clueless and out-of-touch?!

[AzDar]

73. There was a time when we would have mercilessly mocked other countries

for shit like this.

[KoKo]

225. If Chavez did it...for sure.. Or how about the old "Soviet Union" we used to expect this from?

[LibDemAlways]

271. When I was growing up in the 1960s we were told that

the reason we were in Vietnam was to prevent the spread of Communism with all of its attendant evils, such as restrictions on peoples' freedom.

We have devolved massively in the past 40-50 years. Who could have ever imagined that people would have their genitals groped in public by the fucking government? It's surreal.

[npk]

74. What a dog and pony show we are all witnessing

Little old laddies and children being stripped of their clothing and groped. All this to give the appearance that our government is protecting us from terrorists. Meanwhile, we are not the least bit safer.

[sabrina 1]

109. Actually it is all about money.

A lot of people stand to make a lot of money from those virtual rape machines. Security is not an issue for these vile fear profiteers, money is.

[npk]

110. Excellent point

I did not consider that aspect, but you are right.

[awoke_in_2003]

250. bingo..

they are doing this so people will choose to go through the porno scanners- which means more will have to be bought. To quote Chris Tucker in "Rush Hour2"- "follow the rich white man with the money".

[ProSense]

76. That does look unnecessary. Did

the person who took this video do anything with it besides post it on You Tube? I know seeing a child taking off his shirt in the airport is disturbing, but what were the circumstances? Why are people just standing around watching?

Why didn't the parents complain during and after? Why was the TSA searching a child?

One of the things this video demonstrates is that these incidents happen in public, which is bizarre given some of the charges.

There are several issues here, including the policies and the types of people working for the TSA.

The policies can and should be addressed, but it's preposterous to claim, as some have, that everyone working for the TSA enjoys doing this or are perverts.

[CreekDog]

80. The juxtaposition of this being posted today on YouTube and Obama's remarks defending TSA...

can't be good.

[ProSense]

90. Here is what the President said

With respect to the TSA, let me, first of all, make a confession. I don't go through security checks to get on planes these days, so I haven’t personally experienced some of the procedures that have been put in place by TSA. I will also say that in the aftermath of the Christmas Day bombing, our TSA personnel are, properly, under enormous pressure to make sure that you don't have somebody slipping on a plane with some sort of explosive device on their persons. And since the explosive device that was on Mr. Abdulmutallab was not detected by ordinary metal detectors, it has meant that TSA has had to try to adapt to make sure that passengers on planes are safe.

Now, that's a tough situation. One of the most frustrating aspects of this fight against terrorism is that it has created a whole security apparatus around us that causes huge inconvenience for all of us. And I understand people’s frustrations. And what I’ve said to the TSA is that you have to constantly refine and measure whether what we’re doing is the only way to assure the American people’s safety. And you also have to think through are there ways of doing it that are less intrusive.

But at this point, TSA, in consultation with our counterterrorism experts, have indicated to me that the procedures that they’ve been putting in place are the only ones right now that they consider to be effective against the kind of threat that we saw in the Christmas Day bombing.

But I’m going to -- every week I meet with my counterterrorism team and I’m constantly asking them whether -- is what we’re doing absolutely necessary? Have we thought it through? Are there other ways of accomplishing it that meet the same objectives?

link

It's not like he has the authority to unilaterally abolish the TSA.

[CreekDog]

98. Oh quit quoting that stuff back to me again and again, Obama should just be a human being about this

instead we got a long explanation about how he'll talk with his people and keep asking them if it's all necessary or not.

which is exactly how we got to where we are.

now let's xray your limbs 10-20 times before you board your next flight.

thanks.

http://amputeemommy.blogspot.com/2010/05/humiliation-and-now-im-angry.html (May 31, 2010)

[ProSense]

102. Well

maybe you could quit pretending that President is going to jump in and order the TSA shut down this hour.

[CreekDog]

148. Too bad TSA isn't being run by Van Jones

Pistole is so revered by the general public that he's untouchable --or so it would seem.

Ditto for Napolitano.

[demwing]

192. Wow. Prosense defending Obama in the face of another embarrassing let down?

I'm shocked!

Shocked, I say.....

[donco6]

198. The entity is having a bad day.

If I were it, I'd be crawling back into my cave.

[awoke_in_2003]

252. Shocking, isn't it...

We used to ridicule Free Republic posters for their 100% devotion, no matter what, to Bush.

[sabrina 1]

114. Why don't you stop trying to exuse the inexusable.

This is about money, pure and simple. Every expert on security has denounced these vile methods, and I wish I had not even seen this president's reaction to something he would not allow his own wife and children to be subjected to. Shame on him.

Michael Chertoff was all over TV after the story of the underwear bomber became public. For years, the use of these machines had been fought by civil liberties groups, successfully. Chertoff jumped all over this story promoting the use of machines. A man who failed so miserably himself to prevent the deaths of U.S. citizens in NOLA. A man NO ONE should listen to when it comes to security. A failure!! But then it was revealed that he had a financial stake in those machines. So of course, failure that he is, he was not concerned about the real cause of the security breach, he saw an opportunity to make money, and did not reveal his financial interest in his promotion of a useless method to stop terrorists, until he was exposed.

Obama knows damn well that it was a failure of security that the underwear bomber ever got near a plane, considering that his own father had warned that he was dangerous. That is where the security breaches were, on the neglect to act on already known information about him. No machines were necessary to stop that event from getting as far as it got. Obama must think we are stupid.

Ignoring threats is what caused 9/11, the shoe bomber, the underwear bomber and none of these events had anything to do with machines, they never should have been allowed near an airport considering what was known about them.

He is beginning to look like an advertisement for big business. It would have been better if he had nothing at all if he was not going to condemn these abuses, or act like a leader if he believes in these methods, and take his wife and children along with himself, through the same process he is asking the American people to endure.

[ProSense]

122. Excuse?

"Ignoring threats is what caused 9/11, the shoe bomber, the underwear bomber and none of these events had anything to do with machines"

Yes, and airport screening weren't invented by the TSA.

The TSA was created as part of the Aviation and Transportation Security Act passed by the U.S. Congress, and signed into law by President George W. Bush on November 19, 2001. Originally organized in the U.S. Department of Transportation, the TSA was moved to the U.S. Department of Homeland Security on March 25, 2003.

<...>

The TSA was created by the federal government in response to the September 11, 2001 attacks. Prior to its creation, security screening was operated by private companies that had contracts with either an airline or a consortium contracted by multiple airlines that used a given terminal facility.

With the arrival of the TSA, private screening did not disappear completely. Private security firms were approved by the TSA to provide security, but under the authority of the TSA.<2> Under the TSA's Screening Partnership Program (SPP), privately operated checkpoints exist in the following airports: San Francisco International Airport; Kansas City International Airport; Greater Rochester International Airport; Tupelo Regional Airport; Key West International Airport; and Jackson Hole Airport.<3><4>

link

Fact is, the President cannot unilaterally abolish the agency. His statement addressed his concerns.

[sabrina 1]

132. He can express his displeasure at the abuses being perpetrated

by that useless agency against the American people. But that would take courage, and not supporting them.

[james0tucson]

187. Re: Excuse?

<i>Fact is, the President cannot unilaterally abolish the agency.</i>

The President has broad authority with respect to agency rules. He can direct the agency's priorities down to any level he would choose. He could even personally publish rules in the Federal Register. More likely he could issue an Executive Order that would direct the agency to publish rules. Those rules don't have any congressional or judicial barriers to pass, until after they go into effect (which is exactly why we are in this situation.)

Don't underestimate the authority the President has when it comes to the executive agencies, their organizational structure, and their rules.

[47of74]

118. These experts need to be fired

[_ed_]

184. Yeah, the President is just powerless

He just can't do anything. Maybe he should have a TSA agent and passengers over for a beer. That's all he seems capable of.

[LisaL]

93. Why is it done in public?

Because pat downs can be done in public, unless a specific request for a private pat down is made. What do you expect the parents going to complain about and to whom? This looks like a new style TSA pat down and children aren't excluded. Why are these people standing around watching? Are you freaking kidding me? They are the passengers waiting for their screenings, WTF do you want them to do?
Why is TSA searching the child? Are you for real? They are allowed to search everyone before allowing people to get on the plane.

[npk]

100. For the sole purpose of humiliation and power

It shows the other passengers standing around that this could happen to you. It's a good way to erode liberties in plain view. The more people who sit around and watch this, the more fear that will spread. Of course not to worry, the real terrorist will still have no real problem boarding the plane. Because while we're all entertaining this theater, the real terrorist are laughing their asses off.

[ProSense]

105. No I'm not kidding.

Complain. You act as though people simply have no choice but to offer themselves up for ridicule and harrassment.

Millions of people fly every day. If no one complains, why would anyone believe that these are not simply a few isolated incidents by a few obnoxious agents?

[LisaL]

107. You seem to be totally uninformed.

What isolated incidents? TSA has implemented new style pat downs and children aren't exempt. Except those under 12 will undergo modified pat downs, but TSA doesn't say what exactly is modified.
So, WTF are you talking about?

[ProSense]

134. "TSA has implemented new style pat downs and children aren't exempt"

Oh, I can read. I also see that the outrage is not simply about the new policies. Evidently, some believe the TSA agents are all perverts and the agency is completely out of control, and has been for years.

Are you aware of that?

[sabrina 1]

115. So you're not aware that these machines have been so controversial

since they were first revealed, that civil liberties groups have succeeded in stopping their use over and over again? 'Isolated' complaints? You really are misinformed.

[ProSense]

135. Isolated complaints

was not a comment made in reference to civil liberties groups. Read it again.

[sabrina 1]

139. 'Growing outrage, crossing all political lines' is a far better

description of what is going on. And the reason it is only happening now, is because these sick rules, the products of some very sick minds, were not revealed until recently. The TSA revealed 'changes in the rules' in August, 'new enhanced pat-downs' but refused to explain exactly what that meant.

This outrage is growing and will only grow more intense as more people are exposed to these abuses. They are relatively new and yet have already generated an enormous negative response, as they should in any democratic nation.

[CreekDog]

147. we do complain --it gets worse

where have you been?

[awoke_in_2003]

255. at Cheerleading school. nt

[YOY]

206. Don't throw your back out doing those backflips.

n.t.

[KoKo]

226. Pro Sense, they just made all the regulations much stricter and requiring

everyone to choose "pat down" (more invasive than before) or Body Scan for all including babies and children.

See this post from the ACLU...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x9602356

[scentopine]

106. Conditioning - control, they are grooming us for total compliance

look - we let Bush go without punishment.

We let the banks go without punishment.

We let torture go without punishment.

We let fucking every goddamn money bag get away with it and the rest of us are forced to pay!

So now we are going to give our genitals over to the government and they'll get away with it.

[midnight]

219. Looking at that laundry list compiled is what is so over the top...

[tpsbmam]

213. Based on the experience of others, the parent wouldn't be allowed to be with the kid

in a private room. As bad as this was, there's no way in hell I want some stranger taking my kid off to a private room and doing whatever.....NO FUCKING WAY! I'd miss my flight and leave the airport before I'd allow that to happen.

[66 dmhlt]

221. Private Screening w/ a Witness of Your Choosing

TSA Guidelines
Pat-downs are performed by same-gender officers and all passengers have the right to a private screening with a travel companion at any time.

Source:
http://blog.tsa.gov/2010/11/tsa-myth-or-fact-leaked-images.html

How this might delay being able to board your flight is another matter.

[tpsbmam]

262. What the rules say and what actually happens appears to be two different things.

There are agents who are bullying people, are bloated with their power and most certainly aren't following the guidelines. I'm sure there are many more such instances and many that have gone unreported. People are beginning to speak out. Here are three examples:

http://www.mybottlesup.com/2009/10/tsa-agents-took-my-son/

My son was taken from me by the TSA agents at Atlanta Hartsfield-Jackson airport yesterday.

He was taken away from me and OUT OF MY SIGHT because his pacifier clip went off when I carried him through the metal detector.

According to the Transportation Security Administration website, “We will not ask you to do anything that will separate you from your child or children.”

Bullshit TSA.

You took my son. MY SON.

The female agent then called an older gentleman, also a TSA agent over. The male TSA agent stood in front of me and said “I’m going to have to pat down your son.”

With Jackson still sitting in my lap (he was being so good despite all of this chaos) I said ok and continued to hold on to my son, expecting the male TSA agent to start touching Jackson.

He then told me, “I’m going to have to pick him up to inspect him.”

I rolled my eyes and sternly told him “It’s his pacifier clip that went off, can’t you just run that back through the belt and let us go. We are going to miss our flight.”

The female TSA agent, who had been standing there the entire time said to me, “You need to adjust your attitude and do as you are told.”

The male TSA agent repeated, “I’m going to have to pick him up to inspect him.”

I handed him my son.

I handed him my son and he walked away with my child.

My eyes welled up with tears, I stood up from my chair and I asked the female TSA agent, “Where is he going? Where is he taking my child? Why is he leaving?”

Jackson, while being whisked away looked at the male TSA agent awkwardly and repeated “no no no no.”

I started crying.

The female TSA agent did not answer me.

Panic set in. My hands began to shake. My body was sweating. My breath was short and my heart was racing.

They had taken my child and not told me.

Jackson was out of my eye sight.

I could not see my son.

Now sobbing, I repeated my questions to the female TSA agent.

She told me “Ma’am, we’re trying to be nice to you. We don’t know which one of you went off in the metal detector. Stay here so I can search you.”

“But my son… where is my son?” I asked over and over again.

The female TSA agent called a second female TSA agent over as she began to search me. Apparently the second female TSA agent could hear me protesting and asking for my son.

“Ma’am you need to calm down or I’m going to have to involve the authorities,” she told me.

Now I was pissed.

Horrified. Terrified. Enraged.

“You fucking get the authorities,” I told the female TSA agent while the other continued to wand me and forced me to unbutton my jeans because the button beeped when she went over my abdomen with her wand.

“You get the goddamn authorities right the fuck now and tell them to GIVE ME MY SON,” I said.

(more at link)

http://www.lawyers.com/our-blog/archives/271-TSA-Body-Scan-of-12-Year-Old-Girl-Outrages-Parents.html

TSA Body Scan of 12-Year-Old Girl Outrages Parents
Monday, July 26, 2010 by Art Buono - Lawyers.com

The parents of a young girl who was subjected to a full body scan by Transportation Security Administration officials have called foul. TSA personnel at Tampa International Airport separated the girl from her traveling party and scanned her body for weapons. The parents have interviewed lawyers and spoken with their pediatrician about the potential harmful effects – physical and emotional – of the scan.

And, while this child wasn't taken out of sight of the parents, she was separated from her service animal and her parents despite their pleas about her physical and mental state:

http://inciid.blogspot.com/2010/08/tsa-violates-10-year-old-child-at.html

My youngest daughter is a trauma victim and severely developmentally delayed and travels in crowded places in a Convaid wheelchair stroller along with her service dog (Grizwald). Normally before we go through the metal detectors I strip her service dog's collar and harness off and then put him in a down and call him through the detectors. Then my husband puts my whopping 49 LB tiny 10 year old on his back (Piggy back). By doing it this way she is not too traumatized by the event and is reunited with her dog (and family) within seconds of going through the machines. We have practiced this and implemented this scenario everytime we go to an airport. If only TSA would have inquired before snatching her wheelchair out of my husband's grip. Seeing her with her service animal and in a wheelchair should have been a major clue even for those without any common sense) that there should have been some sensitivity - none of this would have happened and my daughter wouldn't have been now dealing with weeks of healing and we with the prospect of not being able to fly due to what happened to her (from a trauma standpoint).
Before we could figure out what was going to happen, a TSA agent took the wheelchair stroller from my husband and pushed it into a glass box effectively separating my daughter from not only her service animal but also the entire family. I told the agent when I realized what was happening that he couldn't do this to her because of her disabilities. She is a trauma victim and has had every kind of abuse a child could endure before we adopted her (including suspected sexual abuse) so having an adult male take her from us was way over the top to begin with. I told the TSA agent my daughter was a victim of trauma a number of times. I am talking some serious life threatening trauma that has caused extensive neurological damage She cannot speak but does understand what is said to her - although when she is traumatized - she goes into "fight/flight/freeze mode and all cognition goes out the window. My daughter thought she was being taken away from us and was so terrorized by what happened she went into a fetal position in her chair.

Her sister who tried to reach out to her was told not to touch her. When I got to her I was not allowed to touch her either and I told the agent again she was a trauma victim and would not allow her to touch her. She said she must allow her to wand her fingers and other parts of her body. I was told to be quiet and to mind my tone. I was frantic knowing the kind of fear and damage was being done to my daughter . I also asked for a CRO and was told no!

(more at the link -- an intelligent, caring supervisor intervened and the child endured lasting trauma)

[awoke_in_2003]

251. "Why are they standing around?"...

waiting to go through security. "Why didn't the parents complain?" Maybe they didn't feel like being arrested that day. If they were arrested, who would be watching the kid? These goons. "There are several issues here". No, there is one issue- why is President Obama allowing this? Remember this line he had to swear to on 20JAN2009- "I do solemnly swear that I will faithfully execute the Office of President of the United States, and will to the best of my Ability, preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States"? Or do minor fucking details like that not matter, as long as we get political "victories"?

[LibDemAlways]

273. Obama, like just about every politician in DC, has

found a new use for the Constitution. As toilet paper in the WH and halls of Congress.

[awoke_in_2003]

276. I just cannot believe...

people are defending this. If Bush was still in office and this was happening there wouldn't be many saying it is okay.

[LibDemAlways]

277. Oh, hell no. 100% of the DUers would be

outraged.

I align myself with the apparently antiquated principles of the Democratic party of old - the one that enacted Social Security, Medicare, the GI Bill, civil rights legislation, minimum wage laws, protection for unions. Today only the Green or Socialist parties would support those kinds of initiatives. Today's DINOs have pretty much illustrated they don't give any more of a flying fuck about the public than the Rs.

[awoke_in_2003]

278. But people like us are...

to quote Rahm Emmanual, "retards"

[Individualist]

77. I hope that agent is overwhelmed with contempt he so much deserves

to the point that his life is miserable.

[grahamhgreen]

82. This kind of trauma can permanantly damage children - and will.

[npk]

86. The kid will most likely grow up distrusting authority

And yet we wonder why so many people grow up having a distrust of the government and those in a position of enforcement.

[TorchTheWitch]

156. and adults

The trauma suffered by this kind of shit is hardly limited to children.

[AzDar]

85. Kick

:kick:

[scentopine]

87. By the way apologists- even in period of high employment

you will always find dirt bags who will have no problem signing up for genital inspector duty.

The apologists believe this is because of bad job market forcing people to do things they don't want to do. If this is true, then when economy improves, no one will be inspecting genitals. Right? That's the thinking and it is so wrong.

This is about control and compliance and a police state.

In a tight job market, only the best and most determined genital control freaks will make it to the top.

Is there no injustice in this world that Obama will challenge?

[somone]

116. He's got his - the heck with the rest of us

Heck, he's got everything already - even a Nobel prize (for what now?)

[sabrina 1]

117. Apparently not. We should have known back when he changed his

mind on the FISA Bill.

[kenny blankenship]

120. People should boo and yell shame! at these incidents

[LisaL]

124. It was hard to figure out who is saying what, but I heard two

comments: ridiculous and unbelievable.

[scentopine]

129. BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO !!! NO WAY TSA!!!!!!!! NO WAY TSA!!!!!!

[brettdale]

141. has the media picked up on this video

and if you have to stripsearch a child shouldnt there be a private room.

[LibDemAlways]

143. I sent the link to Keith Olbermann's Countdown e-mail, telling

them to take a look.

I am glad this is being done publicly. Who knows what horrors the boy would have had to endure behind closed doors.

[Brickbat]

144. Why don't people just stand around and chant "bullshit! bullshit! bullshit!" like they do at a blown

call at a basketball game?

[LibDemAlways]

145. Because when they shout "bullshit" at a basketball game they

have a reasonable expectation that there will be no repercussions. People are terrified of these goons. Listen to the guys watching the kid being strip searched. They express their disgust to each other but they are afraid to direct it at the agents poised to make them the next victim.

I agree. People should be yelling "bullshit" and worse. Unfortunately, most don't want to "stir up trouble," and the government counts on that mindset.

[Zax2me]

146. Boy, that looks bad....

Something is broken here. Hopefully it is repaired soon (by the Administration) and I expect it will.

[Odin2005]

149. FUCKING BASTARDS!

If they ever touch my niece like that They'll wish they didn't after I am through with them! :grr:

[redirish28]

150. I want to vomit after seeing that. If I had kids I'd have slugged the TSA agent.

[brettdale]

153. nothing will be done

Thsi video only has 310 hits, while the cartoon video of tsa members dancing to a rap song has 834567 hits. Seems noone is interested.

[LibDemAlways]

157. The video is new and the count needs updating. I saw

a link to it on a Wall St. Journal blog tonight and found it myself on an anti-TSA site. Judging by the reaction I've seen here and elsewhere, people are interested.

[sabrina 1]

160. Wrong, people are only finding out about these abuses

and already polls across the internet are overwhelmingly against these anti-constitutional attacks.

On the TSA blog itself, people are expressing outrage, there is hardly a single supporter anywhere, right, left, old, young. This is a growing outrage and the TSA has already had to cave in to the airline pilots and to stopping the groping of children under 12. The pressure has just started and will grow as people learn more about what they thought was just security checks.

I saw one article today which had over 500 comments and the poll was nearly 90% opposed to these abusive tactics.

The blogger who drew attention to the whole thing, who filmed his experiences, had over 5000 comments on his blog, and hundreds on other blogs linking to his, with overwhelming opposition to the scanners and the pat-downs.

Members of Congress have begun to speak out against them as they start hearing from their constituents. So, something has already been done, the Airline Pilots have won, and toddlers have been protected from the TSA gropers. There's more to be done, mostly those scanners need to go and the patdowns made illegal, but we just started and with the people united I think this time we will get something done for once.

[_ed_]

185. Cheering for your oppressors

What's happening to this country?

[LibDemAlways]

190. Up to over 50,000 hits this morning.

[LAGC]

161. Children need to understand why they may pose a threat to National Security.

[onecent]

162. This should be against the law...taking off 6 year olds clothes

at the airport........What has our Nation come to?????? I am appalled....

[backscatter712]

164. Are you kidding? The TSA LOVES children!

[katnapped]

171. Yup...Pedobear is LOVING THIS n/t

[tblue37]

165. kick

[nc4bo]

166. WTF!

This needs to stop. What was so suspicious about a little kid ffs?

[mwooldri]

167. Right now we have a secret weapon against this.

Can't see the video cos of firewall @ work but...

Thanks to a congenital birth defect, I know of a handful of people who have the wonderful "ability" to "pee through their belly buttons". These people have a reconstructed bladder and something called a mitrofanoff channel which exits where a belly button would be. If the bladder gets too full the urine has to go somewhere, typically through the mitrofanoff, as often the bladder neck is tied off or severely restricted.

One of them is my eldest son.

All I need to do is for us to go through the scanners just around the time he needs to use the bathroom. Or a little beyond. Any clothing removal will be met with him sucking his belly in.

Oops. Sorry, he needed to use the bathroom, we waited in line plenty long enough... it's an accident... no you didn't pull down his pants... he just has a special condition.

Next thing you know is that TSA agent is visiting the bathroom... and we're demonstrating my sons' toileting techniques to his or her supervisor. Which right now he'll have no problem in doing.

[superduperfarleft]

169. STUPID KID! WHY DON'T HE JUST USE THE TRAIN???!!!!

IF HE'S NOT A TERRORIST HE HAS NOTHING TO WORRY ABOUT!!!!11 BLAH BLAH BLAH

Whew. Sorry about that. I got caught up in the heat of the moment again....

[katnapped]

170. You forgot...

"THE KID'S GONNA GET GROPED BY SOME OTHER KID SOON ENOUGH SO NO SENSE PUTTING IT OFF!!!!"

:sarcasm:

[crim son]

174. The 9/11 perpetrators accomplished more than they ever dreamed. n/t

[nc4bo]

176. Yep. They made the first move then we took it from there.

No, they didn't destroy our way of life on 9/11, 9/11 was just the beginning.

MISSION ACCOMPLISHED.

[Abukhatar]

175. this has been going on for 9 years

funny how outraged most americans are now that they finally experience what we people of color, who may or may not be muslims have been experiencing for the past 9 years - yeah so now it is offensive, where were you when we were yelling about this

[LibDemAlways]

188. I have posted many times here on DU about TSA crimes, starting

almost 9 years ago. I see you are new to the site or to posting here. Outrage against tsa is nothing new on DU.

[seabeyond]

189. i stopped flying when they put the first 9 scanners in. how about you? nt

[blueamy66]

179. Thank goodness that I don't have children

cause I would have been arrested for assault.

What is the world coming to?

[sarcasmo]

193. Follow the money, Chertoff and his company get 170,000 each for these machines.

Our Government has ordered 500. When they order another 1,000 or 2,000 where do you think they are going to go? malls, the library, sporting events, schools, all in the name of protection? BULLSHIT, all in the name of GREED.

[barbtries]

195. they made him take his shirt off.

man this is out of hand

[struggle4progress]

196. When and where did this happen?

[LibDemAlways]

201. Believed to be Salt Lake City Airport, Concourse B. Not sure

when it happened. Video posted yesterday - over 82,000 hits so far.

[LisaL]

202. I bet it is recent because that looks like one of those new

"enhanced" pat downs.

[LibDemAlways]

272. Now confirmed. Salt Lake City Airport last Friday.

You want a laugh. The guy that took the video reports that the tsa questioned him about it, asking him what he was going to do with it. Told him they were concerned for the boy's "privacy." Sure they were. They were concerned about covering their big complicit asses.

[Mhak]

197. I like how our government allocates its oversight....

100% to little boys trying to go on vacation with their family, and 0% to the Wallstreet money-manipulators who get away economic terrorism in the middle of our own country.

[scentopine]

200. Exactly! All the genital inspections in the world are not going to solve terrorism

just like the war on drugs, the war on terrorism is fueling demand. It's good business if you are in the police state market.

[truth2power]

203. Excellent point! n/t

[LibDemAlways]

205. Wecome to DU. Very thoughtful post, and right on the

money!

[Politicub]

199. The terrorists are winning - our freedoms are going up in smoke

The aftermath of 9/11 is far more destructive than the actual attack ever was.

The terrorists were looking at the long view, and America is now afraid of its own shadow.

(on edit - I changed the subject line from "have won" to "are winning." I hope we can turn things around, but the odds seem high.)

[Swamp Rat]

215. 'Osama Bin Laden' already won.

The America we knew (or thought we knew) is dead.

[DeSwiss]

228. Yes, and we now live in a police state.

And it'll only get worse because no one wants to believe it.

[TwentyFive]

209. I'm a Governemt out of the Bedroom voter. I'm also a "Gov't out of Little Boy's Pants" voter.

Obama will LOSE MY VOTE in 2012 unless he puts a stop to this...

[liberation]

246. Well, good luck on Mr. Obama putting a stop to this. He's already supported the TSA on this

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/40289750/ns/travel


Your move...

[dickthegrouch]

214. My letter to my US Senators

What TSA thinks it get can get away with in my name is DISGUSTING

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=skkCpnCm7iM

These kinds of assaults on people presumed innocent until proven guilty must stop NOW.

Tell Janet Napolitano if she does that to any kid I'm responsible for, she will answer for it in court.

Furiously

[Boudica the Lyoness]

220. When the pervert touched his penis

the little boy turned quickly to his dad for help.

Everything we have been taught as small children suddenly doesn't mean anything.

You don't let strangers feel your 'private parts' and dads are suppose to stop strangers from undressing their children and feeling their privates, against their will, for no good reason.

Fuck Napolitano.

[katnapped]

223. What I REALLY want to know

If Bush were the one at the wheel would those poo-pooing this off as a "minor inconvenience" think the same way?

(I think I know the answer)

[Rex]

224. Over 200 posts, yet not one of the TSA apologists here to defend

their love of jackboots. :eyes:

[McCamy Taylor]

227. A public strip search of a child? Are they out of their minds?

[cornermouse]

230. Yes.

[katnapped]

232. Come on now people

If we don't submit, our president will cry. And we don't want that, do we?

[nc4bo]

243. Georgie never cried. Why should the next one be any different? nt

[Fumesucker]

254. The video is up to 124 thousand and some odd hits now on Youtube

I suspect this might be going viral..

[Shining Jack]

261. I hope it does.

I'm actually sick after watching this and I'm not talking metaphorically. :(

[waiting for hope]

256. That is just uncalled for.

What happened to my country? :(

[nonconformist]

263. As a mom of 3 boys, this infuriates me!

I agree with those questioning if they would have done something like this if it was a girl. I am simply appalled that they removed his shirt, did it in public, and groped that poor kid. I did notice his body language when his genitals were being touched, and it broke my heart. We tell our children that that behavior is wrong, yet they have to be subjected to that by "authority".

We had planned to fly a couple of times in the coming weeks, but in light of this insanity, we've been rearranging our schedules and making other plans. Fuck that noise, we're driving now.

The TSA is looking like a dream job to pedophiles and sexual deviants.

[DeadEyeDyck]

264. Why stop at airports?

Why not strip searches at the entry doors to schools and malla. A terrorist could reign as much terror in one of those places. Or are we defending ourselve's from the last attack rather than the next one?

[brettdale]

266. wahoo 166 thousand now

wahoo 166 thousand now

[LisaL]

267. An explanation of how this video came to be.

"The video, posted on YouTube by Utah Valley University student Luke Tait, shows a young boy being patted down while he is wearing no shirt. The filmer, Luke Tait, wrote that "the boy was shy so the TSA couldn’t complete" the search."
http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/home/50725057-76/tait-tsa-video-shirt.html.csp

[LibDemAlways]

268. I read that last night. Probably deserves its own thread.

What outrages me most is that the boy did not set off the metal detector. He was selected for "random" screening. WTF? A little kid traveling with his dad is pulled aside to be molested by the government? Just wrong on so many levels.

I am sickened by this.

[LisaL]

274. Children under 12 aren't exempt. They are just subjected to

"modified" pat downs. Whatever that means, because TSA won't specify what exactly is modified.

[LibDemAlways]

275. Well, I think we saw on that video what a "modified" pat down is. It

involves going inside the waistband and grabbing the crotch. The tsa guy did not appear to touch the kid's butt - maybe that's what they were talking about when they said kids would be exempt from the full on "search."

Still horribly invasive and unnecessary. That kid certainly isn't going to be trusting people with badges any time soon.

[Xenotime]

283. It is about keeping America safe..some people don't get it.