Still resistent stopping use of offensive terms? Here is an example:what some DUers have experience

[bobbolink]

Recently, some DUers have asked for more enlightenment and awareness regarding terms casually used here and in the society at large. Those requests have often been met with derision rather than the compassion which one could expect from a "progressive" community.

This issue also intersects with my own mission to educate people about the true causes of homelessness. The following article will illustrate why so many of these "hospitals" were closed down (which happened BEFORE Raygun), and why "progressives" need to enlarge their awareness and activism to include those whom they don't understand. All oppression is the same, and we Dems USED to care about oppressed people of whatever group.

What is described in the following article is NOT limited to that one institution... these abuses and destructive conditions abound nationwide. During an effort to gather information for a book, I have listened to the pain of a group of people discussing what they have been subjected to. That pain is life-altering and hidden from view and I hope that others will now find it in their hearts to be more caring. That pain is REAL, and it is harming real people.

Because the paragraphs in the article are short, it is hard to get the full impact without reading the article. The grand-jury investigation followed three deaths which happened in a short period of time. Also notice that at no time were the patients themselves interviewed in this matter!

Thank you to those who care!

Changes urged at Colo. mental hospital after three deaths
By Kirk Mitchell
The Denver Post
Posted: 11/24/2010 01:00:00 AM MST

(snip)
A report issued last week recommended the hospital reduce physical restraints and seclusions by half, empower hands-on staff to make more clinical decisions and restore programming.

(snip)
"Based on this report and other internal reviews the department has conducted in recent months, we will develop a comprehensive plan going forward to improve the care and treatment we provide to patients," Colorado Department of Human Services executive director Karen Beye said in a statement.

The new forensic hospital was designed for all-day programming, but programming facilities are rarely used because of staff shortages, the report says. Patients stay in their residential pods most of the time. The atmosphere is "stark." Patient rooms didn't have personal photos on walls, and "fun-house" mirrors give distorted reflections of patients and should be replaced with safety mirrors.

(snip)
The report recommended revamping the hospital's leadership structure, in which administrative policy decisions were "knee-jerk" and not driven by front-line workers who best understood issues.

http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_16697768

[jwirr]

1. As the mother of a daughter who has a developmental disability

I also know why the closing of these hospitals did not work for persons with mental illnesses. When we closed down most of the institutions and brought our group home into the community there were day programs and other services waiting for them. They had a care system that provided for their needs that still exists today. This is not true for persons with mental illness. No work shops, no drop in centers, no group homes. Even today too many communities are without a support system for this group of people.

[bobbolink]

4. you are absolutely right... but few people understand that.

Also, I posted a request for DUers who stop using the offending "r" word:
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/bobbolink/49

It is time for us to become more aware and more sensitive to the pain of others.

My best to you and your daughter, from a former special ed teacher! :toast:

[Kalyke]

7. But I call things retarded, not people.

I used "retarded" as it was intended - meaning to delay, hinder or impede, "The Republicans' refusal to compromise has retarded our governance."

I hate that it's used for people and never should have been.

On edit: FWIW, I rarely used the word, period, but sometimes it can be used without any ill-intention, but because long ago and, still, in some parts of the country, it's used in general speech to mean impede.

[bobbolink]

9. It is against DU rules.

It has been explained to you that the term HURTS REAL PEOPLE (see my link), but since that is not important to you, then please be aware that it IS against DU rules.

Enough. This thread is about another form of oppression, and I will not respond to more efforts to derail it.

[Kalyke]

20. Excuse me?

I was not attempting to derail your thread.

I was pointing out that the word can be used when no ill-intention is made. And, it has NOT been explained to me how the word used as it was intended can hurt people.

I fully understand how the word can be hurtful if used to describe people (I have seen Palin called by that name a couple of times today), but that is, in no way, what I'm debating. I'm merely pointing out that the word can be used benignly.

P.S. And it's not against DU rules to use the word as a substitute for "delay" or "impede." It is against the rules to call a person by that name or to flippantly refer to any stupid remark or action made by the villain of the day as the "r" word.

[TBF]

24. Given the connotation of the word when used in that sense,

surely you could draw on your expansive vocabulary to find another word.

No one is going to fault you for saying something like "growth is retarded" (meaning slowed) in context, but if you are going to use it as an adjective in a pejorative manner then yes it is wrong whether you are describing a person or thing.

[bobbolink]

26. Thank you.

It is sad that there is so much stubborness when it comes to changing the use of a word that hurts vulnerable people.

I appreciate you pointing out that there are many other words to chose from.

:yourock:

[Kalyke]

33. So you're thanking a person who is agreeing with me?

I'm confused.

I said:"I fully understand how the word can be hurtful if used to describe people (I have seen Palin called by that name a couple of times today), but that is, in no way, what I'm debating. I'm merely pointing out that the word can be used benignly."

And followed that comment up with my understanding of the DU rules to mean that it's wrong to use the word as a noun or adjective (i.e. calling people the name). I agree with that rule and don't break it.

And the poster above said: "No one is going to fault you for saying something like "growth is retarded" (meaning slowed) in context, but if you are going to use it as an adjective in a pejorative manner then yes it is wrong whether you are describing a person or thing. "

It's the same argument. Why are you cheering them and telling me I'm insensitive?

Simply put: use the word sparingly as a verb and never use it as a noun or adjective.

[vanbean]

62. Or if you're quoting Rahm.

[Catherina]

25. Would you please link to the rule or Admin statement? Would be helpful. Thanks n/t

[Control-Z]

35. Your message is a bit confusing,

to the point that I feel somewhat uncomfortable responding. You posted about the "r" word and then basically accused a member of making an effort to derail your thread by responding to that post. I'm not defending the use of the the "r" word, but there are perfectly legitimate uses of the word that would be permitted here on DU.

Intent is what matters when choosing our words, and people are pretty good at recognizing that intent. Having suffered depression, I know when someone is calling me crazy bad or crazy good. One is hurtful. One is not. I would never suggest people stop using the word altogether.

Few of us need lessons on which words can bite. It is how we use them that is important, and being sensitive to those they might hurt.

[Obamanaut]

64. The spark in an internal combustion engine (lawn mower for example) can be advanced

or retarded.

Noxious weed growth can be retarded by the application of certain chemicals.

It is not a bad word when used correctly, and 'most' people are aware of that. I think used in the context in my examples it is not against the rules of DU.

[SidDithers]

102. You''re right. The poster is trying to retard our ability to post...

by limiting how we use language.

Sid

[NuclearDem]

66. !

NO, DON'T USE THAT WOR--



Aw, dammit, now look what you did.

[defendandprotect]

65. Exactly -- and that was the intention of those who saw that the hospitals could be closed ....

and patients suffering what is really a chemical imbalance -- but which we call

"mental illness" -- could survive increasingly well without being confined in an

institution. Just want to add here that the power to label others is quite a

life-changing one for those who are thusly labeled! We should remember that these

are simply labels which often carry along with them strong stereotypes of these

labelled human beings.

As with so much else in our promised democracy -- our better ideas/ideals, better

angels, better solutions -- are too often turned back or destroyed by those among us

with the lowest of intentions. The changes necessary to facilitate this move from

institutionalization to outside care and support mainly were not carried thru.

[Binka]

2. K & R

Thanks for the information.

[proud2BlibKansan]

3. It's about doing things on the cheap

Providing appropriate treatment is expensive. Sadly we don't speak out against spending money on war, but taking care of people is socialism. Sigh.

Thanks for the informative piece. K & R.

[bobbolink]

5. And as long as "progressives" accept that, it will continue.

Much is revealed about us in regards to our silence.

It is also about the derogatory terms that are used with thoughtlessness of the suffering of others.

Thanks! :yourock:

[defendandprotect]

68. Agree ... but also think that TPB want institutions because we all fear institutionalization ....

and a labelled class of "inferior" citizens --

Same with impoverished citizens where their status is guaranteed to make the rest

of us feel insecure -- a depowered underclass which is a threat to us all.

The elite must always keep FEAR in front of us --

Any loss of FEAR in the society is a loss of POWER for TPB --

As this switch was made, the very arbitrary "talking cure" was also downgraded.

Psychiatrists are now simply there to prescribe medication -- this is an illness caused

by chemical imbalance. And, it seems to strike the most intelligent among us. Why?

Does it have anything to do with our pollution of the environemnt, drinking water, air?

[bobbolink]

70. The psychiatrists themselves made the decision to be merely prescribers.

And, of course, Big Pharma applauded and helped them along.........

[defendandprotect]

81. Hmmm...

well, don't think that psychiatrists exactly welcomed the downgrading of their

profession -- "friendship" which is the basis of talking therapy is always helpful.

But it has been medications which have reversed these chemical imbalances -- but, again --

too often with serious side effects from the medications.

Psychiatrists, of course, are now the "gate-keepers" for the prescriptions which the

patients require. One positive outcome is that there are some medications which point

more to a "point of need" medication, but still the patient must see the psychiatrist

regularly -- even for a very brief period of time -- in order to get the prescriptions.

[bobbolink]

91. It was their decision. OK, I'll spell it out....

This was told to me many years ago by a psychiatrist, and he was THERE, so you can choose to believe it or not.

He said he could tell me the day and time the decision was made. It was at their annual convention, and the big topic was how they were going to save their profession, because the psychologists and MSWs were cutting into their territory because they could charge less.

They decided to go for the drugs, because that way, they were the ONLY ones (at that time) who could prescribe. It set them apart from the psychologist and MSWs. And, of course, Big Pharma was only too happy to sign on.

[a la izquierda]

6. K & R

The treatment of the mentally ill in this country is a travesty. Thanks for posting.

[Hannah Bell]

79. the treatment of *people* in this country is a travesty. being insecure *causes* mental illness.

[a la izquierda]

93. Well, duh. Sorry, but there are plenty of other comments...

on this thread to pick at. Mine wasn't one of them. If it's not a given that people in this country are treated like crap, I don't know what is.

[Hannah Bell]

96. i wasn't picking on your comment, i was expanding it. there was no intent to

pick on your comment.

[HuckleB]

8. Recommend!

[bobbolink]

10. Thank you! There is so much pain of people who are ignored... we MUST listen to them!

:yourock:

[denem]

11. Anyone who has worked with the homeless is confronted by mental illness.

The 'drunks' and 'write-off' are so ofen the victims of crippling, untreated mental illness. That includes Vets devastated by PSTD.

AS jwirr recounts, when enlightened (and cost saving) measures were implemented to replace hospitalization with 'community care', surprise, suprise, "there were no work shops, no drop in centers, no group homes". Unless they had families to rely on, patients were thrown out onto the street and into a trash can.

If poverty isn't sexy, mental illness is still lower 'everybody's' list. Glenn Close didn't reveal 40 years of mental illness in her family till 2001.

And what of the hospitals? An underfunded, understaffed hospital is most likey to implement inflexible, but time saving practices, no matter how inhumane, notwithstanding opposition from the over stretched front line staff;

This is not a story on one delinquent hospital; it's a systemic problem more often than not tolerated by an indifferent and uncaring society, who might be relieved if more patients were turned away. At least then we just could call them bums or criminals.

Vulnerable people snubbed out by the jackboot of callous bigotry. Shame.

[leftstreet]

13. "drunks and complete no hopers" ...on a thread about offensive terminology

:rofl:

[denem]

14. I was using popular terminology, not expressing my own views.

I will put then in quotes if you like.

I find YOUR LOL to a serious post offensive.

[leftstreet]

44. Putting them in quotes is much better n/t

[bobbolink]

16. Thank you for catching that, but it is not funny.

We are talking about real people who are hurting and suffering abominable discrimination.

[bobbolink]

15. Again, you are repeating a myth... it is HARMFUL and it is time to understand the reality.

According to both The National Coalition For The Homeless and the 2005 Conference of Mayors report,

16% of homeless people are "mentally ill"

Please stop repeating that myth.

It hurts REAL people.

[pbrower2a]

18. Homeless and mentally-ill

Wouldn't homelessness contribute to mental illness by creating clinical depression and general distrust, the latter occasionally morphing into paranoia?

[bobbolink]

21. The term is so loaded that I won't use it in this context.

Until you become homeless and are treated as if you are "mentally ill", you probably won't understand just how loaded and damaging that label is.

[denem]

28. I'm not sure I understand.

I was not saying, I hope in any way that homelessness is caused primarily by mental illness, nor denying that homelessness causes pr exacerbates mental illness. But as someone who has worked with homeless people, those who give every appearance of suffering from schizophrenia, bipolar disorder, or severe PSTD are not only homeless, but avoided by others, missing out on the minimal support that people can give each other. And yes, they often self medicate with alcohol, and if you try to get them into care they are turned away.

A mortgage holder can one unemployment check away from the path to homelessness, If I gave the impression that it's the alcoholics and drug addicts who become homeless, I sincerely apologize.

[bobbolink]

36. "Anyone who has worked with the homeless is confronted by mental illness."

That is a direct quote from you.

You haven't "worked" with me, and I resent the blanket statement.

Again, if and when you become homeless and are treated and dismissed as "mentally ill", I think you will understand.

I gave you the stats, and you ignore it. It is time to be willing to change your opinion, to reflect the truth of the matter.

[verges]

77. Please clarify a point for me...

Is mental illness more prevalent among the homeless? I am not trying to imply that all or even most homeless are mentally ill or vica-versa. But that was all I got out of the earlier post that you were responding to. Is it a fair statement?

[Tsiyu]

80. She gave the statistic of 16%

I think it's one in five for "average' americans, whatever the heck that is. So it would seem the homeless are less inclined toward mental illness.

One has to have his or her faculties operating pretty efficiently in order to survive as a homeless person. But "normal" people are doing just that every day. Surviving as homeless people...not mentally ill people without homes.

BECAUSE WE DO NOT HAVE ADEQUATE AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

[bobbolink]

95. Thank you! It goes against what people have absorbed from the corporate media, so they don't want

to hear it.

Change is Hard.

[bobbolink]

92. I have repeated this over and over and over, and the information is readily available.

According to The National Coalition For The Homeless, and the 2005 Mayors Conference,

16% of homeless people are "mentally ill"

It is time for people to drop the misinformation, which hurts homeless people even more. It is not that hard to get the true facts.

[verges]

98. And what is the percentage of people who have homes?

Or the general population?
And what percentage of each group is able to get treatment. And what tyoes of mental illness? Depression is a far cry from psychotic episodes.

[bobbolink]

99. Clearly, you're not wanting the truth. So, cling to the myths, and keep hurting people.

Another person has also answered you, but you reject the FACTS. When you reject the facts, I can't help you.

[defendandprotect]

73. K&R ---

The lack of sufficient care when hospitals were closed was simply compounded by

other cuts to safety nets -- and a political enforcement which soon began to

stereotype being poor and/or homeless as something illegal. This included, of course,

those who suffered from PTSD and those suffering depression.

The mentality of the right wing is to demonize, especially the most vulnerable among us.

We've seen plenty of that from the right wing over the last 50+ years in demonizing

those who have been impoverished -- while lauding the wealthy and ignoring the often

corrupt and criminal avenues that have led to their riches.

[bobbolink]

74. The homelessness was caused by Rayguns cutting low-income housing, NOT

the closing of the snake pits.

[defendandprotect]

78. Well ... will go with what you're saying ....

but I do consider low income housing to be part of the safety net.

In fact, pretty much ALL "Rent-Control" over apartments which used to be prevalent in NYC --

in Boston and other large cities has been ended which impacts especially the poor and

people of moderate means.

And, actually, perhaps I'm mistaken, but thought that part of this movement of patients

out of mental institutions was begun long before Reagan?


Was just trying to look into this a bit -- these reforms began in the 1960's, but were certainly

prominent during the Carter years with Rosyln Carter being especially active in regard to

mental illness.


http://www.sociology.org/content/vol003.004/thomas_d.html

Scroll down to "Growing Discontent" ---

though I haven't read ALL of that section as yet --

and I'm not vouching for anything else on the website.

http://www.sociology.org/content/vol003.004/thomas_d.html

Here's part of it --

During the early 1960s a series of initiatives designed to reform the mental health system were passed. At issue was the system of state run hospitals for the mentally ill, which were increasingly perceived as inhumane and, with the help of new medications, rather unnecessary for large portions of the patient population. In 1961, the Joint Commission on Mental Illness released Action for Mental Health, calling for the integration of the mentally ill into the general public with the aid of Community Mental Health Centers. In 1963, the Mental Retardation Facilities and Community Mental Health Centers instituted the centers, but due to the financial drain of the Vietnam War during the 1960s and the financial crisis of the 1970s, the program was not fully funded. 1 The result was the release of patients into an environment lacking the Community Mental Health Centers to adequately treat them (Becker and Schulberg, 1976; DeLeonardis and Mauri, 1992; Hollingsworth, 1994; Rachlin, 1974; Rachlin et al, 1975; Saathoff et al, 1992; Shwed, 1978, 1980; Talbott, 1992; Worley and Lowery, 1988;).

By the start of the Carter administration in 1977, involuntary commitment had been restricted to those who were deemed as potentially dangerous to themselves or, perhaps more significantly, those around them. 2 Typically, the commitment had to be sponsored by a family member and/or ordered by the court. A result of this policy was that the mentally ill patient who refused treatment typically did not receive any at all. If the patient had lost contact with family members, she or he would not be committed unless found to be a threat by the court. Often, those arrested ended up in jail rather than in treatment if they had not been found to be a threat but had committed a crime (Abramson, 1972; Conrad and Schneider, 1980). One result was a high degree of stress and frustration experienced by the relatives of the patient. Throughout the 1970s, family members organized with the purpose of correcting a policy that they perceived was wrong.

It was a liberal movement to move patients out into communities -- and of course demonized by

the right wing. And Reagan began to reverse the attempted reforms.

One major problem which still exists but perhaps even more so at that time was that patients did

not take medications after leaving the hospital. Many reasons for that, naturally. But one

abiding reason is that there are many side effects still from these medication. And much of that

is NOT always understood by the public.

The right wing also FEAR-MONGERED in regard to this movement -- quite actively when Carter when

president -- often suggesting that these patients were violent. I'm sure you know that

they are no more violent than any other of our citizens -- about 5%.



:)

[The Green Manalishi]

88. Pretty complex problem.

It seems that a lot of people want to ascribe one or two causes to a situation that has many.

It seems that the factors include, but are not limited to:
-a utopian belief in medication as an inexpensive and side effect free remedy for nearly all the institutionalized, when in reality many chemical therapies turned out to be expensive, prone to severe side effects and not as widely effective as assumed.
- A well founded revulsion against the documented abuses of institutionalized people.
-Blind libertarian cost cutting that favored the elimination of nearly any public institution (except, of course, the armed forces)
-the erosion and eventual destruction of the social 'safety nets' including the extended family.
-the destruction of the lower middle class jobs where someone recovering could make a living (albeit barely) wage
-social stigmatism including but not limited to 'social darwinism' of mental illness.
-the power of the prison/industrial complex and it's need for 'customers.

As usual, TPTB have many of those who would find solutions fighting each other. Complex problem, there is no 'one' solution, although some sort of triage to differentiate people who just simply can't take care of themselves (and would have been taken care of by family, or died/been killed, in bygone times; people who need economic and medical assistance but can get by with same, and people who have just hit a disastrous patch and need a new start- and the economic and medical infrastructure for each. Even my meagre analysis is a gross oversimplification due to my personal ignorance and prejudices (being and always having been a member of the 'middle class)

[bobbolink]

90. Yes, I have said that many times.... this was done BEFORE Rayguns, and those snake pits NEEDED

to be closed.

People insist on conflating those two things. I keep trying to straighten them out on it. But, people don't let go of their misconceptions that easily.

What Raygun DID do was cut all funding for the neighborhood centers which were supposed to help those who had been turned out when the snake pits were closed.

AND cut off funding for low-income housing.

[emilyg]

12. Huge K/R

[Luminous Animal]

17. Not only were patients not interviewed but neither were the over-worked front line employees.

Not a single staff member of the facility felt empowered in the current organizational structure," the report said. "Interactions are too often motivated by fear. Several staff members reported punitive consequences for expressing disagreement with policies, procedures and clinical care."
http://www.chieftain.com/news/local/article_8ad4d3d2-f2da-11df-af25-001cc4c03286.html

I wonder if the patients also feel that they might be subjected to punitive consequences for expressing disagreement?

Good article, bobbolink.

[bobbolink]

19. Thank you for catching that... we need to stop trusting the "experts"!

We see it when it involves corporations, but we don't see it in areas like this with which we are unfamiliar. (Except of course that many, if not most, of these "institutions" are now corporations!)

"I wonder if the patients also feel that they might be subjected to punitive consequences for expressing disagreement?"

Of course, and thank you for pointing that out! That is a situation, one of the few, if not the only one, where a U.S. citizen has absolutely NO rights... their constitutional rights have been abridged by the courts!

They are totally helpless, and as such, deserve our support and concern just as much as we care about the Iraqi victims! But it is not a popular cause, so doesn't even get our attention. :(

Thank you again, and thanks for putting in the other link. Could you please quote the acceptable 4 paragraphs from it?

:yourock:

[Luminous Animal]

50. An excerpt from my link...

" "Not a single staff member of the facility felt empowered in the current organizational structure," the report said. "Interactions are too often motivated by fear. Several staff members reported punitive consequences for expressing disagreement with policies, procedures and clinical care."

The report said, "Accountability measures are seen as 'dinging staff members for errors.' ”

The document quotes a recent survey of the staff that said 44 percent of respondents didn't feel free to question the decisions of superiors and were afraid to ask questions "if something didn't feel right."

The report went on to say that there was a disconnection between administration and clinical care and that "adverse events led to 'knee-jerk' modifications of policies and procedures.""

http://www.chieftain.com/news/local/article_8ad4d3d2-f2da-11df-af25-001cc4c03286.html

I tried to find the report but couldn't. It would be interesting to see more details. Without a doubt, substandard care was the model. Unfortunately, it took 3 deaths in a relatively short period of time to get people's head out of their asses. If the patients had died spread over a greater period of time, few would have noticed.

[bobbolink]

60. " "Interactions are too often motivated by fear. " Exactly... and take that to the Nth power for

the "patients" (inmates).

"The report said, "Accountability measures are seen as 'dinging staff members for errors.' ”

Well, that could be taken several ways. I'm sure "staff" doesn't like to be corrected, either. What a friggin' mess!

It reminds me of Marat Sade!

"Unfortunately, it took 3 deaths in a relatively short period of time to get people's head out of their asses. If the patients had died spread over a greater period of time, few would have noticed."
Please see:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=9623776&mesg_id=9625102

I doubt even this will get "attention". The "investigation" is complete.... now its a return to regularly scheduled programming. :grr:

Thanks for looking this up! :yourock:

[Book Lover]

22. K&R (nm)

[postatomic]

23. This isn't a Mental Health Hospital

It's just a prison.

But, even in the "better" places the atmosphere is depressing as hell. I found myself trying to talk to and comfort people that were being ignored by the staff. One wonderful woman was going through several EST's. One morning she was over in the corner of the Dining Room crying. She was extremely stressed about going in for her 3rd treatment. No one noticed her. I had to get someone to give her something to relax.

Actually, I didn't ask that someone give her something. I lost a few "brownie points" that morning. I was pissed. (brownie points: you are graded by the staff. If your brownie points are too low, you can't leave)

They should call the "hospital" in this article what it really is. A fucking prison.

Again; in the "better" places our get-fresh-air area was surrounded by a 16 foot barbed wire fence with a black tarp over it so the "normal" people didn't have to see the "crazies".

Thanks for bringing this up.
:hi:

[bobbolink]

29. A prison, indeed! The loss of rights alone would be considered unconstitutional if it

happened to any of the DUers here!

As I mentioned, I was once at a conference of "consumers" (the term they use... I don't like the terminology, my self), and the stories I heard were heartbreaking, to put it mildly!

For people to discount those experiences and insist on the right to flippantly use terms that cause more suffering is beyond my ability to grasp.

As someone else posted a while back on DU, there are so many other terms that could be used instead!

Given that, I consider the insistence on using those words to be sheer stubbornness and bigotry.

I can only imagine the depth of the pain you carry just from what you have recounted.

:pals:

[postatomic]

37. I think most people fear what they don't understand

And even words can't adequately describe certain feelings when I try. So, I can understand that many people don't have a problem using using certain words or terms. They don't understand and they lack the willingness to even try.

:pals:

[bobbolink]

39. I think you're too forgiving. The "n" word applies to a minority of people, as do many others.

However, we USED to have the maturity to accept when someone told us we were hurting them.

Now, people mostly dig in their heels, put their hands on their hips, and say "Make me" like a little child.

:cry:

[Liberal_in_LA]

27. K&R

[bobbolink]

31. Thanks!

[RKP5637]

30. Recommend!!! n/t

[defendandprotect]

32. For some reason I can't Rec .... but my K&R nonetheless ...

can't read it all right now -- back later to catch up!!

:)

[bobbolink]

34. Thanks, and looking forward to seeing you here later.

Happy holiday.... and my thoughts go out to those who are in ugly situations like this on a holiday! :cry:

[GreenPartyVoter]

38. I did it for ya! *hugs*

[bobbolink]

41. Thanks!

:yourock:

[county worker]

40. Maybe in contrast here is a LTTE about the department I work for.

Letter to the Editor: ADMHS Provides Professional, Quality Care for Patients, Families
By XXXXXX XXXXXXX | Published on 11.22.2010

E-mail Print Comments Share
I am writing in appreciation and support of the high-quality psychiatric care that my son — and our family — receives at the Psychiatric Health Facility and through Santa Barbara County’s Mental Health outpatient services for the past eight years.

Our family was so confused and worried when our son suddenly started exhibiting signs of mental illness, right after his 18th birthday. Until then, he was a thriving young man with every indication he would lead a typical, successful and happy life.

We were so fortunate to find ourselves in the “medical home” of a doctor at ADMHS who was consistently respectful and professional with both my son and our family. Even when my son exhibited very antisocial behaviors, the doctor empathized with and treated him as the intelligent person he is. The doctor showed that he valued me as the expert on my own child, and I in turn valued him as a competent expert on the treatment of mental illness.

During the past eight years, my son has been in and out of the PHF many times. Every time he is there, I visit as often as possible and see firsthand that he receives wonderful care. All of the staff at the PHF — doctors, social workers, even receptionists — show that they truly care about my son and his recovery. Through my numerous observations, it is quite evident that the PHF embraces its own culture of caring for all of Santa Barbara County’s stakeholders.

Social workers at the PHF helped me understand these new, daunting systems and calmed me. They deftly navigate a multifaceted team of professionals through a complex legal-social-medical process to ensure my son is treated as effectively, fairly and swiftly as possible.

Today, my son is secured by a safety net of conservatorship and a full range of social services. He is getting healthier every day. I have been assured he will be able to “come home” to psychiatrically assisted housing here in Santa Barbara County, as soon as he is well enough.

I believe that true healing will only happen within the context of warm relationships and nurturing environments. The services we receive from Santa Barbara County’s Mental Health Services provide just that.

XXXXX XXXXXXX
Santa Ynez

[bobbolink]

43. "true healing will only happen within the context of warm relationships and nurturing environments."

And that is the key, right there!

Love is the only thing that heals.

I'm sure there are instances where there are doctors and staff and institutions that actually help people.

That doesn't cancel out the harm and ugliness of the "prisons", as someone upthread called them.

In that letter, we also don't hear from the son.... his opinion would count a lot more to me than anyone else's.

[county worker]

46. I'm just pointing out that we so often accept absolutes and we can all agree even though many times

the absolute may have exceptions. I just completed the re-application of a HUD homeless grant for 12 people who suffer mental illness and cannot live off the street without the home we provide. The grant is paid for by Federal Taxes. Twelve people have permanent housing and professional treatment because we care. There are a lot of us out there.

[bobbolink]

48. And what I am pointing out all the time is that the exceptions don't cancel out the horrific

agony that so many are subjected to.

[county worker]

49. No they do not cancel out anything, yet it is better to light one candle then to curse the darkness.

[bobbolink]

51. So, as usual, you are saying I shouldn't "curse" wrongdoing, and people suffering needlessly?

I am sorry that you feel like you need to constantly correct me. It gets tiresome, especially when people are hurting like this.

You have said NOTHING about the wrongdoing in the OP, only wanting me to be more "positive". As long as people are suffering, I will continue to point it out. I am sorry that offends you.

Nothing more to add, so have fun putting me down again. As I said, it gets tiresome.

Try empathizing with those in the OP who have been so harmed and damaged. THEN we can talk. Until then, I refuse to keep defending myself.

Bye.

[county worker]

69. I'm not correcting you. I am saying that there are people out there helping.

They don't get 1/10th the attention you are getting here. Every day except weekends but sometimes then, there are a couple hundred of us here helping the mentally ill and homeless.

[bobbolink]

71. I'm still waiting for an expression of compassion for those who killed themselves, and those

who are still suffering in these snake pits.

[Biker13]

75. Thank You county worker!

I do similar work, with homeless Vets.

Sorry you were so rudely disregarded.

Biker's Old Lady

[bobbolink]

94. Yes, it is so "rude" to ask that the deaths of mistreated people be recognized.

We are here only to praise.. to hell with the suffering.

Yes, how very rude.

[Greyhound]

42. Goddamn outrageous, as usual... K&R

Short on staff (except for the top administrators I'm certain), short on care, and long on neglect.

It's almost as bad as a private facility.
:kick: & R

[bobbolink]

45. "Short on care, long on neglect". Absolutely! But that isn't the end of it... what happened was

also TORTURE.

We will protest the torture of prisoners at Gitmo, but not people locked up as "mentally ill".

It must STOP.

:hi:

[Uncle Joe]

47. Kicked and recommended.

Thanks for the thread, bobbolink.

[bobbolink]

61. Thanks, Uncle Joe! Haven't seen you in a while!

:hi:

[Odin2005]

52. K&R. I HATE the offensive remarks involving the closing of the institutions.

[bobbolink]

53. I'm not sure I understand... could you please elaborate?

:pals:

[Odin2005]

55. Many posters say that the RW crazies are people released from the institutions.

It's really disgusting.

[bobbolink]

57. Oh, for the love of Pete... I have to admit, that is one I haven't heard before.

The bigotry obviously knows no bounds.

From what I understand, THAT kind of post would be prohibited, so if you see more of them, I hope you alert. It is the only way we can have any hope of trying to reduce the discrimination!

Thank you for telling me.... I swear, the ignorance here is LETHAL!! :nuke:

:hug:

[chervilant]

54. Thank you so very much

for this thread, bobbolink. I have a few observations I'd like to share:

1) In my 25+ years as an advocate for survivors of relationship violence, I've heard countless, pain-filled stories of verbal abuse, abuse that leaves no visible marks, yet remains a source of doubt and a killer of self-esteem for months or years after a survivor escapes their abuser. I have heard survivors make pejorative statements about themselves that are clearly the relentless voices of their verbal abusers--embedded in their brains, and convincing them that they are "worthless, lazy, fat, ugly, stupid," ad infinitum, ad nauseum. This psychic wounding has been with us for centuries, thus the old (untrue) adage: "Sticks and stones may break my bones, but words will never hurt me."

2) Relationship violence and other forms of interpersonal violence are practiced and perfected in our childhoods, primarily within the hallowed halls of our systems of public education. Our species perpetuates these behaviors by failing to address bullying when it occurs, and by failing to hold bullies responsible for their behavior. We are apparently SO incapable of addressing bullying that we elevate 'assertive, Type A' personalities, while striving to disassociate from 'victims,' who are universally perceived as weak and 'less than.'

3) (and, I've said this before): the vast majority of our children come out of our system of public education convinced that they have an 'average' or 'below average' intellect. How absurd! We all learn in different ways, and at different speeds, but we learn nevertheless, even those among us whom others have labeled 'mentally challenged.' Because we conflate heirarchy with our intellects, far too many of us relegate those who are considered 'mentally challenged' in the 'less than me, and--so--unimportant' category of humanity. By so doing--and, don't think that denial will grant immunity to the guilty among us--we disrespect ourselves first and foremost.

I continue watching as more and more of us resort to 'react' mode, letting our inchoate fears and frustrations manifest as road rage, name-calling, misogyny (something that happens FREQUENTLY on DU), sarcasm, and other forms of mental, emotional and physical violence. Do I think we humans are experiencing a critical tipping point in our evolution as a species? You bet. Do I think we can do anything about it? I'm skeptical, but the continued advocacy of folks like you is giving me hope.

[bobbolink]

67. Until we are all able to finally come together, all we have is react mode.

We are trapped in Rugged Individualism, and most of us don't recognize that.

Your points are so clear.... and in all of those, listening to those most hurt is crucial.

But as the OP shows, that isn't happening, and, in fact, isn't even being THOUGHT of.

Thanks for all that you add...... .which is considerable! :pals:

[niyad]

56. sadly, the situation there has been in existence for decades. even when I was in high school

(before the earth's crust cooled) we all knew what a terrible place that was.

[bobbolink]

72. Yet, it continues. Some "justice", eh?

A real concern for those on the bottom of the ladder, when this can go on for decades... and not just here, but in many places in this nation!

I repeat... some "justice". :nuke:

[Bluebear]

58. It reads like some prison camp in the Gulag in 1966.

What the hell country is this??

[bobbolink]

63. This has been ongoing since that time, and that is WHY these places were closed, beginning in the

50s.

People erroneously claim that Rayguns started homelessness with closing the prison.... er, "hospitals". Not true.. it began a long time before that, and for good reason.

Snake pits.... Gulags......still going on, still harming people.

And, it is OUR country....wadder we gonna do about it?

[maryf]

59. Thanks for continuing your advocacy

for all the most marginalized, K&R.

[bobbolink]

76. We *are* All in this together, and all oppression is the same process.

However, I am wearing down and ready to retire.

[awoke_in_2003]

82. K&R...

keep up the good fight- a lot of people here have your back.

[tavalon]

83. I don't understand what they mean by "programming"

The rest of it I get and as a hospital employee (though not in a mental health area) I know the frustration of too few staff on the ground and too many higher ups with their heads firmly implanted somewhere other than the real world.

Two of my family members have what would be considered severe mental illnesses and have had to be hospitalized a number of times. Blessedly, they are both learning some ways to work with the illness and not having to go into the hospital (hallelujah. These are people I love and when I've been on the wards, they seem scary and I bet they are even scarier if the mental faculties are misfiring). Many years ago, a friend of mine used to hire one of the homeless folks he knew for handiwork when he needed it and then, we got a trailer and had the guy live on our property. He lived with us for five years and I counted him as a friend. The only reason I use the past tense is because he died of a heart attack 2 years ago. Still living on the property. He wouldn't ever talk about his past and he occasionally went into Seattle to "go camping" which I found out meant sleeping on the street. I asked him why he did it and he said he just missed it sometimes and then shrugged. He wasn't a guy who liked to talk about himself all that much. I'm babbling now. Sorry....

[lonestarnot]

84. K & R!

[Jamastiene]

85. K&R

[HereSince1628]

86. Thanks.

[Forkboy]

87. Kick

And rec.

[ZombieHorde]

89. Recommended. nt

[ColesCountyDem]

97. Illinois used to have one of the finest mental-health *systems* in the world, until Jim Thompson....

Gov. James "Big Jim" Thompson recognized that the DD and mentally-ill populations were not powerful constituencies and decided that the money devoted to their care could be more effectively utilized to serve/placate larger and more politically-powerful groups. In a period of a few years, Gov. Thompson effectively dismantled a truly excellent statewide mental-health system that had been decades in the building; Illinois' system was so good that it was widely studied and emulated in many Western European countries. It provided multi-tiered care available at no cost to the individual for anyone from the acutely- to the chronically-ill, the developmentally-disabled, etc. .

What we see now in terms of homelessness is a direct result of conscious decisions by cynical, callous politicians to 're-order priorites', i.e., provide care on the cheap.

It's been almost 40 years since he started this, and it STILL apalls me!

[bobbolink]

100. I'm with you until you insist on conflating homelessness with "mental illness".

I have come to the conclusion that it is useless to try to deal with fact-resistant people.

I will repeat what I said above, because aparently folks can't learn from what Sapphire Blue kept saying, and what I keep saying:

According to The National Coalition For The Homeless, and the 2005 Mayors Conference,

16% of homeless people are "mentally ill"

I will repeat.. when you conflate and distort, you are hurting people.

Does that matter to you?

[ColesCountyDem]

101. I was with you, until you distorted what I actually said.

Does that matter to you?

[bobbolink]

103. "What we see now in terms of homelessness is a direct result of conscious decisions by cynical,

callous politicians to 're-order priorites', i.e., provide care on the cheap."

You weren't talking about cutting out low-income housing, you were talking specifically about cutting services TO THE "MENTALLY ILL".

So, you directly linked homelessness to "mental illness", and cynically repeating my words back to me doesn't change that.

I will repeat, as I have had to do throughout this thread, because so many of you insist on conflating the issues...

According to The National Coalition For The Homeless, and the 2005 Conference of Mayors,

16% of homeless people are "mentally ill"

Period. Regardless of your caustic reply, you are WRONG. Just be a bigger person and admit that you misspoke.

[ColesCountyDem]

104. The study was junk!

Just because you happen to like its results doesn't mean it accurately reflects the true numbers. I work with the homeless, and those numbers are just plain garbage. Why not admit that, since you're so big on people admitting things?

[bobbolink]

105. Thank you for honestly admitting that you won't accept the truth.

And then we blame the RW for trumpeting distortions and untruths!!

I repeat... you are hurting homeless people by demanding that we are mostly "mentally ill", but it is obvious that it is of no concern to you.

*MY* experience is that "progressives" are, in general, NOT helping homelessness at all.

With that, when people refuse to deal with the facts, there is no use in talking any further.

So, have at it..... blast all homeless people.. it seems to do something for you.

Good bye.