The Progressive: "President Obama continued down the slide toward Republicanism ...."

[Better Believe It]

Obama Wrong to Freeze Federal Salaries
By Matthew Rothschild
Editor of The Progressive
November 30, 2010

President Obama continued down the slide toward Republicanism with his imposition of a two-year pay freeze for civilian federal workers.

The pay freeze was originally a Republican idea, as is the propaganda push to pit private sector workers against public sector workers, as is the propaganda push to make the deficit out to be the single biggest economic threat. It is not. High unemployment and slack demand are.

And that’s why Obama’s move is even more puzzling, since it is profoundly recessionary.

Because of inflation, it will reduce the real incomes of 2,800,000 middle class Americans. They will be less likely to spend money this Christmas and next, and what the economy needs is for people to spend more.

Obama refried the tired old beans about “shared sacrifice.” But who is swallowing those beans today, when unemployment benefits are being cut off and when the top 1 percent of Americans is likely to see their Bush tax breaks reinstated?

http://www.progressive.org/wx113010.html

[HereSince1628]

1. If you keep turning to the right, don't you ultimately end up on the left

having gone through 180 degrees?

Of course, if the turning continues then it's back on the right again... :crazy:

[Edweird]

43. Geographically it's possible to get to Seattle heading East from New York.

Politically... not so much.

[ProudDad]

68. No. You hit the brick wall of fascism

and there you stay...

The "left" is truth based...

[nilram]

82. +100

[polichick]

2. I'm not "puzzled" anymore...

He's sliding toward Republicanism because he works for the same crowd the Republicans work for - I'm done wondering if he's naive, playing chess, or needs a psychologist. Time to believe our eyes, ears and brains.

[wackywaggin]

11. Absolutely correct!!

Heretic Wack :0)

[emilyg]

36. Kick for your message.

[ClarkUSA]

40. Yeah, that's why Wall Street titans like the Koch Bros. & the Chamber of Commerce hate Pres. Obama.

:sarcasm:

[Marr]

53. A lot of far-right Republicans hated McCain, too.

They hated him because he positioned himself to *their* left, not on *the* left.

Hatred by itself proves nothing.

[Bullet1987]

63. I don't believe they hate him at all...if you believe that then you'll buy anything

that's all a game played in the media and it benefits both sides. It makes the Democrats look less politically liable so they can say they tried and at the end of the day Wall Street can still get what it wants. If the leaked cables tell us anything it's that believing anything politicians and Wall Street say on television is highly stupid.

[kas125]

71. I think you're right. It's all like a play, it seems to be scripted.

They play bad cop/good cop with us but in reality they're all on the same side - and it ain't OUR side!

[GOTV]

78. They hate Pres Obama because he gives them 90% of what they want while the GOP gives them 95% ...

... I'm not about to pull out the sarcasm tag to celebrate them only getting 90%.

[Dr.Phool]

65. Sliding?

More like leaps and bounds.

[Lorien]

84. +1,000. He's playing a "good cop/ bad cop" routine with the GOP

and we're being played for suckers.

[blindpig]

87. We can retire the notion that the Republicans are the party of the

rich. Both parties are, and have been, the good cop/bad cop game is over.

[Name removed]

3. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[defendandprotect]

9. Of course, this is all about wanting to "hate" Obama ... not about MEDICARE FOR ALL...

WARS, SOCIAL SECURITY, MEDICARE --

Spying on citizens --

New warmongering/warmaking re Iran --

Why would we "haters" bother our heads about things like that!!! ?????

:eyes:

[polichick]

14. Easier for them to call us haters than to admit they've been had. nt

[ClarkUSA]

42. Who is "they" and exactly how have "they" been had?

It's easier to demonize the most liberal President Americans have ever had for decades than to admit he's done things no DLC President would ever do (contrast Pres. Obama's reregulating Wall Street and the banking industry with Bubba's "welfare reform", deregulation of the media and the repealing of Glass-Steagall, just to name a few things Republicans cheered on during the Clinton presidency).

[Marr]

54. Let me ask you something.

When Social Security receives those inevitable cuts, will you still support Obama? I'd bet you a $50 bill that Social Security is going to be cut, and cut big, just after the next Presidential election.

[defendandprotect]

58. Good question... because people tend to think of S/S for seniors... but it's much more ....

people as young as 30 who have families should be seriously involved in

protecting S/S -- it's really an INSURANCE program -- one which you couldn't

replace at any price with a private company.

If a young person becomes disabled, it will be S/S which will be their lifeline --

and if a young man loses his life, it will be survivors' benefits which keep his

wife and children going --

Good question -- ! :)

[defendandprotect]

57. Obama is no liberal ....

Obama didn't "regulate" Wall Street ...

Regulating Wall Street would entail reinstating New Deal rules and regulations --

including Glass-Steagall. In fact, Rahm clearly tells us that Obama defied the

advice to "NATIONALIZE" the banks ... and this is in an article where Rahm is

"crowing" about what Obama did for business!

And I supposed Repugs aren't cheering on the Cat Food Commission -

or the wars?

Or the loss of single payer universal health care?

[Caretha]

59. Quit spouting that crap

Obama ain't liberal. You can talk that crap all day long but no one is buying it. Black is not white, and white is not black.

[defendandprotect]

55. Amazing to watch the ignoring of reality -- in fact, a handful insisting on

being protected from reality here at DU! --

More and more here are waking up, however -- but it sure took a huge

cartload and two years of deception to bring that about!!!

But -- better late than never -- and courageous of those who say that they

used to support Obama and relate where they are now.

Too bad we've had this two years of wasted time and effort with such sad results

for so many Americans -- !!



:)

[struggle4progress]

4. The so-called Progressive plays fast and loose with the facts: "his imposition of a two-year pay

freeze" is nonsense; Obama hasn't "imposed" anything; he's merely proposed

[defendandprotect]

10. The direction Obama is going is steadily and constantly to the right ....

could you somehow have missed that?

:eyes:

[struggle4progress]

17. The Republicans want a shut-down-the-government bloodbath in the next session.

Could YOU somehow have missed that?

[defendandprotect]

26. GOP is a little further to the right than Obama .... right now --

nobody misses that --

[defendandprotect]

27. dupe

[defendandprotect]

28. We now have one right wing party -- and one radical right wing party ....

Think that's pretty clear to everyone --

[defendandprotect]

29. dupe

[Better Believe It]

12. Do you really think Senate Democrats will "filibuster" against President Obama's pay freeze?

It's a done deal.

You make it sound like President Obama will have little or nothing to do with a pay freeze!

[ProudDad]

69. Oh he's

PROPOSING right-wing republican anti-worker policies...

Not actually done anything...

Well, that IS in keeping with past performance... :evilgrin:

[asdjrocky]

5. There are no more straws.

I used the last one a looooong time ago.

[stillwaiting]

6. Keeeick & Wreck!!

Not expecting a course correction these next two years, but a double down on neo-liberalism.

[hfojvt]

7. nice of the Progressive to stand up for the upper middle class.

To me - that is a slide towards Republicanism. To arms! To arms for the $40,000 - $90,000 workers!

Errr. about 40% of HOUSEHOLDS make less than $40,000 a year, and we should cry when a $50,000 worker doesn't get a raise?

[Better Believe It]

13. So we should welcome pay cuts, benefit cuts and freezes for any workers doing better than others!

That's playing the divisive game that employers and corporate America just love.

Attack any workers who might get better pay and benefits than the lowest 40%.

Pit workers getting lower pay against workers getting higher pay.

Bring everybody down!

That's the ticket!

And do you really believe the right-wing propaganda about "lazy and rich"" government workers with golden parachutes who aren't top level supervisors?

Here's what government workers have to say about that:

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE:
November 29, 2010
AFGE DENOUNCES OBAMA ADMINISTRATION PROPOSAL TO FREEZE PAY
Pay Freeze Proposal Amounts to Symbolic Gesture

WASHINGTON – The American Federation of Government Employees today decried President Obama’s proposal to freeze pay for federal civilian employees in 2011 and 2012.

“This proposal is a superficial panic reaction to the draconian cuts his deficit commission will recommend,” stated AFGE National President John Gage. “A federal pay freeze saves peanuts at best and, while he may mean it as just a public relations gesture, this is no time for political scapegoating. The American people didn’t vote to stick it to a VA nursing assistant making $28,000 a year or a border patrol agent earning $34,000 per year.

“President Obama asks federal workers to share the sacrifice, but it’s unconscionable for him to attack the wages of federal working people while the millionaires and billionaires on Wall Street not only get their bailouts and astronomical bonuses; they also get their tax cuts,” concluded Gage.

[hfojvt]

20. Gage is probably not a Federal Worker

but nice of him to make up a couple of examples. According to US News, "The average federal civilian employee earns $74,311 per year ..."

http://politics.usnews.com/news/articles/2010/11/30/the-top-paid-federal-employees.html

When it comes to class warfare, I doubt if those people are on my side. I don't see it as an attack on them as much as it seems to be an attack on Obama by the left, when most of the country probably supports Obama. Why should the left be sooooo concerned about people who make $70,000 a year? Is that suddenly our base? I definitely don't get it. Suddenly the left is crying class warfare when I don't support those who make lots more money than I do.

[Better Believe It]

35. Gage was a federal worker until those workers elected him to represent them.

Once again, you seem to be siding with the anti-worker elements who seek to divide working class people. And U.S. News and World Report is your source for unbiased news? Do you also think that union truck drivers, railroad workers, auto workers and other industrial workers are overpaid? With some overtime they easily make over $60,000 a year.

By the way, $74,311 a year is what most working class people should make. I hope that is their average salary. Unlike Wall Street and corporate tycoons average government workers actually "earn" their pay.

That's a living wage, even after a big tax hit.

Why do you think that's way too much money for working people?

It seems that you want to bring government workers pay down while I and most others want to bring everyone else up.

[hfojvt]

45. you know what though?

Giving them another 4% increase does not "bring anybody else up". It's much like the Bush tax cuts, in my view. It provides lots of money to people who already have lots of money.

According to that same source, (which is the only one I could find, and yes they are M$M, but try proving them wrong with data instead of innuendo) Federal workers have gained an average of $10,000 in real wage increases over the last ten years. According to another source per capita income was $27,833 in 2000 (in 2009 dollars) and fell to $26,530 in 2009. So the gain of the Federal workers, whose average was $63,445 in 2000 (in 2010 dollars) didn't seem to trickle down to the working class at large.

When I worked for the Federal Govenrment I never saw anybody get overtime, so I am not gonna compare the salary of somenody with overtime to the salary of somebody without, and it's not a question of the value judgement of "overpaid" but of the factual assessment that they make "more than the average bear".

Actually, if they don't get a COLA, and I do, that does not bring them down, it brings me up, to closer to what I make.

One of the wonderful (NOT) things about COLAs is that a 3% inrease is much more in dollar terms to a worker making $110,000 than it is to a worker making $29,000. Often the 3% of $29,000 does not even cover the increased cost of insurance.

[Hello_Kitty]

33. Seriously! Let's cut their wages down to what everyone else is making.

And free that money up to extend the tax breaks to our Lords and Masters.

:eyes:

[hfojvt]

46. yeah that's exactly what I am proposing.

I guess your idea is to give them all a 1,000% increase and that will trickle down to help all working people.

[Marr]

56. Wow.

If you're what passes for a Democrat these days, it's no wonder there's so much disillusionment.

[Caretha]

He's not fooling anyone

he just thinks he is.

[hfojvt]

72. so Democrats are supposed to care more about people making over $50,000

than they do about people making under $50,000?

[Caretha]

60. He's not fooling anyone

he just thinks he is.

[Caretha]

61. He's not fooling anyone

he just thinks he is.

[hfojvt]

73. Why should the primary concern of Democrats

be people who make $70,000 and up?

The house I live in cost $35,000 in 2001. It would take me 3 years to make $75,000 even if I was working full time, which I am not. I should be rending my clothes and gnashing my teeth because those people don't get raises? Where was all this outcry when it was decided that I would not get a raise?

Not only that, but I believe most Federal workers are still gonna get a raise. There is no increase in the pay, for example, of a GS-9.1. However, at least when I worked for DOD, the first five step increases are automatic. That is a GS-9.1 (nine step one) goes to GS-9.2 in one year. That gives that person an automatic pay raise. Something I don't get with my job. Unless the freeze also impacts step increases, then most Federak workers will still get annual increases, with two exceptions. First, after step five the step increases slow down to either 18 months or two years (I cannot remember since it has been 24 years since I worked for DOD and the rules a) may have changed in that time and b) may be different for non-DOD employees). Second, once you get to step 10 there are no more step increases. Since it is fairly difficult to get to GS-13, which is a management position, many workers may be topped out at GS-12.10.

However, a GS-12.10 makes $78,355 a year and a GS-11.10 makes $65,371 a year, so I do not feel too sorry for them. Even the second person makes more than 60% of HOUSEHOLDS. You know, households that often have two incomes, and knowing, from experience, how people with good jobs often tend to marry other people with good jobs, a GS-11 probably has a spouse making $40,000+. Not all the time, but probably more often than not.

[Better Believe It]

76. Your complaints about federal workers pay seem similiar to those made by Simpson, Bowles and the GOP

From the Washington Post today:

During the Great Recession, most private sector employees have seen their wages frozen, and some have even watched wages decline," the chairmen said in their proposal. "In contrast, federal workers have seen their wages increase due to automatic formulas in law that provide them with step-in-grade and cost-of-living-adjustments. For example, federal civilian employees received a 2.0 percent raise in 2010, a 3.9 percent raise in 2009, and a 3.5 percent raise in 2008."

Some federal workplace recommendations by the commission chairmen track closely to other GOP proposals and set the stage for what federal union leaders probably could not have imagined in their worst nightmare not too long ago. Simpson and Bowles recommended cutting the federal workforce 10 percent by 2020, raising health insurance fees for federal civilian retirees and reducing their retirement income by basing it on the five highest years of federal service instead of the highest three.

But, the pay freeze proposed by you and "deficit hawks" will hurt federal workers who you apparently think have it too good.

"Most people live paycheck to paycheck," said Marian Merrit of Forestville, a business analyst in rural development at Agriculture. "My little old $25-per-paycheck" increase she expected with the proposed pay raise would have helped her pay some bills, she said. The 17-year USDA employee pointed to health insurance premiums that will rise an average of 7.2 percent for federal workers in January.

"At the first of the year," she said, "our salary doesn't match the increases."

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/11/30/AR2010113006322.html

[defendandprotect]

8. Repugs couldn't have done better for themselves than having Obama in White House ....

in fact, as far as I can see the Repug party was finished after '08 election ---

Obama breathed new life in Repug Party --

forget that he had a mandate --

Suddenly, everything depended on what the Republican Party was doing!!!

What farce!!!

:eyes:

[democracy1st]

15. totally by design he knows exactly what he's doing,and it's dismantling the Democratic party

a little bit at a time. He's a Goldman Sachs hack,who doesn't really give a dayum about progressive politics.

[Individualist]

16. Correct. Destruction of the party from within was DLC's objective.

[polichick]

19. A Republican stealth attack? nt

[democracy1st]

22. +100%

[defendandprotect]

31. Can we pick up the Democratic Party and take it elsewhere...and leave the DLC behind....????

[Better Believe It]

38. They haven't destroyed it. They just took it over about 20 years ago.

[polichick]

18. How horrific it it was all a big charade, if the Republicans were just faking...

...about taking the prez down in order to provide a smokescreen around Obama's Republicanism.

[democracy1st]

21. Repubs had screwed up so bad,mass corruption,Abramoff,fall of the christian right....

Low and behold here comes Obama with a lavish presentation and always a day or two ahead of the pack when trying to get elected. Once elected one of the dumbest admin in modern history. Packing his admin with corp slacks,continuously making excuses not to push a progressive agenda.

[defendandprotect]

32. And most Democrats just watching and waiting for the "chess game" to start .... wow!!!

Trust by now everyone knows there was no board, no chessgame -- and

a huge fake?

[glitch]

23. It worked rather well for them when they did it to/for Clinton. nt

[defendandprotect]

34. Well, no one wanted the impeachment ... but GOP did it anyway ....

finally -- by forcing him to respond to very personal questions and catching

him in a lie --

This was almost a year after Ken Starr said he was quitting the investigation

of Clinton cause he couldn't find anything!! He was pushed again by right wing

senators -- Helms and another I can't think of -- they also put the particular

Judge in place, as I recall!!

Clinton had zipper problems and should never have been permitted to be a Dem

candidate -- and reflecting on his right wing damage to the party and America,

I'd say we'd all have been better off had we had a truly liberal Dem in his place.

[AndrewP]

44. Absolutely. Having Jerry Brown lose to Bush in 1992 would have been much better!!!

[defendandprotect]

52. 2000 was stolen ... Gore didn't "lose" and I doubt that Jerry Brown would have "lost" ....

This was simply more TPB keeping liberals out of the White House ---

and that will continue on and on until we find a way to stop corporatism --

and rid the party of the DLC --

[glitch]

49. I voted for him because he was smart enough to have Al Gore as his running mate.

But at the time I said that might not work out so well for Al.

I don't think we'll ever be allowed a truly liberal candidate again, or even a left-centrist, as 2000 proved when even Al Gore was not acceptable to them, they pulled out all the stops to prevent that one. Not even John Kerry would do in 2004.

But I still say vote, if only to make them have to steal it.

[Better Believe It]

50. But look at who Al Gore picked to be his running mate! Leiberman. Real smart move.

[glitch]

83. Yeah I know. But even with all that he couldn't be allowed to win.

Think about the implications of that...

[defendandprotect]

51. Gore was a co-founder of the DLC ... and actually later said they gave him

bum advice in telling him to cut the populist stuff in his speeches!!

He left the DLC after that --

TPB would have liked to move Gore in but I've never trusted him -- and look at

what he did with Lieberman!! As if he didn't know who Lieberman was after serving

with him for years in Senate?! Gore also has a degree in theology -- two of them

with that much religion on their minds would have been a disaster. And, Liebermann

would have made quite a TROJAN HORSE had anything happened to Gore.

Gore was also supported most of his career by oil intersts.

Clinton didn't turn out to be especially liberal -- in fact, very much the opposite.

Agree, however, that TPB are not going to let a liberal thru ... in either party.

What's Plan B, then????

[amborin]

30. K&R

[Lorien]

86. He did one better; he turned huge numbers of Dems into Repugs, and within less

than two years. He essentially made the Democratic Party into a new branch of the Right Wing. War? OK! Torture? Sure! Climate Change? What climate change? Public education? Let's privatize it! Universal Health care? No, RomneyCare! And on and one and on... It was a brilliant strategy; who would suspect a young, charming African American from humble roots to be in league with the wealthiest elite? But it worked. So far, anyway.

[Individualist]

24. K&R

[SidDithers]

25. Comedy gold. Don't ever stop posting...

DU would be a truly dreary place without the daily laff riot from Matthew Rothschild.

:rofl:

Sid

[emilyg]

37. I'm not laughing.

[polichick]

47. Nothing funny about the giant con we're living through. nt

[ClarkUSA]

39. So what did "The Progressive" think of former DLC chairman Bill "Welfare Reform" Clinton?

President Obama has tried to reregulate Wall Street -- contrary to what Third Way Clinton did with the encouragement of Republicans -- so Democrats should consider themselves lucky.

It's obvious that the author of the OP and his fans have short memories.

[ProudDad]

70. He PROPOSED to curb wall street abuses

it didn't happen...

[hfojvt]

74. Here they are in Jan. 1994

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m1295/is_n1_v58/ai_14695164/?tag=content;col1

"We know - because Bill Clinton keeps telling us - that he wants the American people to think of him as "a new Democrat." He's that, all right, but it turns out that a new Democrat is all but indistinguishable from an old Republican. If that means more and more Americans are likely to find that their President comes up short, then Clinton had better study Harry Truman's advice: If you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen. Or, at least, find yourself some new recipes. But don't whine and snivel abour an all too occasional unkind word from an all but invisible "knee-jerk liberal press.""

One of the things that bothered me about Clinton though, was his Republican rhetoric. "The Era of big government is over". It seems to me that we have less of that from Obama, although I was not that happy about his last State of the Union address either.

[ProfessionalLeftist]

41. When is the top 1% going to "share" in that sacrifice?

*crickets*

[NorthCarolina]

67. That's one of the perks of being the top 1%

You don't have to share....with ANYBODY.

[GOTV]

80. Are you kidding? Some have had to cut back to bi-weekly pool cleanings at their vacation homes n/t

[amborin]

48. in the words of Krugman: "a transparently cynical policy gesture"

that endorses the position of one's worst enemy

[unkachuck]

62. K&R....n/t

[GrpCaptMandrake]

64. I'm not surprised

Are you?

This is the long, putrid reach of Milton Friedman's dead hand receiving the U. of Chicago secret handshake from Obama. Terrified workers are good workers, and pay must be minimized in the service of "the economy."

[NorthCarolina]

66. They will need more $$ than this pay freeze will provide to pay for the tax cuts for the top 2%.

They'll also need to cut Social Security and Medicare and Medicaid; probably some cuts to education if not outright privatization.

Sorry middle class, it might seem unfair but you do realize that it is YOUR responsibility to ensure the mega rich get their dues, and right now they really really really want to preserve those tax cuts. Momma needs a new Lamborghini, and she wants it THIS Christmas dammit. Besides Mr/Ms 'slightly middle class', were it not for these rich folks and their selfless generosity, you would probably have no job in the service industry at all.

In time you will learn to accept their generosity graciously. It's for your own good, really it is. You KNOW that you have become far too dependent on the Government to educate your children, or to provide you with some form of a secure retirement, or to make sure you have access to medical care in your golden years. Hell, retirement is for sissies anyway, and if your old and sick you can no longer contribute, why prolong the situation by seeking medical attention. That costs money, and if you can't personally afford it, well then take that as a sign from God that he's calling you home.

If you do not agree with this then your are obviously in the minority, likely one of those fuckin' Liberal Retards who can't accept the fact that America is overwhelmingly a right-of-center nation that knows these insignificant sacrifices are necessary to return America to the country that our founding fathers intended. This is the only way to guarantee you true FREEDOM. You have the freedom to make the life choices that will lead you to adequate funds for education for your children, access to necessary health care, and to set aside for a secure retirement....or not. That is your freedom. That is all.

Have a nice day

:) smiley face!

[pecwae]

75. Great post! Thanks.

:thumbsup:

[katnapped]

77. You forgot...

Also gotta cut the minimum wage down to a dollar a day because without us rich benefactors, you wouldnt even be making that dollar a day! Besides it gives you just that much more incentive to WORK HARDER so just maybe someday you'll be one of us! (well, pfft...not really--LOL)

:sarcasm:

[NorthCarolina]

81. When there's no jobs to be had, the 'minimum wage' becomes a moot point. nt

[WinkyDink]

79. Well, Obama has criticized the "divisiveness" of the 60's. So his principles would be based on.....

I have no idea any more.

[Better Believe It]

89. The "good ole days" of bi-partisanship in the 50's?

The wonderful days of anti-radical witch-hunts, Jim Crow segregation, women and gay suppression.

[Lorien]

85. He's already a Reagan Republican. If he continues to "slide" he'll be a Rand

Paul Republican in no time. x(

[Lorien]

88. "Shared sacrifice"? When does the top 1% join in on that "sacrifice" Obama?

So far they have been profiting even more than they did in the gilded age!