Hmm... Simpson and Bowles Defy Executive Order, Want to Delay Catfood Commission Vote - FDL

[WillyT]

Simpson and Bowles Defy Executive Order, Want to Delay Catfood Commission Vote
By: David Dayen Tuesday November 30, 2010 12:19 pm

<snip>

For most of the week, you could see the wheels coming off of the Catfood Commission. First we heard that “they may surprise us,” but then there was this moving of the goalposts. Despite the fact that 14 of the 18 panel members had to agree to secure any recommendations which would go to Congress for a vote, now insiders were saying that a majority vote would show a signal of support.

But it’s clear that Erskine Bowles and Alan Simpson can’t even get that. They canceled a planned public meeting today in favor of more private negotiation. And reports emerged that the panel was simply deeply divided on the issues.

A presidential commission on balancing the U.S. budget likely will fail Wednesday to secure enough support for its deficit-cutting plan to trigger a congressional vote on it, aides and analysts said.

With just a day left before a deadline to produce a plan, the commission’s co-chairmen were still scrambling to nail down 14 votes among the commission’s 18 members—a super-majority threshold set when the panel was created in February.

“We do not think that the commission’s report will get 14 votes,” said Brian Gardner, a Washington policy analyst at the investment firm of Keefe Bruyette & Woods.

Trust the lobbyists on this one.

You know that Simpson and Bowles are sweating, because they don’t want to bring their proposal up for a vote. The latest is that they won’t hold a vote tomorrow.

President Obama’s deficit commission is likely to delay a vote, originally set for Wednesday, on a plan to rein in the soaring national debt, according to congressional sources.

As commission chairmen Erskine Bowles and Alan Simpson huddle one-on-one with other members in hopes of assembling a respectable majority, sources said Tuesday that a vote later in the week is looking more likely.

<snip>

More: http://news.firedoglake.com/2010/11/30/simpson-and-bowles-defy-executive-order-want-to-delay-catfood-commission-vote/

Plus this...

UPDATE: At a press conference, Simpson and Bowles say they will present their report tomorrow, with a vote on Friday. That means the report will not be official. It would have to get 14 votes by tomorrow for that to occur. Now it’s just a bunch of greybeards in Washington with some cockamamie ideas. It doesn’t even rise to the level of a panel white paper.

:shrug:

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

1. Meow!

[Beetwasher]

2. They Were Never Going To Get The Votes To Bring It To Congress

Anyone who was paying attention knew that, which is why all the whining that this commission was set up to kill SS was just so pathetic.

[hlthe2b]

4. So, why the hell did Obama set it up like this, appoint these asses?

(and I include so-called Democrat, Erskine Bowles in that assessment)...

What the hell was Obama thinking? Does HE want to kill SS? I honestly am so beyond depressed. I don't know what to think about the guy I have supported so strongly, defended so ardently, praised (recently) so rarely. He acts like a man whose family is being held hostage--totally out of (what I thought to be) his character, so inexplicable.

[Beetwasher]

6. Dog And Pony Show

It's basically a PR show to get the debate going about the deficit. Nothing really new. These types of commissions are set up all the time and rarely produce anything worhtwhile, but they serve to the lay the groundwork for debate and get the lay of the land about what the positions are among various factions. It can shake everyone out so you can have an idea where they stand and what's achievable.

[TheWraith]

8. Get out of the echo chamber.

If you believe one tenth of the misinformation you read on DU, then nobody could blame you for wanting to shoot yourself. But here's the key: most of the crap posted here is just crap.

[hlthe2b]

12. Please don't condescend...

I gather my facts from numerous sources and hardly need DUers to spoon feed me. The facts are the facts. Alan Simpson has long lusted for destruction of SS-- as have most Republicans the past 60 years. Yet, Obama named him head of this commission. Bowle's viewpoints are also not a mystery. So, what, then TheWraith was Obama's goal in putting them in charge? If you devine strategy, I am more than happy to hear from you. Rather, I would LIKE to hear what you feel is being these decisions.

[dionysus]

37. i'll step in and offer my opinion.

Obama appoints two jackasses who want to go after SS.

jackasses make fools of themselves, become neutered and ridiculed.

[hlthe2b]

63. Except that one is a marginal democrat; the other a RETHUG has been

One that is so clearly from another era, that, despite his espousing the wet dreams of the current crop of Rethugs, will likely not be considered to have represented them.

Maybe you are right, but that seems like quite the gamble.

[librechik]

15. really makes you wonder....

I could take things I don't like. But things that make no sense whatsoever? That don't add up econbomically? That make conditions worse for ordinary Americans?

I really don't know, but the hostage scenario has occurred to me too.

[glitch]

29. Establish the frame that Social Security was on the table. nt

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

5. All CAPS doesn't make it true.

It's known as sowing seeds.

If they can get it, great.
If they can't, it'll be easier next time.

See: Erosion

[Name removed]

7. Deleted message

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[gratuitous]

11. I disagree

They'll push forward whatever they want to push forward. The charade was the ground rules by which the committee was set up in the first place: "Did we say 14 votes? We meant a majority. December 1? Oh, that was just a guideline, something to shoot for. We'll bring our recommendations forward when we're darn good and ready." And there's a whole gaggle of folks eagerly waiting in Congress to do whatever Bowles and Simpson propose. They will proffer the lame excuse that they're just doing what the commission recommended, and that this is the tried, true, and only way to fiscal sanity.

The measures they take will not reduce the deficit, will not make social security more solvent (which isn't a problem now anyway, but will almost surely become one once these monkeys are done wielding their wrenches), but will placate the yammering nitwits of the Tea Baggers, provide cover for the gutless Democrats, and give the Republicans yet another "achievement" to run on in 2012.

But that's just, like, my pathetic opinion, man.

[Beetwasher]

13. That's Nice, Now Provide Evidence They Can Do What You Say

Otherwise yr just making stuff up out of thin air. They don't have the votes, they're done. End of story.

[gratuitous]

14. I'll betcha a $10 donation to DU

Not only can they do it, but they will do it. The committee rules will be re-cast as "suggestions" or "guidelines," never meant to be a constraint on the efficient and expedient working of the committee. Recommendations will be promulgated to Congress without the formerly necessary 14 votes, and while there might be some grousing from the usual suspects, it will be lost in the rush to enact cuts to social security benefits as a way to balance the budget, reduce the deficit and keep social security solvent for another six months. Those of us disappointed by these developments will be told that it's unfortunate, but absolutely vital to the continued working of the government, and you don't want the government to grind to halt now, do you? Anyone who persists in their bad attitude will be derided as an unregenerate pony seeker, deemed to be Unserious about the deficit, and summarily excluded from any further discussions on the issue.

Ten bucks.

Edited to add: That is to say, that whole December 1 deadline/recommendations must have 14 votes stuff will go by the boards.

[Beetwasher]

18. Make yr prediction very specific and clear and yr on

are you predicting there will b ss cuts as a result of this commission? Is that the bet?

[gratuitous]

54. My predictions

First, the December 1 deadline will not be met.

Second, the "requirement" that recommendations have the endorsement of 14 out of 18 of the commission members will be jettisoned.

Third, the commission will present findings and recommendations that will be presented as something other than whatever the language is for those recommendations. Among those recommendations will be raising the retirement age, lowering social security benefits, and other deficit reduction schemes that will land disproportionately on the lower classes and affect the upper classes mostly by accident.

*

Fourth, the drumbeat to implement these recommendations will begin almost immediately, under the rubric that they are "crucial" to deficit reduction, and if they aren't adopted right away we're in danger of the End of the United States As We Know It. The Republicans will lead, naturally, but they will drag the Democrats along in the slipstream.

Fifth, the recommendations in the third paragraph will be adopted either wholly or in part by the end of the year. Any recommendations not adopted by the end of the year will be adopted by the Ides of March.

*Almost forgot: The deviations from the written procedures will be glossed over, if they're mentioned at all. Anyone who insists on bringing them up will be dismissed as Unserious About the Deficit by the cable show hosts, the press punditry (in particular the Washington Post and New York Times), and of course, Fox News and the rest of the Right Wing Rabble (who won't say it quite so nicely).

_______________

To sum up, I'm willing to bet $10 that the commission will ignore its own rules (December 1 deadline, 14 votes required to present a recommendation) and nobody will care. The commission will propose raising the retirement age, and cutting social security benefits for new retirees, and those proposals will be adopted. I'm not sure of the timing of those proposals, but I'll say that the retirement age will be raised to age 70 from the present 67, and benefits will be cut for new retirees beginning somewhere around 2016.

[Beetwasher]

61. You Are So Fucking On, Every One Of Those Conditions Have To Be Met

Bookmarked. Done deal. Dude, bad, bad bet on your part. But there it is. I'll give you one last chance to back out because it really seems you are unfamiliar with how these committee's work and what it takes to change their mandate as spelled out in an Executive Order. I'll give you an opportunity to research it before you fully commit. Or you can waive my good faith offer and jump in. I'm sure Skinner will appreciate your donation.

[gratuitous]

66. I'm good for it

The commission will ignore its own rules and nobody will care. It will propose raising the retirement age and cutting benefits (though not for current retirees), and those proposals will be adopted by Congress and signed into law by the President. I will happily pay $10 to DU to see that not happen.

[Beetwasher]

67. I know yr good for it

no worries. Same here if I lose.

[Hannah Bell]

24. provide evidence they'll do what *you* said. your speculation is no more

credible.

[Beetwasher]

38. I Didn't Say It Was More Credible, However I DO Have The Existing RULES In The Executive Order

That state clearly every thing we know about how the committee is to be run. I assume you are familiar with the mechanism for changing those rules now?

So, on second thought, I am saying my opinion is at least a BIT more credible since I do have evidence.

[Edweird]

16. By your bizarre logic, * didn't try to privatize SS because he 'didn't have the votes'.

[Beetwasher]

19. So you have already made the assumption the commission was created to destroy ss

because of course you've seen into Obamas soul and know his true evil intent.

[Edweird]

20. If Obama wasn't so busy trying to privatize everything in sight, it might be different.

If he wasn't consistently advocating RW policy, there might be some slack. But that's not the case. He IS advocating RW policy consistently and he IS trying to privatize things. Only, in this instance, he failed. So now you are trying to play it off as if he was 'just kidding around'. Disgusting.

[Beetwasher]

21. My What a vivid if not vapid imagination you have!

Extraordinary how this man who devoted his life to community service is now suddenly a corporate whore hell bent on "privatizing" everything in sight. Yes, like the CFPA, TOTALLY Privatized. Funny, you can't point to a single tging he's actually privatized that wasn't already controlled privately. In fact he's given the govt more control in areas they never had it before. Like HCR, like CFPA, like Lilly Leadbetter...

[WillyT]

22. Imagination... Is All We Are Left With...

Since we no longer know what he stands for, or what his plans are!

If you have inside information... I'd LOVE to know?

Please share!

:shrug:

[Beetwasher]

23. I prefer to hear yr ridiculous conspiracies

they're cute.

[WillyT]

25. I Noticed You Didn't Answer The Question...

"... we no longer know what he stands for, or what his plans are!

If you have inside information... I'd LOVE to know?"

Can you, as an ardent supporter, please cogently explain the strategies, and the goals?

:shrug:

[WillyT]

28. Crickets...

Ah well...

:shrug:

[Beetwasher]

31. Whatsa Matter? In Your Fantasy World I Have A Time Limit To Respond?

Didn't realize that rule was in effect that I had to stop everything else in my life in order to reply to you within your mysterious, imaginary, time limit.

[Beetwasher]

30. Sure We Do! According To You He's A Corporate Whore, Right?

He's looking out for his corporate buddies! See, I know everything now, just like you! I have looked deep into Obama's soul and know his evil plans! Just like you!

[WillyT]

32. Still Didn't Answer...

Can you, as an ardent supporter, please cogently explain the strategies, and the goals?

:shrug:

Sorry... didn't mean to pressure you.

Just curious if you, or anybody else, can answer that question.

[Beetwasher]

Yes I Did! He Wants To Sell Your Soul To Wall Mart!!

In exchange for a new pair of Chinese made golf shoes with gold stich embroidery.

You are the one seeming to imply that you and only you have true knowledge of his ultimate goals, objectives and motives. Not me. I can have opinions on it and in fact have already given my opinion about the deal with the commission.

[WillyT]

40. You're Making Shit Up, And STILL Have Yet To Answer The Question...

Because you cannot... nobody can.

And THAT is a major problem.

:shrug:

[Beetwasher]

60. LOL! It's A Major Problem That You Can't Read Minds And Know People's Souls??

Really? So, you have a problem cuz you're unsure of someone's real motivations for doing something? As if you know ANYONE'S real motivations for doing anything? What fucking world do you live in with these sorts of expectations?

Me? I look at the whole of a person. You want to know Obama's motivations? His goals? His objectives? Take the measure of the WHOLE man. His WHOLE life up to now. Was he a corporate whore his whole life? Is that what he's fought for HIS WHOLE LIFE up until now?

I think you know the answer to that question. But you pretend your myopic view and distorted interpretations of some cherry picked events in less than two years under the most difficult circumstance imaginable gives you the "wisdom" to judge him as corporate whore who's going to fuck you. That summary judgement says more about you than it does about Obama.

[WillyT]

62. So... You're Into Unconditional Love...

I can dig that.

Just not in a politician.

BTW - You seem a tad angry... are U OK?

:shrug:

[Beetwasher]

68. are you coming on to me?

This always happens to me, I try to have a debate and end up in bed.

[joeybee12]

3. Well if they hadn't put such divise assholes in charge, they might

have gotten somewhere.

Fuck you Simpson.

Fuck you Bowles.

[Hawkeye-X]

9. Defy and delay the vote - the catfood commission is now decommissioned and rejected

Remove the cap off the SS, and it will stay solvent forever.

[eridani]

10. This does not mean that Simpson and Bowles are going to stop--

--going after Social Security and Medicare.

[Ikonoklast]

26. Then they can use their own coin to do so.

But, as noted above, the commission vote doesn't seem to be going the way Simpson and Bowles thought it would, when they held their little dog-and-pony show when the president was out of the country.

They have a timetable, and when the bell tolls, they are done whether they like it or not.

[eridani]

42. Simpson is hoping for bloodletting sponsored by the new Repuke congress n/t

[dionysus]

47. and apparently he won't any power to do so.

[eridani]

64. The Repukes do, and they'd be delighted to help out n/t

[Ikonoklast]

49. Then he can spend his own money lobbying them to do so.

And I don't care what political affiliation you have, if you are a congressman voting in favor of changing Social Security in any drastic manner, you've just signed your own political death warrant.

[JVS]

17. LOL.

[ProfessionalLeftist]

27. "just a bunch of greybeards in Washington with some cockamamie ideas"

Bingo!

I just hope President Bipartisan Compromise isn't silly enough to listen to their bullshit. Because he hasn't uttered a peep about it . . .

[PBS Poll-435]

33. I guess all the panic was worth it then, right?

:rofl:

[Ikonoklast]

41. "When in trouble, when in doubt..."

"...run in circles, scream and shout!"


Have seen plenty of that here the last few months, over something that the people most upset about it here never took the time to even vaguely acquaint themselves with what the process entailed.

[PBS Poll-435]

44. It is disappointing that misinformation and fear are spread like Fox News and the Food Network. nt

[Ikonoklast]

51. I take extreme umbrage at that statement.

The Food Network tells me that eating four pounds of butter a day is good for me, and I believe them!

[dionysus]

53. that paula deen, i hear she's DLC.

:rofl:

[Ikonoklast]

55. She'll get you for that.

Oh, yes.


Arteriosclerosis is her weapon of choice.


You'l never even know until it's too late.

[dionysus]

57. deep fried mac n cheese with bacon? yum.

:rofl:

[Ikonoklast]

59. And the most insidious part of her nefarious plans are

that she gets her victims to do themsleves in, without any evidence implicating her in any way.



Paula Deen makes Lucretia Borgia look like a piker.

[PBS Poll-435]

56. After her show gets renewed, I hear she is going to change her party affiliation

:(

Damn turncoats.

[dionysus]

58. "My southern fried treats were for everyone until Mr Hussein Obama outlawed deep fried cheese,

NADER 2012!"

[yurbud]

34. people should bring rotten fruits, vegetables, and eggs to any public appearance of these assholes

[dionysus]

35. does this mean people were shitting themselves over nothing?

[PBS Poll-435]

36. Meow

:P

[dionysus]

39. well, i never...

:hi:

[PBS Poll-435]

43. And you never will with that attitude.

:hi:

[dionysus]

45. i'm just going to leave in a huff then.

*huff*

:D

[PBS Poll-435]

46. Don't forget your nasty-ass cupcakes and plastic cups

Some party this was.


:eyes:



Leave the beer.

[dionysus]

48. *huff* it was only a beer ball of bud light, and i threw out a lit cig in the last full cup of beer.

sorry. you can have the cupcakes, they're from 7-11 anyways... i threw all the hostess wrappers in the bushes when i arrived...
:evilgrin:

[PBS Poll-435]

50. Might actually enhance the taste of Bud Light.

And you said they were homemade!



:grr:

[dionysus]

52. oh, i brought my own stash of real beer and real cupcakes... i'll give you some if you want before i

storm away in a huff

:D

[MilesColtrane]

65. They'll get the votes, somehow.

Bribery, coercion, whatever it takes...

Want to bet this commission has 9 Lives™?