If I had wanted a Republican as President.....

[CaliforniaPeggy]

I cannot go there, I just can't.

I wanted Obama to be our President, I really did.

And so I worked for him, donated to his campaign, and for what?

He is becoming a gift for the Republicans.

I am sick at heart...

We keep saying, it's just the first two years, and he has two years to go...He'll fix it, he will...

I no longer trust this to be true.

When I permit my mind to contemplate all of this, I become truly scared, for my country, and my family and friends...

[AspenRose]

1. I'm not sure what to believe anymore.

[GreenPartyVoter]

2. I feel your pain, Peggy. *hugs* Let's face it, we're on the Titanic.

[AsahinaKimi]

143. feels like it ..

Not a raft boat in sight..

[txlibdem]

279. Not the TItanic, we're trapped inside the movie "2012"

On the Titanic the women and children were saved first, only then did any of the men get saved. The rich old white men gallantly stayed behind if there wasn't room for them in the lifeboats. Today, the rich white men who caused all the problems for the rest of us are the first ones in line for handouts from the tax payers and protection from prosecution for their crimes. It's so nice to have a few politicians in your pocket! Thus, I think we're not on the Titanic but rather we've been transported (ala Twilight Zone) into the movie 2012.

2012 movie spoiler: be warned. Stop reading if you don't want to spoil the end of 2012. In case you never saw it, the powers that be knew that a global cataclysm was on the way so they built these huge ships to carry the only survivors of the human race. And who was chosen to be the survivors? Why, the rich of course. You had to purchase a spot on the ships. But the movie follows the exploits of a single family of presumably middle class status (he's a limo driver).

That being the thesis, keep a skeptic's eye on the machinations of the bought-and-paid-for politicians and the Puke Pundits. The current crisis was brought about by greedy rich f*kers but who will end up paying the tab? Look at the "solutions" that are promulgated by both the right and the Corporatist Dems: it's you and I that will end up with the bill for the excesses and inbred incompetence of the "smartest people in the room."

[Poll_Blind]

3. Peggy, I'm right there with you. All I can say is I hope he is as susceptible to pressure as...

...we have been led to believe and I hope we can provide that pressure.

PB

[lark]

429. Nope, he doesn't care about us

therefore we can't pressure him. He used and discarded progressives and is now with his real homies - the corporatists Dems & all the Repugs.

[Poll_Blind]

485. I can't yet refute your statement.

PB

[VMI Dem]

4. Welcome to reality.

[Name removed]

5. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Raven]

6. You said it all, Peg. I cannot get my mind around what appears to

be happening.

[peace frog]

287. I've had my mind around it for some time now

We are well and truly f*cked.

[femrap]

336. Me, too.

WASF...We Are So F*cked.

Pitchforks 4 All!

[chimpymustgo]

352. Same. At least we're not being harangued to NOT believe our lying EYES. Or wait for the CHESS game

to unfold. Or give the man more time.

Pulleeze. At least more people are pulling their heads out of the sand. Now we have to figure out what to do. We know who we CAN'T count on or trust.

[bigtree]

7. I guess you're just ignoring promises kept

. . . and many parts of our Democratic agenda that have been advanced so far as a result of this presidency.

'Gift to republicans' just isn't accurate or fair at all.

[KansasVoter]

9. And you are ignoring what he could have done. Or at least tried. We had so much momentum!

[bigtree]

17. there never was a sufficient progressive majority of Democrats

. . . to successfully advance a progressive agenda into action or law. That's not the President's fault. We took back much of what had been lost over the years, but to imagine that we were going to unravel a huge chunk of all of that in two short years with the political balance in our legislature is a bit misguided.

[KansasVoter]

24. If he has met your expectations then your were much lower than mine!

[bigtree]

38. he accomplished most of what was politically possible in the legislature

. . . and made many, many executive actions regarding the environment, energy, and other issues that have advanced progressive concerns and initiatives.

[KansasVoter]

70. And tried to compromise with people that everyone but him knew would not!!

[bigtree]

yet, pushed forward with as much partisanship as he could politically manage

. . . when that proved unworkable and signed an historic health bill into law.

[Name removed]

93. Deleted message

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[Name removed]

98. Deleted message

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[Name removed]

106. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[bigtree]

111. rhetoric

. . . and stale, uninformed rhetoric at that.

[KansasVoter]

113. PM me when he caves on tax cuts, I can't wait to hear your justification!

[bigtree]

118. you mean when he accepts the Senate compromise that extends the middle-class tax cuts?

PM yourself for me.

[KansasVoter]

120. LOL.....you must be joking at this point.

[bigtree]

122. he promised he wouldn't let middle-class taxes increase

I don't see him backing off of that one.

[fasttense]

283. You are so mistaken.

I heard a snippet of a political speech he gave while campaigning in Iowa City. He specifically said it was unfair to have tax cuts for the rich who have garnered so much of the wealthy of our country.

It was a campaign promise to increase the uber rich tax share.

And when he cuts Social Security and increase our elderly working population, do we still have to call him a Democrat?

[handmade34]

302. sadly

to keep that promise, ultimately the middle class will pay more to compensate for the continued tax cuts for the rich... not a good plan

[BonnieJW]

334. He also promised

no tax cuts for the wealthy. I would rather have my taxes go up and let the cuts expire than give the wealthy anything except a free pass to prison.

[Name removed]

135. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[bigtree]

137. I'm not the droid he's looking for

[Skittles]

142. LOL - yes, you are

[bigtree]

145. help me

Obi wan kenobi. Use the force.

[Name removed]

146. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[bigtree]

150. now you're just trying to hurt my feelings

you folks!

Aren't there enough folks here agreeing with you to your satisfaction?

[Name removed]

158. Deleted message

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[Name removed]

163. Deleted message

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[Name removed]

166. Deleted message

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[donheld]

156. Right on

:thumbsup: One begins to wonder at what point will these people wake up.

[liberation]

182. LOL...

... the evening shift is here I see.

[roguevalley]

239. I think when the pugs repeal everything, we have mercury

floating in the water, rich folks get richer and he says 'look what I've done' as me and my class go under the waves for the last time. When revolution comes, when enough people get hungry -and this generation is not one to do without- then maybe. or not.

[awoke_in_2003]

188. ah yes, the glorious...

Bush "middle class tax cuts" that affected my take home pay by the whopping amount of about $3.50 a paycheck. Oh, how could I survive without that?

[Tuesday Afternoon]

297. survival ---yeah, that is to what I aspire.

no high cotton for this here ole gal.....nosirree!


:eyes:

[Hannah Bell]

215. you mean when he caves on tax cuts for the rich, the #1 cause of the deficit & the continuing reces-

sion?

in order to continue the so-called "tax cuts for the middle class," most of which go to the upper-middle & none of which do a damn thing for the nearly 10% of the population that's officially unemployed or the equivalent number living in poverty, on benefits, or under the table?

[roguevalley]

238. he's going to give zillionaires our money and our country

at that point is the new rome, readying itself to die. but all isn't lost. he'll get a nice check each year himself.

[defendandprotect]

212. Just dropped the Yahoo article on that ... he's put Geithner in charge of a workshop .....

that's the continuing gimmick to avoid fall out from political decisions --

I'll see if I can find the link again -- I had it ready to post since early today --

and then never got to it --


Here it is ... a link to my post with the link to the article in it --

Btw ... tax cuts ... here you go --
There was no consensus on whether to keep Bush era tax cuts in place for the middle class and wealthy alike. But the eight bipartisan congressional leaders and the president agreed to break through their differences by appointing a working group to negotiate a tax cut agreement.

The president appointed Treasury Secretary Timothy Geithner and budget director Jacob Lew to the group while party leaders will appoint their own representatives. Obama said he expects to hear back from them within the next few days.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_obama_congress

A gimmick begun a long time ago -- and always useful!!



Here's a bunch of stuff on Lew .... a pageful --

http://search.yahoo.com/search;_ylt=Avqk7HSdiU6e4C0aUCxVcT.bvZx4?p=Jacob+Lew+and+banking&toggle=1&cop=mss&ei=UTF-8&fr=fp-yie8

This one pretty much tells the story! Yikes!


Obama nominates Jacob Lew to run OMB | NJ.com
WASHINGTON — President Barack Obama nominated Deputy Secretary of State Jacob Lew to ... Lew served as a hedge fund manager for Citigroup, overseeing one of the bank's ...
www.nj.com/business/index.ssf/2010/07/​post_100.html - Cached


How much drug money laundering did his bank do -- ?

And will it now directly be done right through government -- ??

Disgusting from beginning to end!!

[Speed8098]

272. Healthcare reform

Please explain to me why we allowed the republicans to gut our healthcare reform, including getting rid of the public option and not one damn repub voted for it.

Stale, uninformed my ass. I know that Obama has accomplished alot in these two years but why does he keep turning the other cheek just to get slapped there too?

[Recursion]

299. Republicans didn't gut it

Republicans had essentially zero input into PPACA. The concessions made were to get conservative Democrats on board.

[Boudica the Lyoness]

107. They won't repeal it

They are saying that to make the teabaggers happy.

[bigtree]

112. it won't be for lack of trying

It's a pretzel argument to say that republicans actually favored the health care legislation they so vigorously opposed and are still working to unravel in court and in the state legislatures.

[Boudica the Lyoness]

126. They got what they wanted

for the insurance companies. It won't be repealed and because they won't let it be. It's a game put on for their teabag friends.

I remember when Bush stole the election in 2000, right wing radio was flooded with the pro-life crowd calling in all excited because finally abortions were to be banned. I knew there was no way the Republicans would let that happen, but they went through the motion to appease their base.

It's all a big game.

[bigtree]

129. it's easy for critics

. . . to ignore the folks that have already benefited from the legislation; and to discount the ones who will benefit when other provisions become active in the future.

[Name removed]

185. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[roguevalley]

240. given that most people won't benefit until 2014 -all those who

suffer will have to continue- and that most of it doesn't kick in until 2020, who cares? We ceased to be a good country in 2000 when the fuckers put wiley coyote in the white house. all it is now is suffer and die. God, I am so glad I am not a youngster.

[Plucketeer]

381. What DOES sand look like

when that's all one can see???

[lark]

434. Who benefits much compared to the ultimate cost?

Yes, I got healthcare for my unemployed son - a nice gain - but my expenses are going up astronomically - out of pocket max went from $6,000 to $20,000. What am I going to do if my husband ends up in the hospital again with his chronic condition - he's been there for over a week for each of the last 2 years! What's upcoming - limiting the FSA deduction to $2500 when it's $5000 now (bad), medical co-ops with no single payer in MA. and SD run over $900/mo and have huge deductibles - so we can expect roughly the same - mandates that everyone has to get insurance - what about the people that are barely making it now - they can't afford the $900/mo. co-ops. and will the government really subsidize their care - doubtful. Yes, this is such a wonderful plan, everyone should be so excited. Peopl

[awoke_in_2003]

183. they said they want to repeal it...

to get elected- nothing more.

[olegramps]

It is my understanding that they oppose the mandatory buying of insurance.

There is only one solution and that is Medicare for all. That is what the insurance companies feared the most. It would have put these crooks out of business. If Obama had gone directly to the citizens instead of cutting backroom deals it could have been done or at least exposed the Republicans as enemies of the working class. He blew it. I don't pretend to know what will happen in two years, but at the present he has lost the independents, youth vote and has alienated much of his own party. The Cat Food Commission is a damn disgrace along with his appointment of Wall Street crooks to his administration.

[Hannah Bell]

214. lol. a democratic majority & this is all that's "politically possible"?

what kind of democrats *are* those?

[Foo Fighter]

482. "What kind of democrats *are* those?"

That's easy. Corporate whores who sell themselves to the highest bidder. Seems to be a lot of that going around these days.

[roguevalley]

237. no he didn't. dem presidents with less majorities got theirs

stuff done by knocking heads together on both sides. He doesn't, He keeps doing the same stupid slag expecting a different result. I think he thought he could come and 'heal' the nation and bring us all together and he thinks so highly of that that he pursues bipartisan ship with people who are soulless and would be happy if he were dead and still thinks its the most important thing. NO, OBAMA! Getting good legislation and cracking heads together like your predacessors did in the past is more important.

[DimplesinMI]

255. Yes, ask President Bill Clinton

He managed to get plenty done with a Republican Congress and Democratic one. Amazing that the "Harvard President" cannot manage to do anything be "compromise" for nothing gained at all.

Boy, did I waste my vote, money and walking in my neighborhood in 2008. Fool me once, shame on you....fool me twice, shame on me....he WILL not fool me again!

[Recursion]

300. Who? When? (nt)

[BrklynLiberal]

387. EVERY single time he reached across the aisle for "bipartisanship" he pulled back a bloody stump..

EVERY SINGLE TIME. The repukes won every battle...and they will win the war too. There was not one total victory for the Democrats.
It is hard to keep the faith when all one sees is capitulation and reiteration of the same old same old. No backbone, no real courage, no stand up and fight attitude....It literally makes me ill.

Obama and the Dems have been nothing more than Charlie Brown to the repukes Lucy...over and over and over and over.
And it would seem that the midterm elections have done nothing to change that....It will only get worse.

[txlibdem]

526. +1 Well said!.... ...... ....n/t

[MattSh]

280. And now he lost 1/2 of that legislature...

If he keeps aiming low and missing most of the time, maybe he can lose that other half too.

[whathehell]

26. I don't believe he ever tried

or even believed in a progressive agenda....He's barely a democrat of any stripe in my book..and my book is long going back to Jimmy Carter..

Frankly, I think we've been "had".

[HowHasItComeToThis]

210. TO SAY WE HAVE BEEN HAD SEEMS TO EXPRESS MY FEELINGS TOO

[whathehell]

267. Yup....I'm starting to feel

verrrry pissed off.:grr:

[SammyWinstonJack]

347. Oh yes we definitely have been had! Heckuva job Obama!

:puke:

[BrklynLiberal]

389. +1

[Foo Fighter]

487. Well, I don't feel like I've been "had."

Then again, I voted third party. I saw through Obama's shit from the get-go. I never thought he ever had any intention of promoting policies that were even remotely progressive.

My only regret is that I wish he had proven me wrong.

[Raksha]

513. My book goes back to JFK. I KNOW what a Democrat is. I KNOW what a leader is too.

And Barack Obama is neither...not because he doesn't have it in him to be a leader, but because he chose not to be.

[whathehell]

27. I don't believe he ever tried

or even believed in a progressive agenda....He's barely a democrat of any stripe in my book..and my book is long going back to Jimmy Carter..

Frankly, I think we've been "had".

[COLGATE4]

168. What did we "take back, much of what had been lost"???

I fail to see any progress. Obama has continued with the Patriot Act, Gitmo, DADT, domestic wiretapping and spying and is even claiming greater executive powers than Bush in allocating to himself the right to order the killing of any US citizen without due process.

[roguevalley]

242. they bitch about how unfair DADT is and then they pursue it in courts

he is so far removed from the real life of the rest of us that he hasn't a clue.

[inna]

236. sad.

and instructive.

[tpsbmam]

328. I'm no longer buying this as an excuse.

Obama came into office touting bipartisanship from the word go. It was very quickly apparent that the Republicans had no intention of reciprocating. Obama stuck stubbornly, almost obsessively, to the bipartisanship bullshit when it was clear that it was bogging everything down. Hell, he's sticking to it now....:wtf:

Imagine if we'd had a President who stood up from the beginning and said we've heard the American people and we intend to make the changes Americans are demanding. Imagine if we'd had a President who fucking stuck to his no lobbyists rhetoric! Imagine if we had a president who looked at what Americans were shouting during the healthcare debates -- Americans wanted the public option and further, Americans support Medicare for all! Instead we got this bullshit gift to the corporate criminals who caused most of the healthcare atrocities we have today and which will continue under this fuck you to the American people plan. Imagine if we had a president who fucking stood up to Wall Street instead of pandering and coddling Wall Street. Yes there were reforms, if that's what you want to call them.

He had a damn mandate and from the minute he came into office he turned his back not just on his base but on the American people. Fuck the majority -- he had what he needed to get MUCH more done than he did and to get MUCH more done for the people, not the damn corporations!

Ooooo, I guess I'm a tad testy on this topic. Oh hell, I'm just plain angry.

[Mimosa]

362. He did turn his back, sad to say

I remember how candidate Obama wooed us. Things were really going to be different this time. Nobody thought he could work miracles. We just rusted him to keep his word.

But Obama indeed changed and went secretive after his inauguration. The man who said he wasn't gong to get cozy with the lobbyists had the health industry CEOs and lobbyists dictate what plans we US citizens must participate in, by mandate. Obama the president would not even meet with his family doctor (from Chicago) of 20+ years, who was a single payer advocate, as are many health care professionals.

What does President Obama know from the inside which we don't know? Is he scared to defy the powers that be? He certainly doesn't talk to us, the public, as he did when a candidate. But I don't pity him, because he should have known what he was getting into. He could have let us become his allies.

I pity the ordinary citizens of the USA who are losing ground every month, every year.

[tpsbmam]

395. I find I keep my mouth shut among friends

who have children. I'm terrified for them. If you do, I apologize for voicing it now, but I'm sure it's all stuff you've thought of. When my mother was diagnosed with cancer & we knew she wasn't going to make it, she and I had lots of deep conversations. She was terrified at the world she was leaving behind for her children & grandchildren. She and Dad had fought the good fight -- both were liberals who fought for and against all of the right things. And when she was leaving the world, Bush was resident. It scared the hell out of her.

And look at us now. When Obama & the Democratic majority were elected, I was a little sad Mom & Dad weren't here to see it. My god, I'm glad they're not here to see it now! I don't have kids and have to admit that I breathe a sigh of relief at that. But there are kids in this world who I love and I'm petrified for them. I'm not all THAT old but have lots of health problems and, given the nature of "healthcare" in this country, will probably die younger than I would if I lived in any other industrialized country. I have to admit that these days, I'm not so sure my shorter lifespan is such a horrible thing. Isn't that awful? But it's true.

And yeah, what really did it for me was the health insurance fiasco and Obama's unwillingness to even meet with single-payer advocates....to the point of standing by as they were arrested for trying to deliver him a letter. A letter! Yup, that did it.

[Doremus]

435. How big of a majority did you want?

The pugs pushed the lion's share of their platform into fruition with a smaller majority than we had.

I mean, c'mon. They passed the biggest increase in social service programs since LBJ (Medicare Part D) fer crissakes. This from the pukes of all people.

No, it's time to quit deluding ourselves that Obama is anything but a corporatist.... or that we live in anything other than a corporatocracy. Government by, for and of corporations is here, now, and will stay as long as we allow. And as long as we keep giving passes to our elected representatives.

[Foo Fighter]

488. We also need to quit deluding ourselves that this is a two-party system.

All we have is the Corporatist party. And voting for any member of the Corporatist party (regardless of what letter is behind their name) is, to quote Albert Einstein, the very definition of insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.

[tblue]

187. What's missing is LEADERSHIP!

And commitment to something other than getting Republicans to vote for compromised policies.

[femrap]

339. The prez has absolutely

NO FIGHT in him whatsoever. Plus, I'm beginning to think it's nothing more than a CIRCUS. Either a woman or a Black was going to get the mess that W created. And now the nation's bigots, sheeple, and willfully ignorant fundies can blame a Black man....this is exactly what TPTB wanted.

Obama is playing his part. He is doing exactly what he is being told. I guess he doesn't want to end up like JFK.

I woke up the other morning from a very sound sleep with the words, Jeb Bush, coming from my brain. And he's married to a Latina.

I'm

:hide: ing!!

[KoKo]

340. Yes...Leadership. He seems to Delegate everything to "special commissions" or

put folks who have ties with Wall St. and Banksters in charge of negotiating. Where is Biden in all of this? Biden was picked so that he could work the Senate where he was well respected and Emmanuel was picked to work the House since he had the reputation of a ball buster.

What did we get? Biden either was successful for Obama's agenda...working with Harry Reid to squelch most of Pelosi's and Houses progressive legislation and Rahm managed to screw us over in the Health Care Bill.

What is going on there? Obama doesn't seem to want to get his hands dirty...but to delegate and blame everything on the Repugs and the "Professional Left."

Robert Gibbs was on that Morning Joe Show this morning sneering and laughing with Scarborough over his "Professional Left" comments. They thought it was hysterically funny that Gibbs had trashed the left.

[Greyhound]

217. It's like what we might have seen had Hoover won reelection.

It would be fascinating to see what judgment history will pass on this group of Presidents.

[laughingliberal]

231. +1000 nt

[defendandprotect]

390. I was grasping for that earlier ... you've said it very aptly !!

A depression without FDR is bad enough --

Obama administration is adding insult to injury!

[Greyhound]

417. Thanks. It's just so damn disappointing.

I'm not sure 2008 was our last chance, but it sure feels like it.

[defendandprotect]

498. It is -- and it is intended to be --

The thing that disturbs me is that two years ago we should have been

fighting the rightward direction of Obama -- and acknowledging the

corporate takeover of both parties -- and discussing a Plan B.

We don't seem to be any further along in that regard.

Everyone seems to be kind of frozen in place -- shock and awe?

Is this being struck again by the "Hamlet"-syndrome which I think was

an apt description after the assassination of JFK?


When we look at other historic struggles -- even the theft and genocide

against the Native American -- they still knew. The African enslaved here

-- they knew. Revolution -- language of "equality for all" and rebellion

understood by all -- they knew. Granted we ended up with quite a

schizophrenic Constitution, but the Bill of Rights pulled it out a bit.

Why do we seem to be so unmotivated? Why is liberal leadership so unmotivated?

Is this my imagination?


:)

[Greyhound]

509. Why are we so unmotivated? Mostly ignorance, IMO.

Why is liberal leadership so unmotivated? I don't see any liberal leadership.

[defendandprotect]

510. Thom Hartmann today asked: "Should Obama announce he will step down in 2012?"

We have some liberal leadership in Congress still, but not much!

It still drives me nuts that the liberal organizations don't unite --

Women and unions, NAACP, Human Rights groups -- in a campaign against

this shift to the right. From what I hear, they don't want to divide

the $1 they get --

Barely heard the voices of any women's groups calling for MEDICARE FOR ALL --

nothing unusual there because women are basically disappeared in our press.

Why didn't the unions call out Democratic voters to demonstrate for MEDICARE

FOR ALL? Why didn't the Democratic Party do it?

Certainly, any time the GOP sees an opportunity for a wedge issue or a way

to move to the right, they CREATE a movement.

GOP/Christian Coalition
GOP/NRA
GOP/Swiftboaters
GOP/"pro-life"
GOP/T-baggers

All of it tools of the GOP and mainly bought and financed by the GOP.

Nothing equal to it on the left -- though shirley Obama would have only had to

ask and Democrats would have been marching for MEDICARE FOR ALL --

Wouldn't have cost the party anything --

The party is silent on all of this -- silence is also an answer.


Motivation .... ? I really don't think Americans are stupid -- I do think that

anyone can be turned from their own interests by lying propaganda.

Given direct questions, Americans are a liberal bunch.

Given rw lies, they are a confused bunch.


We need liberal leadership from the White House -- and I think that means a change

of candidates for 2012. IMO, we should also be demanding that Obama rids himself

of these pro-corporate advisors -- they created the economic problems, they profitted

from deregulation, and they are blocking reinstating appropriate remedies.


We need many things done to regain America --

Patriot Act and Homeland Security need to be overturned --

Trade Agreements need to be overturned --

Glass-Steagall and other New Deal rules and regulations need to be reapplied --

and most of all we need to stop these illegal and immoral wars -- which btw are

bankrupting the Treasury. That's a sure way to destroy democracy.

[Chulanowa]

235. No we didn't

The Legislature was unwilling.

But of course, the president is a king and can rule by fiat, so the progressives ignored the legislature and decided to blame everything, no matter how distant on Obama. While ALWAYS ignoring any achievement, or dismissing it.

[roguevalley]

243. in the past, dem presidents have made the world shake withtheir

efforts by knocking heads together. Read about them, FDR, Truman, Johnson. They did things against the worst tides and won because they FOUGHT for us. These pussies? They are so intimidated by the pugs and trying to be liked, they have no soul.

[Chulanowa]

466. All three had very helpful legislatures

[Foo Fighter]

489. Right on. Much like Bush who had a Dem majority in the Senate when he

he passed his first "Tax cut for the Rich" bill. Oh wait...

[defendandprotect]

511. Don't think as many Dems at the time were as pre-bribed and pre-owned by

corporations as they are now -- ???


Otoh, don't want to suggest that I'm naive about Democratic Party corruption --

evidently LBJ was very close to Mafia and oil industry which are basically the same.

Was taking payoffs supposedly when he was in the White House -- envelopes with cash.

LBJ was a vile and corrupt man -- who happened to also do some good things for the

nation.

Truman was the replacement for Henry Wallace, who would have been the liberal future

of our nation -- don't know the entire story but some say that the Convention was

closed down until they forced FDR to remove Wallace and take Truman. That was a turning

to the right. Wallace was removed only 4 months before FDR's death. Coincidence?


Look at the things Clinton did in overturning 60 years of Welfare guarantees --

much of the economic destruction originates in the trade agreeements which Clinton

also pushed.


JFK echoed FDR -- and the wealthy were not about to have a repeat of that!!

[olegramps]

316. FDR went directly to the people to state his case.

This is how you use the power of the presidency. Obama should have never had any backroom discussions with the drug and insurance companies. The polls showed the over 70% of the citizens wanted a national health care program. I just can't figure out what the hell he is. But I sure as hell know that he isn't a FDR.

[Chulanowa]

467. No, Obama is not FDR; nor is 2010 the same as 1939

But of course, it looks to me like liberals are as susceptible to this "golden age" and hero worship bullshit as the right is.

Let me be frank with you; if FDR were to magically become our president right now... He would fucking flop. If Truman, or Johnson, or Lincoln, or whoever your Fantasy Football President is were to be in charge, odds are they would do no better than Obama. Their successes were not solo endeavors, where they bulled their way through despite the gods and society and all that other "Lone Hero" Hollywood shit.

They succeeded because the people around them helped them succeed. Their successes are remembered as great because the times allowed for it. The "greats" are products of their times, and of the government around them. FDR was fucking awesome because he had a lot of help from Congress, because he had the bonus of fighting a defensive war against people who were obviously bent on global domination, and because he had four fucking terms to do it.

Does Obama have any of that? No, he doesn't. So stop making the comparison, much less pretending it proves anything.

[bluestate10]

475. Wow.

"But of course, it looks to me like liberals are as susceptible to this "golden age" and hero worship bullshit as the right is."

I could not have written it any better.

Maybe we would be better off if McCain/Palin won the 2008 election. Obama could have come in 2012 and played FDR, with an Hoover like depression in full bore. But, I am plain vanilla moderate and prefer not to scare myself.

[olegramps]

505. Keep carrying the torch for Obama with your eyes tightly closed shut.

FDR accomplish more in his first year in office than Obama would be able to do if he had four terms.
Stop spewing crap and go and read about the accomplishments that FDR's LEADERSHIP wrought for the struggling working class. How did he react when the Republican leadedrs said that their most important accomplishment will not be working to solve the nation's problem, but to defeat him in 2012. What is his reaction? He invites them to lunch at the White House. Judging by his track record I can only thank God that he wasn't president during the 1930's and FDR was since I and most of my relatives would have probably starved to death.

[defendandprotect]

512. Agree with you completely .....

Among strange things I became aware of this week, evidently any speech the

president now makes is checked by what sounded like every government agency,

MIC and intelligence -- pretty much all of DC -- before it is "approved."

Ike not only spoke of the MIC -- he spoke of the Mititary Industrial Intelligence Complex.

But when the draft of his speech was returned to him, "intelligence" was taken

out -- Ike put it back in -- and it was taken out again. So this has been going

on a very long time. Many of our presidents have been betrayed in very serious

ways by the CIA and intelligence complex. That includes Ike and JFK.

I also heard that the Secret Service is now part of Homeland Security!!


Obama trampled universal health care for Americans -- what I ask now is ...

"How does Obama sleep at night?"

[bluestate10]

481. Obama lost momentum when he "proposed" health care changes, then

let Congress fill in the blanks. Republicans seized on that weakness and uncertainty. Obama come off as too clinical during moments where heart felt responses mean the world. I still have nightmares of his response to that woman who stated that she was tired of having to fight and defend him daily. All of us fight with conservatives over policy. The sad thing is that our President is not covering our backs and will give us an unemotional response if we shared our pain of fighting an emotional battle only to see our general put up what appears to be a flag of surrender. Obama must fight against republicans on tax cuts, if need be, let middle class tax cuts expire along with those for millionaires and billionaires if republicans insist on having their way. I would respect Obama more if he explained that he will let all tax cuts expire rather than give in to people that don't need tax cuts. President Obama must stand tall, then send out telegenic, sound bite savvy, knuckle dragging mouth breathers to explain to the average american why letting all tax cuts expire was the right thing given the choice that was presented. No more sending a Larry Summers or the always smiling economist that went back to California out to explain why a tough policy stand was not only warranted, it was the only possible right outcome.

[tyne]

10. No kiddin

But this type of thing(comments in the thread) is a very good example of why Dems can't hold onto power.

[whathehell]

43. No kiddin...With Dems like this, who needs repukes?

OTOH, I doubt you've been a Dem...or anything else, for that matter...for very long..:eyes:

If you had you'd remember what true democrats once were...and guess what, bro?...It ain't this.

[Hannah Bell]

221. dems didn't hold on to power because they didn't act like dems.

[defendandprotect]

515. Exactly ... !!!

[defendandprotect]

514. Of course, corporate money . . .

and 50 years and more of right wing political violence have nothing to do

with that --


:rofl:

[CaliforniaPeggy]

15. I know he's kept some of his promises...

But when he says he hasn't cooperated enough with the Republicans, what am I supposed to think?

That is just plain wrong, and a gift to them.

They want to destroy him, make him a one-term president, a failure. And he's cooperating with them.

Where is his spirit?

[bigtree]

32. He said the same thing throughout the health care debate

. . . and republicans refused to support what Democrats eventually produced. In effect, he maneuvered in a bipartisan posture, yet, pressed forward with as much partisanship as he could manage. It's not as if the legislature is more progressively inclined than he is.

I really don't see or get the same reaction to his presidency outside of DU that I see on these pages. What did the President 'give' republicans? The federal pay raise freeze? My wages are stagnant. I'm feeling very little sympathy for government employees facing a 2 year raise freeze. Some, but not much.

And tax cuts? Is that your breaking point? What about the effect of losing the middle class portion of the Bush cuts that the President said out front that he's committed to extending, just to end the upper-class tax breaks? That's what any compromise is going to be about. It's a sure bet that the majority of this mostly conservative Congress (Dem and rep) is bent on extending the upper-class cuts and won't allow the middle class cuts to proceed without some kind of extension of both. I know that some here and elsewhere say end them both, but I do remember the President's promise to not allow middle class taxes to increase in his term. That's what I believe he's focused on most of all. That's not a republican concern, but he has to get past their filibuster to get to the extension of the middle class cuts. It makes sense that he's willing to let the upper-class cuts ride for a while longer in exchange for that. He needs to make a deal in this lame-duck Congress before the opportunity to extend the cuts just evaporates in the smoke of a republican House-oriented tax bill in the next one.

Dang, CP. This politics isn't some easy, zero-sum enterprise.

[CaliforniaPeggy]

39. I hear you, and I know it isn't easy.

But it doesn't look to me that he's even tried.

That's the thing that gets me down the most.

You're supposed to try.

[Demoiselle]

346. I think you're right, CP.

I have the same sinking feelings you do. I just haven't seen anything that looks like conviction or spine coming from the Obama Administration.
It breaks my heart.

[BuelahWitch]

372. That's exactly what Cenk Unger says

He isn't trying. If he's playing chess, he's giving away the Queen. I agree with him, and you, Peggy.

[johnnie]

44. Interesting

"I really don't see or get the same reaction to his presidency outside of DU that I see on these pages."

I was going to post almost the same thing. I was talking to two people at work today (who happen to be civil servants, I'm a contractor) and they both are Democrats that voted for Obama and both of them said they think he is a little too left leaning. Other people I talk to have the same opinion or are happy with him because he is a little to the left. The only freaking out I hear is on DU and it confuses me.

[lunamagica]

66. How so? How so? Please tell me because I don't see it.

[mmonk]

148. You have to understand the power of propaganda.

From a historical and reality based perspective, he isn't very left.

[LibDemAlways]

177. "they think he is a little too left leaning" That tells me they

are being influenced by the rightwing "Obama's a socialist" meme.

Total media bullshit.

[Mojorabbit]

186. I see the opposite

I use my apolitical husband as a baramoter as well as the many apolitical friends we have. He said the other day that Obama has done nothing. I know he got that from the television as we don't do FOX in this house. I gave him a list of the things Obama has done and he was unaware of most of it. The reporting is major antagonistic on all the regular news venues, ie evening news and newspapers.

[defendandprotect]

204. Would presume they're not part of the 76%+ who wanted MEDICARE FOR ALL ...???

Because I doubt any of them think Obama is a little too far to the "left" --

:rofl:

In fact, if you include Catholic Latinos, the numbers are as high as 83% --

Presume these people have solid health care and they'll be no challenges to it ?

[Hannah Bell]

218. ask those people which policies or actions they consider "left".

bet they 1) won't be able to answer, or 2) their answer won't make sense.

for example, maybe they'll say the health reform bill, which mandates that everyone pay for a policy through a private, corporate insurer, is left-wing.

[reggie the dog]

311. easy, we are more informed here

anyone who thinks obama is too left leaning either has no knowldege of international politics or is greatly confused, obama is farther to the right than most nearly every democratic president ever. he is not a little to the left on an international scale, he would pass for right wing or hard right wing in every country in the european union. ask your coworkers about that and see if they can even name the 27 states of the eu much less have a knowledge of the politics of at least several of those states... then ask a similar question here on DU and you will understand why people here freak out and your coworkers dont, you coworkers probably get their news on cable vs people here reading multiple international sources of info.

[Foo Fighter]

494. Exactly.

I work with a number of people from various countries and all of them are amazed at what passes for the "left" here. They are all very politically aware and are amazed at what they consider the "political unawareness" or downright "apathy" of Americans. The so-called "left" in our country would most definitely considered right or hard-right in their countries. We have no "left" in this country as far as they can see and, sadly, they are absolutely correct.

[emulatorloo]

314. Obama Job approval among Democrats: 81% - Gallup Nov 22-28

http://www.gallup.com/poll/124922/Presidential-Approval-Center.aspx

DU is a bit of a bubble. I'm afraid.

[JuniperLea]

342. Bubble, indeed...

Dutch Oven would be a more accurate term at the moment.

Some want Obama to fail, some want him to be just like Bush and run roughshod over the world, and some don't give an airborne rodent's derriere what he does because this mess is all his fault.

And DU continues to grow too stinky for some... I think I'm turning blue.

[BrklynLiberal]

391. Allthe Democrats that I know are beyond disappointed. They are very aware and

well-informed. All they see is one compromise after another...and nothing REALLY accomplished, and little hope for anything in the next two years. I guess the difference is in expectations and gullibility. Those of us that actually believed what the candidate Obama said are heartbroken that the man who is now President has shown absolutely no indication of being the same man who was present during the campaign. Political realities aside...SHOW SOME SPUNK, MAN!!! WTF!! LEADERSHIP!! CHARISMA!!! COURAGE!!! ANYTHING!!!!

[Tesha]

74. That's right. Outside of DU, THEY DESPISE OBAMA and don't even cut him...

...what little slack we here cut him. He's finished.

Tesha

[bigtree]

81. republicans certainly despise him

Democrats, however (liberals esp.) support President Obama with record numbers.

[Tesha]

89. You keep saying that.

Do you honestly believe that *WE* will believe you if
only you say it enough times?

Tesha

[bigtree]

97. polling backs me up on that point

. . . DU rhetoric backs you on yours.

[Tesha]

102. How'd that poll taken November 2nd turn out? (NT)

[bigtree]

110. you mean the one where republicans came out and voted against our Democratic success?

. . . voted against our President and party's legislative and political successes?

It turned out about as predicted. Pretty weak for a 'takeover'. So republicans control the loquacious, but politically neutered House and that's supposed to be some referendum on the President's progressiveness? That's a joke of an argument.

[defendandprotect]

206. 28 million expected voters stayed home this election day ....

In other words, on top of the vast numbers already not voting --

we now have another 28 million of them --

[roguevalley]

244. from a sheerly political point of view, shitting on groups of

your constituents and expecting them to be happy to stand with you while you give the country to the insane asshats on the other side might have something to do with it. Shitting on unions, lefties and the like, real smart. Real damned smart, asshats.

[Tesha]

269. I see. You endlessly repeat polls you like and disregard polls you don't like.

Even when the polls you don't like are far more
meaningful than the polls you do like.

Tesha

[Mimosa]

365. The poll which counted was in early November, on a Tuesday.

Very nice weather, nearly everywhere.

The youth vote and minorities who turned out overwhelmingly for Obama in Nov 2008 did not come to the polls. Iwas a poll watcher during both elections, same day and advance.

Why did people stay home? Disillusionment, disappointment. Dumb or not, they had reason to think their votes wouldn't change anything.

[TBF]

277. It's not going to be a joke anymore when he's voted out in 2012 -

he's a bigger failure than Jimmy Carter.

[Celtic Raven]

349. But he can give a speech

Can you imagine how much money he's going to rake in once he's on the speaking circuit?

No more having to deal with people expecting him to be our generation's FDR, just showing up to say a few words, shake a few hands, & have his pic taken with other rich people. Money will just be rolling in after he's out of office.

[TBF]

354. I'm sure he's looking forward to that. He is quite an actor. nt

[bread_and_roses]

276. I lost count how many House seats Ds lost here in New York

Maffei conceded just the other day. And that's of course not including the many, many local seats the Ds lost - particularly painful for the many of us Upstate who had finally see years and years of work bear fruit in '06 -'08; nearly all reversed now.

It's small comfort that some of them were worthless Blue Dogs anyway.

This is NY, remember. NY. Two D Senators. Union dense. Progressives thick on the ground. Even here upstate. Anyone wants a "poll" that's about as real-world as it gets.

[Recursion]

304. But you're taking a lesson from that that is completely disconnected from reality

The reason conservatives came out so strongly is that we forced through some of the most important progressive legislation in decades.

And if you say "what progressive legislation did we pass? It was all Republican ideas" you need to leave the echo chamber for a little bit.

[bread_and_roses]

424. Your reasoning is flawed.

Do you seriously think that the NYers of 2010 are fundamentally different than the NYers who elected Ds in 2008? I was on the ground both those years, and years and years previous, and can tell you, no, they are not.

http://cityroom.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/11/16/new-york-state-ranks-last-for-voter-turnout/

New York State Ranks Last for Voter Turnout

Despite contests for every statewide office for the first time in decades, a smaller share of eligible voters turned out two weeks ago in New York than in any other state. New York turnout was lower than in any midterm election for at least three decades...

...New York ranked lowest, just below Texas and Utah...

...New York ranked among the 10 lowest turnout states in 2006 and 2008, but this was the first year since then that it sank to the very bottom.

People poll as despising the Rs as much as the Ds. Ordinary people are frightened. For their jobs. For their homes. About paying for heat for winter. At seeing their health insurance costs - if they're "lucky" enough to have insurance - going up AGAIN. For their jobless family members. For their children trying to pay for college. If the Ds had done ANYTHING* that these voters could have seen as working for them, the results would have been different.

*and if anyone wants to point to the known-to-be-too-small stimulus, the message on it was so garbled, the effects so delayed, the benefits so diffuse, that hardly anyone even remembers it - gee, why do you think that is?

[Tesha]

103. (Duplicate removed by author)

[defendandprotect]

205. Last polls we saw here show just the opposite ....

[emulatorloo]

327. Link?

http://www.gallup.com/poll/124922/Presidential-Approval-Center.aspx

Nov 21-28 2010

Job Approval

Liberal Democrat 81%
Moderate Democrat 77%
Conservative Democrat 75%


DU is a bit of an echo chamber, I think.

[midnight]

351. The liberal Democrat 81 % is that the same as the professional left?

If this is accurate, it would seem that the base he is leaving in the ditch, supports him more than the conservatives he lifted out. Maybe I have this wrong, but that's what it seems like.

[MrsCorleone]

419. Just curious. Who makes up the "professional left" in your mind?nt

[defendandprotect]

383. Obama's ratings have fallen in every quarter since his election.....

according to your link!


His average approval rating has declined each quarter since he took office, falling by more than two percentage points in the most recent quarter to establish a new low.

Yet, allegedly, after an election where the public showed disapproval for Democrats

and we lost the USHR -- and 28 million expected voters stayed home -- they say he's up

3% points "in last few days" ...

Makes absolutely no sense --

Maybe they were people who were out of town when Obama explained immediately after the

election that he would be compromising further with GOP and continuing to move even

further to the right?

Given the huge landslide vote for Obama in '08 -- and 76+% of Americans who wanted single

payer/government run health care -- seems obvious that the constant quarterly falls in

his approval are connected to his move to the right and his compromises!!

[emulatorloo]

386. You are shifting the terms of the argument - we were talking about democrats

And all the various claims that "all liberal democrats can't stand Obama."

You are now talking about "average approval rating" which includes Republicans who give Obama an approval rating of 12%.

And so on.

[defendandprotect]

393. More correct to say ... Obama can't stand all liberal Democrats -- ??

Meanwhile, obviously the nation is unhappy with Obama for his betrayals on

universal health care -- and other issues where he is to the right -- way to the right.

And if we subtract Republicans from Obama's approval rating ... it would be 35% ... ???

Is that what you're saying?

[emulatorloo]

396. There's something a bit off in your math skills

Average Approval Rating = an average of all the people polled
Democratic Approval Rating = the democrats among those polled
Republican Approval Rating = the republicans among those polled.

[defendandprotect]

397. Same thing I was thinking about Gallup's Poll ....

http://www.gallup.com/poll/124922/Presidential-Approval...

Nov 21-28 2010

Job Approval

Liberal Democrat 81%
Moderate Democrat 77%
Conservative Democrat 75%

Here you recite simply "Job Approval" --

How did Gallup define a "liberal" Democrat and where did they find them?

Are they sure they weren't DLC Dems?

And, who is a "moderate" Dem now ...

We have one right wing party now and one radical right wing party --

if Obama is in the center of that, it puts him between right wing and radical right wing!!

Same for any "moderate" -- !!

And you also don't seem to be concerned about the "liberal" support at 81% while

the "conservative" support is 75% -- isn't that a little close for two polar opposites???


What this poll is lacking is some common sense --

Based on its own terms, it invalidates itself!

:eyes:

[emulatorloo]

402. The respondents identify themselves

I don;t know gallups question but in polls I have been called on it is more like this.

Q: Do you identify yourself as a republican or democrat?

A: Democrat

Q: Would you describe yourself as a liberal, moderate, or conservative democrat?

A: Liberal Democrat

-=======

"And you also don't seem to be concerned about the "liberal" support at 81% while

the "conservative" support is 75% -- isn't that a little close for two polar opposites???"

No, why would that concern me? I know from being out in the world that there are liberal democrats and there are conservative democrats. It is a "big tent" party.

[defendandprotect]

413. And how many here will tell you Obama is a "centrist" without understanding how far right ....

that puts him right now given we have one right wing party and one radical

right wing party?

Again -- 76%+ of Americans supported single payer/government run health care --

and the figures were rising as Obama was making his back room deals to trample it.

Were any of those people interviewed?

You also don't seem to get what I'm saying here ....

"And you also don't seem to be concerned about the "liberal" support at 81% while

the "conservative" support is 75% -- isn't that a little close for two polar opposites???"

No, why would that concern me? I know from being out in the world that there are liberal democrats and there are conservative democrats. It is a "big tent" party.

This isn't about "big tent" -- this is about issues --

With Obama supporting Bush's wars ...

With Obama destroying single-payer ...

With Obama attacking Social Security ...

You really think that BOTH liberals and conservative Democrats would support those positions?

They are direct opposites --


:eyes:

[emulatorloo]

439. Honestly, I wish Skinner would ban the eye-roll smiley already

I understand your position perfectly

"we have one right wing party and one radical right wing party"

Just because you have that viewpoint/framework doesn't mean that the majority of Democrats have that viewpoint. Because they don't.

DU is pretty much an echo chamber, it helps to keep that in mind no matter what your position is.

[defendandprotect]

470. And, similarly, because you disagree ... doesn't mean that isn't the way it is ....

As for the eye rolls and other emotioncons -- one of the first things I

pointed out to Skinner was how CRUEL they are -- how insulting -- how uncivil.

But, evidently, he he likes them?


:rofl:

[sabrina 1]

436. Anyone can claim to be a liberal democrat. I've seen some people

whose policy positions are nowhere near being liberal, let alone, democratic, claim the 'liberal democrat' label. And as has been pointed out many times before, democrats when answering polling quesions, depending on how the questions are worded, will NOT say they do not support a democratic president. I would have answered 'yes' to that poll, because NO ONE wants a Republican in the WH.

[RufusTFirefly]

442. Keep in mind that Pres. Obama's a "socialist."

That ought to tell you something about the reliability of labels these days.

[defendandprotect]

471. So true -- !!

[sabrina 1]

480. Yes, exactly. n/t

[JuniperLea]

343. Hahahahaha!

Oh man... that's rich...

[defendandprotect]

516. Where was Obama's "spirit" when he picked the very people who created

the financial melt down as advisors?

These people not only created it -- they profited from it!

And they're preventing any true remedy to this economic disaster --

reinstatement of New Deal regulations and rules -- Glass-Steagall --

we're still open right now to a new round of corporate crime.


Where was Obama's "spitit" when he made back room deals with Big Pharma

to prevent Medicare from negotiating on drug prices -- when with private

HC industry in promising that single-payer would be "off the table."


What I ask about Obama these days is ... "How does Obama sleep at night!" --



:eyes:

[Dappleganger]

49. She is only acknowledging what many of us have finally come to realize...

the president's actions and choices are more befitting republican 'values' than those of FDR's.

I know it, she knows and and a whole bunch of people here on DU know it.

[bigtree]

51. that's just not accurate

FDR was all over the place politically during his terms and he had much more of a Democratic majority to work with.

You're wrong on the facts of history and on the facts of this presidency.

[Dappleganger]

59. You can keep believing the dream...

while the rest of us in the real world continue to suffer due to this president's decisions.

[bigtree]

82. weel, there have been many I disagree with

. . . but you're shifting the argument.

[Name removed]

132. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[bigtree]

133. I've taken the time to reply

. . . that's not at all something to fault. Did you actually want a reply? Your premise is unsupportable by anything I've written on this thread in response to the replies I received stemming out of my original response to the op. I'm actually defending Democratic principles, as represented by the progress this President has made on his campaign promises and on advancing some of our Democratic agenda. I'm also defending against misrepresentations of that progress from our Democratic president. If you can't debate that, you can't debate it. So be it.

[awoke_in_2003]

192. I am shopping for glasses...

how much more are the ones with rose colored lenses?

[defendandprotect]

207. Point is, we have a depression due to another capitalist crime wave and corruption

of government -- and NO FDR!!

[roguevalley]

247. the fact that no one is jailed for that or swinging from a tree is

another nail in his political coffin because putting heads on spikes because crimes where committed is a tenet of keeping us believing that the lie that we are equal still applies.

[roguevalley]

246. I'll remember that when I decide which bill I can't pay this

month due to my dogs needing cancer medicine while he and others as wealthy as him get a fucking tax break. I am drowning and he doesn't give a shit. How partisan of him.

[AndrewP]

392. Best wishes to your dog....

The lower/middle class is being told to go f*** themselves.

Now, either the President is

1. Fighting for us and doing everything he promised!!
2. Complicit with the Republicans in screwing us!!

Regardless of how anyone answers that I would hope that we could agree that, in a "giving him 100% of our trust" scenario, he got his ass kicked in the November election and is doing a piss poor job framing his political agenda.

[Caretha]

165. Could you please give me a list

because right now 98% of us feel shit outta luck.

[ProudDad]

425. Promises Kept...

http://whatinthefuckhasobamadonesofar.com/

[lark]

430. What real advances? I'm totally serious.

He gave the insurance companies the key to healthcare with few conditions, refused to even negotiate lower prices for rx, refused to even allow the possibility of single payer. He shamesfully and repeatedly covered up for BP, and made a deal with them that allows them to keep drilling in the gulf, no matter what, Afghanistan war forever and Iraq nearly the same, appointed social security critics and deficit hawks to lead his debt (aka cat food) commission knowing they'd cut social security and taxes for the rich. Refuses to hold bush accountable for lying the country into war, politicizing the justice dept., etc., etc. Tell me, how does this advance a progressive agenda? What am I missing? All I see is a Repug/shrub lite, none of the promise of hope or change for the better of the working class, everyting for the rich corporatist class.

[Foo Fighter]

497. Oh c'mon now. Everything you mentioned are "real" advances

for insurance companies, pharmaceutical companies, BP and war profiteers, that is. And you left out the banksters.

But you gotta cut Obama some slack here. After all, he can't be expected to hold Bush accountable for lying the country into war if Obama truly believes he can use the war and all of Bush's policies for his own political gain (translation: to assure his corporate masters that what happens in DC stays in DC.). After all, that's all that matters in the end.

[KansasVoter]

8. I am there with you! So disappointed!

[jaxx]

11. We don't have a republican president so what's the problem?

People need to pay attention to the facts instead of the nonsense.

[azmouse]

90. oh but Jaxx...

It's so much more fun to whine! We see that over and over and over on this website.
We know it's beyond hopeless here.

[Skittles]

138. no - hopeless is aplogizing for someone who clearly is not on your side

[Greyhound]

223. Now to be fair, we don't know that.

They may be trust-fund babies that have seen their portfolios grow by leaps and bounds.

And if a few thousands or millions people have to suffer and die... well, they were going to die someday anyway, weren't they?
:hi:

[liberation]

191. Right...

... passive aggressive condescension is soooooo much "harder."

Actually that was beyond easy. LOL

[Hannah Bell]

220. no, 5 years of double-digit unemployment is hopeless, for a good percent of the electorate.

cutting the social safety net is hopeless.

union-busting is hopeless.

REFUSING TO TAX THE BLOATED RICH THAT CAUSED THIS RECESSION-CUM-DEPRESSION, AND ARE CURRENTLY ON CAPITAL STRIKE -- IS HOPELESS.

[displacedvermoter]

370. Always use "poutrage" in your posts attacking those

who disagree with you, especially in conjunction with "whining"!

[reggie the dog]

313. facts

the democrats caved on everything, the republicans didnt even philibuster one time because the democrats caved in advance

more facts average americans are hurting big time and are not feeling helped by privitizing schools throught charter schools, are not feeling helped when bernie sanders is one of few people talking about delocalization, are not feeling helped when they see that social security is under attack, are not feeling helped when there is money for war but not for people losing their jobs, they are not feeling helped when they see that wall street got bailed out but that there is little if any help to keep families in their homes!

things are tough and getting tougher for working people and have been for a long time, once again the democrats are shitting on us people that work our asses off to have so much less than others, others who seem to sit on their asses all the time, not produce anything, and bitch that they should pay less taxes.... we can see who obama sides with in spirit.

[emulatorloo]

324. FACT - voting against cloture = Filibuster

It isn't like in the old movies. All the Republicans have to do is vote against cloture, that is the modern fillibuster

[NightWatcher]

12. but Pegs, you are supposed to be a holdout for hope

I've long since given up. I hoped for change but feel I was hosed

It's depressing, but oh well life goes on.

All we can do is take care of ourselves and loved ones. Thanks again for the star.

[flyarm]

13. well people in hell want Ice water, and if you had done your homeowrk as many of us did ..

this would not have come as a Horrific startling surprise to you or anyone.

You would have know what those of us that were degraded and treated like animals knew and were slandered.

This is why lemmings were told to stop all debate.

I wanted a great president as well, but I knew because I did my homework this man was a fraud.

What solutions do you have now that you have had your "come to jesus" moment? Any Ideas???????

[Subdivisions]

34. I didn't believe you.

By "you" I mean those of you who did your homework. I must admit that I fell into the cult-of-personality and dismissed your concerns. I volunteered. I donated. I marketed. I even went to see him personally and was able to briefly speak to him and I was in awe. I wanted the same thing we all did, a Great President.

I was profoundly wrong.

I'm sorry.

[awoke_in_2003]

194. I still remember...

the great pride I felt on that election day. I got all choked up in the voting booth because I realized that for my entire life I could NEVER dream I would get the chance to vote for an African American president. The feeling was almost overwhelming. We had turned a corner. I was part of history (even though, being in Texas, my vote didn't count for much). Unfortunately, I feel very underwhelmed with the results.

[defendandprotect]

208. Congratulations ... not easy to say ....

[Lorien]

405. You and me both. I gave up months of work to volunteer for him and stood in line for hours

to hear him speak. I expected great things election night. Man oh man, did I get snookered!

[bluestate10]

476. I supported Clinton in the primary, and got beaten fair and square.

I wish Obama would show more backbone on key democratic strong points like taxes and jobs. But given the resistance that he has faced from republicans and his not having a totally liberal or moderate democratic majority, he has done as well as he could. Would Hilary have been better? Who knows?

[Skittles]

141. CORRECT

anyone who paid attention is not surprised

[LibDemAlways]

193. Never an Obama fan. Voted for him because he wasn't McCain.

Neither disappointed nor disillusioned. I listened to the campaign rhetoric carefully and came away with the impression "there's no there there." Sucks to be right.

[defendandprotect]

209. Well, I can't go anywhere until everyone else gets their Plan B set .....

and I'd never paid any attention to Obama -- so suspicious re the nature of his rise.

However, everyone here kept saying he was great --

I had to vote for someone -- and I hoped they were all right.

Was also good to vote for an African American --

HOWEVER, from the first days after the election it was obvious that things were being

pushed in a very wrong direction -- despite all denials here.

We've wasted two years here with many simply trying to stall the all out rebellion against

Obama. But it's has broken through -- and without a doubt!!

We need a Plan B, folks -- let's work on it!!!


I have to also say that while I didn't expect much -- I am nonetheless shocked at how far

right Obama has gone -- Bush/Obama bail outs one of the biggest financial coups ever pulled off.

Outright trampling of our best opportunity yet to help citizens with MEDICARE CARE FOR ALL --

and the cruelty of Obama making deals with Big Pharma -- and the private health care industry

to keep single payer "off the table." Many of us here know the medical stories -- one horror

after another we hear about here at DU -- and I'm sure that many of us don't tell all we could

about our personal lives. It is absolute cruelty what Obama has done.

And then doubling up on "The Cat Food Commission" -- making clear that the foul and vile

Alan Simpson is someone that Obama listens to!!

And after two years of this, there's anyone left who thinks that Obama will "listen" or turn

to the left -- ????

About all of these things I have truly been shocked -- truly shocked.

But these days that's the name of the game the right wing are playing = Shock and Awe!!


Hugs for us all --

:grouphug:

[somone]

296. I can think of no better summary

than what you said. Thank you!

[PassingFair]

315. I voted for him because he wasn't Hillary.

Not that it made any difference.

Hobson's Choice.

:puke:

[defendandprotect]

374. Me, too --

because Hillary is part of DLC leadership --

and Obama was saying he wasn't DLC --

but now labels himself as "New Dem" -- had I known, I would not have

voted for him. Would have done a Kucinich or Sanders write in.


It's all disgusting and don't know what we're going to do about it --

but we'd better wake up from this shock and awe before everything gets worse!!


:)

[flyarm]

385. it already is worse! eom

[defendandprotect]

399. "Those who control the past, control the future" .... !!!

:evilgrin:

[librechik]

14. As a democrat, you must be used to it by now.

Carter was a strong president and a progressive--they went out of their way to connive and deceive the people until they got rid of Carter--they only had to commit treason to do it. They've worked all the way up to genocide and illegal war to destroy democrats. I can't blame Obama--he's got a family and he must be aware that they kill the president if he really resists. Who wants to die to protect this evil empire we now have? Not many. I'm surprised we have no draft. They are still sneaky, not up front. That will change as they get more entrenched.

[murray hill farm]

42. I said once that Pres. Obama's actions are so often..

so difficult to coincide with his beliefs and his position. And, someone said to me that"they" probably showed him the many and never before seen clips from many different angles of the action on the grassy knoll...and he got the message. He could let all of the tax cuts expire..which makes the most sense..and is the easiest to do. He could then have congress introduce a new bill to give new tax breaks for those making under $250000. Easy! But he sticks with the keep the line in the sand for not raising taxes for the middle class and in doing so he MUST continue to negotiate and ultimately compromise. I wonder who really runs this country.

[StarsInHerHair]

154. just the other day I had started a thread with this very premise

I asked if what we're seeing isn't weakness but his response for his family's sake. I was asked if I was a troll & why was I focusing on such a weird idea. I repeatedly mentioned that other posters here had noticed-directly after he got sworn into office there WAS a swift flurry of actions, LOTS of stuff signed. Then slowing down, & turning in slow-motion to the rightiest of the Right. I still know he can counter them, but will he?

People talk here like he "didn't have enough support"
-what about all the Republican voters who voted for him?

-what about all those Libertarians who voted for him?

He HAD their support when he was first in office. Except the press-but they've made themselves irrelevant all on their own.

Trouble is now Obama's going to have to turn that wheel even harder to the left to avoid disaster. The Catfood Commiss. using skyrocketing healthcare-costs to justify dismantling healthcare infrastructure?
Were the 'brains' of Obama really the speech writers' intelligence? That's what I'm now forced to think about.

[awoke_in_2003]

195. to be honest...

the republic died on 22NOV63- it just took us a while to realize it.

[defendandprotect]

376. Exactly ....

and they took not only our president but our "people's" government --

The fact that the Democrats had no power to respond at that time was even

more frightening --

Like watching Democrats NOT responsing to election steals now --

and assisting with funding these wars and new warmongering --

Maybe it is worse than Obama imagined but this can't be about personalities --

If so, he should step down -- and Biden as well if he doesn't want to work for TPB.

From what I've seen Biden has been encouraging an attack on Iran by Israel for a

year now -- says Israel "would be justified in attacking Iran" -- !!

More shock and awe!!



:)

[inna]

241. thanks for being fair to Carter. really. (+1)

Carter bashing really bums me out, for some reason. The comparisons (Obama-Carter) are pretty ludicrous, anyway.

[cherokeeprogressive]

16. Dearest Peg... where do I turn in my game piece? I think I'm done playing.

If it weren't so sickening, it would be funny.

[CakeGrrl]

18. Do Republicans go into Doomsday mode like this?

I don't know, I don't read FreeRepublic or any other conservative blogs.

But sorry, this sounds like one step removed from curling up on the couch in the fetal position and packing it in.

Where does the party of organize and fight materialize from thoughts like this?

If a primary challenge is what some are desperately seeking at this point, who leads the charge?

[CaliforniaPeggy]

22. I don't know what the Republicans do...

We need someone to lead the charge. But I don't know who that would be.

The situation is not good...

[Recursion]

305. God yes. They were harder on W than DU is on Obama

Though the rhetoric was the same: "sell-out", "triangulating", "If I wanted a Democrat I would have voted for one", "we're going to lose because he's forgotten his conservative base", etc.

[BzaDem]

19. Just because you work for a politician doesn't mean he only exists to please you.

The vast majority of liberal Democrats approve of his performance, so he is obviously pleasing someone. He has made plenty of decisions I don't agree with. That doesn't mean a Republican is somehow better than him in 2012.

[whathehell]

Oh please.....The vast majority of "liberal" democrats

think he sucks and so do I.

[Name removed]

29. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[CaliforniaPeggy]

31. You obviously do not know me in any meaningful way.

Insults do not solve problems.

[BzaDem]

37. I don't think tyne was responding to you. n/t

[whathehell]

40. Who are you talking to?....I'm not the OP

You might want to get that straight before you start insulting people..Duh.:eyes:

[BzaDem]

35. Except, actually that's not true at all.

According to Gallup, 80-90% of liberal Democrats have approved of Obama's job performance each week since the day he was inaugurated. Furthermore, his Democratic approval rating is higher than every single President since WWII except for JFK (who at certain points was slightly higher).

Studies do show that when people who hold incorrect beliefs are confronted with data proving the incorrect beliefs wrong, they often double down and believe their incorrect beliefs even more. Your post is a perfect example of that.

[whathehell]

61. Except, actually, it is....

and I've not heard the term "liberal democrat" used for ANY of the recent polls...They said "democrats"..Which these days, could mean anything left of Sarah Palin.

[BzaDem]

181. Then you haven't been polled by Gallup. They track the words "liberal democrat" each and every night

[roguevalley]

250. gallup is a crap poll. Truly.

[BzaDem]

265. Sure. After all, you don't like the result. So it must be a crap poll. n/t

[whathehell]

266. One doesn't need to be polled

to hear those words...One only needs to hear them and although I'm a news junkie, I haven't heard them...Seems like a lot of other people around here haven't either.

Whatever.:shrug:

[awoke_in_2003]

197. maybe, unlike what is commonly...

postulated here, liberals will support this president when asked by "outsiders". We don't go around willy-nilly knifing people in the back. Amongst ourselves, however, we will ask difficult questions and don't buy into the pom pom waving.

[roguevalley]

248. +1000

[whathehell]

408. My bud, Roquevalley.....

"Great minds" and all that...:fistbump:

[DimplesinMI]

256. Add to you reply....

A growing number of moderate Democrats who happen to be African-American, thinks he sucks too!

Just saying.......:kick:

[whathehell]

406. Self-delete. n/t

[whathehell]

407. Yup....n/t

[emulatorloo]

318. Obama Job approval among Liberals: 71% / Moderates 54% /Conservatives 25%

Among Democrats: 81%

Gallup Nov 22-28 2010

http://www.gallup.com/poll/124922/Presidential-Approval-Center.aspx

[whathehell]

410. If they're so damn happy with him (even one quarter of Conservatives?)

Than why the hell did they just do a "protest vote" in favor of repukes?

Either these "respondents" were drunk or Gallup is lying...I wouldn't be the first to float that last possibility.

[ChiciB1]

469. And THIS Liberal Agrees With You "whathehell"! I Even Worked Very Hard

to get him elected because my kids FINALLY got interested enough to become real activists! Obama was NEVER the one I wanted to elect, but was PROUD that we finally elected a black person as POTUS!

Now, it's not about black, white, female or male... it's about HIS failure to lead! I THOUGHT at one point he might begin to see or realize what he's doing to his "fellow" Democrats. You know, "we the people" who are just regular folks!

Now, I think I expect nothing but MORE OF THE SAME! I can't in good conscience vote for him again! It may be suicide of some type, but what we have now is just about as REPUKE as you can get! Yes, I think I actually believe that he's more of a Repuke than I ever imagined!

And I SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO wish it wasn't so. We are SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO screwed!

[whathehell]

508. Thank you, ChiciB1...We really need to admit the disappointment

and even the "suspicion", frankly...that he may be an R in D clothing, if you get my drift.

You're right...I worked and donated to his campaign too even though Edwards was my first choice (he imploded before the IL primary)...It's creepy and rather outrageous IMO...but we're "stuck", I guess.

My feeling is that, if he doesn't change by '12, I'm voting primary challenger or Third Party..

I've had it!..I'm a boomer and I've been "holding on"...but I've now HAD it!!

[NorthCarolina]

53. There you go again with that 'vast majority of Dems' talking point.

If a Vast Majority of Dems are for him, as you repeatedly keep telling us, then why worry about any post to the contrary since you Already Know that Obama is, in fact, a shoe-in for reelection.

[Name removed]

94. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[northernlights]

116. that's why so many Democratic seats were lost on November 2

here in Maine-- which just 2 years ago had a huge majority for Obama -- we ended up with an effing teabagger for governor. The democratic candidate pulled in all of 20% of the vote.

The vast majority of democrats here switchd to independent. That's why you can claim the vast majority of democrats love Obama. Because your party is shrinking. (I've gone green/socialist, myself.)

[struggle4progress]

20. Would you care to explain just what gives you the idea that you have a Republican as President?

I see an enormous amount of dishonest criticism of Obama here every day

[CaliforniaPeggy]

25. I would say more Republican-light.

The fact that he said he needs to cooperate more with them...

That was just the latest thing.

The so-called cat food commission...

Not fighting for tax relief for the middle class.

Stuff like that I would never have expected from a Democrat.

[struggle4progress]

46. What do you expect him to say? Do you expect him to announce he won't work with the Republicans?

And what would you have him do next? Retreat to the White House and quietly sit out the rest of his term as an irrelevancy? Of course he's going to say he'll try to work with the Republicans

The so-called cat food commission hasn't released, because it's hopelessly deadlocked

"Not fighting for tax relief for the middle class"? Where did that meme come from?

[lunamagica]

69. Republicans love to scream from the rooftops that they won't work with Democrats

Many, many of them ran on the platform of Destroying Obama and the Democratic agenda. And they won. And now Obama says he will work with them.

They speak forcefully, aggressively, about doing away with everything our side believes in. They get promises of "bipartisanship" -which really means "concession", since they've made clear they won't compromise. Their whole purpose is to destroy this administration so they will win it all in '12.


And the President will work with them.

Honestly, how do you expect us to feel?

[struggle4progress]

71. Frankly, I care more about what you do than how you feel

[lunamagica]

91. I'll still support him. What else can I do?

I was srtongly for Hillary, but Obama won so I support him and will continue to do so.

I'm still not over the 2000 disaster and the Nader effect on it. I'm not going to pull for something similar to happen when that got us here in the first place.

I also believe that a primary challenge would mean a sure loss in '12.

It's all about the lesser evil. Keeping the right wing Republican out.

But the sense of dread and doom is overwhelming. They are on their way to a victory, and I see less and less in Obama the strength, or even the willingness to stop them.

[reggie the dog]

317. stop with your nader effect crap

nader got as many votes as browne the libertarian, gore lost because of cheating, the supreme court decided that w was president before the recount which would have confirmed gore's victory was completed. nader has nothing to do with this. many people that voted nader were not democrats and would not have gone to vote for a democrat!

[lunamagica]

379. Nader was a factor, deal with it. So no, I will NOT stop telling the truth

[reggie the dog]

414. what truth?

do you blame nader for gore's loss or the outright fraud carried out by w's brother and the supreme court? but ok, rather than look at the crooks who fixed the election you prefer to badmouth one of the best consumer advocates the usa ever had...

[lunamagica]

437. The truth I lived back then. Arguing with morons who parroted

Nader's dishonest stance that Gore and Bush were the same. Your precious Nader took campaign money from the Gop and helped to bring Gore down. The election could have never been stolen had it not been so close.

[reggie the dog]

448. harry browne

must have taken money from the democrats to help them bring down the gop then too right....

[sabrina 1]

416. Since Gore won, Nader nor anything else the voters did was a factor.

The election was stolen by the five felons on the SC.

But if you want to blame voters, because that IS who you are blaming, blame the hundreds of thousands of Democrats who voted for Bush.

This blame Nader nonsense has to have been started by those attempting to cover up the treasonous crime committed by the SC who interfered with an election and snatched victory from Gore, handing it to Bush.

[lunamagica]

441. And blame Nader, and his voters. Being here in Fl, telling

them that this was no the state nor the time to "send a message" to the Democrats just to get "There's no difference between Bush and Gore". Nader did a lot, A LOT of harm back then, so he deserves blame.

[bluestate10]

477. Nader must take responsibility for all that has happened bad, but he won't.

How over sized an ego the man has.

[defendandprotect]

518. The GOP stole the election ... but it's convenient for them that you think otherwise ....

:rofl:

[sabrina 1]

478. Wrong, voters votes are not owned by anyone. Nader legally

ran and voters who voted for him voted legally. The over 300,000 Democrats who voted for Bush, also voted legally.

The fact that Gore won means none of that harmed Gore at all.

What is odd about those who continue to make the ludicrous claim that voters and candidates acting legally was the problem, is that they completely ignore the ILLEGAL and treasonous interference of the SC which was the actual cause of Bush's 'winning'.

Not to mention the stolen votes and all the other actions taken by the Bush gang, the removal of minorities from voter lists etc. You have to wonder at the out of proportion anger at people acting legally while giving a pass to the corrupted system that plagues the elections in this country, but mostly the lack of anger at the SC. It is simply incomprehensible and completely irrational misdirected anger. No wonder election fraud once again handed a second election to Bush. I'm sure the Bush gang was happy to see the anger directed away from their criminal activities. I wouldn't be surprised if they were the ones pushing the false claim that Nader was the cause of Bush's theft of the election.

Nader was not a factor in 2004 either. So who do you blame for that? The SC along with an army of Bush cohorts was the reason for him 'winning' in 2,000. Nader had nothing to do with it. You cannot be blamed for something that was a travesty of justice when you were not a part of the illegalities. It's simply ridiculous to keep making that claim.

[defendandprotect]

517. GOP stole the election ... beginning with Jon Ellis/Fox and the recall of Florida ....

and ending with the GOP-sponsored fascist riot which STOPPED the vote counting

mandated by the Florida State Supreme Court -- there were 180,000 votes still

uncounted. They were being manually counted.

The SC stepped in to stop the recount and to award the election to Bush.

Gore actually won the election, including in Florida, no matter how the votes are

counted.

Nader had nothing to do with Bush's alleged "537 vote" win!!

Though I'm always intrigued at how the few remaining "Nader did it!" posters

confirm that the exact 537 votes which gave Bush his alleged win were votes that

Nader stole, and NOT 537 of the 3,000+ votes taken by Buchanan via the butterfly ballot?

Or that those "537" votes votes weren't part of the 300,000 votes by "Democrats" in Florida

who voted for Bush?

Or one of the tens of thousands of votes cast for other third parties in the Florida

election?


You were given Nader as a scapegoat because the Democratic Party hate Nader for criticizing

them -- but MAINLY because they wanted to hide the reality of their failures --

Gore's miserable campaign -- after the election, Gore left the DLC .... it was the DLC

which had given him the poor advice to avoid populist subjects in his speeches!

Neither Gore nor Democratic leadership protested the election -- nor ever filed a suit

vs the purging of registered voters by the GOP which took 50,000 Democrats off the rolls

in Florida. Guess that had nothing to do with any of the "537" votes you're claiming

Nader stole?

To this day, Democrats have done nothing about computer voting steals -- they treat it as

a taboo subject and don't want Democrats discussing it ... Why? Because they say if

they discussed it Democrats would get the idea that our elections aren't honest and they

wouldn't come out to vote!!??


Of course, the GOP is also happy that you think Nader STOLE the election and not them!!


:eyes:

[laughingliberal]

83. How about if he just said he would continue to work for policies that help the American people?

That would work just fine. Of course, I'm waiting for him to find some common ground with the Democrats.

Cat Food Commission is deadlocked but I'm sure we'll see a push to adopt their austerity measures coming out of Congress. And the President has already said 'we' have to make tough choices. Of course by 'we' he means 'us.'

[roguevalley]

251. I expect him to be a dem and some of us on this board are

old enough to remember what that meant and we know it when we don't see it and when we do. Remember that when he caves and allows the fat asshats in this country to parasite our country to death with the tax cuts because he will and that will be the last straw.

[Number23]

50. Please stop. Please. I am begging you.

You seem like such a lovely, warm person. Please stop believing every lie you read on this web site.

[JTFrog]

67. Facts are invisible here.

Obama just confirmed after the Pentagon's review that he wants to end DADT. He called on the Senate to get to work ASAP on legislation repealing the ban on gays serving in the military so he could sign it "this year." A thread about this is slowly sinking in LBN.

:shrug:

[Number23]

79. Doesn't surprise me in the least

People think that they can tear down everything the Dems are working for (good or bad, right or wrong), and then they sit open-mouthed with wonder why they have so little power and no one smart and/or credible wants to align themselves with them.

It would be funny if it weren't indicative of something far more serious and more than a little scary.

[StarsInHerHair]

162. I think this is a false meme injected by the soon-to-be-NeoCons

as they left the Dems & went into the GOP. He had overwhelming support from voters across the spectrum. I ignore the msm.

[reggie the dog]

320. that is a good thing

but has noting to do with economics, a court case already said it was a basic civil liberties issue. had obmam's justice dept not appealed then dadt would have been gone already.

[JTFrog]

438. And would have been sent on to the current Supreme Court.

You somehow think that would have turned out to be a good thing?

This way he's going to end it for GOOD.

[reggie the dog]

461. it will be sent to the supreme court

because obama's justice department appealed it!! how else would it have ended up before the supreme court?

[defendandprotect]

519. Obama permitted this to go on for two years -- and exerted no leadership over it ....

and then appealed the recent ruling stopping DADT --

Congratulations if he has since done what you say -- Congratulations!!

About time!!

Was it wise to let this hang over for two years -- causing the misery it does

for those in service who are constantly expelled and harassed?

Was it wise to let it continue as a Republican wedge issue?

Obama rarely assumes a leadership role -- basically, I think, because he really

doesn't support a liberal agenda --

as we see he is more often backing a right wing agenda.

[YOY]

75. That's just what she did.

n.t.

[Dr.Phool]

80. I think she did. Thus, the change.

[Smashcut]

427. She should only believe whitehouse.gov, not "the lies"

Got it.

:rofl:

[whathehell]

57. That's precisely what he is...and those who say otherwise probably are not old enough to remember

a democratic president before Clinton...another "R-Lite".

Thom Hartmann said it correctly...Obama is probably more conservative than Dwight Eisenhower...Eisenhower was a "liberal" by today's standards.

[NorthCarolina]

54. The proof is in the pudding. nt

[fascisthunter]

77. he sure acts like a republican

[Name removed]

21. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[monmouth]

23. Dear Peg, spot on! Where do I turn in my pom-poms....n/t

[Carolina]

28. Obama showed us

his true colors when he took office and chose Rahm, Geithner, Summers, Duncan, etc. This latest, freezing pay raises for federal workers, is just another wound to working people from a DINO POTUS.

Obama is truly the worst. At least with Bush we knew we were getting screwed, but words fail to describe my loathing for Obama's deficit reduction ideas, his back peddling on campaign promises (public option), his continued coddling of repukes and their ideas, his empty speechifying and I'll say it again -- his choice of inner circle members...

Let TSA scan and frisk him!

I will not support him 2012 and to all flamers here, spare me any Potus Palin remarks.

[DimplesinMI]

257. He lost me today.....Permanently

When he decided (or either his speech-writer BUT regardless, HE READ IT) that 15 minutes of talking about compromising with Repukes on Tax Cuts -that will ADD to the 13.7 trillion dollar deficit, to the tune of $700 Billion megabucks; was MORE IMPORTANT then fighting about the passing unemployment extension legislation. Three FREAKING sentences....just three...a total of less than a minute....was all that American's Unemployment Job Seekers where worth, on President Obama's lips today.

President Obama needs to GO!! Period!

I fight, write and advocate everyday for the unemployed. We cannot continue to tell this group to "suck it up" when parents and individuals are trying to find whatever way they can to keep the HEAT on this winter and FOOD on the table.

Since, President Obama's family is not suffering....I guess three sentences on the jobless was all he could muster up!

[WillyT]

30. My Dear Peggy...

You ain't a kiddin.

:shrug:

:loveya:

:hi:

:kick: & R !!!

[Ken Burch]

33. Don't mourn...ORGANIZE!!!

We have to take our party back.

[Canuckistanian]

140. I think that's the best advice of all

Show up at your local Dem meeting. Speak your mind. Get yourself on a committee.

This can't happen without REAL participation.

[NuttyFluffers]

486. ORGANIZE! needs repeating. after tears, stand back up & fight. ORGANIZE!

very important.

[blondeatlast]

36. Peggy, I wanted to believe--and did--right up until yesterday.

I know that somehow, McCain would have made things even worse, but there was so much promise in Obama. I'm just sick.

[bluedigger]

41. I'm pretty disillusioned as well, CaliforniaPeggy.

He told us he was going to drive the bus out of the ditch, but he's abandoned it, and it's up on blocks and being stripped of its parts by the ones who put it there.

[Number23]

45. Are you serious?

"He is becoming a gift for the Republicans."

The same Republicans who have voted against every DAMN piece of legislation he has put forth? Who have held up or done their hardest to deny every single appointment this president has tried to put through? Who have created an unprecedented environment of disrespect and obstruction?

GET AWAY FROM DU. The stuff you're reading here is skewed towards -- God only knows. Read the REAL news. Get a real perspective. Inform yourself and do not allow yourself to be led by people who are trying their hardest to create an echo chamber of hatred for this president, the Dem Party and its leaders.

This is not hard.

[slay]

144. He's a gift to Republicans because he won't fight back and he won't fight for us

AND he enacts and supports many of their policies (like most of the patriot act and warrant-less wiretaps and now a freeze on federal pay). Did he ever once bring up single-payer during the so called "health care reform"? He just threw it out the window, didn't even use it to bargain with. If you don't understand why we are not happy with Obama, re-read this entire thread. If you still don't get it, well, can't do much about that - sorry.

[Number23]

155. People can be unhappy about alot of things. Doesn't make any of it smart or true

[slay]

219. Everything I posted is true

and for you to say - or imply - that i'm not smart is not cool - you don't know me - so i suggest we end this right here.

[Number23]

449. Considering you started this when I replied to the OP and not you, ending this is fine with me.

[mdmc]

270. read the news?

?

[xiamiam]

290. here is the real news

in the spring of 2009..obama had the opportunity to stem the foreclosure crisis by reinstating the bankruptcy bill which had been in place from the depression until 2005..it was attached to the stimulus..he caved and abandoned the bill..he then created a help for homeonwers program which is ineffective..the foreclosure tide could have been stemmed at least..he threw his long time mentors bill, dick durbin, under the bus immediately..that was my first eye opener

the second was one year ago when i watched him deliver the afghanistan surge speech..i had heard that exact speech from bush..almost word for word ..terror terror terror..i sat here with my jaw dropped

no war crimes or war profiteers indicted..no banksters fraudsters indicted..

that was enough..everything else is par for the course...

the housing market is about to take another nosedive ..all of those people in loan modification limbo are about to be in the streets as they ramp up the rejections..

stop pretending and attempting to justify inaction ..it is insulting

we need a leader ..we dont have one..i'm over the shock of it although it is not easy and heartbreaking

[Number23]

443. So, is this post supposed to represent the "news?"

This is poorly editorialized, incomprehensible rubbish. No wonder you feel so at home here.

[defendandprotect]

524. K&R for your post .. but didn't know that heart-breaking bit of info ....

in the spring of 2009..obama had the opportunity to stem the foreclosure crisis by reinstating the bankruptcy bill which had been in place from the depression until 2005..it was attached to the stimulus..he caved and abandoned the bill..he then created a help for homeonwers program which is ineffective..the foreclosure tide could have been stemmed at least..he threw his long time mentors bill, dick durbin, under the bus immediately..that was my first eye opener

The first days that Obama picked his team, I knew something was very wrong --

and it's been downhill from there --

The question I'm asking now re Obama is: "How does Obama sleep at night?"


I don't think I've actually listened to a presidential candidate's speech nor president speak since

JFK -- I will read text, however. Interesting to read your observations on Obama's "surge" speech!

[Dappleganger]

47. I know that feeling, Peg...

it was so hard to acknowledge what was really happening, but at some point in time the facts just glare at you in the face.

:hug:

We'll never give up, and we need to continue to fight for the working people and the poor. ;)

[ProSense]

48. Nothing this President has done

is remotely close to what a Republican would do. The fact that people disagree with some of his policies does not make him a Republican.

He inherited a mess created by Republicans and Democrats alike. He has got a lot to untangle and fix, and its not going to be easy.

People need to stop reacting to every decision he makes as if it's the end of the world. He proposed a federal wage freeze because everyone elses, in the excutive branch and Congress, is frozen. People around the country have seen their wages frozen or cut.

A wage freeze is better than a hiring freeze, which is what Boehner and Republicans are promoting. A hiring freeze could pass (after January) with the help of conservative Dems. Frankly, the backlash to the wage freeze is a perfect counter to the Republicans' plan.

In states around the country, public employees are being furloughed or laid off. Retaining jobs and additional opportunities are much better options.

[Name removed]

64. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[northernlights]

119. you're right. even the Republicans wouldn't have dared

to declare the right to assassinate American citizens without due process, based on suspician. He trumped even W and Cheney with that one.

[PassingFair]

321. Or successfully be able to gut Social Security.

Guess I'll be working at McDonald's until
I'm 69....

We would NEVER have let the 'pukes get away
with this, but we are NOT LOYAL DEMS if we
criticize this bunch for robbing Social Security.

[defendandprotect]

521. Thanks for the reminder .... !

Wow!!

[Marr]

230. You describe a difference of degree, not type.

Looking at Obama's work so far, it's clear that he accepts the standard conservative worldview, that economies are fueled from the top down, and the top 1% must be catered to. Everything else is just style and window dressing. The example you cited is a perfect one- a wage freeze instead of a hiring freeze. Same direction, just moving at a different speed.

[stevenleser]

291. Many people in the private sector had their wages frozen too. There is a deficit and a recession

going on. It's clear people are not factoring that into their thinking.

[defendandprotect]

520. No ... Obama inherited a mess created by those he took into his administration ....!!!

Did Obama FREEZE Congressional salaries?

Or maybe Congressional benefits?

Federal workers had nothing to do with the meltdown of the economy --

Geithner, Summers, Bernanke and Paulson did -- they not only created it they profitted

from it -- and then they followed through in preventing sufficient remedies to it --

rather moving us into the largest financial coup ever pulled off!!

And coincidentally, those federal workers are also UNIONIZED --

Additionally, it is these illegal and immoral wars which are bankrupting our Treasury --

Democrats were elected in '06 to end the war!

[lunatica]

52. I know how you feel but it's still possible that things could change

I don't hold out much hope for it, but just today President Carter visited President Obama and urged him to be more independent. You never know, maybe Obama needs to hear it from another President.

[defendandprotect]

522. And what are we supposed to do with the last two years ... the loss of universal

health care because of Obama back room deals with Big Pharma and private HC industry

in a betrayal of the American public?

Are we supposed to think that Obama's heart and soul are going to shift in the next day

or two?

Or are you saying that Obama just wasn't prepared to be a Democratic president?

And, maybe overnight he'll figure it out?

:eyes:

[TK421]

55. I hear you Peggy, loud and clear...and I know where you're coming from

I gave this man my vote because I thought he would be different than other politicians...I was wrong

[muffin1]

56. K&R n/t

[HughBeaumont]

58. Obama isn't a progressive and neither is this country.

Too many people are uneducated and poisoned by the M$M. We blame politicians without focusing on the real culprits of this nation's ills - the corporations and the wealthy that run them.

[Bobbieo]

60. I'm with you dear Peggy! Such a letdown!

[Raine]

62. I feel exactly like you do

we have no one that we can trust to work for us. :-(

[laughingliberal]

63. K & R. And I know it hurts like hell. Happened for me during the health care debate. nt

[Name removed]

65. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[leftstreet]

68. K&R

It's always a pleasure to see you post, because you post from the heart

[City Lights]

72. I hear you, CaliforniaPeggy.

I honestly don't know what to say anymore. I'm so disappointed. :-(

All I can do is offer a :hug:.

[YOY]

73. Hurts like hell, don't it?

You are not alone. Rest easy in that.

Glad you woke up Peggy.

[amborin]

76. K&R everyone is sick at heart

[aquamarina]

78. I agree with you CaliforniaPeggy, oh do I agree with you.

He is so wrapped up in being bi-partisan that he no longer tries to simply do the right thing. Healthcare is a perfect example. No one I know likes health care as it currently works through private insurance - and neither did he (once upon a time). So instead of focusing on doing the right thing - public option, single payer - he went for bi-partisanship and look and what we got - a continuation of the same private insurers who care not one iota about yours or my health. We are nothing more than an opportunity to make money off of our illnesses.

I know this is extreme but I swear I think if republicans tried to bring back slavery he would capitulate for the sake of bipartisanship.

I seriously don't know what to think of him. I do know that as of today, he has not earned my vote for 2012. And I am sick of hearing how bad it would be under a McCain presidency. We all know just how awful it would be. All I am saying and what I'm hearing from you is how utterly disappointing this man, who campained on hope and change, has turned out to be.

[grasswire]

455. wage slavery is slavery

And I'm sure that members of the black community are suffering disproportionately to whites. As usual.

[Dont_Bogart_the_Pretzel]

84. Just think if we didn't have any Bluedog democrats...

we would not be in the mess where in now.

[HowHasItComeToThis]

211. CORRECT

[roguevalley]

252. he should have done what Johnson did and kicked their ass.

[Owl]

85. K&R

[MrsCorleone]

86. Agree with Wrath above.

You're marinating in media BS here online. Read reputable sources. Go talk to people in the real world.

[Bluebear]

228. Nonsense. Real people here are suffering.

[inna]

249. LOL. Total, utter fail. :facepalm:

kick and rec for Peggy's OP, of course.

[MrsCorleone]

421. But, of course!

Your sentiment is of no surprise to me! :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[Amerigo Vespucci]

87. This isn't what we signed up for...period.

It's not the platform he ran on, either. The difference between the way the country is being run right now and teh way it was being run under George W. Bush is that Obama smirks less. That's about it.

Wall Street's happy. The banks are happy. The "have mores" are happy. The men and women of the American working class...what's left of them...are bleeding like stuck pigs.

And somehow, that's off Obama's radar. Or it's on there and he just doesn;t care. Wither way, it's not what we signed up for.

:patriot:

[Dr.Phool]

88. Good luck Peg.

It's going to be tough, but opening your eyes can be a very liberating experience. No more making excuses for someone, and having that gnawing feeling in your gut, that somehow something just isn't right.

[mix]

92. K&R nt

[tavalon]

95. Shit

If he's lost CaliforniaPeggy, he's lost the nation. This is not tongue in cheek. The only person I would be more shocked to see such a post from would be FrenchieCat.

[WillyT]

160. + 1,000,000,000... What You Said !!!

:wow::wow::wow:

[Lorien]

409. I said the same about my dad. He gave thousands of his fixed income to Obama

and would just about blow a blood vessel if anyone said anything less than complementary about him. He acted as if the man was America's savior. Now he can't even stand to listen to him speak. He feels deeply betrayed, as do many of us.

[cwydro]

479. Well everyone in my family voted for him.

Including my Republican mom and dad, both in their 80's.

Dad is the only one still defending him.

None of us will vote for him again.

[gateley]

507. I haven't seen FrenchieCat around in a while, have you? And I agree. nt

[Little Star]

96. You are not alone.

[HCE SuiGeneris]

99. Whether by his own volition, or through the pressure from the smoky back rooms,

the decision to surround himself with people like Summers, Geithner, Gates, and Vilsack has effectively voided the agenda promised in in his pre-election rhetoric.

[CaliforniaPeggy]

101. Exactly right.

There might be other reasons, but those people are certainly part of the problem.

[HCE SuiGeneris]

105. I fear for the fate of our country as well, Peggy

I wish us all a better future than is unraveling , and I'm sorry for the harshness that is emanating from some of the other responses to your concern.

[CaliforniaPeggy]

123. Not to worry...

I'm not taking them personally.

I think I just might be getting a slightly thicker skin.

I did hesitate before posting this; I thought it could get ugly. There's arguments both ways, and a lot of healthy debate, and I approve.

Thanks, sweetie...

[Dinger]

363. Don't Fotget arne duncan

He's almost single-handedly lost the teachers' vote.

[defendandprotect]

523. But Obama picked Arne Duncan and has been praising him for privatizing public education!!!

Rahm just went off to privatize Chicago schools if he wins election there --

You think Obama just happens to pick people who are destroying our economy and

public education and our best chance yet for universal health care by accident???

This is essentially about an attack on teachers, their salaries, their standing in our

communities -- their influence on children and the curriculum -- and THEIR UNIONS!!!

It is a rightward shift in public education in America by privatizing it -- and moving

again our tax dollars into support for private interests -- which basically work against

the nation's interests!

[callous taoboy]

128. You left out Duncan. Takes a teacher to always point that out.

[HCE SuiGeneris]

164. Agreed.

His stank permeates the air as well. Unfortunately, there are quite a few others carried over from the Reagan era...

*Heavy Sigh*

[Overseas]

428. I just wish the corporate perspective had not been so distorted over the past few decades.

They are so focused on quarterly profits now that they can't be appealed to when things get as far out of balance now as they were in the late 20's. They don't seem to care about restoring our long-term economic health.

The middle class and poor needed a real boon like Medicare for All. I just wish my Democratic leaders could have replied to their corporate advisors that -- You've got to give me something big for the middle class and poor. They're being evicted from their homes and bankrupted by medical expenses. We need a big benefit to rebalance our economy. Give us that, at least.

Wish the corporate powers had some modicum of rationality left. Plunder and hoard forever is not a great strategic plan. Yet we're being bullied in that direction.

Democratic rebalancing of our increasingly plutocratic economy was really necessary after the Bush Crash, millions crossed party lines to vote for it. We need bigger moves in that direction, not more slashing of the budgets for compassion for the poor and unemployed.

[TexasObserver]

100. recommend

[Texasgal]

104. Jesus Peggy!

Obama is NOT a freaking republican!

Has he done things that have sucked? Yeah.. who hasn't? Where are you going to find an your very own idealogical president? I'll answer... NOWHERE.

[Jack Sprat]

108. The joke is on us, Peg

and the DNC, DLC, and Obama himself is laughing at how they sucked so many in.

[uponit7771]

109. *****OBAMA PROMISE METER AT > 90% KEPT!!!!***** Another bs Obama bashing post

[Name removed]

139. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[slay]

151. It's what he hasn't done that is a large part of the problem

He could have condemned the war in Afghanistan - and I already know what you're going to say - but he campaigned on focusing war on Afghanistan - maybe so but that still doesn't make it right. We are wasting lives and money that we do not have - every day in a pointless war - the same war that bankrupted the Soviet Union - only we've been there longer - and he escalated that war. How very much the war-mongering Democrat of him.

Need someone to cover-up the war crimes of Bush/Cheney - Obama's your man!

If you really can't see why we are unhappy then you're not very in tune with the things Obama has NOT done - like standing up for single-payer in the "healthcare reform" - oh wait yeah that's right he wouldn't even talk about it - might as well have been a 4 letter word to him. We deserve better, this country deserves better - and I think deep down you know it.

[uponit7771]

286. It's been less than 2 fuckin years!! GOD DAMN!!!

[slay]

415. Yeah it's amazing the amount of damage he's done in only 2 years isn't it? And don't yell at me.

or more correctly - the possibilities he has squandered and wasted. and why do you only type topics with no message? If you don't want to discuss anything uponit7771, please stop replying to my posts. EOM.

[Number23]

172. Thank you. And here's what ACTUAL Republicans are doing

"Senate GOP letter calls for blocking most bills"
WASHINGTON – Senate Republicans intend to block action on virtually all Democratic-backed legislation unrelated to tax cuts and government spending in the current postelection session of Congress, officials said Tuesday, adding that the leadership has quietly collected signatures on a letter pledging to carry out the strategy.
http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5iUcVCaOccjaIuG0kWbNerQsBRoyA?docId=3d1d3fae7cc542db8172f9c18c7144f6


Yes, he is such a damn gift to the Republicans that they are doing EVERYTHING THEY CAN to get him out of office and prevent him from passing even the most insignificant legislation. The clueless and the stupidity around here are just too much at times.

[stevenleser]

295. Yup, but it is instructive in a way.

It's OK, these folks will learn. They will learn just like those Nader voting Greens who are more level headed learned after 2000. As I like to say, "If you think there is no difference (or not a big enough difference) between Democrats and Republicans, or a particular Democrat and Republicans, the Republicans will happily prove you wrong at the next opportunity."

[PassingFair]

325. Oh, there's a difference. It's just a bullshit choice:

[GoCubsGo]

114. Join the club.

After watching KO tonight, I have pretty much given up an hope of this country getting fixed. Just when I thought I couldn't get more disappointed and disheartened...

[WillyT]

115. Hey Peg... Get Load Of THIS !!!

Link: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x9660340

:wtf:

:banghead:

:beer:

[Octafish]

117. ...I'd have voted for one.

From wars without end to welfare for Wall Street, we've been thinking the same thing, CaliforniaPeggy.

[Boudica the Lyoness]

121. He made a fool out of me

It's like once he became president, he found out who really runs this country.

[TheKentuckian]

124. It is easiest to see with open eyes. I was a lemming once upon a time too.

Obama is a global corporatist that agrees with the Republicans 80% (or more it seems).

The 80% is his number, not mine.

[HarveyDarkey]

125. He's a politician

his only goal is to be reelected.

[Atticus]

127. Ma'am, I believe that your well-deserved reputation for being a kind and thoughtful

person is what have some here so upset this evening.

"If even Peggy is troubled about how this adminstration is performing, some of the 'fence-sitters' are bound to be influenced! We'd better react vigorously or, before you know it, others will be asking some of the same questions!"

Many here share your concern and admire your integrity and decency.

Carry on, "my dear California Peggy."

[CaliforniaPeggy]

130. Thank you so much, my dear Atticus...

What a lovely thing to say!

I spoke from my heart...

:hug:

[Autumn]

131. Hugs to you Dear Peggy,

it hurts to find out you have been hoodwinked. I know.

[Skittles]

134. we tried to warn you

many of us did

[DainBramaged]

147. Yes, even those of us who could never pass the purity test!

:hi:

[slay]

136. I totally understand how you feel

cause I feel the same way. Did the same things. I think we're being played and I don't like where things are headed. If Obama does not start acting like the president of this country in a positive and forceful manner i believe we will SERIOUSLY have to have open, frank discussions on this board of who we would like to draft to run against him for the Dem nomination in 2012. We're getting another 2 years of him regardless, but do we really want to make it 6? My answer at this point is NO.

And are the Dems as a whole too corrupt, too big a group of pushovers/corporatists to continue to support - that's the bigger question - which i will leave for another time. Sigh... :( :hug:

[alarimer]

149. I think he is actually a conservative.

Not a right-winger necessarily but certainly no progressive, that is clear.

Typical lying politicians who says one thing (that he doesn't believe) to get elected but shows his true colors once in office.

[jotsy]

152. You trust in you Miss Peg!

The truth of whatever lies ahead waits there. Nothing either of us can do about that but be ready.

http://www.ilsr.org/

The idea of you heartsick and sad is not a happy thought for me. :hug:

RECOMMENDED

[bertman]

153. Peggy, your big, caring heart will eventually heal. Just don't give up on our

democratic ideals. You have plenty of good company among those of us who figured it out a while back and are now working to push a true progressive agenda.

Peace.

[StarsInHerHair]

157. I too get scared, for awhile just after Obama was sworn in

I could finally sleep again. I started having difficulties after W stole into office, too many nightmares, too many really bad things coming to pass. Obama needs to be "monster strong" and get the Progressive achievements done.

[somone]

159. Obama is a genius

for keeping people guessing whether (1) he would make a great customer for a used car salesman or (2) he would make a great used car salesman.

Either scenario is not good.

[donheld]

161. Right there with you Peggy

It's very sad and frightening.

[CreekDog]

167. I thought he would show the fight he had when he beat Hillary

Back when he was running to her left.

Neither of these things seems to be in evidence with him as president.

I'm disappointed too.

[myrna minx]

173. He knows how to fight other Dems, union workers, teachers and the democratic base,

just not republicans.

I feel like such a fool for falling for the hope and change bs.

[steve2470]

169. I wish he was a lot more feisty with the Republicans

I hope one day he can thoroughly lay out his reasoning on why he has not been more feisty.

[DeSwiss]

170. K&R n/t

[The Hitman]

171. This is depressing.

I thought this was DEMOCRATIC underground, "not fight with other Democrats" underground.
I'm all for spirited debate but the way this community is turning out is making me reconsider posting here.

OBAMA, a Republican? GET REAL.

[DimplesinMI]

258. He sure is heck not a Democrat

Not even a moderate Democrat, like myself. Nothing that he has done lately identify with me.

Believe it or not, I even took the health care failure with a cautioned heart. BUT, as a fiscal conservative (yeah, this is what makes me a moderate), when you believe that negotiating with Republicans on Tax Cuts that will add $700 trillion dollars to a 13.7 BILLION dollar deficit, is MORE IMPORTANT than giving 2 Million Job Seeking Americans (on a average) $296 dollars a week to live off of, that only adds $56 Billion dollars to the same deficit....yeah, you lost me.

President Obama is a moderate Republican at best. He is certainly not a Democrat in ANY FORM!

[The Hitman]

Riiiiiiiiight

http://www.whatthefuckhasobamadonesofar.com/

Just like Dub-ya.

[creon]

445. Got it in one.

pretty sad.
It is hard to figure at times. But, people are the prisoner of their passions.

[GoCubsGo]

278. No, what is depressing is seeing him cave to the republcians all the time.

And, what's even more depressing is seeing the likes of Boehner and Cantor and McConnell going out there and acting like they run the place. It makes me want to vomit.

[OhioBlue]

401. That is definitely a depressing thing about DU

it has become more of a "fight with other Democrats" or "complain about Democrats" board than anything else.

[creon]

446. true

I agree. It certainly seems to be that way.

Sad, really

[creon]

447. true

I agree. It certainly seems to be that way.

Sad, really

[RetroLounge]

174. “If I’ve lost Cronkite, I’ve lost America.” - LBJ

“If I’ve lost California Peggy, I’ve lost America.” - Obama

I'm right with you on this one....

RL

[DesertFlower]

175. i had so much hope. i donated to his

campaign too.

right now he's got a big problem with the tax cuts. i know he doesn't want them to go up on the middle class, but i'd rather they do then keep rewarding the rich. i'll pay a few hundred more in tax. it won't hurt me, but there are others who it will hurt.

maybe just let them all expire -- then in january propose a new tax cut for the middle class which the republicans will say no to.

i don't have the answers. i too am sick at heart.

[farmboxer]

176. Obama Thinks Republicans Put Him Into Office

or so is appears........... Always wants to please Repubs! I am sick over this.

[liberation]

189. No, he knows damn well who put him in office in 08...

... he however knows who he wants to put him in office in 2012.

I think he is under the delusion that he will carry the center-right next time, for such a smart man he really is mistriangulating this one. Pity.

[Poll_Blind]

190. Yup. Ride the Left into office, surf the Center into a second term. n/t

PB

[Lorien]

411. He won't run again. He's already hinted at it.

His work for the elite will have been completed. They'll have our SS and their permanent tax cuts, Obama will have his seat at the Carlyle Group.

[Recursion]

307. He's under the impression they are a third of the country

And so are we, and that the middle third can lean either way and currently leans right.

And he's under the impression that one way or the other we have to find some at least broad consensus on what to do about our problems.

And he's right on both counts.

[Greyhound]

178. K&R for more of that "change".

I'm so sorry that those we trusted have chosen to betray us. Some of the more cynical among us, myself included, fully expected this, but even we hoped that we were would be proved wrong.

Just watching him crawl on his belly pleading for some cooperation, as I just saw on Maddow's show. makes me disgusted and angry anymore. She tried to put a face of some dignity on it, but it too pathetic to view any other way.
:kick: & R

[russspeakeasy]

179. I spent 18 hours on the phone bank, donated and solicited

contributions (a little over $1800)...for a man who said what
I wanted to hear and believed he was what this country needed.
I am sickened by his caving to the repubs and to blue dogs..H







$1800 in donations.
This could very be the last time I vote for, or work for any
presidential nominee.

I am disgusted by the capitulation of a man who had the
potential and opportunity to set us on the right course.
What we got instead was bogus health care reform, watered down
financial regulations, long boring lectures about the
"process" and no apparent ability to communicate
with the middle class.

I see his leadership skills as middling and on some issues,
non-existent,

The last act for me will be if he extends the Bush tax cuts
for the wealthy.
. 
To date, I have not been active against him, but I could be.









th   

[defendandprotect]

216. My son worked for Dean ... and gave a lot of money to him....

after what they did to Dean he hasn't voted since!!

I think everyone here at DU needs their BS meters turned waaaaay higher!!

Remember -- these are politicians -- and most of them pre-bribed and pre-owned by

the corporations whose control we are trying to fight against.

Corporations are now replacing sovereign governments!!


:)

[Swamp Rat]

180. I know what you mean, jellybean

:hug:

[tblue]

184. More and more people say this EVERYDAY!!!!!!!

It used to be just a few of us. Does he have any idea how much we'd have his back?

[Bucky]

196. He's nothing at all like a Republican.

The only problem is that he's content to clean up the Republicans' messes. He's not going after the causes of the ills their policies do to society. So he's a centrist liberal, not a reformer. But even just by going into "clean up the mess" mode, he's done a lot of good. It's just that he could have done so much more.

We shoulda nominated Joe Biden. He wouldn't have lost the House.

[Skittles]

260. do NOT attach "liberal" anywhere NEAR his name

PLEASE

[piratefish08]

275. centrist Liberal??

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[Bluenorthwest]

333. 'Centrist liberal'? Is he also a 'tall short guy' and a 'fat thin man'?

What the fuck is a 'centrist liberal'? That is one of the most forced and absurd phrases I have ever heard used.

[Forkboy]

353. +1

:rofl:

[emulatorloo]

388. Pretty sure poster means "slightly left of center"

Which is how I characterized him during the primary. Based on his record in the Senate.

There is nothing "forced and absurd" about that concept.

[quinnox]

198. I'm not going to say I told you so, but Hillary was the best choice

Yes, I was a Hillary supporter, and she got a raw deal by the media which was in love with the Obama hype. Obama pulled the wool over the eyes of my fellow Dems, and now we are stuck with a weak and ineffective president.

Obama seems to be more worried about what the republicans want, and he has shown this tendency since day one.

An important quote from Mr. Obama - "I have rejected all kinds of things the Left wanted...." from an interview with Fox news when Obama was bragging about not giving in to what the liberals wanted on the Healthcare reform effort. This is his presidency in a nut shell straight from his own mouth.

Hillary would ave been much more hard nosed and wouldn't have given the disgusting republicans an inch, meanwhile Obama has given them lock stock and barrel, no questions asked.

I won't be responding to ANY comments to my post, it would waste my time, enough said.

[Hannah Bell]

222. no, she would have done more or less the same things. the pressure is coming from the money men,

not the people in the front positions.

her husband = telecom bill, welfare deform, free trade, & hypocrisy.

she would carry the same water.

don't care if you don't respond, the idea that hilary would have been some vast improvement is bullshit.

just different factions of the same power.

[Marr]

232. She was the other candidate declared "viable" by our corporate media.

She would've done the same thing. She's even in his cabinet-- c'mon.

[Recursion]

309. DLC-founding member Hillary Clinton?

The person who campaigned in the primaries on a bill with a mandate and no public option? (You don't move to the left from your primary position if you're a Democrat, as a hint.) Funny, that.

[Forkboy]

355. LOL

[ibegurpard]

491. pretty much

[TacticalPeek]

199. Heard that.

digby links to an interesting discussion about this on MSNBC The Last Word last week:

http://digbysblog.blogspot.com/2010/11/thanks-part-ii-chris-hayes-on-msnbc.html


(transcript - http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/40420571/ns/msnbc_tv/ )

ROGER HODGE: Well, I think the movement around him was real. I think people actually saw that there was a possibility there. But I think ultimately, he didn‘t care. He came in and he—once he got in, it was just like the door shut.

[sheldon]

200. A bit of truth to this?

[Swampguana]

201. I just wish things were different

I wish money didn't run everything

[girl_interrupted]

202. K&R Peggy I am as mystified as you are

Obama leaves me terribly confused. That Credit Card law for instance, it did nothing to help consumers, usury continues, and on top of that it now allows guns in National Parks. Banks can get as many bailouts as they need with taxpayer money, yet a consumer cannot get a decrease in interest rates, even with an excellent credit rating. I would have thought that President Obama would have fought for the passage of Senator Bernie Sanders credit card bill, but no, not a peep out of him. So what people see is, banks can get away with anything, but the consumers can't even get a fair shake . The Health Care bill....I have yet to meet anyone who can explain it fully, and so much of it goes into effect in 2014. No one can be denied insurance, we are told, yet there are no caps on what insurance companies can charge, so it looks like a lot of people are right back to where they started, if they can't afford it...they can't get it and if they can't get it, they are penalized. Very confusing. Sometimes it seems like the only ones benefiting are the pharmaceutical companies and the insurance companies, and I think a lot of people feel the President really didn't fight for more, like single payer or medicare for all. Or why Dr. Dean wasnt brought in when he had so much success with it, in his state. Instead he was treated like dirt while we cozied up to republicans.

This is just my opinion, but it seems a lot of things so many people are upset about, taxes, unemployment, etc has been co-opted by the teabaggers. In a lot of the blue states, we are being taxed to death, and lot of it goes to red states who take more in from the federal government...yet they don't seem to know it, or maybe they do and they just don't want to hear it. And I have yet to see one Democrat explain that to them. What I always hear is how, we have to settle, because the blue dogs won't go along. Yet when the republicans had the majority, they led a very tight ship, they got what they wanted. And here is where the question of leadership comes in...LBJ would kick anyones ass in his party to get them on board. I just don't see that with Obama and I don't understand why.

I was just thinking the other day of how in the 90's, the republicans wanted to shut down the federal government over increases in medicare and the minimum wage. Republicans had the majority then, yet President Clinton managed to get around them. And then I see this "cat food" commission, where one of the members called seniors "greedy" and he is allowed to remain. Seniors won't be getting any increases this year, yet there will be increases in what they have to pay to medicare. It all seems so unfair and it's like no one is standing up for them.

When President Obama spoke up about the Mosque in the WTC area, I find it hard to understand why he didn't bring up passing the health care bill for 9/11 workers, also. It's been 9 years and they are still waiting for help and some have already died. You would think that would just as important to mention, to really wake people up. Some are so offended by building of a Mosque, but not by workers who risked everything to help on 9/11 and the months that followed, being ignored. Would have been the perfect time to bring that to the publics attention. He didn't.

I don't know, so many of the remarks and actions directed toward liberals, gays, teachers, unions, yet we "must" show we are willing to get in bed with the republicans. At times, this is so discouraging, it hurts.

[defendandprotect]

203. Well, unite with the rest of us who have been "scared" and "sick at heart" ...

about Obama from his first rightward steps --

Takes courage to admit your scared like the rest of us and face the truth --

Neither did I vote for a Republican --

We have a huge liberal voting bloc --

and we need to be discussing what to do about all of this --



:grouphug:

[pam4water]

213. K&R

[Name removed]

224. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[CaliforniaPeggy]

225. You can say that...

It's helpful to make constructive criticism, though...

My post criticizes him, after all...

Welcome to DU!

I don't see him as a DINO.

However, to each his own.

[chowder66]

226. Wow

This is a depressing thread and it seems like people are dropping off like flies. Way to go!

Sorry to see the expectations shattered. Seriously....

But..for this democrat-The MSM, the Republicans, the teabaggers, the hard decisions, the hard compromises, the hard work, the drive to set right the political process/civility and fail (due to the Republicans) will NOT deter me. If you are disappointed with the stuff that hasn't been done then you are in for a big surprise because I am here to tell you this is how it is going to be. This is a cynical nation that loves to belittle the next to get some self worth or a rise out of someone or something.

I am disappointed in "the disappointed" within this party. Democrats are well known for eating their own. It's too hard for some, not for others and for that they or we get called worshipers, etc. Well if you must call me a name...please go ahead. I don't know you so it is just electronic scatter to me. Just as this post that I have written is.


The self defeating members of the democratic party are the gift that keeps on giving to the republicans and the republicans know exactly what to do with that. I'll bet some troll is hand delivering this right now. Pretty packaging and all.

If some here at DU can't dig deep to find enough worth supporting the Prez and/or the elected democratic members for, why in the world would anyone expect the BlueDogs, the Moderates, the Independents to do so? I think we need to get our house in order as well.


Ugh....I have more Obama/democratic worship to attend to.

[Lucian]

227. I told everyone here to vote for Kucinich during the Primaries.

But no one listened. We wouldn't be having this discussion right now if Dennis Kucinich was our President.

[Skittles]

259. hey! some of us knew what was going on

not many, but I KNEW

[Recursion]

306. No, we'd be asking why nothing got passed in the past two years

Kucinich couldn't change the rules of the Senate either.

[Bluebear]

229. "Chill the fuck out! He's got this!!!1"

:crazy:

As if those were words that would ever come out of his mouth. He certainly was packaged and sold well.

[tomm2thumbs]

234. 'packaged and sold well' - yup

very well indeed, and the 'actual ingredients' list was printed in a font too small to read

[BlueCaliDem]

233. I'm right there with you, Peggy. I feel you. I'm losing

faith in the President, too. He's becoming more and more of a Republican with each passing month.

I'm heartbroken as I watch this. Every single bill that would've benefited the average American, was defeated without much of a fight.

What can I say? I'm deeply heartbroken.

[akbacchus_BC]

245. Now you know how I felt! Was all agog with President Obama, he tried

in the beginning but now, not so much! A person who got elected and squandered it all, not a leader!

[DimplesinMI]

253. K/R for the TRUTH!!

[Major Hogwash]

254. We still love you California Peggy, even if you have doubts.

We're all in this together. The liberals and the conservatives all have to deal with the same problems. We all have to face the music and pay the piper eventually. We know the budget can't be balanced on the backs of the unemployed, or the sick, or the poor, or the elderly. That's why we are Democrats. Mainly, anyway, we view life through a political prism that calls for more equality, to be more fair, and to be more equitable.

However, over the course of time, and in this case the last 2 years, the conservatives in Congress and the rightwingers on the radio and tv, like Limbaugh and Beck, have all conspired to thwart any real change that Obama and the Democratic base wanted to implement. Obama has lost touch with the very progressive left wing of the Democratic party and has spent too much time compromising with the moderates, the Blue Dawgs, and the conservatives within our own party. It didn't work by reaching out to them. But, he had to try.

Because the alternative can always be done, at any time, pulling back and sticking to our guns and voting in lock step. Unfortunately, a lot of the Democrats that weren't willing to work with the President on accomplishing his goals have lost their seats in the House in the mid-term election and we will have to deal with a Republican House next year as a result.

President Obama has no other choice now but to stick to his guns if he is going to lead the nation towards his goals. He can't step back now and let the Republicans dictate policy and hope to accomplish anything he wants, or else he will wind up losing support from his own party. He may have lost all of the progressives from the far left already. But, he has to start pushing back against the onslaught of lies, rumors, and just pure hot air this next year or else he is going to lose the moderate middle of the Democratic party as well, and he will wind up facing a more liberal, more progressive candidate for his own job in 2012.

DADT will be thrown out. Maybe not this year, maybe not next year, but it is a doomed policy. And it will go the way of the Edsel. The fiscal irresponsibilty of the Republicans to demand tax cuts for the rich to increase the deficit, and the federal debt, is totally illogical in view of the size of present-day deficits and the increasing debt. The outsourcing of American jobs will have to stop or even the people who supported it will wind up out of work because their job can be done cheaper overseas, too. CEOs don't make multi-million dollar bonuses in India or in China!

I have doubts and worries, too. But, we must remember, we are mere mortals. President Obama can't do this by himself. He needs other Democrats to agree with his goals, and he needs them to see through all of the smoke and the haze that the Republicans and the Tea Party candidates are putting out there. We need more Congressmen like Rep. Alan Grayson who isn't afraid to tell the truth of what is going on in Washington, D.C.

So, in 2012, we need to get more people like Representative Grayson elected. We knew this wouldn't be easy, we knew this would take a fair amount of time. But, now is the time that we need to fight back and do what we can to help Obama accomplish his goals, what he said he wanted to do when we voted for him 2 years ago.

I can only give you a little hope this year that things will get better.
A little hope goes a long ways. Remember Rosa Parks and the struggles that she endured.
Because we aren't ever going to get in the back of the bus again. Ever.
Yet, look how long that struggle took to make right.
Heck, this has only been 2 years. We can make it better, we will make it better.
We are Democrats because we know that what we strive for is the right thing to do.

[spicegal]

261. I've wholeheartedly supported the president, but have to

say, I'm feeling completely disheartened. I keep waiting for him to show some real strength, a willingness to fight. When I look at what's on the table at the moment, the choices are obvious. How can anyone NOT make a case and fight for extending unemployment benefits, NOT extending tax cuts for the wealthiest Americans, repealing DADT, or ratifying the SALT treaty? The Republicans are on the wrong side of every issue for no other reason than they don't want to give Obama a victory. And rather than fight and use the bully pulpit, it just seems like he's rolling over.

[Richard Steele]

262. K&R

[Name removed]

263. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[indimuse]

264. I'm sorry...I have to agree with you..

except I wanted Hillary. Butsince he was our nominee and elected, I have been supportive... have defended him the past two years!I'm beginning to wonder..who's side is he on... WHO does he work for?? :(

(what is a signing statement again...??)

[old mark]

268. Peg, I posted similar feelings. I believed the hype about Obama being

"the most liberal Senator" and was very happy when the RWers called him " a very dangerous man"/ I supported and voted for Obama in the primaries and the GE, and I have given in to despair now - we seem to be giving up so much ground in only 2 years, I have no idea where we will be in 2012, but I am sure it won't be good.

mark

[democrank]

271. The truth can set you free.

[Vinca]

273. I agree entirely with your post and, worse yet, I think it's becoming

a bit of an embarrassment to have the POTUS come out and give one version of a meeting, then have the Party of No give their version. Version #1 - kumbayah. #2 - the President apologized to us for the snub.

[Name removed]

274. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[elocs]

281. As far as the "make me do it" line, that's bullshit. You do what is right because it is right,

not because somebody makes you do it. I expect much, much more than that. Leaders lead, they don't require being pushed.

There are many who are disappointed and sick at heart, but they are accused of supporting Republicans, being trolls, are told to shut up, or the ever popular DUism used to shut up people: "Thank you for your concern".

[MissDeeds]

Sadly, I agree

Our country is in free fall. Obama has not proven to be a strong Democratic leader, and we continue to move further and further to the right. I fear to think what two more years of timid leadership will bring.

I have read your posts for several years, Peggy, and know that you did not come to this point without much thought and reflection. It hurts to have to say that a Democratic president has let us down, but it is essential that we hold our leaders to the the highest standards. There is too much at stake to settle for less.

Thanks for your candor.

K&R

[BlueIris]

282. If I'd wanted a tool of the intelligence community/Pentagon to be president...

All I wanted was to avoid going to Iran. I thought there was only one candidate who would do that after getting the WH. Boy was I wrong, and boy do I feel stupid for believing that.

[PassingFair]

329. Hillary was SALIVATING to attack .... I mean OBLITERATE Iran...

so the Obama vote bought us at least 2 years on that one....

[Douglas Carpenter]

284. that's true but ANY non-Republican lite President or candidate will be completely marginalized

before they can even get off the ground. - And this has essentially been the case for the last few decades. No major party candidate since 1972 has actually run as a New Dealer. Even former Vice President Mondale - who was originally an old-style New Deal Democrat - by 1984 his actually campaign platform positions would have left 85% of Reaganism in tact.

Even globally none of the labor, social democratic, socialist or even communist parties around the Western democratic world actually are expanding social-democracy. They all are reversing the process albeit usually slower and more moderately than their right-wing counterpart.

It appears that New Deal and social-democratic policies were something that were allowed to flourish for a few decades post World War II - largely because the dual factors of expanding industrialization within Western economies and also as an alternative to Marxist economics. Capitalism for that brief time period required a liberal alternative. Once outsourcing to the third world with its much lower labor cost and lack of enforceable protections came to dominate global economy - and once the threat of a competing global economic order was neutralized - whatever leverage working class progressive interest had was largely stripped away and rabid speculation became the engine of Western economy. So even if a genuinely progressive candidate won running on a genuinely progressive platform and was elected along with a strong majority and a sympathetic Congress - given the power of capital and the threat of capital flight - I would doubt that they would actually be able to change courses beyond the cosmetic level.

Having said this, the right-wing alternative to this much watered down and weakened form of western liberalism is still far, far more reactionary.

I'm not too disappointed in Obama only because I already knew this and he is doing more or less what I expected. Only for brief moments following the collapse of October 2008 - did I have any hope that the power of capital might be sufficiently weakened enough to allow a return to progressive economics. But even then, I knew that was highly unlikely.

Expect power and wealth to continue to be transferred to the privileged, regardless who wins what elections. But try to keep in mind that those who think like the crazies on Fox News and who really do think Obama is a wild socialist are the only real viable alternative power base capable of actually obtaining and administering power. It's very depressing. But it is the sad reality of the world we live in today. At least for the foreseeable future, the class war is over and unrestrained power of global capitalism won.

[blindpig]

285. Reality is uncomfortable...

yet there is liberation when the scales fall from one's eyes.

[raouldukelives]

288. K&R

[PinkFloyd]

289. He hasn't surprised me at all.

Mainly because he was a noob at politics. Hillary would have been better because at least Hillary Clinton seemed to understand YOU CAN NOT WORK WITH PEOPLE WHO'S PRIMARY OBJECTIVE IS TO DESTROY YOU!!!!!! Obama bangs his head against that wall a zillion times and he'll still fall for it today. Then on top of all that, he kept so much of the former administration intact and everything about the Bush administration sucked.

Obama is the reason WE WILL have a Republican for president in 2012 and it'll probably be some extremist dip-shit like Palin too, which will be just like Bush with dimples and boobs.

[PassingFair]

330. Oh for F's sake, she voted for the IWR...how more "working with" the pukes does it take for you?

Jeez, born yesterday?

[GTurck]

292. To not be concerned...

is not to have paid attention. We too worked to get Obama into the White House. We too had hopes that the Bush years would be denounced and rectified. We too are afraid of where we are going and how we are getting there.
But mostly we are concerned that we worked for a better world for our grandchildren and will leave them instead at best rags of a democracy or worse a plutocracy where their choices will be to comply or to be made redundant.

[Ninga]

294. I sadly agree.

[Name removed]

293. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[blm]

298. I did, too. IMO, second-guessing himself is his problem, so he relies too heavily on former WH

personnel from Clinton years whose actual experience is in giving the corporate establishment what they want while prettying up the rhetoric to the progressives who are kept busy defending them from RW bullshit. Many of us never WANTED to go through that crap again, especially for so LITTLE progress in return.

[xchrom]

301. Recommend

[handmade34]

303. I'm with you CaliforniaPeggy

[kentuck]

308. Damn! It has come to this.

Who would have thunk it?

[LynneSin]

310. Fix it in 2 years? You think we can fix 8 years of Bush even in 4 years?

It will take at least a decade to fix these problems. They are so horrifying deep.

[tilsammans]

312. Indeed, a HUGE gift to the Republicans, . . .

. . . and yet they STILL hate him. :wtf:

[LibDemAlways]

326. They hate him for the color of his skin. It blinds them to all else. n/t

[Wednesdays]

319. Ask a Republican if he/she thinks Obama is a Republican...

especially those at Freeperville.

[ElsewheresDaughter]

322. you echo my thoughts and emotions

[Name removed]

323. Deleted message

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[MindandSoul]

331. I feel exactly the same way. . .I have kept hoping and defending Obama until

yesterday. Today, I am just sad and disapointed.
There was no reason he should give up on "tax extension for the rich!" The majority of Americans are against it. . .he is just rolling over and smiling!

I am losing hope. I still think he is a good man. . .but he is no longer my leader.
Very sad!

[blondeatlast]

357. The Federal wage freeze finally broke me. A bloody drop in the bucket

that this private sector employee would happily pay for.

Your last line speaks my mind perfectly.

[upi402]

332. Many tried to warn about him...

and we got flamed relentlessly, even here. Still do when pulling back the curtains! Too sad. We're planning on leaving the country again now.

[colsohlibgal]

335. With You All The Way

The job of the dogged apologists keeps getting harder and harder but they keep trying, always with an excuse.

This federal employee pay freeze sends the message that federal employees should sacrifice so that billionaires can get continued tax breaks. Not exactly a populist move but on his track record so far not a huge surprise.

[RufusTFirefly]

337. Silly humans!

[bongbong]

338. The powers that be

At this point in history, a person doesn't stand a chance of even being nominated for anything higher than state congressman unless he/she agrees to certain things. The last time the people that run things got surprised was when JFK started going against their wishes. As everyone knows, Carlin said it best.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=az0jMekZ1-g

[kestrel91316]

341. At times I feel the same. And yet, spend a few minutes contemplating life

under McCain/Palin........

I still have hope for a better world. I just don't think it's coming to pass very quickly. Our battles are for the long haul.

Never give up. NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER give up.

[tjwash]

344. You guys are so cute when your mad.

The common conception of all liberals, is that they will turn on each other at the drop of a hat, for the slightest reasons, and, of course this whole thread just proves the point. Yell...spit...scream...stamp your feet...hold your breath till you turn blue--the dude has been one of the most effective Presidents in modern history, and has managed to push through things I never thought I would see in the United States.

I was cracking up for a while there, while you all were acting like there is an actual difference between the Democratic and Republican parties. I especially liked the parts where huge chunks of folks were actively denying that the D's are exactly like the R's in that both will say whatever bullshit will get them elected, then suck corporate dick all day long once they're in office.

Of course all this hate will turn to love, once President Huckabee gets sworn in.

Have at it...draft Bernie, or Dennis or your next door neighbor to run-they are all great guys and right on all the issues; too bad they all have about the same chance to actually win a presidential election. You'll be able to peel off just enough progressive votes to elect Huckabee/Palin, or, at least give them a slim enough margin for another supreme court decision. Frankly, at this point, I'm hoping that is exactly what happens. I've grown tired of listening to the DU whine-o-sphere complain about Obama constantly selling out (like he's their favorite band, or actor, or something), and definitely don't wanna listen to it for another for 6 fucking years. I would rather you all do what you do best, and move to the phase where you start reminiscing about how under-appreciated he was, and being the righteous dissenting minority instead of having to hurt your heads, thinking about the messy business of governing.

[cwydro]

345. You said it well Peg.

My thoughts exactly and it is why I never come back here anymore...apparently dissent is discouraged.

But thanks for saying it and I hope your thread doesn't vanish, even if my post does.

[RufusTFirefly]

348. Criticize Our President all you want, closet Palin lovers!

:sarcasm:

[randr]

350. Is it time to find an alternative candidate for 2012?

Who is the most electable progressive?

[onehandle]

366. There are none. Obama is our only hope to retain the Presidency. nt

[randr]

378. Then I think we are truely doomed. nt

[DontTreadOnMe]

356. I am disappointed

The Progressive agenda had all the momentum and the entire country behind him, and then Obama dropped the ball.

Obama doesn't have the fight in him. He leads in a passive manner. We needed an FDR and we got a compromiser.

Healthcare reform is the last thing you worry about if you don't have a job!

The fleecing of the middle class was obvious under Bush, and Obama is continuing to enable it.

[CrownPrinceBandar]

358. Thom Hartmann's talking you up Peggy!

[davidwparker]

359. Thom Hartmann just read your post on the air !!!!

Congrats !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[SalviaBlue]

360. Oooh, you just got a shout out from Thom Hartmann!!

Thanks for posting CA Peggy, I am feeling pretty much the same.

[Dinger]

361. Same Here, K & R

and I am NOT an Obama hater!

[onehandle]

364. The first two years are it. Boehner calls the shots for the next two.

Pray the unemployment rate drops significantly before 2012.

[Vinca]

367. I just heard Thom Hartmann read your post on air. Congrats!

[classof56]

371. Hey, heard that too. Congrats indeed, and well said, Peggy!

Amazing post!

[PeaceNikki]

375. Did he do it in Maya Angelou's voice?

[OhioBlue]

404. Congrats??? Hell - I would be embarassed.

yeah - how fantastic..... a DUer bashing the Pres is read on a progressive radio show.

That is some great propaganda.

We'll never win at messaging b/c we all suck at it. each and everyone of us.

[Vinca]

420. The only people who should be embarrassed are in Washington.

[PeaceNikki]

473. It's funny cuz it's true.

[David Zephyr]

368. While others may criticize you, I understand where you are coming from & you're not alone.

I understand, CaliforniaPeggy. Believe me, I do.

[UrbScotty]

369. Gift to the Republicans? I'm not a Republican!

I'd say he's a gift to me, alright - I get to stay on my parents' insurance for a couple more years - but I'm not a Republican.

[bvar22]

373. And anybody who has parents with MONEY...

..are free to do the same.
Once again, this bill helps people who have MONEY,
and does little for people who are struggling.

[young but wise]

377. This has got to be the most ignorant post i have seen in my life.

You calling Obama a republican is pathetic. I don't get it.

[jotsy]

384. ybw...

I question wisdom absent the common courtesy of manners or respect. The appropriateness of referring to this post or its creator as ignorant is as questionable, unless of course ignorance is a matter you speak to with some expertise.

Edited to remove an is; I typed a little peeved.

[EFerrari]

403. Are you talking about your own post?

Do you usually call people names when you don't understand something?

[tavalon]

495. CaliforniaPeggy is many things

Kind, gentle, caring of her fellow human. She isn't ignorant and this post reflects how she feels.

[BrklynLiberal]

380. My EXACT thoughts and feelings CP! I could not have said it more clearly.

I get this sick feeling in the pit of my stomach whenever the news starts reporting anything that is happening in DC.....
I think I have lost hope...and with that all the joy and euphoria that came with the election of Barack Obama as President.

The candidate, and the man in the White House are not the same person.

Disappointment hardly even begins to describe my feelings....It goes so much, much deeper than that.

[The_Casual_Observer]

382. We will have to see how this all works out.

Obama's message of change was based on bipartisanship, new kind politics.

[alsame]

394. A very sad k&r. nt

[mahina]

398. I know he's doing the best that he can in the face of incredible obstacles.

He can't fix much without us.

I learned from my Senators that you can't just elect good guys and trust them to do what you want. This is no time to sit it out. They are influenced by other forces. We have to build a force to move things the right direction- as Bernie Sanders said, a leftist tea party. They are astroturfed but we are the real grassroots.

This is no time to lose heart. Kind of like deciding to stop swimming in the middle of the Molokai channel. It's not really an option unless we prefer to drown.

[krawhitham]

400. god this place sucks anymore

99% believe the media spin and bitch about it

[MrsCorleone]

431. Agreed.

This is so sad. Think tankers and PR firms have done a number on them. If this keeps up, 2012 will go to the Republikkkans for sure.

Notice how little factual debate is taking place on this thread. It's almost all emotional, mindless lurching based on spin and manufactured outrage(TM). They don't even realize it.

Mass hysteria brought to you by the M$M. It worked on the Teabaggers. It worked on the Hispanic community in '06. It worked on the LGBT community this year...

So sad.

[OhioBlue]

412. This attitude is the gift to the Republicans.

We will NEVER move this Country in a progressive direction if we cannot make the most of the opportunities that we have. We will never change the narrative if we fight with our allies b/c they are not pure enough for us. We will continue to shoot ourselves in the foot and then bitch about it. The give up, quit and complain attitudes that are so rampant on DU is what scares me Peggy.

You know - with Gov Strickland, I got pissed at him for being R-lite at times - he wasn't pure enough for me either. I didn't donate this year, and didn't knock on many doors. You know what happened??? We are stuck with Kasich who is going to gut education funding, take medicaid coverage away from children, cancel the passenger rail project that would have created jobs, privatize the ODOD department and fill it with his cronies, etc. We got royally SCREWED in Ohio on election day. We went backward. I sure do see Strickland's progressive qualities more clearly now than when I was pissed at him over slots, not moving fast enough on education reform, the death penalty, Jennifer Brunner, etc.

We went from Bush, 2 wars, the worst economy since the Great Depression, the worst deficit/debt problem ever, a nation that has been brainwashed with trickle down since Reagan, brainwashed that Global Warming isn't real for the last 8 years, and saddled with a Republican Party that is only interested in obstruction so the black guy doesn't look good. The Koch funded tea baggers set the narrative from the month Obama took office and there was a complete void and absence on the left to fight back against them.

This isn't the time to give up on the President. This is the time to dig in and fight the RIGHT!

[ismnotwasm]

418. Aw Peggy

I'm NOT disappointed, I don't think he's a repuke, I think he's a decent man who choose a career in a undecent system that spiraled more out of control far than usual prior to his election. I know many here have names of Democrats they think would have performed better, maybe that's true, maybe it isn't. We'll have a chance here in a few months to take a look at that.

I don't buy the conspiracy theories, the 'sell out' bullshit, the 'won't stand up to Republicans' crap either. We have exactly what we elected. A Centrist Democrat. If anything, he reminds me of Clinton, who I DID NOT vote for, being to interested in voting for the Socialist party.





(BTW I don't worship the ground he walks on)

[motorcityliberal]

422. Pure shit

The progressive movement logo should be a child crying over not getting that toy they're harassing their parents about, I don't care if I get accused of being a blind supporter of this president I rather be a blind supporter than a person who's trying to compare one president to others that never existed. You might as well compare who's a better Spider-Man The Amazing Spider-Man or Ultimate Spider-Man. The president for the most part kept his promises and while I think health care isn't prefect you need a launch off point where future Democratic presidents can build upon.

I know the typical response is going to be well President Bush got everything he want yeah because he had a majority of Republicans that were willingly to walk off the cliff for him, while President Obama has to deal with blue dog Democrats who pretty much aided senate Republicans in holding up or entirely killing bills. Randi Rhodes asked an excellent question few weeks ago about the newly GOP majority house she asked who's at fault more people who always vote against their interest or people who knew the risk of having a Republican house and still chose not to vote? The house Dems did their part and voted for progressive legislation yet they still paid the price from the so called progressive community. President Obama didn't make Alan Grayson or Russ Feingold lose it was those progressive who decided to take their ball and run home that made these two lose their re-election bids.

I never seen a so called political movement that when face a set back or they don't get 100% of what they want that movement first response is sit at home or vote green which result in the person they're claiming to be against to win the election. I give the right wingers credit for one thing when they don't get what they want they add more Republicans or find new Republicans to ensure they get that thing, liberals,progressive or whatever you folks want to call yourselves instead of adding more Democrats or at least finding more liberal Democrats you folks stay home and when the result ends with more Republicans being elected you bitch about it.

Liberals still haven't learned their lessons from 1994 and 2000, you not going to force change by staying home or voting for some douchebag running on the Green Party ticket, grasp you actually have to work for it. By finding more progressive Democrats in 2011 and voting for them in 2012 along with President Obama.

Hey if you might dismissed what I said with some mean comment but I'm going to say this if you chose to stay home or vote for someone other then Barack Obama in 2012 you give up your right to complain about whatever that Republican president wants to do. So if President Palin or President Mittens Romney wants to invade Iran you better smile and keep your opinion to yourself.

[ProudDad]

426. Promises kept...

http://whatinthefuckhasobamadonesofar.com/

[RufusTFirefly]

444. -1 n/t

[floriduck]

423. I hear you.

I am afraid we elected a sucker for a president.  He is either
so naive that he actually believes he can work with people out
to destroy him or he is actually complicit in what is going
on.  I am beginning to think it is the latter. 

[oldlib]

432. It is so sad

that Obama hasn't performed as us Democrats would like. He has this policy of bending to the will of the GOOP and ignoring the will of the Democratic Party. I wanted to contribute to your message in the hope that the White House will read it.

[CLANG]

433. Thom Hartman just gave you a shoutout CaliforniaPeggy!

[donco6]

454. He sure did. n/t

[laughingliberal]

464. That is so cool! nt

[Hell Hath No Fury]

440. Peggy, I am sorry it has come to this --

I know you have been a strong and consistant of President Obama, and it must hurt you to be feeling this way about him. :(

I am sorry he will not (cannot?) be the President this country needs so very badly at this critical time. I am just as scared as you are, because we will be living with what is and isn't done in the next two years for a very, very long time. The damage that may be inflicted -- it chills me to my core.

I think, at the end of the day, Obama was right: We are the ones we have been waiting for. Not him. And probably not any politician, but a handful of'em. As Americans and as voters, all we can do is stay clear-eyed, educated, and act on our values.

Out here in CA I think we can feel a little more hopeful. We are making leaps and bounds in some important areas, and look to go even further with Brown in office. I remain hopeful that CA will continue to lead and the rest of the country will be pulled along in our wake.

[postatomic]

450. It seems you've stirred up a Hornet Nest

I think anyone who isn't very scared and very concerned about the future of the country isn't paying attention. My frustrations are that I'm still waiting for the Transparency In Government that I thought was promised.

There are times I read or hear things and I have to remind myself that Bush isn't President anymore. So, what the fuck is going on? I don't know. I wish I did.

This is the kind of situation that forces many of us to find blame. Who's fault is this? Who can I blame?

I share your concerns and my glass is no longer half full.

[beforeyoureyes]

451. Yet when I posted a thread to challenge him in the primary, it did not get a single recommend

And, the administrators locked it

Where does the problem lie? With the corporately purchased President, or a cowed people who don't know how to fight?

[bobburgster]

452. I respect your worries and concern Peggy, but I disagree with them.

8 years of republican shit can not be eliminated in 2 years. Also consider the unanimous "no vote" from republicans on everything that even hints of being progressive or regulatory, not to mention he even has to battle members of his own party too.
I'm patient. I believe his heart and direction are in the right place. There are just one hell of a lot of powerful people fighting against him.

[designforce]

453. I agree with your position

I too was hoping that things would change, but alas....it was not to be. The Dem's are still weak as water and give in before the battle is even joined.

Goodbye DU, goodbye democrats.

Going back to the Green Party where I belong.

Peace

[Poboy]

456. +325 votes

[demmiblue]

460. +410 (minus the unrecs)

[grasswire]

457. someone propelled him to the presidency and then showed him the black spot.

The piece of paper with the black spot on it. The one that means "you are at grave threat of death and destruction."

And so what happened since election day has been out of his control. I guess that makes him a stooge. Or a victim of some kind. Maybe even a prisoner of his position.

[gateley]

458. Peggy, I can't tell you how many times I've said "well surely THIS time he'll

realize they're not willing to do ANYTHING".

Then he comes out with conciliatory statements about working together and I tell myself "well, he HAS to say that, he's the POTUS, but let's wait and see what he does" and what he invariably does is give too much, in my mind.

Most recently I was infuriated with the Republicans having "scheduling conflicts" when he asked them to come to dinner, and again, well of course he HAS to say he takes him at their word but surely he knows better.

Then after the meeting both sides are sounding kind of hopeful, the R's sound as though they may be willing to actually think about doing the work of the people.

But no, business as usual. Now we have their compromise YET AGAIN -- do it our way, or nothing gets done.

They insult him over and over, treat him as though he's the rube and they're the adults and they know how to do it right. They are SO disrespectful.

I swear, Peggy, if he caves on this I will be so sad. There's so much he can do for our country, and he HAS done a lot (more than we yammer about, as you well know), but if this Unemployment extension isn't put through and if he doesn't scream from the High Heavens that the Republicans took away your unemployment benefits, and if he capitulates on the taxes, I just don't know. :sad:
:hug: And I know we're not alone :grouphug:

[ChiciB1]

459. Kicking For ALL Of Us! We HAVE Been Betrayed! I Don't See A Silver Lining

ANYWHERE, nor do I feel we are going to get a REAL Democratic President anymore. For those who still defend almost EVERYTHING Obama does, I can only say that I can do NOTHING but scratch my head and wonder!

UNBELIEVABLE!!! I've pretty much lost trust in this man! I too wanted him to succeed and I also know that many things that have happened these past two years have upset me a lot. Early on he disappointed me but many kept saying it's "only" been this or that time, give him MORE time!

Well, I think I'm done with the MORE TIME thingey! I don't even know WHAT questions to ask about this, and most certainly have NO ANSWERS!

Paint me totally BETRAYED! Of course the tax "deal" isn't done yet, but why it would be beneficial to us little people escapes me. All indications and trial balloons being floated look like OBAMA CAVES AGAIN!

It is such a shame and it really breaks my heart and I'm more cynical than ever!
:puke: :nopity: :grr:

[hay rick]

462. Sadly, K&R

[craigmatic]

463. his biggest sin is that he's only been ok but he sold himself as great.

[EFerrari]

465. My dear Peggy,

I'm so sorry to see this.

I've been feeling this way for a long time and it's nowhere I want my friends to be.

:grouphug:

[usaf-vet]

468. So let me get this straight.........

.....the Dems are fighting to give me a middle class tax cut. Yes I earn less than $250,000.

If memory serves me right the last one amounted to $600.00. Although I can't be sure because I never got a check that I could hold and see..... Oh I digress we pointed that out already.

Back to the point at hand. So they are going to save me $600.00 so I won't get a tax increase. BUT to do that they are going to agree to give millionaires and billionaires tax cuts. That, if again memory serves me right could amount to tens of thousands to hundreds of thousands of savings for them.

So now... they can take their millionaire/billionaire 'savings' and use them to buy the 2012 election. Steal the remaining wealth middle class Americans are fighting to keep. Appoint probably two RIGHT WING SCOTUS judges. Ship the remaining middle class jobs over seas.... etc.... etc... etc.

Sounds like a deal to me. /snark /F*&#IN snark.

LET THE TAX CUTS SUNSET. My $600.00 doesn't stand a snowballs chance in hell of counter acting the millionaire/billionaire Citizens United spending.

Couldn't this be called political mass suicide.

[Ichingcarpenter]

472. Both you and I lived through Eisenhower,

I would perfer him over what is happening now..

I cried tears of Joy when Obama got elected now its tears of Woe.

[suffragette]

474. You've always struck me as exceedingly fair and calm

And this statement continues that.

I'm right there with you. It's been so hard to realize this, especially after working so hard for him.

[lonestarnot]

483. My dearest CPeg, being scared is part of human nature. It's ok.

:hug:

[Poll_Blind]

484. Just noticed this had 330+ recs! I've been on DU for a long time and....

...while I've seen posts with more recs than that, Peggy clearly struck a chord.

So thanks for posting it!

PB

[Joe Fields]

490. Peggy, I feel this is a Walter Cronkite moment.

When Cronkite told Americans that we could not win in Vietnam, it was a watershed moment for the LBJ whitehouse.

You, Peggy are the kindest, most fair person on DU. And now you are stating what many of us have felt. If Obama has lost you, I don't see how he will be able to win re-election. Why do I say this? He can't win without progressives doing all of his legwork and carrying water for the next presidential campaign.

I'm not sure how to put this all into words, but I have a strong sense that, if democrats such as yourself have lost faith, then the president will be a one termer.

I could be wrong, but I have been correct about so many things these last several years that I doubt I am.

It is truly sad.

[Douglas Carpenter]

492. the sad part is with a mandate for change coming on the heels of the greatest economic crisis since

the great depression - President Obama really could have gone directly to the people and rolled right over the Republicans and the blue dogs and their sycophants in the media and consigned Reaganism to the dustbin of History where it belongs. But he choose not to. He choose politics as usual. Then again, I didn't really expect him to. And I doubt very much if Hillary or Biden or anyone else who would have been taken seriously by the the power structure and the mainstream media would have done significantly different. The power structure and the mainstream media simply would marginalize anyone who really was going to deliver on hope and change.

"No savior from on high delivers. No faith have we in Prince or peer. From our own hands the chains must shiver. Chains of hatred, darkness, greed and fear."

[MrMickeysMom]

493. I think I've been following you on this one, Peg...

I know you don't start OP's easily in this area, and I see that the reaction is a bit different than last time.

I've been having to vent, too. Because this is where we have to do it, before we decide where to go to next for our kids.

Personally, I'm becoming more interested in the Zeitgeist movement and have seen some follow up addendums to the original. WE HAVE TO CHANGE!

hugs to you... :hug:

on edit: typos

[ibegurpard]

496. K&R

[Violet_Crumble]

499. I don't blame you for being disappointed...

I would be too if I was American. I think the problem is that so much hope was built up in people that there would be change and the reality turned out to be that it's business as usual, but with a smile this time and in a much less autocratic manner. Even here where there is much more difference between the Left and the Right, I'm feeling much the same way about our first female LW Prime Minister and the spineless way the Labor Party is conducting business where there's not all that much change on some issues from that of the Right...

[Ramulux]

500. Welcome to the real world

I suggest ignoring all the brain dead Obama loyalists on this site, Obama could literally switch parties and they would still defend him.

[theNotoriousP.I.G.]

501. Today was my tipping point

I haven't really been paying attention for the last year and living outside of the country makes that easier to do but reading this morning that "Obama and GOPers Worked Together to Kill Bush Torture Probe" was the last straw. I am deeply disappointed and I will no longer make excuses or hope that Obama will finally live up to his campaign rhetoric or deliver the change he promised us all.

[Imagevision]

502. Kidding?! we've got a Republican for a president...

[somone]

503. Technically no

I don't know what party he belongs to, but he's caused a lot more damage to Democratic ideals than people like Lieberman. (Lieberman is just one among 100 senators. Obama is the president.)

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

504. Error: you can only recommend threads which were started in the past 24 hours

[Haole Girl]

506. Kick. I just saw this today

I feel the same. The news, since the primaries, makes me sick.

:-(

[Owl]

525. I draw the line at any compromise extension of the damn Bush tax cuts for the wealthy.

I've worked too hard, spent too much time and money...; all we've in return are broken promises?