If you're on unemployment, who will you blame when this

[MineralMan]

deal falls through and your payments end at the next deadline? The Republicans? The Democrats? President Obama?

I'm not on unemployment, and have never been eligible for it, since I've been self-employed almost my entire adult life. I can't imagine the panic that many who are receiving those payments must be feeling right now. If it doesn't get extended now, I doubt it will be extended in the next Congress. I'm very concerned for everyone who is currently receiving those payments.

[leftstreet]

1. Who are the 99ers blaming?

:shrug:

[MineralMan]

5. I don't know. Are you one of them? If there is someone here who

is in that category, I hope he or she will respond. They're screwed either way, and there's not going to be any help for them in the next Congress, I'm sure.

Do you have a job? Are you unemployed and getting unemployment payments? I'm not. I'm still self-employed. So, I'm not in their position. Are you?

[Ohio Joe]

88. I'm one

I blame the repugs. I blame them for every last bit of whats going on. I blame them for getting us into this mess in the first place. I blame them for their shitty economic policies that have fucked up this country. I blame them for their obstructionist blocking for the last several years. They are entirely at fault for all of it.

[Love Bug]

59. I'll tell you who this 99er blames

Every single goddam politician that let this shitty economy happen, that's who. I don't care what party they are with; if they supported the deregulation of Wall Street, I blame them. If they allowed jobs to be shipped overseas, I blame them. If they allowed unfettered access to H1B visas, I blame them. If they allowed corporations to avoid taxes by putting their 'headquarters' overseas, I blame them. If they tried to break unions, I blame them. If they put corporate interests above middle-class interests, I blame them. I blame the PNACers for their push for endless wars, thereby bankrupting the country and killing our troops. I blame our politicians for the lack of regulation and oversight in the housing industry that fed the housing crisis. I blame Bill Clinton for NAFTA and for welfare 'reform' (where are the jobs now, for those 'welfare moms'?). Where is the reform of corporate welfare? Yeah -- I thought so.

Bit by bit our politicians have gamed the system so badly against the middle class there isn't a casino in Las Vegas that wouldn't kill for such a 'house advantage.'

Am I angry? You bet your sweet ass I am. I am 56 years old and have been working since 1972. I have worked for almost 40 YEARS without a break except by choice for military service and for pregnancy. I have been unemployed for 2 years now after being laid off one month after my 21st anniversary at my last employer. I am a good employee and have the job reviews to prove it. I still am looking for work, but it's getting harder and harder to feel any hope.

I think what makes me angriest of all is the betrayal I feel by my own country that would let this happen to me and others like me, especially since IT WAS AVOIDABLE.

When I joined the Navy I took a vow to protect and defend this country and its Constitution. When in God's name are they gonna defend me?

[MineralMan]

61. Thank you for your answer.

[ibegurpard]

72. absolutely spot-on!

[WillyT]

75. + 1,000,000,000... What You Said !!!

:applause::applause::applause:

:grouphug:

:hi:

[leftstreet]

78. +1 This should be its own OP

:applause:

[kentuck]

82. Agree.

Excellent post.

[Warren Stupidity]

2. Thank you for pushing the capitulationist meme. nt

[MineralMan]

7. I'm pushing nothing. I asked a question.

Perhaps you missed the question marks?

[Name removed]

Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[MineralMan]

31. You don't know me. Nobody on DU knows me.

You may think you do, but you do not in any way know me. This thread is not about me. It is about the unemployed.

[Name removed]

29. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[RockaFowler]

3. I'm crying over here

I'm not sure how much more I can take. Look - my husband wants to work. It's time to stop the games and help the people.

Oh and the people who claim to be Christians are not acting very Christ Like during this holiday season. I'm Jewish and I care about my fellow man/woman.

[MineralMan]

8. I'm very sorry. I want your payments to continue. I want that

very much.

[prolesunited]

9. Yep, people on unemployment are merely pawns to them

I got screwed over the summer and luckily was able to borrow money from my dad to tide me over, but the stress is just awful. I'm now a 99er, so I've entered a new level of hell.

[RockaFowler]

15. I have you in my prayers

:hug:

We are all in this together. I just wish we weren't pawns. But boy it seems like we are all expendable. And again I sit here crying. I can't take it much more. It's affecting my work. I yell at people for no reason. I just want to wake up from this nightmare that my life has become. My husband was making good money before he was Laid Off. Now, we are barely getting by with my small amount and his unemployment.

[DesertFlower]

13. i'm an atheist and i care about my

fellow man/woman. i hope unemployment will continue for as long as it takes for someone to get a job.

[RockaFowler]

16. You are truly a blessing

:hug:

I wish there were more people that thought like you

[DesertFlower]

34. it can happen to

anyone of us. my husband's company has been cutting jobs for years. there were times when we really thought he was going to be let go. fortunately he's 63 and eligible for his pension.

i hope your husband finds something soon.

:hug:

[prolesunited]

60. If you are 45 or older

You pretty much have been kicked to the curb in this economy. The father of my son's girlfriend lost his job of 32 years. He was lucky enough to land another one at 54, but was there only a year and has just been let go since they are moving operations to the Mexican border, where I'm sure they won't be employing any non-Americans. :sarcasm:

[defendandprotect]

4. No attempts at fear-mongering from the WH should move this legislation....

There is no help for the '99'ers in this --

and they are the ones who need it most and shouldn't be cut off --

We need to raise more tax money from corporations to ensure that it is THEY

who have shipped jobs overseas are paying for these long term u/e benefits --

This is Republican legislation and the Democratic Party will finish itself off

if it passes it!!

[MineralMan]

10. I agree. They need help, just as do the rest of the unemployed.

It looks, though, like that's not going to happen for either group. It's very wrong. All parties involved share the blame.

[defendandprotect]

17. No -- it is Obama who has moved this issue ....

a one sided wind-fall for the Republicans --

[kctim]

19. Do you really think

that people who need money to eat and keep their lights on really give a shit about who YOU think should help them? They need help, not opinions.
And you are sadly mistaken if you think they are going to blame the two groups who offered to help and excuse the group who did not.

[NashVegas]

54. How Many People Have You Helped Find a Job - Better Yet, Hired?

The greatest difference between the people stuck in long-term unemployment during the depression and now is the average joe wasn't over his head in debt to begin with.

I'd rather see no unemployment extension and the Bush tax cuts expire, than have this bullshit "compromise" that puts every single one of us in ever more jeopardy as still more money flies out of the treasury.

[kctim]

56. What YOU would 'rather see'

has no bearing whatsoever on who people are going to blame for not being able to feed their family or keep the lights on.

[MineralMan]

62. +1

Exactly. That's why I asked the question. This is not about politics. It's about people's lives. There is a huge difference.

[NashVegas]

66. No

It's about putting what we think is better for the country, over the long term, ahead of politics.

[kctim]

69. Not to be rude, but

people who need help NOW do not care what YOU "think" is best for the country. Especially when you place what YOU "think" ahead of what THEY need.

Its ALL about politics when you care more about sticking it to a group you believe has too much more than you care about the group who has too little.

[NashVegas]

65. I'm Guessing That Means Your Answer Is "None"

[Taverner]

6. I am too, but at what cost?

Come on - you can't tell me that with a majority in the house and senate still, and the WH, that capitulating at every turn is a good idea.

[MineralMan]

11. I can't really tell you anything at all. This should be beyond

politics, as far as I am concerned. We need to be helping those who need that help. Period. I fear that the politics is going to put an end to their hope, though, and the blame is going to be shared across the spectrum. It sucks.

[Taverner]

12. Yes but the GOP has turned everything into the political

With their one, stated goal of making the Obama admin fail

When Rush hoped his country failed, he MEANT it. And so do all the other racists and randists.

[MineralMan]

20. Well, it looks as though they may win at that goal.

It won't be them who suffer, though. They all have plenty of resources. The thing is, though, that it won't be just the Republicans who will be blamed for this failure. The blame will be spread to all sides. Possibly, that will be well-deserved. Politics has gotten in the way of doing what's right, and it's not just the Republicans who are using it in that way.

The unemployment extension should never have been part of this stupid tax bill. It should have been a separate thing, and should have passed by acclamation. We have lost sight of what's important in our zeal to do everything in a single step. This should be immediately be broken out of that tax bill and passed by both houses today, and it should include the 99ers. They can fight over the tax thing all they want.

[Taverner]

24. Who said anything about them suffering?

They are well of traitorous scum

[polmaven]

46. And for the idealism of the left

I should lose everything I have worked for all my adult life?

[girl gone mad]

64. Everything you've worked for all your adult life is..

max $400 a week in unemployment benefits?

And you blame the left's idealism?

:wow:

Just... wow.

[polmaven]

67. I have worked all of my adult life

for my home, and to put food on the table and to pay for my living expenses. I am single, and until jobs are available, the UI check is all I have to pay for that. My life is not lived extravagantly, but it takes money, none the less. Until jobs are available, that money is all I have. After paying 20 years of my 30 year mortgage, yes....I will blame the left's idealism if that is all lost for the sake of their political posturing. Millions of people's lives are at stake, and you just don't see that? Elitist much?....My turn! :wow:

[girl gone mad]

68. What will you do in 13 months when UI expires again?

Or when you join the ranks of the 99ers and the millions more who never qualified for UI in the first place?

The left's idealism represents the best hope you have of ever getting a good paying job again.

[polmaven]

71. I thank you for your concern.

Your understanding is overwhelming!

Oh well....what's another year to allow job creation to occur? We have bigger things to worry about than people's lives. We have reputations to think about! :sarcasm:

[jpgray]

14. Nothing is beyond politics.

Politics maneuvered us into a situation where UI extension is held hostage. Thirty years of deregulation and institutional decay brought us to this point, and that too was politics. Politics is very fond of manning the gallows, putting the noose around the accused, and then declaring that in order to save the condemned, we must set politics aside and do what some number of politicians demands.

[defendandprotect]

22. "Politics" is the shadow cast over government by corporations .....

this is not a "people's" government nor a president acting in the interests of

the people --

it is a president acting once again in the interests of corporations/elites.

[MineralMan]

23. I recognize that. I'm just saying that some things should be

beyond politics, and unemployment compensation is one of those things.

[coalition_unwilling]

89. I think you put your finger on it - I was going to reply to the OP to say

that I blame the Reagan regime, having come of age when the "politics of middle class resentment" first gained center stage and having watched it never give up the stage since.

I think one way to ensure that this hostage taking does not occur again is to resurrect one of McGovern's ideas from his 1972 campaign: a Guaranteed Annual Income. A GAI would function much like Social Security does (or used to), in that it would provide a true income safety net that every citizen could be assured would be there come hell or high water.

How to pay for GAI? Simple -- cut the U.S. defense budget by 50% and restore marginal income tax rates to levels they were pre-1980. I'm not holding my breath that I will see GAI or the means to pay for it any time soon. If unemployment reaches Great Depression levels of 25% maybe. Short of that, the politicis of middle class resentment will continue to hog the lime light.

Edited for typos.

[Lord Magus]

25. The problem with that logic is the majority in the Senate is in name only.

It always was, even before the Mass. special election.

[Taverner]

32. Yes, but even in name only, we should have at least ONE bargaining chip

And we have none, its like we're the superminority

[polmaven]

47. Please tell me you are not

calling the loss of UI benefits a "BARGAINING CHIP". We are talking about people's lives here. Literally!

[Taverner]

50. I don't consider it a bargaining chip - THEY DO

And yes, its as frustrating as it is unethical

[H2O Man]

18. Appeals to fear

and anger are so distasteful.

[Autumn]

21. I'm sorry for them, we have a President and

Senate and a Congress that plays with them and doesn't give a shit about them. Perhaps they should get mad and throw all their sorry asses out. If we give in and bestow a giant wad of cash on the rich, they will start crying about the deficit, make their "deficit saving" cuts , on the backs of those who can least afford it, and when these benefits run out for them, what happens then? I'm very concerned that the President and Congress and Senate allowed it to come to this. And that pisses me off.
If the next Congress doesn't extend it then it's time for action and if that doesn't get people off their asses nothing will.

[EC]

26. repubs.. n/t

[JoePhilly]

27. No one has answered your question yet ...

My sense is that Obama will be blamed almost across the board. He is after all President.

I'm not unemployed, but I have in-laws who either are now, or have been recently. They lean to the right, but don't really follow politics much.

They know that Obama is a Dem, and that the Dems have majorities in the Congress. They believe that the Dems "borrow and spend" although if pressed, they can't explain that position ... they just know it. And so if anything bad happens to them, Obama the socialist did it.

They are not against giving people unemployment benefits, after all, they've received them. In their view, they EARNED THEM, even though those I am describing struggle to maintain regular employment.

They are also pretty sure that minorities are getting better benefits than they get (again, can't defend it, they just know it). When they are on UE, its "situational" ... when a minority is on UE, that is proof that minorities game the system.

Oh ... they want business to get tax breaks so that a business will hire them. See, its not that they don't have skills that keeps them unemployed, its that taxes on the rich cause the rich to not hire them. They admire, and see the very wealthy as the oh so potentially benevolent caretakers who will ultimately step in.

[MineralMan]

33. Thank you for answering the question. It's odd that few have

even tried.

[Newest Reality]

43. Thanks for that insight into

more specifics on how those folks are coming to their perspectives. A lot of it seems to be based on vague chunks of memorized propaganda.

I always enjoy learning more about HOW people do what they do, rather than just paying attention to the contents. There are some useful keys for change in it for me.

[donco6]

28. You might as well say -

"You just want President Palin!"

Because it's the same argument. Go along or else the puppy gets it. It's disgusting.

[MineralMan]

35. No. If I had wanted to say that, I would have said it.

Instead, I asked a question. What is your answer to that question?

[Name removed]

38. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[MineralMan]

41. Nice.

[CakeGrrl]

30. I would think

that the bottom line prevails:

Who, at the end of all this crap, was trying to get me my money, and who was trying to STOP it?

Never mind the political maneuvering.

When you have bills to pay, it's only about the bottom line. If you can afford to hang back and watch political football play out, you aren't vested.

Obama is trying to get UI benefits in place via the tax deal.

The Congressional Repubs killed the UI extension.

The House Dems are blocking the tax deal that carries the extension of UI benefits along with it.

Do the math.

[MineralMan]

36. Thanks for the answer to the question I posed.

I don't know who's going to get the blame from those who are unemployed, since I'm not in their shoes. That's why I asked. Most of the replies in this thread have nothing to do with the question, so I appreciate your reply very much.

[CakeGrrl]

39. No problem. I don't think people WANT to answer the question

Because in this political circus, the House Dems can come out of this with egg on their faces for not forcing the issue sooner, despite looking like they're NOW fighting for Dem principles.

Obama could come out looking the best of all for his pragmatism, and a lot of people here would choke on the notion that their weak, wimpy, pathetic Neocon traitor of a President could come out ahead in the eyes of the people who are MOST affected by this theater while the newly minted House Dem Progressive heroes could be seen as spoilers.

[polmaven]

49. I absolutely agree with you!

President Obama is the only one in DC nowadays who seems to care more about the PEOPLE who will be effected. It is sounding more like the Democratic Caucus is willing to hang us out to dry because the president hurt their feelings by not getting their permission to make this kind of deal....It is, literally, an EMERGENCY of large proportions for millions of people, and the House Dems are playing political games.

[Swamp Rat]

37. Obama, the DLC, and their sycophants. eom

[Catherina]

40. Obama, the New Dems, their enablers and their apologists.

In short, the people despicable enough to use the unemployed as pawns to hand $700 billion to the foie-gras eating elite.

This sudden concern for the unemployed from the New Dem corner isn't fooling anyone.

[CakeGrrl]

42. Because you think they SHOULD?

I don't think you've been in a make-or-break financial situation.

Obama's trying to get UI benefits back. That's a GOOD thing when you need them.

Republicans killed the UI benefits extension. That's a BAD thing because there will be no money.

And as much as it galls you, the House Dems, Progressive heroes that you seem to think they are, are trying to stop a bill that carries UI benefits. That's a BAD thing when you need that money.

Harsh toke for you, but Obama is the one that people will credit with trying to get them a paycheck.

[emulatorloo]

76. the total cost of the package is 800 to 900 billion. Only 75b of that is for top 2% tax break

Breakdown here:

http://money.cnn.com/2010/12/07/news/economy/tax_cut_deal_obama/

[1badjedi]

44. Maybe it's time

to start a new james gang and begin robbing banks. If you get caught it's 3 hots and a cot plus free health care and schooling. :sarcasm:

[MineralMan]

45. Not a solution, but I have no doubt some will do just that.

[Bluenorthwest]

48. Were you born yesterday?

In politics, each party will always blame whomever it serves them to blame. Also the sky is blue, the world is round and it gets dark at night.

[polmaven]

51. Those of us whose lives are literally

at stake here will not be playing poltics. I will blame all of those who decided the politics were more important than the well being of millions of Americans. The president will likely be the only one without blame.

[Name removed]

52. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[MineralMan]

57. What on earth is that supposed to mean?

[Lorien]

53. Why is one being tied to the other? We need a SEPARATE bill for unemployment benefits.

[MineralMan]

58. That's it. That's how this should have been set up in the first

place. The unemployed should not be used as a pawn in this game by anyone.

[Dappleganger]

77. +100000

[True_Blue]

55. Where the blame lies - Obama / McConnell

They're the ones that met privately and came up with this rotten deal. I didn't hear where any Democrats were invited to this meeting or had any input on this deal. I certainly can't fault any of the Democrats that don't want to be party to this.

Grassley is now saying they would have passed the extension without the tax cuts. Of course it's a lie, but since there wasn't even a bill introduced for just the extensions, they can say whatever they want about what they would have done.

"I think there would have been some accommodation on unemployment anyway, even if you didn't have this tax bill," said Grassley, senior Republican on the Senate Finance Committee, on a conference call with Iowa reporters, according to the Quad-City Times." - http://qctimes.com/news/national/article_0ba26c02-02f5-11e0-b751-001cc4c002e0.html

[rucky]

63. Well, there was a stand-alone vote to extend unemployment.

And everybody against it went on record.

Should be pretty clear.

[readmoreoften]

70. Democrats. Republicans. And most of all, the banks, if they're smart.

[walldude]

73. Thom Hartmann played a number of clips today

of Republicans saying that they would have extended Unemployment anyway. There were enough of them to get it passed. The 99'ers would have got screwed but they are going to get screwed anyway.

This was a bad deal.

[Prophet 451]

74. Everyone. I'll blame everyone.

Well, nearly everyone.
I'll blame Republicans for being the bootlicks of the corporate class and utterly sociopathic toward everyone else.

I'll blame (some) Democrats for not getting this f'ing thing done back when they had a super-majority and for assuming Republicans would be in any way reasonable on, well, anything. And if they intended to use this to embarass the right, they should be f'ing ashamed.

I'll blame Obama for not using the bully pulpit enough but I'll spare him some of the blame because he seems to have accepted this shitty f'ing deal to get unemployment extended. Could have done more but, hell, that might well end up being the story of his presidency.

I'll blame Bill Clinton for "reforming" welfare in the first place and Dumbya for crashing the economy and making this a life-or-death issue and Reagan for starting the whole "government can't ever help people" crap in the first place.

I'll blame the media on the right for pushing the "lazy unemployed, undeserving poor" bullshit and I'll blame the media on the left and centre for not firebombing the right-wing media (metaphorically. Well, mostly metaphorically).

I'll blame a good portion of the public for being stupid and vicious and mean-spirited enough to buy the aforementioned bullshit.

I'll blame the unemployed for not marching on Washington and scaring the living shit out of the politicians but that's only a little bit of blame because most are, understandably, more concerned with staying alive.

I'll blame the corporate class for not fucking hiring people and Congress for not fucking making them or just directly employing the unemployed to rebuild the infrastructure that's falling apart before our eyes.

I'll blame my own (British) government for following along with the most detestable, cruel and sadistic aspects of Republicanism and Fox for making me redundant when they brought out my employers and myself for being mentally ill and not getting the fuck out of this fucking country when I had the chance.

I have anger issues. I am aware of this.

[Love Bug]

80. Word, except for one item

Please don't blame the unemployed for not marching on Washington. We can't afford the gas to drive there, frankly, since we're trying to keep the heat on at home. But a great big "Fuck yeah!" to the rest of your rant.

[Prophet 451]

86. Good point, well made

Strike the unemployed from the list and apologies for sweeping you up in my rage.

[Love Bug]

87. No apology necessary

I wish we all could march on Washington because several million people converging on that city at once would shut it down. Now THAT would be a message! Maybe we all should march on the nearest US Embassy and ask for asylum...

[TheKentuckian]

79. The TeaPubliKlans in general, the President, Democratic leadership in both houses,

McConnell, Sir John of Orange all share the blame for not indexing the extensions to the unemployment rate in the first place and everybody from the President down to the dog catcher and the rest of America for leaving the ever increasing 99ers to die.

The real culprit is conservative and corporate ideology but nonsense tends to always get a pass.

[TBF]

81. Unrec for fear mongering .nt

[democracy1st]

83. both parties, neither has common sense solutions to our problems.

[Skidmore]

84. Exactly, and parties that cannot think beyond the next election cycle

or raising money for their own campaigns. It is inconceivable to me that we can only find candidates from among the wealthiest to run for office or that people who had, in the past, been part of them middle class and were able to get into office decades ago, have become very wealthy in public service.

And I blame the public for continuing to vote for these people and this system AND who remain woefully ignorant of the system of governance.

[democracy1st]

85. true thats one of the ways the system eliminates the middle class,it costs to much to run !

[coalition_unwilling]

90. I will blame the fucking Republicans - n/t