Starting on a hill

[matcom]

This was covered in another forum and me being new to manual shift (except for my training course), I thought I would throw the post over here for advice

"Today I went to a parking lot that has a fairly large slope to it to practice starting on a "hill". I need to do this because the driveway to my complex has a slope right before the gate, and I "learned" real quickly how to start on that last week, when I stopped right on that slope with a car behind me. At that time, I used some combo of front brake, clutch and throttle to make it up the slope (after a few stalls).

Today in the parking lot, the slope was more steep and I found out very quickly that I couldn't use that same combo - I needed to apply more throttle and I wasn't able to do that and squeeze the front brake at the same time . So after stalling a few times, I switched to the rear brake. It was a breeze after that.

What did I learn? What works for me in one situation doesn't necessarily apply to a similar (but not identical) situation. The "hill" combo I use for the driveway to my complex wouldn't (and didn't) work for me on a steeper slope. Be flexible and go with what works rather than the "rule" you have laid out for yourself.

Also I learned that as James said in his tip, starting on a hill is not a function of which brake but rather all about the feathering of the clutch and application of the throttle."

Thoughts?

[JustABozoOnThisBus]

1. I just work the throttle & front brake at the same time

Thumb & forefinger on the throttle, the other three fingers on the brake. A little practice and it's pretty easy.

My bike's "front brake" lever works a hydraulic master cylinder, and actually works both brakes. The foot lever is rear-brake only.

The only problem with relying solely on the foot brake is, what happens if you lose balance and have to put that foot on the ground? You're rolling. Yikes.


Practicing in a parking lot? Excellent idea! It beats learning in traffic!

[ThomWV]

2. West Virginia is nothing but hills - you have to do it all the time

You get used to it here because very often, particularly in towns at intersecting roads with stop signs, the road that runs up and down the hill will stop while the roadway running along the hill will be uninterrupted.

So, here's how you do it. Left foot on ground to support bike, right foot on rear brake pedal to stop bike from rolling. Right hand is on throttle but not front brake lever because you want full throttle control, left hand on clutch. Ease off the brake as you release the clutch and raise your left foot off the ground. It is one very smooth fluid motion.

The point is not to try to use your right hand to control both the throttle (which has to turn) and the front brake lever (which does not turn) at the same time. So you simply use the rear brake instead and that requires that you use your left foot for support and balance while stopped.

On Edit: This will show you how old I am I guess, but 'back in the day' a lot of the bikes I rode didn't have front brakes and some had hand shift and suicide clutches. For those of you who aren't familiar with such things there was a time when some motorcycles had a shift lever on the left side of the tank that you moved forward and back to change gears while the clutch was operated by a pedal at your left foot. Your right foot operated the rear brake - no front brake. So imagine stops on hills with one of those beasts. Two methods were used. If there was no car behind you then either you simply did not stop or you attempted to slip the clutch to hold yourself while supporting the bike with your right foot - quite a trick if you've never tried it. The second method, used when there was someone behind you, was to let the bike roll back until your rear tire hit their bumper and let them hold you from rolling back so you could hold the bike up with your right foot. Sometimes the people in the cars did not react well to this maneuver.

[Haole Girl]

5. Agreed

This is the best way to start from a hill. I must have tucked this in the back of my mind somewhere because I used this advice for the first time yesterday! I'd been on hills before, but never starting (at a stop sigh) on a steep hill. Takes a lot more throttle than I thought it would.

On a side note, I miss seeing Matcom here Hope he is out enjoying his bike. Hi Matcom... if you are lurking! :hi:

[dmallind]

3. I never use FB on a hill start

Back brake is more than enough to hold you (I have a 700lb bike and weigh 290) and allows for far better throttle control. Hill starts are just an extension of how the MSF beginner courses first teach you to start moving. If you release the clutch until you start feeling a forward pull and then roll on the throttle then off you go. The only differenec with hill starts is applying a little bit more rpm than for flat starts. I can't tell you what that rpm is because all bikes are different. You IIRc have a middleweight twin cruiser, which is a fairly torquey type of machine which should not need as high rpm to start as a sport bike for example. I'm on a V4 sport tourer which is similarly low geared and even on steepish hills I rarely exceed 2500rpm to pull off smoothly. I'd play around with it somewhere in that rev range - starting off lower than you think. After all stalls are just embarasssing if you try too low. Wheelies and sudden uncontrolled rushesa into traffic lanes if you go too high are positively dangerous, so err on the side of lower rpm until you get the feel. Let out clutch slowly at say 2k with your foot on back brake and hand off the front brake. When you feel any kind of slight pull roll gently on the throttle to apply a sensible amount more rpm and release the back brake. If you're careful worst thing that can happen is a stall, and it will only take one or two triues before you get it.

[Robb]

4. Important note nobody told me until late in my riding career:

You can't burn out a moto clutch the same way you can on a car.

Feather, feather, feather. It's designed for it.

[david13]

6. Generally it's a wet clutch and will slip easily. Friction zone.

To start out on a hill, use the back brake. Just put one foot down.
When braking, use both brakes. Get in the habit of using both brakes. You will need that skill in a panic stop.
Also, using both brakes will keep the back wheel from skidding out on you.
But stay off the road until you get a lot a lot... of practice.
dc

[JustABozoOnThisBus]

7. My clutch is a dry single-plate type

like a car. So going up-hill, I like to get started quick, and not let the clutch slip too long. That should help avoid friction wear and heat. A clutch replacement on my bike is a big job, requires removing the swing-arm and transmission, lots of fun.

:hi:

[david13]

8. I am going to say that you then have a BMW. As they are the ones who

most use the dry clutch on some models, as well as the single side arm on many models.
But there may be others.
dc