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AlphaCentauri Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-01-10 10:52 AM
Original message
Venezuela to buy GE gas power plants for $600m
1 April 2010 - Venezuela plans to spend about $600m to buy two gas fired power plants from GE to help cope with electricity shortages.

The Associated Press reported mining minister Rodolfo Sanz as saying Hugo Chavez' beleaguered government will buy the two plants and equipment to yield 880 MW.

Sanz said that the government has received the pieces of a first plant being installed at the state-run steel maker. Venezuela expects the second plant to arrive next month.
http://www.powergenworldwide.com/index/display/articledisplay/7742659901/articles/powergenworldwide/gas-generation/new-projects/2010/04/venezuela-to_buy_ge.html
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Judi Lynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-01-10 04:47 PM
Response to Original message
1. Thank you, AlphaCentauri. Kicking. Recommending.
:kick: :kick: :kick: :kick:
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Wilms Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-02-10 12:33 AM
Response to Original message
2. OK, but...
How about wind and solar for rural electrification? Practical?
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protocol rv Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-02-10 09:49 AM
Response to Reply #2
3. Not really practical at all
The use of wind power in Venezuela doesn't make much sense except for spots near the coast where the wind blows and there's space to put the windmills. This is feasible at Paraguana. However, the cost per KW capacity is a lot lower for General Electric gas fired turbines, and Venezuela has the gas supply available at the site where the plants are to be built.

The use of solar power for rural electrification isn't very practical, unless it's for tiny communities.

You see, the problem in Venezuela is a massive lack of electric power (you can read about it in my Crisis Update posts). The core reasons for this shortage are:

1. The government failed to maintain the existing thermal plants, which use natural gas - some fo them have been so poorly maintained they can be considered junk. The government points fingers at previous administrations, but they have been in power for over 10 years now, so this finger pointing is regarded as juvenile and absurd by the Venezuelan public.

2. The government has allowed the deforestation of the Caroni river watershed by illegal miners and squatters. As the forst has been cut down, we have observed soil erosion, and the net result is that the forest surrounding the water reservoir fed by the Caroni river isn't able to hold water that falls in the rainy season. Since in Venezuela we have two seasons, rainy and dry, it's important to have water stored for the dry season, and the main reservoirs and their catchment areas have to be managed - and this includes forest management to make sure mother nature lends a hand by hanging on to the water which trickes out during the dry season.

3. The government has failed to build new power plants as had been scheduled. This is a twin to the neglect of maintenance. In general it can be said this government is run by incompetent people, mostly political appointees who have personal or military connections to Chavez, or have the proper Marxist background. We also see Cubans giving advice in these matters, and the Cubans come from a fairly backwards nation where the use of electricity in large scale just isn't possible because they are so poor.

4. This has been the mother of all dry seasons. While under normal circumstances, when we have had dry seasons in the past things got a little tight, there was always sufficient water stored for hydropower use, and there was sufficient spare electric capacity. I know the Chavistas who post here like to point out there's a problem in Jamaica and in Burundi, but Venezuela is a fairly rich nation where we haven't seen this type of crisis - because previous governments, as lousy and corrupt as they were, did take care of building a basic infrastructure which worked good enough.

In conclusion, your proposal just doesn't meet reality, the need here is urgent, and these plants have to be ready in a few months. What's left unsaid in the articles is that it's unlikely they'll be ready before the whole system collapses. You see, the government still faces two problems: 1) They still lack the people with the ability to get things done on time, they are famous for making mistakes, and I bet when crunch time comes they'll have the plants, but they'll have forgotten something simple like the cables to hook them up, or the transformers won't have the oil, or something stupid like that. 2) the water level at the dam which provides 70 % of the country's power has been allowed to fall to a dangerously low level. Right now it's only about 10 meters, and they keep running it down. The real conditions at the dam are now considered a secret, I think, because there's no longer real data being made available by the government, but I suspect we have until around may 24th before the system collapses - unless it rains.

The forecast for the next few days shows no significant rain where it counts - the Caroni river catchment basin. So here we are, stockpiling candles.

Another thing: the government has also failed to develop the gas supplies, so when these plants do fire up, they'll be using gas which has to be taken from somewhere else. And we're already importing gas from Colombia, even though we have huge gas reserves. I guess you can say the main characteristic about this government is the sheer incompetence they exhibit at all levels.
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AlphaCentauri Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-02-10 11:08 AM
Response to Reply #3
4. What I can see is that the government is doing something to fix the problem
the shortages were not a big deal until the opposition start pressing Chavez to fix the problems they never took care of during their time in power.
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ChangoLoa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-02-10 05:18 PM
Response to Reply #4
5. There were almost no shortages before, this problem started 4 years ago
Chavez had already been in power for 7 years. It grew with the drought.

Previous govts had already built almost all the electrical capacity of the country.
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Wilms Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-02-10 08:38 PM
Response to Reply #5
6. The drought? I thought the whole problem rested squarely on the shoulders of...
The

Hugo Monster

Didn't you get the meme(o)? :shrug:
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protocol rv Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-02-10 08:53 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. Exactly, the problem was caused by Chavez
We have droughts like clock work. It happens every year - we call it the dry season. And every 7 years or so, we get two really bad years back to back. Everybody knows it, and prepares for it - except for Chavez et al. They are not a very competent lot.
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Wilms Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-02-10 09:32 PM
Response to Reply #7
9. The fact that this is a record breaking drought notwithstanding?
More of your usual.

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protocol rv Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-04-10 08:12 PM
Response to Reply #9
11. Yes, despite that this is a record breaking drought.
Do you know why? Even if this hadn't been a record breaking drought, there would be a power crisis. The record breaking drought is just making it so that within 10 weeks, if it doesn't rain, we are going to be in a very difficult situation. Remember, right now the water level is between 249 and 250 meters above sea level. At 240 meters, according to Enalca, they are supposed to start shutting down the Guri generators. So of course this is the current government's problem. And we who are suffering the consequences aren't in a very forgiving mood.

You know, I'm a fairly educated person, when it gets dark, I'm not about to go bananas and start rioting. But the people in the barrios are a wildcard. I'm not planning on being in Caracas around mid May if it doesn't rain, because anything goes if the lights go out here in Caracas. This is the reason why Chavez fired the electricity minister the first time he tried to impose a rolling blackout program here, he knew it could get out of hand.

Which means we do want it to rain, we don't want to be in the dark and see half the city burning because we're getting a super Caracazo. The PSUV is likely to lose the elections anyway, the economy is such a shambles, they won't be able to talk their way out of the hole they dug themselves.
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ChangoLoa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-04-10 03:00 PM
Response to Reply #6
10. Did el Niño started 4 years ago?
Before, it was all the fault of the evil opposition's sabotage.. didn't you get the meme?
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-02-10 09:00 PM
Response to Reply #4
8. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
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