DON'T LET A POLL FEED THE PANIC....

[ProSense]

DON'T LET A POLL FEED THE PANIC....

The new Gallup poll won't help, but it's not a surprise, either -- a 55% majority would prefer to see lawmakers hit the brakes on health care and "consider alternative bills that can receive more Republican support."

At face value, I think the wording of the poll may skew the results a bit -- Americans say they love "bipartisanship," so if you ask the public whether Dems should seek out GOP support, it's easy to expect a majority. If, however, the same poll asked Americans to choose between Democratic policy ideas and Republican policy ideas, the GOP would lose badly.

But even if we accept the poll as entirely reliable and an accurate reflection of public attitudes, Democrats would still be crazy to retreat because of it. Greg Sargent had a good item on this.

(I)f Dems don't pass reform, they will never have a chance to sell a completed package to the public -- and to try to convince the public that they were right, and Republicans were wrong. People will never have a chance to decide that their fears about reform were unwarranted.

Not passing reform won't stop Republicans from attacking Dems for trying to jam an unpopular bill down the public's throat. And failure would give Republicans more ammo, not less. It would allow the GOP to take credit for blocking reform, to present itself as an effective and relevant opposition, and to paint Dems -- accurately -- as ineffective and unable to lead.

Look, I can appreciate why Dems are feeling anxiety, but if they take a deep breath and think about it, what's the best way to turn the polls around? Do they think public opinion will turn in their favor if they cower in fear and fail to deliver? After they've already voted for health care reform?

What I'm suggesting is that they give success a chance. The polls are far more likely to recover if lawmakers do what they said they would do, pass the most important domestic policy legislation in generations, reap the rewards of a historic victory, and then get out there and sell their handiwork -- making clear to the country that the scare tactics were wrong. Once the bill is signed, the media won't just have a major signing ceremony to cover, but there will be plenty of reports about what the new law does and does not do, which would further help debunk the myths.

How is this not obvious? In what universe do the polls improve after politicians fail to deliver on their promises?

Pass. The. Damn. Bill.

Pass. The. Damn. Bill.

Pass. The. Damn. Bill.

[last1standing]

1. Stop. The. Damn. Spam.

Stop. The. Damn. Spam.

Stop. The. Damn. Spam.

Stop. The. Damn. Spam.

[ProSense]

3. Stop. The. Damn. Denial. n/t

[Oregone]

5. Whoops!

I duped your posts on accident! Great minds think alike. :)

[ShortnFiery]

11. ...

;)

These INDIVIDUAL post threads are like what we'd call in the military "Artillery Bracketing."

THREAD POST COUNT =

1) "Adjust POPULIST for Paul Krugman. OVER! Fire for effect. OUT!"
2)"Adjust EXECUTIVE BRANCH for Robert Gibbs. OVER! Fire for effect. OUT!"
3) "Adjust INVECTIVES for righteous indignation. OVER! Fire for effect. OUT!;"

and

4) "Adjust PLEADING + INVECTIVES for an Hail Mary Instance Over! Fire for effect. OUT!"

Wash. Rinse. Repeat. :crazy:

[saracat]

2. But yesterday the president asked that the bill be shelved to concenrtate on other issues..

And as more compromise would only make it worse, it might not be a terrible idea.But unfortanately, the pusuitof faux bipartisanship has ensured that real HCR will never see the light of day.

[ProSense]

6. But yesterday

the President did no such thing.

[saracat]

14. "Taking time? Letting the dust settle? The president has a full plate?Determining the way forward?"

Read between the lines.And he DID request waiting to allow brown to vote, who has already announced he will vote against it. You have selective hearing and no idea how messaging works.Apparently you believe the rhetoric and cannot seperate it from what is really said. Perhaps you also believe political figures all resign to "spend time with their families" ?

[Oregone]

4. Stop. The. Damn. Spam.

[OneTenthofOnePercent]

10. Pull. Your. Head. Out. Of. The. Sand.

[lapfog_1]

7. You don't get it, do you?

The Senate bill is the only one that can "pass" (by the mechanism of the House passing it without alteration), thus placing it on the President's desk for signature.

Most progressives don't like the Senate bill, *I* don't want the House to pass it. Even if that means that this health care insurance reform bill dies. The Senate bill sucks. The House bill is less sucky, and, as a first step, might be palatable.

At this point, it would be better to piecemeal the main provisions and dare the Republicans to filibuster each one. Pass the ones that the insurance companies absolutely hate (no pre-existing conditions, no caps on payouts) but without the things they wanted (continued exclusion from anti-trust laws, mandatory insurance purchase by 30 million+ more Americans). See how fast they get their pawns in the repuke party (and those in the Democratic party) on the phone to PASS the current legislation with a conference bill with the House.

You bet they will.

[Name removed]

8. Deleted message

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[ProSense]

9. Hmmm, complicated

"*I* don't want the House to pass it."

You don't get it.

I do!

[lapfog_1]

12. The House isn't going to pass it as is.

Nancy has already stated that. The President no longer wants the Senate bill on his desk because "Massachusetts spoke". So...

you aren't getting what you want, even if you could convince 100% of DU to agree with you.

The President is moving on to finance reform.

If you support the President, you need to get with the program here.

[cali]

13. The bill is dead

yes, there's a high political cost for not passing it. there may have been a high political cost for passing it, but it's dead.

[ProSense]

16. Wrong

Sanders said Washington's focus should be on why reform is needed rather than why Brown won.

"Regardless of what happened in Massachusetts, the reality remains that our health care system is disintegrating," Sanders said. "It is unacceptable that 45,000 Americans die every year because they don't get to a doctor on time."

link

[cali]

18. oh, c'mon. there's NOTHING in that quote that refutes my claim.

wake the fuck up. it's done.

[ProSense]

19. No, stop your wishful thinking.

People are still negotiating.

[cali]

21. you are delusional if you think that this can be passed.

[TheKentuckian]

15. Clearly, you want it to pass. I guess you own lots of health sector stocks

[ProSense]

17. Oh brother. n/t

[TheKentuckian]

20. You love corporate influence?

You just want to pass something called health care even if what is actually in the bill mostly just encourages clubbing baby seals???

You want to transfer wealth from the middle class?

You want to entrench the existing system?

You are upper middle class, rich, or wealthy and want the liability limits?

You want to be able to browbeat poor and working people for not making use of their government mandated bootstraps when they can't afford care?

You want to starve "the pig"?

Fuck if I know. I knew I wouldn't be able to support this when it came out of the Finance committee and said so THEN (as did many others who have went back on principles) but was optimistic we could by going through the process actually improve the compromised bill into a genuine "starter house" rather than corporate welfare and entrenching the status quo further.

I compromised my principles, values, and horse sense to the point that I could accept the House structures without the public option despite how astoundingly anemic that would be too because it does at least lay down some basic foundation that can actually be expanded on rather than it's self requiring wholesale reform.

Now, you bellow and shill 24/7 for this particular measure not just now when there is no other easy option but even when there was a near universally agreed superior option. You favor state pools, you want the industry to enjoy an anti-American and anti-capitalistic anti-trust exemption, you yearn for less affordability, in short it has long appeared you want the status quo codified and the entire "reform" heavily slanted toward the insurance companies.