Precognitive Maddow

[soleft]

This morning I was listening to the Rachel Maddow radio show from January 29, 2009. She and David Bender were discussing the stimulus bill and debating about how long it would take for Obama to jettison his hopes for cooperation from the GOP.

Bender said it would only take a matter of weeks. Even though Obama had been making concessions on the stimulus to get GOP support, he was only a few weeks into his presidency. If Obama saw no signs of pi-partisanship with 8 weeks, he would use the bully pulpit, go straight to the American people and say the GOP is not cooperating, I need your help.

Maddow disagreed. She said Obama was too entrenched in his believe that if he could only explain his thought process to the Republicans, they would eventually become rational and work with him. She expected that it would be a process of Fail, Fail, Fail, Fail, Fail, and that someday, after a long and drawn out effort, maybe he would come to a moment when he would realize nothing was going to change and eschew his kumbaiya (Sp) philosophy.

Maddow appears to have been right on, as usual.

But I guess the question I have now is, has that moment finally happened? Or are we still waiting for it.

[livetohike]

1. I disagree with Rachel Maddow on this one

I don't think she knows President Obama's thought processes, as do any of us. He will keep trying to bring the Republicans in. He said this while campaigning, he said this the other night in the SOTU. He said he won't quit, and I believe that means he won't quit on trying to make the Republicans part of the process.

His tone was a little stricter in the SOTU, I believe he put the Republicans on notice to some extent, but I also believe he will keep trying. He's the adult in the room right now, imo.

[zipplewrath]

2. The adult

As any elemetary school teacher will explain to you, treating children like adults won't get them to act like adults. Quite to the contrary, it is important to recognize their true nature and deal with them within that reality. A college professor once told me his biggest challenge every day was remembering that in the end, he was dealing with a bunch of 20 year olds.

[livetohike]

3. One should treat people the way they expect to be treated

with respect. Despite their age. I taught elementary school for nine years and while you don't treat children as adults, you do model the behavior you expect, so in this I disagree to some point with your premise.

[zipplewrath]

7. Model the behavior you expect.

But you don't expect behavior they can't achieve. You don't expect them to behave as adults. You expect them to be respectful of the other children, and of adults. You model that by being respectful of them, and of other adults. But you also model that there are behaviors that adults engage in which children do not.

[soleft]

4. I think she would agree with you actually

Especially now. I think was saying that he would keep doing what you say he will do, and that if, and it's a big if, he changes, it would only be after a long time, if ever.

[livetohike]

5. Oh, I guess I misinterpreted this then

:hi:

[high density]

6. 2009 was mostly a lost year for Obama (and the country) thanks to the blocking of the GOP

The stimulus went through after being tinkered with for the Republicans, and then it still got virtually no Republican support. Then everybody became entrenched on health insurance (which started out as health care) and we basically remained there in a holding pattern until his speech on Wednesday. There's still no easy solution to health insurance reform but at least there is now an agenda that has been laid out for moving beyond this issue.

Yes there have been some changes that have been able to leak through the logjam in DC, but Obama's overall idea of fixing Washington obviously isn't anywhere close to being realized at this point. Most people there obviously have a vested interest in the place not changing. I think he's finally realized the laid-back tactics need to change, especially when it comes to dealing with the Senate. Plouffe coming back is a good sign.

[rucky]

8. There is absolutely no incentive for the Republicans to cooperate.

Zero - nada. And if he did make it worth their while, Obama would have the Democrats to contend with. So I'm puzzled about what Obama's incentive has been to win GOP support. It doesn't seem rational. What am I missing here?

[rucky]

9. Independent swing voters?

maybe he's making bipartisan gestures to please them? Betting that they're sick of two-party partisanship, and the GOP's stubbornness will kill their independent support in midterms?

If that's the case, Dems need to start using the "o-word" - Obstructionism. On the Blue Dogs, too.

[LiberalFighter]

11. He was also talking to so called independents.

Making it clear that he is still trying to be bi-partisan about it, letting them know the Republicans are the main blockers of legislation.

He also made it clear to the Republican Congress that they have the responsibility to govern as well.



And if the Republican leadership is going to insist that 60 votes in the Senate are required to do any business at all in this town -- a supermajority -- then the responsibility to govern is now yours as well. (Applause.) Just saying no to everything may be good short-term politics, but it's not leadership. We were sent here to serve our citizens, not our ambitions. (Applause.) So let's show the American people that we can do it together. (Applause.)

[soleft]

10. I had this thought when they were going after Snowe for her vote

Is it possible, that Obama sees Washington and the political process as completely broken. And that until that is fixed, we'll just keep going along in this dysfunctional way, never really getting anything accomplished.

I was imagining if they got Snowe's vote, and some how that event gradually snowballed (Sorry), into a trend, if Obama could change the way Washington works, then decades to come, our government could actually work together and work on issues rather than trying to defeat each other.

So Obama not only sees the big picture, he sees a huge picture.

Only problem with that, it suggests a bit of a messiah complex - a "Well in 20 years they'll understand" kind of thinking. And that, unfortunately, would make him not that different from Bush. Granted, trying to rid Government of partisanship is better than invading another country.

[Clio the Leo]

12. A leopard cant change his spots....

.... and Barack Obama's spots are bipartisan ones.

The speech that we were all lauding 24 hours ago was full of that .... he even chastised Congress in a bipartisan manner.

I suspect those who are waiting for him to take a different path will be waiting a while.

The man has personal favorability rating in the 70s .... a number unchanged since his inauguration. His approach to bipartisanship is ONE of the reasons for that.

[Phx_Dem]

13. Righto. +1