Time: Van Hollen's slide for Dems detailing what insurance benefits will be available immediately

[flpoljunkie]

http://swampland.blogs.time.com/2010/03/13/health-care-the-talking-points/#more-23329

[babylonsister]

1. Thanks and bookmarked for future reference, and rec'd. nt

[JTFrog]

2. K&R

[midnight]

3. Does anyone know what Requiring premium rebates to enrollees is, and

what are high administrative expenditures?

[flpoljunkie]

5. If HHS Sec Sebelius rules a rate increase excessive, premium overcharge will be rebated to insured.

I think they are referring to the medical loss ratio--how much of the premiums must be spent on paying benefits to the insured.

[eridani]

7. 15 states have already tried this, and it has has no effect whatsoever on costs

Complete failure.

[jefferson_dem]

4. Facts...are stubborn things.

Thanks for posting.

[eridani]

6. HIgh risk pools are utterly useless overpriced garbage

My state has a pool, and it's useless unless you are very rich and very sick.

[CreekDog]

8. Well a better system than we have now is not on the table

However, a worse system is on the table.

by doing nothing, each day, the current system gets worse.

i'd rather have a high risk pool than nothing.

and i have friends facing the lifetime maximums on their insurance policies and this bill will end that immediately --and that's worth doing.

a lot of this stuff is worth doing.

[Raineyb]

10. In other words it'll benefit you so fuck everyone it doesn't.

Noted.

[CreekDog]

11. where did i say it will benefit me? i supported this even when my union was raising concerns

and if they were going to oppose it, i was going to take issue with that among my local membership.

so you are completely wrong about me.

i want universal health care so badly that if they said my rates would go up so that everyone could have access/care/coverage, i would be willing to pay.

if i didn't, knowing what i have, how could i sleep at night?

[Raineyb]

12. So it benefits some friends of yours. My mistake.

However, it doesn't seem to change the essence of your argument. It seems to me that a lot of people are pressing for the passage of this current bill because it will benefit some people (whether or not it will actually benefit them has been fodder for argument for months now) usually people they know, and if you don't want this bill passed you don't give a damn about all those uninsured people. Well people do care and they still don't want this bill passed because they believe that in the balance this bill hurts people more than it helps.

The high risk pool is a ghetto of overpriced insurance that even if you could pay the premiums have deductibles would make getting care unaffordable. No one is addressing this. They yammer on about subsidies as though that were the end all to be all of the problem of cost (which isn't even addressed in this bill so the insurance companies can continue to rape its customers with impunity) which it doesn't or that one could get a catastrophic plan, which for someone who has a preexisting condition wouldn't cover regular doctor visits to keep their condition under control, as though the catastrophic plan was some sort of panacea. What's worse, in all likelihood these people will find themselves unable to pay for the mandated crappy insurance plan and end up with no insurance at all so now they can PAY for the "privilege" of being uninsured? They're still uninsured! Only now they're being fined for it. At least with the status quo if you can't afford insurance it won't cost you anything.

There are a lot of people who will not find themselves benefiting from this plan at all which is a huge departure from covering everyone which should be the goal in the first place and to make the argument that it'll benefit so we should pass it isn't really the most convincing argument when you think of all the people who will be screwed by this bill. What's worse every time it's mentioned instead of acknowledging this the pat reply is "well you'll just have to suck it up." It's callous and it pisses me off and I tend to respond in kind.

However, as my reply bothered you, I will give you the benefit of the doubt and not assume that you were being as callous as so many of those who are insisting on this bill's passage as is. My apologies for dropping the f bomb in my characterization of your argument.

[eridani]

13. Even with "reform" the system gets worse

And now it will all be Democrats' fault.

[Vinca]

9. That's the same where I live. Only a handful of conditions

allow you into it and the premium is nearly $2,000 a month.

[Maestro]

14. Thanks for this.

I am debating a neocon who just brought up the four-year argument.

[golfguru]

15. Unfortunately none of those will benefit me !

My 18+ year old who is now covered by my insurance plan
so long as she is a full time student, and she will be for next
4 years in college. After that perhaps the new bill helps keep
her on my insurance, but that is 4 years away, not immediate.