Sorry to be saying this.....

[Firstzar]

...but Obama bought the paint for the corner he's now in. During the campaign, he criticized (quite rightly) the Iraq War, while calling Afghanistan a "war of necessity."

And did he not appoint McChrystal himself? (I'm open to correction on this one.)

Iraq shall never be Obama's war, no matter what happens after U.S. forces leave. But tonight, by all the reportage, he's gonna make his own purchase at Colin Powell's Pottery Barn.

[levander]

1. If Obama won't take ownership...

Iraq shall never be Obama's war, no matter what happens after U.S. forces leave.

If Obama won't take ownership of the war, he ought not escalate it.

It's like saying Vietnam wasn't Nixon's war. Yeah, Kennedy and Johnson get some of the blame, but Nixon deserves blame too.

[Firstzar]

2. But.....

...Obama isn't escalating in Iraq.

[FrenchieCat]

3. Obama became President, so both wars are his......

and he'll end them both. Then what?
What will the revolutionary rage folks
be mad about then?
Oh...I'm sure they'll find something.

[still_one]

4. and you know he will end both wars because...... /nt

[FrenchieCat]

5. Because he's ending one now,

and he will announce that the other one will end as well....
So I count 2.

[bigjohn16]

6. How many people will be sent to their death before he "ends" Afghanistan?

You can't call sending 30,000+ more troops ending a war.

[FrenchieCat]

8. Folks have been sent to their deaths for the last 8 years......

and when they went to Afghanistan, barely anyone gave a shit.

Now, real quick, everyone is concerned about death, exactly at the
moment that Obama decides to review the strategy and make some changes.

He's sending in 30,000+ troops with a plan and an exit strategy.
considering that prior nobody did shit there, I'm gonna listen tomorrow,
and not even come to this site afterward, as I don't want to get in the
way of those who will want to preen in their Utopian ideological sun,
as it will be like an intellectual fashion show where the choir will sing
to the choir about death, despair, and try to outdo each other on how
condescendingly they can describe this President and his supporters.

[bigjohn16]

10. Everyone cares now because a Democratic President is about to escalate a war.

If he doesn't give a timetable for exiting, which we know he won't, then this is just the same open ended quagmire we've had for the past 8 years. It's not preening to not want to waste our military, which is a finite resource, on nation building in an attempt to defeat such nebulous enemies as the Taliban or Alqaeda.

He'll own this war tomorrow and the lose of blood and treasure that follows.

[FrenchieCat]

12. He didn't start it, but he will end it......

we are in the middle of the process currently.
He's owned this war since he was inaugurated....
cause that's how long I've heard that.

[Orsino]

14. Your faith is touching...

...and I hope you're right about Afghanistan.

An escalation, though, is moving in the opposite direction--unless it's accompanied by a magical new strategy for winning enough of a "victory" for us to leave. I don't think that such a plan is possible, and that new troops there will simply prolong our stay.

It's clear that our occupation of Iraq is (currently) winding down. I'd like to think that President Obama will eventually find the courage to do the same in Afghanistan, but it doesn't appear that it will begin tonight.

[dionysus]

15. while i am sure many of the people outraged about this are sincere, some of them are fake.

they don't give a shit about the issue at hand, no matter what it is, they'll froth at it.

if obama started a program to give puppies to every child in america, these same people would be frothing at the mouth in perpetual outrage how he's discriminating against kittens.

[Cha]

19. You got that right.

as evidenced by the indefatigable cheap shots.

[freddie mertz]

21. But many more are undoubtedly sincere.

Your focus on what must be any measure be a small minority is not helpful to the discussion.

[still_one]

7. That will remain to be seen on both counts. History is definitely not with us either in both areas

[FrenchieCat]

9. You are correct, time will tell us......

After eight years of death, while many speculate negatively about it all,
I will see a light at the end of the tunnel.
Death we've been doing, but the light at the end of the tunnel is new.

[Name removed]

11. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[polichick]

13. By choosing McChrystal, Gates and Clinton - they want this...

...while Biden warned against it.

[Firstzar]

16. Biden is Right!

Look, I'm not advocating total withdrawal: That would be disastrous. Bring home the regular infantry, put the CIA on point, and use Special Ops military strikes to truncate the Taliban just enough so it can no longer play the reliable host to the terrorists. That way, you've got the rest of the military freed up to hit al Qaeda operations in Somalia, the Philippines, Indonesia, etc.

[polichick]

17. I totally agree - just like that campaign ad said, "Joe is Right"...

I'm sorry the prez sided with the military ~ it's tragic imo.

[Firstzar]

18. All presidents have to side with the military

After all, no red-blooded American man turns down a chance for glorious war! (belch)

[polichick]

20. Yeah, power and glory and all that. FOOLS! nt

[Firstzar]

22. Uh, dude?

I was being (belch) sarcastic.

[polichick]

23. I know, but unfortunately there's a certain amount of truth in it...

And, if not power and glory, an unrealistic arrogance.