Kucinich announces alliance with far right Republicans in Congress

[HamdenRice]

Has Dennis Kuchinich become the Lieberman of the left? On Democracy Now yesterday, Kucinich acknowledged going on Fox News to make common cause with far right congressional critics of the administration, and said that he would form an alliance with them, and that liberal/conservative distinctions no longer matter to him. This coming from the man who announced early in his 2008 presidential race that he was considering far right winger Ron Paul as his running mate:

http://i3.democracynow.org/2009/12/2/rep_kucinich_on_afghanistan_war_were

AMY GOODMAN: The War Appropriations Bill almost didn’t get passed. There was a lot of opposition in Congress. But what is your sense of what will happen now?
...
Do you find actually on the media—I bumped into you yesterday when you were heading into Fox in Washington, D.C.—that you are making more common cause with those on the right who are actually saying that the struggle is here at home and that we shouldn’t be in Afghanistan spending this money?

REP. DENNIS KUCINCH: The answer to that is yes. and I think we need to look for common cause with people with whom we may have a different way of looking at the world. I cite as an example Congressman Rohrabacher from California. Another example, Congressman Duncan. Congressman Chaffetz from <Utah>. They’re all challenging the war.

The Cato Institute has issued what I think is a very reasoned approach towards getting out of Afghanistan. We need to look for allies across the boards here, and we have to get away from the old thinking that pigeonholes any of us into left/right, liberal/conservative.

<end quote>

Rohrabacher -- anti marriage equality; anti-choice; immigration hardliner; voted against stimulus, mortgage relief, regulating subprime lending, rehabbing public housing; voted against banning job discrimination for sexual orientation; voted for constitutional amendment to restrict marriage to only between a man and a woman; voted to ban gay adoption in DC; strongly pro free trade; strongly anti-environment.

John "Jimmy" Duncan -- member of far right libertarian caucus in the House, Liberty Caucus; extremist anti-choice positions, such as criminalizing inter-state travel by minors to get an abortion; voted against bill to ban job discrimination based on sexual orientation; voted for constitutional amendment banning same sex marriage; voted against stimulus bill; highly rated by Christian Coalition; voted against expanded health care for low income children.

Jason Chaffetz -- staunchly anti-choice; voted no on stimulus; opposed to marriage equality.

http://www.ontheissues.org/CA/Dana_Rohrabacher.htm
http://www.ontheissues.org/House/Jimmy_Duncan.htm
http://www.ontheissues.org/House/Jason_Chaffetz.htm

[firedupdem]

1. Rec'd

Sounds like he joined up with a great bunch.

[Dinger]

3. Unrec'd (nt)

[HamdenRice]

9. The truth hurts, doesn't it?

[spiritual_gunfighter]

18. unrec'd, it looks like this post aint gonna make it n/t

[mcablue]

24. Your logic makes nosense: that if a man is anti-choice, he must be wrong regarding the war, too

Listen to your logic:

Kucinich is pro-choice.
Certain Republican congressman is anti-choice.
Therefore, Kucinich must oppose whatever the anti-choice congressman says about the war in Afghanistan.

How in the world are abortion and the war in Afghanistan connected? Is it not possible for a Republican to be right in one issue and wrong in another one? Is Kucinich joining the anti-choice congressman in his anti-choice position? No, he is not.

And why don't you applaud Kucinich for opposing what MOST Republicans think about the war, which is sending 40,000 troops there?

[HamdenRice]

29. Why not form an alliance with anti-war progressive Democrats?

Why does he have this thing for boosting the profiles of far right wingers like these congressmen and Ron Paul?

It's because he is nothing more than a con man and grand stander. If he formed common cause with the left of the Democrats, he'd be just another face in the crowd.

It's about ego and poor judgment. Assuming they got their way and the war ended earlier making funds available, would Kooch's new allies support domestic spending increases?

Do you agree with him that left/right and liberal/conservative distinctions don't matter anymore?

Also, btw, Kooch was anti-choice for most of his political career.

[John Q. Citizen]

37. Dennis is Vice Chairman of the Congressional Progressive Caucus. He already done what you want him

to. http://cpc.grijalva.house.gov/index.cfm?ContentID=166&ParentID=0&SectionID=4&SectionTree=4&lnk=b&ItemID=164

He's so far ahead of his regressive Democratic Blue Dog conservative detractors that it would make your head spin, Hamden.

Here's where you can make a contribution so Dennis can do his work. http://kucinich.us/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=46&Itemid=58


Thanks for letting us know that Dennis is working with everyone to stop the needless loss of life and treasure that America's Imperialistic wars are.

Kucinich certainly is one of the good guys!

[treestar]

74. It's time for that four quadrant thing

Libertarians put it out. They agree with us on social issues and disagree on economic. And reverse of that with the conservatives.

Real far out rightists are against the war but for different reasons - their isolationism.

Dennis is the only Democrat in the lower left quadrant and Ron Paul was in the lower right quadrant.

[ClarkUSA]

47. Kucinich is no Messiah. He's just a sellout on a soapbox. Hope he gets primaried by a real Dem.

Kucinich = :puke:

[liquid diamond]

99. I never paid much attention to that little shit until recent weeks.

First his refusal to punish Joe Wilson. Then he stabs us in the back on health care and now this. Fuck Kooch.

[Buzz Clik]

2. That's fucking brilliant. He's going to ally with those who gave us this war in the first place.

What an ass.

[HamdenRice]

6. To be fair, he's talking about far right paleo-conservatives, not neo-cons

and some paleo conservatives have been opposed to the war.

But the funny thing about the Kooch, is he doesn't announce he's going to form an alliance with the progressives of congress, and chooses instead the paleo-conservatives and libertarians.

I think that's because (1) that's kind of what he is on many levels, and (2) if he forms an alliance with progressives, he's just one in the crowd and can't grandstand.

His ego prevents him from doing anything cooperative with like minded Democrats.

[Nicholas D Wolfwood]

20. It's kind of funny.

Dennis has gone so far off the deep end to the left, that he actually reappears on the right hand side of the screen, as if it were Pac-Man.

[These Eyes]

54. Thank you…

for a MUCH needed laugh! :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[treestar]

75. It's an example of politics making strange bedfellows

Opposing the war, they can make common cause on that, even though their underlying reasons for opposing it are different.

[Ruby the Liberal]

84. Sounds like he is siding with the Libertarians.

On this issue, (and precious few others) I agree with them as well.

[knightinwhitesatin]

91. As opposed to

a certain CinC who is doing the same by giving them more war?

[Starry Messenger]

92. "Be vewy vewy quiet...

we're wiberal hunting." Howdy knight, welcome to DU. I've been enjoying your input. :)

[knightinwhitesatin]

93. thanks

I'm floored to see people actually supporting more death.

On any other issue I have no beef with my man Barack, but this war is something that is going to screw up his entire agenda.

[Pirate Smile]

4. Not surprising. He voted with them on the Stimulus and Health Care Reform too.

[mcablue]

61. Please do better research: Kucinich voted YES on the stimulus package (All Republicans voted no)

http://clerk.house.gov/evs/2009/roll046.xml

[Mass]

5. Nothing wrong in having a tactical alliance as long as you understand that you disagree on the

ultimate goals.

The problem here is when some people think Ron Paul is a hero and would vote for him in a general election, or propose that RWers take a role in an administration because they happen to be right on ONE issue.

But I really see no reason to get opponents to vote for your vision of the world in a temporary alliance. What I disagree with is what moderates do: change your vision of the world to get a few votes and get nothing else in return.

[HamdenRice]

7. Does that apply to Obama trying to peel off the remaining northeast republicans?

Or is it only an acceptable strategy when Saint Kooch does it?

[Mass]

12. Sure, as long as they stand firm on their goals and do not give the house away

to get the votes.

I am not concerned about Kooch changing his views on Afghanistan in order to ally with the far right. They have a temporary common goal, not escalating there.

I am concerned though, about concessions and about on the other side people not understanding the difference between a very narrow common goal and a broad agreement on principle (probably a reason why so many people here revere Ron Paul and see nothing wrong with Buchanan!!).

[HamdenRice]

13. Here's what I don't get (as I wrote below)--if it's about saving money to take care of "home" issues

Then assuming both the paleo conservatives and progressives got their way and ended the war sooner, and there was money available, the paleo-conservatives would be dead set against spending it on "at home" issues; that's the very essence of paleo-conservativism. So other than being in opposition to the administration, I can't quite figure out what the alliance is about.

[Mass]

14. This is a narrow alliance. Stop the escalation so that the money is there. Then there will be

plenty of dems (some of whom are not happy sending more troops anyway but do not want to oppose the president openly), to work with Kooch on how to spend the money on "at home" issues.

But the first step is to have this money available, and for this, he needs to ally with the RW.

(I am not saying I agree with the strategy. I am just explaining how the game is played. It probably will not work, but who knows).

[WhiteTara]

8. Duncan and Rohrabacher

are thieves as well. Bad move Dennis.

[HamdenRice]

10. Another bizarre aspect: if it's common cause to focus on "at home" problems, then ...

assuming Dennis and the paleo-cons got their way and ended the war sooner, the paleo-cons would in fact oppose all the domestic spending that Kooch says he wants to end the war to fund.

It makes no sense on any level -- practical, political or ideological.

[goclark]

110. I am so shocked at Dennis

Maybe I'm missing something but he sounds more and more like Joey L. everyday.

Democrats are acting like crabs in a barrel, Republicans must be jumping for joy!

[mdmc]

11. The corporate middle should be removed like a cancer

God bless Dennis Kucinich and all that see that the current system is not working for America (except corporate America).

[karynnj]

15. With any sanity, this should end the Kucinich the hero fantasy here

The fact is that the far right only aligns with him on stopping things - so all he is doing is publicly opting to be an obstructionist. He is now part of the problem.

My question is whether organizations like Bold Progressives will support efforts to primary him to get a more dependable vote on our issues.

[John Q. Citizen]

43. Kucinich is America's Congressman. He's a very hard worker and a very good man. I just sent him

10 bucks and you can to, if you want to.

http://kucinich.us/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=46&Itemid=58

[slipslidingaway]

80. We should get rid of Grayson as well, his alliance with Ron Paul and his...

position against the escalation need to be challenged.

[The Northerner]

96. He's only aligned with Paul on Auditing the Fed and not escalating troop deployment

On pretty much everything else they disagree.

BTW, I also agree that the Fed should be audited to see what they've been doing for so long.

[slipslidingaway]

100. According to the OP Kucinich has formed an alliance with some Repubs and ...

then goes on to list what the Repubs support, as if Kucinich agrees with all those points.

Following that logic Grayson must agree with everything Paul represents, that is dangerous thinking IMO. I agree on the Fed audit and posted the bill here back in March, it was ignored until Grayson took up the cause.

That does not mean I agree with Paul on everything either.

:evilgrin:

Welcome to DU

:hi:


"Rohrabacher -- anti marriage equality; anti-choice; immigration hardliner; voted against stimulus, mortgage relief, regulating subprime lending, rehabbing public housing; voted against banning job discrimination for sexual orientation; voted for constitutional amendment to restrict marriage to only between a man and a woman; voted to ban gay adoption in DC; strongly pro free trade; strongly anti-environment.

John "Jimmy" Duncan -- member of far right libertarian caucus in the House, Liberty Caucus; extremist anti-choice positions, such as criminalizing inter-state travel by minors to get an abortion; voted against bill to ban job discrimination based on sexual orientation; voted for constitutional amendment banning same sex marriage; voted against stimulus bill; highly rated by Christian Coalition; voted against expanded health care for low income children.

Jason Chaffetz -- staunchly anti-choice; voted no on stimulus; opposed to marriage equality."

[Ninga]

16. Those of us who live in NE Ohio have watched in horror as Dennis defends

GOP Ohio Cong. Steve LaTourette by refusing ever, to endorse or support any Dem who dares
to run against LaTourette.

Dennis prefers to do the right thing when everyone is watching. He could care less about
doing the right thing in private.

[hayu_lol]

17. The UFOs must be landing in Ohio...

in force.

Dennis 'do-nothing' Kucinich is getting desperate.

[HamdenRice]

21. Why doesn't he support Democratic challengers?

Does he offer any explanation?

[Ninga]

39. He told the last 2 challengers, face to face, that LaTourette is a friend of his and that

he would not endorse, publicly comment or support any challenger.

This is the full truth of the matter.


BTW
LaTourette cast the deciding vote for CAFTA, after telling a roomful of constituents he wouldn't vote for it under any circumstance.

Here is a TPM post on the subject of LaTourette and CAFTA. http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com/archives/151490.php

[HamdenRice]

49. I guess friendship trumps public policy and the well being of the country nt

[Ikonoklast]

112. Try telling that to the out-of-staters that think Kooch is a saint.

He sticks a knife in the back of anyone trying to run against that fucking snake LaTourette.

The only reason Kooch retained his seat was the last-minute appeal for out-of-state campaign money, as his re-election campaign was broke. He lied to his constituents when he told them he would pay more attention to them, and not run for president the last election cycle.

Then he ran anyway, and that pissed off a lot of people.


Cimperman, as shitty a candidate as he is, was giving him a run for his money, so St. Dennis actually called the Federal Protection Services on him.

A real dick move trying to use the government to intimidate a political opponent.

That was the reason he quit the presidential and quickly got back into his district. They were getting sick of him running for president, and neglecting them at home.

He was lucky to pull it out at the last minute.

[mcablue]

19. Can you please tell us Kucinich's rating among conservative interest groups?

Let me give you a hint: Very close to zero (if not zero).

And look at your weird, nonsensical logic: "Congressman X is anto-choice, therefore Kucinich shouldn't join him in opposing the escalation of the Afghanistan war."

What does abortion have to do with the Afghanistan war?

[HamdenRice]

22. I'm sure that if they re-rated him based on post-inauguration votes, he would be highly rated now

The past is the past. Obviously Dennis has had some sort of change of heart -- or maybe it's that the mind directions from the UFO have changed.

[mcablue]

44. Kucinich will be highly rated by coservatives? After voting for the stimulus, against Stupak...

Voting yes on the hate crimes expansion (which Republicans ovewhelmingly opposed), etc.? Very interesting.

Exaggeration of the milenium if you ask me. Nobody without hatred towards Kucinich would predict that he will be "highly rated" by conservative groups based on his votes this year.

I will gladly take your bet though. We'll check on the ratings next year and see what happened.

[DCBob]

23. So Dennis agreed with President Bush on starting this war...

but opposes President Obama who is trying to finish it.

[freddie mertz]

25. Isn't the president going to have to rely on conservative Republicans for support too?

That is my understanding, anyway.

[HamdenRice]

On the additional troops in Afghanistan, probably yes

The issue is: if bipartisanship is OK for Dennis, is it OK for Obama?

[freddie mertz]

51. But in this thread, it is the "Obama Ha Sempre Ragione" crowd who are bashing

Dennis for seeking bi-partiasn support for HIS position.

Can you not see the irony?

[mkultra]

26. he talking about bi-partisanship, something Obama does

to the ire of the Dennisons. Entertaining.

[vaberella]

38. Very. n/t

[Clio the Leo]

27. Unfortunately, I think Lieberman is slightly.....

.... more intelligent than Kucinich. Not MUCH but a little bit.

Bachmann perhaps?

[WeDidIt]

76. A bit more reliable when it comes to the big votes, too. n/t

[Freddie Stubbs]

28. Why the surprise? He wanted Ron Paul as his VP

[mikelgb]

32. Why not just make it your fucking sig line?

He said he'd consider it.

Perhaps he should have considered a war pig Blue Dog instead? maybe a woman hater like Stupak? Which one of your beloved blue dogs should it have been?

[Freddie Stubbs]

36. Wow. I must have really touched a nerve

He was considering putting a small-government Republican one heart beat away from the presidency? Brilliant!

[Sebastian Doyle]

95. And Al Gore invented the internet, right?

:eyes:

[Freddie Stubbs]

106. Hear the audio yourself:

http://blog.cleveland.com/openers/2007/11/exclusive_audio_kucinich_consi.html

[RufusTFirefly]

30. This is really your life's work, isn't it?

Pathetic.

[mikelgb]

31. So Kucinich champions Obama's meme of bipartisanship and you kick him for that too?

Kooch haters are hilarious in their zeal.

[msongs]

33. the administration prefers bipartisanship nt

[HamdenRice]

34. The administration is trying to peel off Republican moderates. Kooch is going after the far right

republicans.

You don't find that a little odd?

Do you agree with Kooch that left/right and liberal/conservative distinctions don't matter anymore?

[karynnj]

40. uhmm Obama wants bipartisan coalitions to do things, Kucinich wants them to obstruct things from

being done. Big difference.

[mikelgb]

52. Yes to obstruct war from being done.

And Obama wants bipartisan coalitions to do what things besides war and insurance welfare?

[Dr Robert]

59. that's not what he's doing. he's betraying his own party out of spite.

[slipslidingaway]

83. Gone!!!! nt

[stranger81]

66. These people would kick DK for saying the grass is green.

He doesn't toe the DLC party line, much to their consternation.

[PinkoDonkey]

35. Isn't this just part of, well, politics?

Sometimes a politician makes common cause on a particular issue with those s/he generally disagrees with. I'm not sure what's wrong with that.

On foreign policy issues, there is a lot of overlap between the far left and the far right. The way they get there might be different, but both sides contain a strong anti-interventionist element. It's really not too shocking that they'd end up speaking to one another.

[RufusTFirefly]

41. Centrism vs. Common Ground: For the people who slept through civics class

Not naming any names here, but some people would appear to be pretty dim.

If my obnoxious right-wing neighbor says, "You know, I think I'm just going to come over there and swipe everything you own because I think I'm entitled to it," if I'm a centrist, I might say, "Now, hold on there. I'm sure we can come to some sort of agreement. How about if I just let you take my car and my television instead of everything I own?" I have found the center between his outrageous demands and my rights of ownership. I'll tell my wife triumphantly about our great victory.

Finding common ground is different. If I like hockey and learn that my right-wing neighbor likes hockey, I might go to a game with him. In fact, we might even have a good time together. We may even learn to understand each other better. That's called finding common ground.

Our best politicians don't capitulate. They find common ground. There are dozens of examples. Just two come to mind:

Kennedy-Hatch Serve America Act (Omigod! Ted Kennedy was a right-wing sellout!)
McCain-Feingold amendment (I guess that means Feingold supported Sarah Palin, eh?)

[depakid]

73. +1

Not saying that its wise to ever trust a Republican, though.

[HopeOverFear]

42. extremism loves company. n/m

[mcablue]

45. If extremism has company, why doesn't Kucinich turn anti-choice?

After all, you are claiming that Kucinich is bound to start imitating these Republicans' extremists positions.

[ClarkUSA]

46. He was anti-choice until the 2004 primaries, when he conveniently changed his lifelong position.

Guess he wants to run in 2012. Oh goody.

[mcablue]

62. Wait...but I thought the narrative was that he is turning conservative

Does this mean that he's been turning liberal? On one side we're told that he's making deals with conservatives; on the other side we're told that he's been turning liberal for political convenience.

I do not understand. The guy is damned if he does, damned if he doesn't.

[HamdenRice]

48. Kucinich was anti-choice for most of his political career nt

[mcablue]

64. Hamdan, you said earlier that "the past is the past." Why do you bring up the past in this instance?

Consistency problems?

[Vidar]

50. Obama is far better known for his bipartisan sellout schemes than Kucinich.

[AlinPA]

53. Alliance with Rohrabacher? Sorry Dennis, I respected you since your beginning

in politics, but not now.

re: "Rohrabacher -- anti marriage equality; anti-choice; immigration hardliner; voted against stimulus, mortgage relief, regulating subprime lending, rehabbing public housing; voted against banning job discrimination for sexual orientation; voted for constitutional amendment to restrict marriage to only between a man and a woman; voted to ban gay adoption in DC; strongly pro free trade; strongly anti-environment."

[Orsino]

55. Gee. Shiny new headline...

...that cleverly reveals Kucinich's sinister plot to work with other Congresscritters to end a war.

Truly, there is no end to the man's barbarity.

[Peacetrain]

56. Well the right used Nadar and made him impotent, they used Lieberman

(and he is now not even a Democrat anymore) and of course they are going to try an attract Kuch.

It is one of the oldest tricks in their play book.. I am not a bit surprised.

It is a seek and destroy agenda. Kuch if he falls for it, will be just walking the footsteps of people who have been sucked in before.

The inability to accept compromise on your own side, forcing you into an alliance with those who seek to destroy everything you stand for in the end, has always been a mystery to me.. But it keeps working for them

[HamdenRice]

57. You left out Sharpton also

Whatever else you can say about him, from the perspective of local NY police politics he has at times done a lot of good and during presidential campaigns sometimes injected some common sense into the spin.

But his last campaign was funded by some of the sleaziest repug operatives around, just to make the Democratic field look kooky and marginal.

I think they are doing the same with Kooch. I notice that he seems to be on Fox much, much more than on MSM outlets -- and the point is that for Fox viewers he is used to represent "kooky Democrats," and he goes right along with it.

[Peacetrain]

60. I know, I know..

I still hurt for Nadar..We owe him so much as consumers, and he was sucked in with the money and the petting his ego.. and the poor guy fell for it hook line and sinker.

It is part of the Rove package.. and they are still using it, because it just works.

[Dr Robert]

58. what a fuckin' Hero, eh?

:sarcasm:
:puke:

[dionysus]

63. ah, the travelocity gnome strikes anew.

[Dr Robert]

65. the worst part is that he is doing this and still will accomplish nothing

other than completely marginalizing himself...

[Stevepol]

67. Kucinich is what every rep should be: he bases his decisions on PRINCIPLE not personalities.

[HamdenRice]

68. That's not what one of his constituents in this thread says. He supports LaTourette(R) a "friend"

So he refuses to endorse Democrat challengers to a republican congressman because they are friends? Isn't that personality over principal?

[slipslidingaway]

78. Well I would like to hear that or see a quote in writing before continuing...

to spread that information.

Too bad Congress never took up the infrastructure bill that Kucinich and LaTourette have introduced for almost the last decade - who needs jobs and repairs to our crumbling system.

Besides we needed the money to prop up the too big to fail financial institutions after they got in trouble taking on risky plays.

[HamdenRice]

81. See post 16 and subthread by someone from Ohio nt

[slipslidingaway]

82. There is no proof in that post and if this is true you might think there...

should be something written about this.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=433&topic_id=35240&mesg_id=35484

"He told the last 2 challengers, face to face, that LaTourette is a friend of his and that he would not endorse, publicly comment or support any challenger.

This is the full truth of the matter."


Are you willing to accept, and then repeat, something a poster says on DU without anything to substantiate that statement?

This poster may be correct, I have no way of knowing, but will not just accept this as proof of the original claim.

I guess you will.

:shrug:


You really should go after some other Dems as well - Grayson obviously agrees with Ron Paul about everything, he worked hard to gain cosponsors on his Audit the Fed bill. Make sure to post Ron Paul's record in your Grayson post so people will associate all prior votes with Grayson!

[Cha]

70. kucinich is based on opportunity and hypocricy.

[Cha]

69. Not even batting an eye..my opinion of kucinich

is.. he's a hypocrite.

http://www.cleveland.com/kucinich/plaindealer/index.ssf?/kucinich/more/104747092810861.html

http://www.jessekb.com/2007/04/26/dennis-kucinich-is-a-swarmy-pro-life-opportunist/

http://2politicaljunkies.blogspot.com/2007/11/dennis-kucinich-hearts-ron-paul.html

[slipslidingaway]

79. How dare Obama change his mind on SP, in 2003 he told union members...

that the Dems needed to take back the WH and Congress.

Obviously once you support something you can NEVER, EVER change your mind.

[Norrin Radd]

71. Still burned up that he opposed your beloved bank bail out?

[earth mom]

120. You hit the nail on the head. The OP has a mean and nasty ax to grind. nt

[depakid]

72. A good example of what happens when there's a political vacuum on an issue

Sort of like Sanders joining Ron Paul in trying to get an audit on the Fed.

You also see these alliances on immigration matters throughout history- which make immigration an excellent template within which to study the promulgation and implementation of public policy.

Transcends partisanship and focuses on the interests and the players.

[slipslidingaway]

77. Kucinich always votes against the people and for the corporations, obviously...

he needs to lose the next election.

If needed...

:sarcasm:

Announces an alliance! Just because someone agrees on one point, that does not mean they agree with everything that person has supported or said in the past...or will say in the future.

Is that a really hard concept to try and understand?

:eyes:

Read what Kucinich said about the needs here at home before the IWR vote.

Many Republicans were too loyal to their Party and went along with Bush's request for war funds. Loyalty should be to the people of the country, before loyalty to the Party.


Kucinich from the interview...

"...We need to look for allies across the boards here, and we have to get away from the old thinking that pigeonholes any of us into left/right, liberal/conservative.

We’re all Americans. We ought to be talking about what is best for America, without regard to what particular place we stand on a political spectrum. Sooner or later, we all meet in a place of concern about whether we can afford these continued military adventures and whether or not it’s time for us to start focusing on taking care of things here at home..."

[ProSense]

85. Yeah, voting for the people by voting with the Republicans against Democratic bills.

Kucinich delivers a big fat nothing.

[slipslidingaway]

89. When the Democratic bill is a give a way to insurance companies...

then I would hope any real Dem would vote against the bill.

It was so nice of the Obama administration to pull the state single payer amendment from consideration.

:(

He also voted against the China Trade bill and the financial deregulation bill - those were Dem backed bills that are coming back to haunt us.

Tell me who voted for the people in those bills.

We must marginalize Kucinich at all costs, look at all the posts complaining about him speaking out against escalating the war in Afghanistan.

Where are the posts about other members of Congress?

This OP is a pretty nasty attempt to smear one member who has been right many times, even when it was not popular.

[mcablue]

98. self-delete n/t

[Cha]

105. Don't let facts get in the way.

[Romulox]

86. LOL at how principles over party just BAFFLES the OP!

He opposes war no matter who the CIC is? How can this be? :rofl:

[Hippo_Tron]

104. I don't doubt that Kucinich's position is genuine

But Dana Rohrabacher had no problem with war when Bush was President. Making alliances with people who have no opposition to war other than the fact that the President is a Democrat is not really a good way to stop a war.

[QC]

107. Pretty much everything baffles the OP. n/t

[Romulox]

108. It's almost sad, since he seems so proud of himself. Like he really made a big find!

:silly:

[QC]

111. You are far more kindhearted than I.

I just find the whole thing amusing.

[SIMPLYB1980]

87. I told ya'll.

:popcorn:

[two-fold nature]

88. This is no more surprising

than the fact that it was you specifically who chose to make an OP about it.

There ain't really a dimes worth of difference between the so-called left in America and the omnipresent far right.

When everything is a consumer choice "issue," what is remotely unreasonable about making alliances with those who've made a similar consumer choice about any one of them?

You list off a litany of "issues" as though they somehow form a coherent body of political "difference." Well, they don't. And merely because some folks who don't agree on what's on aisle 9 of the political supermarket shouldn't, in the thoroughly fucked up "marketplace of ideas" that passes for meaningful politics to liberals of all stripes, preclude maing alliances on the proverbial aisle 7. Indeed, nothing else that supposedly defines the "left" in America is any more inscrutable nor any more rooted in the materialist reality that helps one to make sense of it all rather than decrying those who are not "team players."

I have to say it is with bemusement that I have lurked around and read content like the OP here. "underground" my ass.

Politics is economics. Nothing less and nothing more. And where economics are concerned, there ain't a dimes worth of difference. So Kuci, fuckin' new age kook that he is, is far from out of line despite what party propagandists wish to say otherwise.

[knightinwhitesatin]

90. I guess that makes sense

Obama seems to have made an alliance with those fuckers about surging into Afghanistan...

[slipslidingaway]

94. Is there a press release for this alliance from Kucinich, still waiting ...

for your post on Alan Grayson.

Remember to link Ron Paul's record, obviously you have to buy the entire package.

[IndianaGreen]

97. Obama's war sucks, and you will find antiwar politics making strange bedfellows

so it doesn't matter whether is a rightwing Mormon congressman from Utah, or a progressive one from Ohio, the point is that this war is EVIL and it must be stopped.

We elected Obama, but we got a DLC government instead.

As someone else said, "Obama is Clinton without the sleaze."

[slipslidingaway]

103. Right and left joined to try and defeat the FISA bill, but we know ...

who won.

:(

[Warren Stupidity]

101. DK stands against PermaWar. Who stands with him?

I do.

[Hippo_Tron]

102. While the CATO institute is right on occasion, these folks liked war when Bush was President

Now that there's a Democratic President they're less fond of it. The thing that they have in common with Kucinich is that they will never be President. Thus they will never have to deal with the grim realities that one faces when they enter that job and can continue to live in fantasy land.

[Romulox]

109. So...who's decided that they like war because Obama is President?

Several of the posters to this thread, for a start. :hi:

[Hippo_Tron]

113. Your point?

[Romulox]

114. Supporting "our team's" war seems objectively worse than opposing "their team's" war

if one looks at from the perspective that war is objectively undesirable. :hi:

[Hippo_Tron]

115. Not really

If they support a war when Bush is president, stop supporting it when Obama is president, and will start supporting it again when Palin is president they've done nothing anti-war and thus their position is not objectively any better. They're simply trying to create an outcome where wars are being fought with Republicans in the White House rather than Democrats in the White House.

If Kucinich's desire is genuinely to stop war (and I believe it is) then his methods of doing so are foolish.

:hi:

[Romulox]

117. You need to look at it from the other side now..."If they support war when Obama is President,"

...and then oppose it when a Republican is President, you are using the lives of men and women as pawns in your political game without regard for any principle beyond "Go team!"

A disgusting proposition, to say the least!

[Hippo_Tron]

118. I never suggested otherwise

Supporting a war because your guy is fighting it is indeed disgusting. It doesn't change the fact that making alliances with people who blatantly don't share your objectives in reality is stupid.

[Lord Helmet]

116. I voted for K in the primary but I don't see any logic in this strategy.

[saltpoint]

119. Who knows what Kucinich is thinking.

Or if he's thinking at all.

FOX News. To form an alliance with ultra conservatives.

Jesus.

[ima_sinnic]

121. must everything be "partisan"? I don't care what "side" they're on if they're against

this stinking war.

Gee, Dennis, who leads the progressive caucus in the House, should act like a 5th-grade republican and refuse to associate with people in the other party JUST BECAUSE they're in that other party?

It might actually turn out that, by joining forces, those who oppose the WASTE and CARNAGE might actually succeed in turning around this bone-headed, greedy war and extricating us from Afghanistan. Ya think?

I mean Obama has wasted a year striving for the myth of "bipartisanship" and none of his cheerleaders saw anything wrong with that. Now Kucinich might succeed at it and it's all bad.