A Market Punishing to Mothers

[Sgent]

Source: NY Times

The last three men nominated to the Supreme Court have all been married and, among them, have seven children. The last three women — Elena Kagan, Sonia Sotomayor and Harriet Miers (who withdrew) — have all been single and without children.

This little pattern makes the court a good symbol of the American job market. Women and men with similar qualifications — age, education, experience — are much more likely to be treated similarly today than in the past. The pay gap between them, while still not zero, has shrunk to just a few percentage points.

Yet once you look beyond the tidy comparisons of supposedly identical men and women, the picture is much less sunny. There are still only 15 Fortune 500 companies with a female chief executive. Men dominate the next rungs of management in most fields, too. Over all, full-time female workers make a whopping 23 percent less on average than full-time male workers.

What’s going on? Men and women are not identical, of course. Many more women take time off from work. Many more women work part time at some point in their careers. Many more women can’t get to work early or stay late.

Read more: http://www.nytimes.com/2010/08/04/business/economy/04leonhardt.html?_r=1&hp

[applegrove]

1. If Alito has less than 8 children...and he must because there are only 7 in total...

then he is not being a good catholic.

[RainDog]

2. every woman I know knows this is true

quote:

...our economy exacts a terribly steep price for any time away from work — in both pay and promotions. People often cannot just pick up where they have left off. Entire career paths are closed off. The hit to earnings is permanent.

The fact that the job market has evolved in this way is no accident. It’s a result of policy choices. As Jane Waldfogel, a Columbia University professor who studies families and work, says, “American feminists made a conscious choice to emphasize equal rights and equal opportunities, but not to talk about policies that would address family responsibilities.”

No fault divorce laws also punish women who put their families before careers. It pretends that woman can make up for that time out of the work force - when these studies show they obviously cannot.

...but every woman I know already knew this was true.

[knitter4democracy]

5. I was told that my repayment for my ex's degree was getting to stay home.

The lawyer who ran our mediation said that I was already repaid for his MD by being a stay-at-home mom all those years. He then went on to say that I should find a new job easily, since even his receptionist made $30/hr. We're in Michigan, and he was an idiot.

[Tumbulu]

7. How sick!!!!! I am sorry you had to go through this (nt)

[knitter4democracy]

13. He wasn't the worst part of the process.

We've been in court 14 or 15 times in a year and a half or so (I've lost count). I'm just sick of the entire process.

[Tumbulu]

6. So true, we all know this

but it still infuriates me.

In this way motherhood and typically female professions were thrown under the bus.

US feminists were not in a vacuum. They are part of the US culture which values money and individualism more than anything else. If a woman wants to be equal to a man on the workforce here in the US , she has to work like a man who has a wife supporting him. And yes, there are a few men who take this role on for their mates, but very few.

[Alcibiades]

3. Doesn't address the question of a "daddy track"

Do dads who take time off to raise their kids also take a hit? That would be a good apples to apples comparison.

[RainDog]

11. yes n/t

[Jennicut]

12. My husband took time off after my first daughter to stay home with me

and that boss was fine with it. His second boss after he moved into a different department gave him a hard time after the birth of our second daughter so he went to human resources and they told the boss that he was allowed a week off. Both bosses were males. I guess it depends on the person.

[defendandprotect]

4. K&R ---

[snot]

8. EXACTLY! The BEST a woman faces is the WORST a man faces --

I.e., w.r.t. the burdens carried outside one's profession, the WORST most men have faced is that either they're single w/o kids so have few outside responsibilities or they have a family and actually do carry their fair 50% share of outside responsibilities.

That is the BEST women can hope for; and the vast majority who have spouses or families STILL carry more than their fair share of outside responsibilities.

The extra responsibilities add up, in both time, energy, and levels of stress. (Not to mention that women STILL face considerable discrimination within their jobs/professions, in addition to the extra responsibilities elsewhere. AND not to mention they're STILL paid less for the same work.)

[Demeter]

9. It Doesn't Matter--Throw the Women and Chilldren Under the Bus

:sarcasm:

As long as Man is the King of Beasts.

[AnneD]

10. In a nutshell....

No excuse I know I did stupid at first but.....

Ex left shortly after I had child. We were together almost 10 years but he said child not his. Paid no child support for first 5 years-meanwhile I was going to Nursing school and working full time. Gave up sleep but had great friends. He had a degree and lots of job offers (even one that was a great gimme from a friend) but he wanted to do his own business (I have had hobbies that paid more) and live with parents.

The results of the first custody battle. I got the child and he had to pay 335.28 cents (this included paying me for my carrying ins on the child). This was unchanged for almost 10 years.

Fast forward 8 years. Child is teenager. I remarry. Child unhappy and makes up stories about new hubby. Ex takes me to court on of charges that were thrown out due to no evidence. Ex still lives at home (he is 45) and still not supporting himself.

The courts decision II... The kid goes to hubby I have to pay 878 in child support PLUS weekly music lessons ($45), and the cost of the instrument, plus insurance, This totaled to over 1/2 of my paycheck. Current hubby did not make much-I was the major bread winner. We had to move to a small RV and I worked like a dog for 2 years (the amount of time before he could take me to court to up the support) to pay bills. Ex still lived at home with his elderly mother rising a headstrong teen.

If you think working 2 full time jobs is hard, try parenting from a distance with your hands tied. Thank God I had her for as long as I did because the courts but a sorry example of a man/father in front of her. Disneyland dad over responsibility mom. My words to her once she graduated college-" I love you with all my heart but henceforth-you are on your own. I now have to save up for retirement so as not to be a burden to you in my old age. I will try to help you know and again but you are basically on your own now."

In America we love happy endings... so here goes.

The job I worked so hard to stay on has an old fashioned pension and I am eligible to retire when I turn 58, We are working on saving to buy a house so I really won't retire then but will be able to shortly after that. We are close to being totally debt free by next year. Ex had to go to work. He never told his mom he was getting child support and was not paying for anything while daughter was there. As a result his mom is running out of retirement money and her home will have to be sold when she dies and he will be out. As I predicted-once the checks stopped-he really had to start working. While he has his own tile installation company-he will be working for some time.

My latest thought. When I get my house, I think I will have him re-tile part of my floor. I will take great satisfaction walking all over that floor as I plan my day, knowing he will not be able to retire for a long, long time.

Our society gives lip service to women but when the rubber hits the road-the unpaid work that women do is not valued nor are children. If that were the case, we would not be paying for 2 wars and cutting back on pre-kindergarten of all children, not just the poor and they would not be laying off teachers but enlisting soldiers. Kids would not have to hock their future just to get a college education.