Van Jones said it better than Gibbs, basically.

[ProSense]

Van Jones said it better than Gibbs, basically.

by droogie6655321

When I heard what Robert Gibbs said, I wasn't offended. I wasn't offended because I was fairly sure the comment wasn't meant for me. While I do have some serious disagreements (and a few petty ones too) with the Obama administration, those are buried under a thick layer of gratitude.

I'm glad to have him working for me every day, and not just for me, either. He's also working for the people who never gave him a fair shake -- on the right and the left.

As much as I wish more were possible, I know how historically lucky we are to have him working for us. But working against long odds for people who don't appreciate you, day after day, can't help but take a toll. A lot of us know this from our own workplace. Ever do the same kind of work for two different bosses, one who appreciated you and one who didn't? It makes all the difference in the world.

But again, back to the thought I came in on. I feel like when Van Jones came to Netroots Nation this summer, he said essentially the same thing that Robert Gibbs said. He just said it in a way that held you by the hand and helped you understand where he was coming from.

"I can't stand it. President Obama volunteered to be the captain of the Titanic after it hit the iceberg," Jones said.

Speaking directly to bloggers and other pockets of online outrage, Jones said: "This is harder than it looks. Having spent six months in the White House, it's a totally different experience when you're sitting there and the missiles are coming over the horizon at you," he said.

more

You can watch Jones' speech here

[Phx_Dem]

1. K&R

[Political Tiger]

2. Damn right! n/t

[babylonsister]

3. Rec'd. Yes. Thanks. nt

[msanthrope]

4. Oh, I can't wait for the posts dissing Van Jones.....

Oh, wait...

[BootinUp]

5. It doesn't matter how well it is said

its too easy to get on the nets and complain and feel righteous doing so. It can't be stopped. Its too easy to make up narratives to explain the world of politics in terms that make one feel better about complaining. If only some of the roudy complainers would get a real job in politics and demonstrate their superior abilities maybe we can put this all to rest. Maybe not. You see, Van Jones has been there, many others have been there. Of course we can think up new narratives that justify not heeding his advice. Won't take but a minute or a second.

[Parker CA]

6. That last quote in the OP is the money quote. How very true. nt

[zipplewrath]

7. So the complaint is that the job is hard?

It took them 6 months to find out the job is hard? I'm sorry they didn't know that up front, but most of the rest of us do. I say every election cycle, my number 1 concern about any candidate for the job of President is that they actually WANT the job. You can't complain after the fact about the reality of the job, much less suggest that it takes 6 months to realize it.

The very definition of the job is having to make decisions, everyday, on a wide variety of subjects, that the majority will not like, and many of those decisions will turn out to be wrong. That's the job description. If ya don't like it, don't run.

[Nicholas D Wolfwood]

9. No one said he didn't want the job.

It's tough being a quarterback in the NFL - that doesn't mean I wouldn't want to do it. And recognizing that difficulty doesn't mean one's complaining about it.

There just seems to be no recognition of how difficult the job is, which can be extremely frustrating. Haven't you ever felt taken for granted? And frankly, his supporters especially should be cognizant of that - and of how much he actually has accomplished on their behalf in light of how difficult it is.

[zipplewrath]

11. That's a self serving view for him to take

The problem is my critics, not that I am coming up short.

Quite a self serving observation. Did it ever occur to him that they do get it wrong occassionally?

We spent alot of time in the last administration laughing about how the shrub never could remember doing anything wrong. Not that Obama is just like Bush or anything.

[Nicholas D Wolfwood]

16. ...except his critics on that flank represent exceedingly few people.

They are disproportionately loud in comparison to other like minded individuals (read: Liberal Democrats). And frankly, Obama has been very willing to take responsibilities for mistakes, so I find that accusation rather hollow.

[zipplewrath]

19. Such as the public option

or excluding single payer from day 1? Or negotiations in private and secret with Big Pharam?

He tried to claim that he never campaigned on the public option.
He never even acknowledged that he broke campaign promises on cadillac taxes or mandates.

The only two mistakes I can particularly remember is him what led to the "beer summit" and that he trusted the experts on the safety of oil drilling.

What he didn't admit to is not listening to his own supporters that were screaming that drilling wasn't safe.

[CakeGrrl]

13. The President knows it's a hard job. The blogosphere doesn't get it.

Van Jones is making his point pretty clearly. The President (and Jones, in his limited time there) has a far, far better view of the reality of Washington than those sitting back here on message boards.

You don't have to tell the President how hard the job is. He knows it much better than you or I do. And that's what Jones is saying.

[zipplewrath]

And it's easier to fail than succeed

And what Gibb's is saying is that they don't like it pointed out when they come up short.

[ProSense]

17. No, what Gibbs is saying is

don't be ridiculous: President Obama isn't Bush.

[zipplewrath]

18. Which is a nice dodge

from the legitimate criticism behind such statements. He's arguing against the hyperbole to avoid the underlying criticism.

[ProSense]

20. "the legitimate criticism behind such statements"

There is no legitimate criticism when the claim is Obama is like Bush.

[zipplewrath]

24. Yes, there is

The purpose of hyperbole is exaggeration for the point of emphasis. Executing the SOFA can be hyperbolically as being "just like Bush", as is keeping Gates to do it. Exaggeration for sure, but to focus on the exaggeration and ignore the underlying criticism is to avoid the point.

[ProSense]

28. "Executing the SOFA can be hyperbolically as being 'just like Bush'"

Oh please. You're trying to justify a ridiculous comparison by trivializing it when in fact there are those who really believe the comparison and have rejected the President's achievements as insignificant, some to the point of claiming these have made things worse.

[zipplewrath]

31. There are those that believe in space aliens

But to marginalize the entire left wing of the party because some choose to speak in hyperbolic terms is to avoid the legitimate criticisms of the left.

[ProSense]

35. "But to marginalize the entire left wing of the party " He did no such thing

It's not the entire left wing of the party claiming President Obama is just like Bush.

[zipplewrath]

15. And it's easier to fail than succeed

And what Gibb's is saying is that they don't like it pointed out when they come up short.

[CakeGrrl]

25. That's what you choose to see in his statement

What I see is that they recognize that all some people do is bitch and moan and bitch and moan even when some clearly positive developments have been made.

And if they don't think those are positive enough to suit them, then tough shit, because they aren't sitting where the Administration sits and sees the big picture.

Come up short? Knowing what you know, which from your vantage point is apparently quite a bit more than those fools in the White House, do give us the candidate who won't come up short. You must know what it's going to take assuming you have your finger on the political pulse of Washington better than the Obama administration.

[zipplewrath]

27. The point isn't that he isn't perfect

It's that he can't stand having his own imperfections highlighted. If you don't want that to happen, don't take the job. But if he expects everyone to avoid his mistakes, he's dreaming. My work is subject to CONSTANT review. It isn't generally an opportunity to highlight what great work I've done, it is to detect the mistakes I may have made. If I got pissed all the time because they spent more time on my mistakes than my successes, I'd go insane. The vast majority of my successes are "doing the job right". There are no parades for that. My mistakes are to be detected and corrected. Repeated mistakes are to be highlighted.

[CakeGrrl]

30. But that's not a refutation of the actual point Gibbs made

If your boss told you you hadn't accomplished anything, would you consider that a fair assessment?

If your boss told you you were no different than (some lazy so-and-so), would that be a simple assessment of your imperfections?

The two specific examples Gibbs used cross the line into divisive hyperbole. You don't say those kinds of things in the hope of encouraging better performance or engaging in debate. Someone who says things like that, especially when they don't have a foundation in fact, is just out to throw barbs.

[zipplewrath]

33. I frequently get that

When my boss says I haven't accomplished "anything" it is always in reference to a core issue of some sort or another. Yes, it is a bit of an exaggeration. A test isn't done, never mind we've put in 80 hours already, but we never got to a milestone so we haven't "accomplished" anything. We are forced to use a system called "earned value". I chafe when they say we have no "earned value" after a month, but in the end they are right, we did not accomplish enough to take "credit" for the milestone so we get no "earned value" against that milestone.

In sports they say that the offense "couldn't gain any yardage on the ground". That doesn't mean literally zero, it means that their ground game was a detriment as much or more than an asset.

And in politics, when you keep your opponents Sec Def, execute his plan in Iraq and escalate his war in Afghanistan, some people are going to describe that as "being just like your opponent". The underlying criticism is valid.

[spoony]

22. And that the little people are mean old bullies! Lol nt

[CakeGrrl]

23. Hardly. They're just frustratingly short-sighted

and will shoot themselves in the foot with their reactionary miscalculations.

Meanwhile, the Repubs are all ready to organize and take back the controls when the goofuses on Left bash each other into a political loss.

The President can hang this up and retire in comfort with his family. But he won't. He'll stick this out. The irony is that some of these "bullies" to whom you refer would probably be ready for a strait jacket if they had his job for a month.

[johnaries]

32. No, the complaint are the "Monday morning quarterbacks"

who think they know everything but in truth are clueless about what is actually involved.

[zipplewrath]

34. Um, they came in on Sunday

He gets the criticism well before Monday morning. This isn't after the fact criticism. It is criticism that is ignored and marginalized by the White House DURING the debate. THEY locked out single payer.

[CakeGrrl]

8. Jones gets it.

It's easy to sit back behind a keyboard and have visions of President Harrison Ford cowboy his way through Washington and clean everything up pronto.

It's unfortunate that people are so short-sighted they can't understand the idea that this is tougher than everyone, probably including the President, anticipated. And since they can't grasp it, they'll look for the next hero and either flame them or rationalize reasons they couldn't do what they promised they way they originally envisioned or planned.

Did anyone predict that the Republicans would close ranks as tightly as they have against Obama's agenda? Even as messed up as we expect them to be, I don't know if anyone realized their opposition would be as steadfast.

[tularetom]

10. Well, maybe, but it would be nice if they just ACTED

like they gave a rat's ass once in awhile.

[Dawgs]

12. Van Jones is wrong. Obama made the decision from the start by selecting Summer, Geitner, etc..

And, ignoring people like Dean and Krugman.

I could agree with Jones and Gibbs if Obama didn't continue to choose centrists to fill his cabinet.

[Ignis]

29. Oh, they didn't just ignore Dean...

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/12/16/gibbs-lashes-back-at-dean_n_394596.html
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/miles-mogulescu/fire-robert-gibbsor-at-le_b_396339.html

[30rock]

14. Shhh....Gibbs said we shouldn't argue n/t

[butterfly77]

21. Kicked&Recommended!!!

:kick:

[rucky]

26. It's ALL about how you say it.

If you respect the people you disagree with, you avoid ad-hominem and lay out your case.

[hulka38]

36. See, it's real hard work.

[30rock]

37. Obama gave Van Jones a good job

I am not surprised that Jones is grateful.

[damntexdem]

38. Who didn't?

[FrenchieCat]

39. Yep!