Democrats should let all the taxcuts expire?

[kentuck]

Then let Obama declare his own bill to cut taxes on the middle class as the first item on the agenda. Dare the Republicans to vote against it.

Then will tell the people about the crisis we have with our huge deficits and why we cannot give any more taxbreaks to the millioniares and billionaires at this time. We have to get these deficits under control and the taxcuts for the wealthiest is a main culprit in the deficit crisis.

Also, we need to understand that one of the biggest culprits in the creation of the crisis with the deficit is the military. We are spending too much money in Afghanistan. There are more important things that can be done with that money.

However, the Social Security fund has not added to the deficit. In fact, the deficits would be even larger if they had not borrowed from the Social Security fund. This is the same money that working people put into the fund over the years and were guaranteed that it would be protected by the integrity of the US Government. Now they want to steal that money.

Then he will tell the Republicans that he wants to meet them half-way but we have gone as far as we can go. The time has come to work together to look out for our middle-class and working class families. We ask that the Republicans work with us...

:-)

[Sadie5]

1. I totally agree with you

But the Repugs have no intention of working with Democrats. They are a nasty bunch who think the corporate community comes before the citizens. Another good post Kentuck.

[kentuck]

2. They could make it hard on working people.

They already are. Do I need to say who "they " are?

[doc03]

3. Not a chance in hell it will happen n/t

[tritsofme]

4. That sounds like a suicide mission.

For starters, I don't know how you think Obama is going force any votes, when Republicans will control the House floor. Cantor has pledged that if the tax cuts expire, H.R. 1 would be the Republican tax cut "plan".

The best strategy is in the lame duck to separate the middle class tax cuts and make them permanent, then extend the cuts for the rich only temporarily, and force Republicans to support their solo extension next time around.

But letting the middle class tax cuts expire on Obama's watch would be an unmitigated disaster.

[SunsetDreams]

5. I like the way you think :)

[kentuck]

7. The President presents his budget to Congress..

But it is true that the House has the last word in taxes and spending. I would disagree that the taxcuts should be made permanent. Who is left to pay taxes??

I do not doubt that the Repubs would let the poor and middle class suffer if it would benefit them politically. The unmitigated disaster was when the taxcuts were passed the first time, don't you agree??

[lumberjack_jeff]

9. Agree. n/t

[kelly1mm]

12. I would bet money that the R's will not "decouple" the tax cuts. It is

the R's plan to do one of these 3 with the tax cuts.

1) all get extended forever
2) all get extended for 2 years (the R's plan IMO to have the same hammer over the President in 2012),
3) take the risk and let them expire and hope the MSM will have their back.

Lots of risk in #3 for both the r's and the President.

[kentuck]

13. I thought Repubs passed the bill....?

..so that it would expire on the last day of 2010?? Is that not correct? They passed it but now they want to change it? Right? Because the economy is so much worse now? But the taxcuts are in effect as we speak. They never went away.

I will say this. The very moment the Democratic Party gives up the idea of paying for government with taxes, that is the end of the Democratic Party. We cannot help people if we are not progressing. We cannot be Democrats if we do not progress. There is a line in the sand. Are we going to surrender or are we going to fight?

[ProudDad]

16. No one needs to "force" any votes...

the bush tax giveaway expires at the end of this year unless extended...

No vote needed...

[tritsofme]

30. Middle class tax cuts will expire too.

It is not good politics or good policy to raise taxes on the middle class in the midst of this bad economy.

Do you think this would be a political winner for Democrats? Raising everyone's taxes? Really?

[BootinUp]

24. of course you are 100% correct.

There is no other play that makes political OR economic sense. And to those who want to cry about the deficit right now, there are unemployed people who have a message for you, it is very simple really: F you.

[pscot]

6. Works for me

[lumberjack_jeff]

8. Legislation comes from the House, and goes to the Senate. Then to the President.

The Senate will be presented with a tax cut bill permanently extending the tax cuts for the rich. My nickel bet is they'll pass it.

[kentuck]

11. If they do...

that is the end of America as we have known it. I don't think it is an exaggeration to say that government is paid for with taxes. No taxes = no government. No government = pain for the most vulnerable in our society. No government = no schools or roads.

I have seen it with my own eyes. I have one streetlight on my street for each two or three blocks. They have taken the portable toilets out of the park and locked the main restrooms. They did not cut the grass in the medium of one of our busiest streets. That happened this year. Because no one wants to pay taxes.

[ProudDad]

17. Which they can change in conference... (n/t)

[EC]

10. This is basically the only way he can do and have it to tote

in 2012...They would then be "Obama's tax cuts" not the Repub's congress cuts...especially if he totes it immediately in Jan. and really big in the State of the Union address...then we should crowd their town halls all summer screaming for our tax cuts if they stall it...


On edit: on the military spending - he should make clear about the cost of the war, but also tell Boeing and other suppliers that if they want to keep contracts to make the stuff we've ordered work or we cancel and to come up with new products we can use instead of relics...

[kentuck]

14. Yes, they would have to sell it everyday...

But it can be sold. Taxcuts for people making less than $200,000 is a popular idea with a big percentage of Americans. It is the Republicans that would be playing with fire if they blocked it.

[ProudDad]

18. CUT THE FUCKING WAR BUDGET BY 75%!!!! GAWD!!! (n/t)

[ProudDad]

15. Until recently the debt was almost entirely due to the war machine!

and the wars of empire...

And I agree that it would be better to let them all expire than to give another $700,000,000,000 to the ONLY motherfuckers who benefited over the last 30 years from the Ponzi Scheme mislabeled the USAmerican "Economy"...

CUT THE GOD DAMN WAR BUDGET!!!

[Name removed]

19. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[budkin]

20. No way, they're going to be extended for all...

[kentuck]

21. But it has to go to the President for his signature.

What happens if he vetos it?

[subterranean]

25. If he vetoes it, the tax cuts expire on schedule, and he'll be blamed

for "the biggest tax increase ever." Then the Republicans will probably introduce a bill for even deeper cuts, plus elimination of the estate tax, and dare the Democrats and Obama to reject it.

[kentuck]

27. This is the stand he will have to take.

If he sends it back a week before it is to expire with a stern message to send it back with taxcuts for the middle class only and he will sign it, the ball is in the Republican's court.

[ElsewheresDaughter]

22. agreed...let them expire!

[ElsewheresDaughter]

23. LET THEM EXPIRE>>>LET THEM EXPIRE!!!

[Orsino]

28. "The Democrat Senate is about to pass the biggest tax hike in history!"

That's what the TV will tell us.

[Pryderi]

26. I like this idea!

[apnu]

29. K&R for the first sentence alone.

That's exactly what the Dems should do.


Now the question is... will they?

[FBaggins]

31. When did the President obtain power to "declare" what bills the House would take up?

The executive can write any proposed bill that he wants... but House leadership determines whether it ever sees the light of day.

[PBass]

32. DISAGREE... This is a terrible strategy to accomplish what you want.

Letting the tax cuts expire will be portrayed as "raising taxes on the middle class". It's totally pointless and unnecessary to let the tax cuts expire (causing a reaction on the right) and then turn around and lower taxes again. First, because you "raised" taxes (with all the bad publicity that causes), and second because it looks like you lowered taxes again, as a reaction to the outrage on the Right. It makes the Dems look like tax hikers, and then weaklings.

You wanna keep the same tax rates on the middle class? Fine, then extend the tax rates. Don't play around with raising and lowering. There are no positives to this approach, only potential negatives.

BTW, I will be PISSED if the Dems do not let the Tax Cuts for Millionaires expire. If they can't use this as a wedge issue against the GOP (it's popular!!!) then they are freaking idiots! Tax cuts for the wealthy don't create jobs... if they did, we already would have seen that happening under Bush (who doubled the unemployment rate during his term).