Does anybody remember an interview when Obama said this?:

[jenmito]

Todd: Let me jump to another topic, Scott Ferguson, he's upset about taxes, he says: "Explain how raising taxes on anyone during a deep recession is going to help with the economy." And he actually wants to you look at historical markers where this has been — you say, you know, where this has been a helpful thing coming out of a recession.

Obama: Well, first of all, he is right. Normally, you don't raise taxes in a recession, which is why we haven't and why we have instead cut taxes. So I guess what I would say to Scott is his economics are right, you don't raise taxes in a recession. We haven't raised taxes in a recession. We don't have a…

Todd: But you might for health care. You might for the highest -- for some of the wealthiest.

Obama: The — we have not proposed a tax hike for the wealthy that would take effect in the middle of a recession. Even the proposals that have come out of Congress, which, by the way, were different from the proposals I put forward, still wouldn't kick in until after the recession was over.

So he is absolutely right, the last thing you want to do is to raise taxes in the middle of a recession because that would just suck up — take more demand out of the economy and put businesses in a further hole.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/32301534/ns/us_news-the_elkhart_project/

That was in Aug. '09. So is he caving when he says he may accept a temporary extension of tax cuts for the rich?

[Make7]

1. Recession officially ended in June 2009

http://money.cnn.com/2010/09/20/news/economy/recession_over/index.htm
 

[jenmito]

3. Everyone knows it "officially" ended. But we also know not many people FEEL that it ended

including Obama.

[Make7]

5. But a tax rate increase now is not technically raising taxes in a recession. ( n/t )

[jenmito]

9. "Technically" doesn't count. n/t

[jpgray]

12. Words have meanings, though

Recession is typically defined as a decline in GDP for two quarters, if I remember my macro.

[jenmito]

14. Yet the % of people who think the recession is over is in the single digits. n/t

[jpgray]

16. But it is. 77% think Obama kept taxes the same or raised them, but it ain't necessarily so

Right?

[jenmito]

20. Yup. But that's a result of misinformation. People living from day to day still feel

that a recession is going on.

[jpgray]

22. They also feel Obama didn't cut taxes. In both cases, they're wrong

Something is certainly going on that allows for this feeling in both instances, but it isn't a recession, and it isn't a lack of tax cuts.

I don't think changing the meaning of words based on feelings is where we want to go right now. It's that sort of thing that makes the media treat "gov't hands off my Medicare" as a respected political philosophy, or that gets the NYT to stop calling torture torture.

[pa28]

18. If we are going to be flexible with the definition of a recession you might want to read this.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x9555791

The wealthy are doing just fine and making more than ever.

[pa28]

21. dupe

[jpgray]

2. It depends on whether you also remember this:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x4531661

Source: The New York Times

WASHINGTON – President Obama will rule out on Wednesday any compromise that would extend the Bush-era tax cuts for the wealthy beyond this year, officials said, adding a populist twist to an election-season economic package that is otherwise designed to entice support from big businesses and their Republican allies.

Mr. Obama’s opposition to allowing the high-end tax cuts to remain in place for even another year or two would be the signal many Congressional Democrats have been awaiting as they prepare for a showdown with Republicans on the issue and ends speculation that the White House might be open to an extension. Democrats say only the president can rally wavering lawmakers who, amid the party’s weakened poll numbers, feel increasingly vulnerable to Republican attacks if they let the top rates lapse at the end of this year as scheduled.

It is not clear that Mr. Obama can prevail given his own diminished popularity, the tepid nature of the economic recovery and the divisions within his party. But by proposing to extend the rates for the 98 percent of households with income below $250,000 for couples and $200,000 for individuals — and insisting that federal income tax rates in 2011 go back to their 2001 levels for income above those cutoffs — he intends to cast the issue as a choice between supporting the middle class or giving breaks to the wealthy.

In a speech in Cleveland on Wednesday, Mr. Obama also will make a case for the package of roughly $180 billion in expanded business tax cuts and infrastructure spending disclosed by the White House in bits and pieces over the past few days. He would offset the cost by closing other tax breaks for multinational corporations, oil and gas companies and others.


Read more: http://www.nytimes.com/2010/09/08/us/politics/08obama.html?_r=1

[jenmito]

I remember. But as my OP shows, it's not the first time that he

was open to temporarily extending tax cuts for the rich.

[jpgray]

11. So to sum up his position...?

Political realities change and politicians with them, but conflicting ultimatums are swiftly becoming a theme here.

[ruggerson]

4. We're not in a recession

GDP has been growing for a year and a half.

[jenmito]

10. The interview was 2 months after the recession "officially" ended. n/t

[ruggerson]

13. I understand that

but it doesn't apply to today.

We have anemic growth, but it is growth nonetheless.

Partly, imho, because the WH and Congress made some good, tough choices last year.

[jenmito]

17. I know what you're saying...

but even TODAY, people feel that the recession isn't over.

[Milo_Bloom]

6. *SIGH*

" So I guess what I would say to Scott is his economics are right, you don't raise taxes in a recession"

Reagan did. http://www.miseryindex.us/urbymonth.asp?StartYear=1982-09&EndYear=1983-11&submit1=Create+Report

Reagan raised taxes in December 1982, when unemployment was at its HIGHEST POINT of his presidency.

Why the F is Obama afraid to point this out???

Of course "officially" the recession ended in November of 1982, but that is just because unemployment doesn't figure into recession numbers per se.

http://www.miseryindex.us/urbymonth.asp?StartYear=2009-02&EndYear=2010-09&submit1=Create+Report

Supposedly the "recession" ended in June 09, but as we known unemployment continued to rise and has only recently begun to dip off.


As Reagan actually PROVED, you need to spend your way out of a recession. He hid over 1.5 TRILLION of stimulus spending in a dramatic increase in the defense budget. It was only once he RAISED TAXES in 1982 to increase REVENUE that the stimulus actually started working, as the deficit wasn't quite as scary as it was before and companies could be confident that the stimulus money would keep flowing.

Why do democrats constantly give into the idiotic talking points when they freakin know they are false!?!?!?!?

[OHdem10]

7. The Recession is over. We still have horrible unemployment

from the Globalization Crisis which no one will
admit.(outsourcing did not work so well for us.
and poor enforcement of sorry labor laws the
last coupe of decades)

They are not raising taxes in a recession. Because
of high unemployment the Republicans know they
can get away with saying--do not raise taxes in a
recession. It still feels like a recession to the
American people.

[elleng]

8. HATE this 'caving' meme! Aren't adults expected to learn and adapt

to changing situations and times? Isn't that why we elect leaders?

And of course, he does NOT want to raise taxes on the VAST middle, but rather return the HIGHS to the status quo ante, so the middle can retain its ability to 'demand,' and the highs essentially retain their status w/o burdening all of us with $700 zillion more debt.

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

15. Absorb the power of the McTodd.

[de novo]

19. Yes. He is caving. He was never ambiguous about letting bush tax cuts EXPIRE.

You are using the gopper meme that it is a tax increase.

[Enrique]

23. Obama uses GOP rhetoric all the time

he could enact the entire GOP angenda, and there would be a record of him making statements consistent with doing that.

Of course, at the time he's using the GOP rhetoric, Obama defenders on the left say he doesn't really mean it. And then when it turns out he does mean it they say, see! He's doing what he said he would do!