If the administration and its supporters spent as much time attacking the right as they do Taibbi

[depakid]

and other progressives- and reminded folks who (and who's policies) are responsible for this mess- not only would their poll numbers be higher, but they wouldn't be constantly having to make excuses for half measures (or failures).

You'd never see this sort of behavior from Republicans engaging in this sort of behavior. Nope- they'd be on message. They wouldn't continually scold their supporters while pandering to the opposition, nor would they allow "moderate" members of the party dictate the terms of their policies.

That's one reason they get their policies through- even when they are (sometimes profoundly) unpopular, whereas Democrats have trouble getting things done that have 70% + approval.

[hollowdweller]

1. Agreed.

He said a while back he could multi task but he's not doing a great job at it.

He ran a great election. The Rev Wright thing could have brought down a lesser candidate/team.

But now he's just not using his cabinet members and the media to creat momentum like the GOP and Bush Did. Or Clinton.

The sad thing is a lot of conservative dems think they are somehow doing themselves a favor by opposing the president but if they make their congress seem "do nothing" and they undermine the presidents authority they will be the first to go. Despite the trend favoring progressives in 08 the moderate republicans got booted.

[FrenchieCat]

2. Did the Administration attack Taibbi?

I'm seeing things slightly differently......
that is, if those who spent their time dogging out this Administration
and its supporters, instead excoriated the Republicans and their supporters,
perhaps Republicans wouldn't be experiencing somekind of "resurgents".

When someone tells you every day that Obama is like Bush, when he is clearly not,
then those someones are part of the problem, IMO.

[Armstead]

4. Not saying he's like Bush....But he's too much like Clinton, IMO

[FrenchieCat]

6. Did the Administration attack Taibbi?

cause that is in the title of the OP.

[Armstead]

10. Its supporters do...I haven't heard from the administration on it

My response was to the statement about people comparing him to Bush.

While I recognize that some do, I am simply pointing out that IMO a closer comparisonb is to Clinton.

Clinton was, like Obama, a good man and in some ways a good president, and certainly better than a republican. But when it came to policy, Clinton ultimately screwed the pooch by distancing himself from liberals and aligning himself and policies with the Wall St. Corporate Oligarchs far too much.

Some of us do not want to see Obama make the same mistake. We hope for the best from him, but are becoming increasingly worried that we've seen this movie before.

[FrenchieCat]

15. So in essence, the OP is full of shit. The administration hasn't attacked Taibbi.....

but rather Taibbi has attacked the administration.

I don't really care that Taibbi has attacked Obama and his administration, so much as I don't think Taibbi is actually very correct, but that goes way back for me, based on a lot that he has written...not just this article. I hope I have a right to have my opinion that Taibbi is not perfect, just like this administration isn't perfect....as we live in imperfect times, and undoing fucked up shit sometimes can be messy, especially if folks are throwing rocks at you while you are trying to get it done.

In this case, I think a few folks are defending the Administration from Taibbi's attacks, because they perceive them as unfair, uncalled for, and nonfactual.

It's true that it appears very much in vogue to attack this administration right now,
However, if all who attacked the administration, attacked foes of the administration instead,
perhaps then the administration would have more support to carry out its agenda.

It's kind of like the egg and the chicken and which came first.

My view is to allow the Administration to do what it feels is required,
and then see what the results are. In the case of the economy, I find this even more true,
because consumer sentiment is everything, and it is very easy to undermine an economic recovery,
if the only said things about the economy are negative, and the only thing said about the administration when it relates to the economy is that somehow they are all crooks and aren't doing it right (which is pure hyperbole exaggeration to begin with).

[NJmaverick]

14. It didn't, but FACTS don't matter to some DUers

:thumbsdown:

[Armstead]

3. No,no,no....LIBERALS are the enemy. Liberal policies are bad.

Haven't you gotten the memo?

[NJmaverick]

5. If only people like you spent as much time defending the Dems that you to Taibbi

:rofl:

[depakid]

9. My allegiance is to policies- not politicians or parties

This ain't college football- though in some ways maybe it ought to be in that scolding and attacking one's supporters isn't going to make you very popular (nor will it help to get effective policies in place).

Something shallow partisans might want to think about.

[NJmaverick]

11. Your allegiance appears to be to any hack that attacks Obama

[depakid]

12. Note the operative word in my previous post

shallow.

It applies rather conspicuously in your case- as anyone who reads my writing knows.

[NJmaverick]

13. Your writing is rife with intellectual dishonesty. That is what one gets from reading your writing

Your suggestion that the administration is attacking Matt couldn't be further afield from the truth.

[depakid]

17. Having trouble with reading comprehension, too

subtlety and abstract though often eludes the shallow.

Concept: The administration and its supporters have shown an unfortunate propensity to scold people like Taibbi and other progressives, while pandering to some ephemeral "center" -or to the corporate right.

We've seen this time and again from the administration, its opinion leaders (and the leadership in Congress).

The question an astute observer would ask themselves is: do Republicans behave this way? If not, why not? -are they successful in getting their policies through?

The answer of course is yes they are- and the fact that they're relentless, persistent and give no quarter to the opposition on the issues- while embracing their core supporters is one of the major reasons why.

Intelligent folks learn from things like this. Indolent sycophants watch with astonishment as poll numbers fall and policies are watered down and compromised away until they're diluted to the point of ineffectiveness.

Then they wonder why people don't turn out the next election- whereupon they renew their scolds and aspersions, blaming progressives for their own repeated failures.

[NJmaverick]

19. Oh weasel words.... nice! Karl would be impressed

you can take your bullshit about "shallow", "subtlety" and "abstract thought" and shove it.:hi: Oh and that goes for the rest of your condescending self serving pseudo-intellectual claptrap, as well.

[depakid]

21. Shallow is as shallow does

[NJmaverick]

22. You got it Forest

:rofl:

[depakid]

31. Thanks for the reminder re: irony impairment

it's always useful to bear in mind that it's not limited to Republicans.

[NJmaverick]

33. A reminder to the fact paired- Obama never attacked MT

[depakid]

40. Still stubbornly incapable of comprehending a sentence

much less grasping a concept.

It must take considerable effort to remain so thick.

[Name removed]

32. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

34. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[mcablue]

7. Attacking the right is un-pragmatic

Please be more post-partisan.

[lob1]

8. When 70+% of the people want health care, and we can't get it,

that's proof that we no longer have a democracy. Vote, don't vote, what fucking difference does it make? The corporations always get what they want...and our vote? We get to elect the crook that robs us. I feel so much better when a democrate is screwing me, so I always vote dem.

[DontTreadOnMe]

16. When 70+% of the people want health care, and OBAMA can't get it done...

Where does the buck stop?

[vaberella]

24. Obama doesn't vote on it in Congress---and I blame Congress--not the Pres. n/t

[dionysus]

45. the senate genius. the people who have to, you know, pass the bill.

jaysussss keeerist are people thick around here...

:rofl:

[sandnsea]

18. "they'd be on message"

Hello?? The message isn't single payer and out of Afghanistan now.

[depakid]

20. What's your interpretation of the message(s)

Armstead posted a very insightful piece about that today regarding the convoluted health care bill(s).

I tend to agree with his thoughts (especially as they relate to being "on message").

[vaberella]

23. Did the Admin ever attack Taibbi?

Your posts are normally valid, but theres no need to give out false information---much like Taibbi himself.

[depakid]

26. People seem to be missing the point

If the administration and its supporters spent as much time going after the right as it does going after Taibbi and other progressives....

To take a point from history- FDR rarely missed an opportunity to remind people who (and who's policies) were responsible for the problems. This administration has a tendency (as Clinton did) to pander to them- and worse, to scold or exclude its own core supporters.

This is a dysfunctional pattern- a lesson that ought to have been learned in the 1990's.

[spoony]

37. It doesn't matter, they'll always find a loophole to crawl into

so they don't have to address criticisms. If it isn't "he didn't campaign on that" it's "you're not being reality-based" or "I'm too smart to listen to you" or, in this case, "your OP can be read in a way it may be taken as factually inaccurate so the message doesn't count."

It's all about ducking the problematic goings-on in our government and yay-team bullshit.

[NJmaverick]

38. Damn those the facts are important loopholes!

[spoony]

39. ...and they seem to have an inordinate amount of time on their hands

to patrol these threads and spread their dismissive commentary all over, creating enough of a mess that the original point is intentionally lost in the dust clouds.

[NYC_SKP]

25. Your post is Fail. Worse, it is re-hashed and beyond boring Fail. Why, it may even be...

[depakid]

28. You forgot the sarcasm tag,

[NYC_SKP]

30. Sarcasm thingy, or thingie...

Here tis, overdue but here nonetheless:

:sarcasm:

:P

[Cha]

49. The OP was such a failure.

I actually expected better. Oh well.

[phleshdef]

27. If progressives spent as much time attacking the right as they do Barack Obama...

...well, you know the rest.

[bvar22]

43. The "progressives" ARE attacking The Right.

The DLC New Team
Republican Lite ONLY
Working Class Democrats Need NOT Apply

(Screen Capped from the DLC Website)

Who else but The Right would:
*INCREASE Military Spending at the expense of the Working Class & Poor?

*EXPAND the WARS in the Middle East while most of America doesn't have adequate Health Care?

*Give a $TRILLION Dollars of Public Money to Wall Street no strings attached?

*Re-enforce the worst "Police State" provisions of the Patriot Act?

*TrashCan EFCA?

*Trashcan equal rights and equal protections for ALL (No Exceptions)?

*Give a $TRILLION Dollars of Public Money to the Health Insurance Cartel?

*Force Americans to BUY faulty "insurance" from For Profit Corporations that produce no tangible products and produce no REAL wealth?

*Use "achieving bi-partisan consensus" (appeasing Republicans) as the guideline for Policy?

:shrug:

[TwilightGardener]

29. I must have missed Obama's big call-out of Matt Taibbi--do you have a link?

[NJmaverick]

35. You don't understand from what the author of this OP has told me, he is so brilliant that

you simply don't understand that he is above having to use facts

[TwilightGardener]

36. Oh--I guess when Obama doesn't offend us to our satisfaction, we invent shit that he does wrong.

Very Republican.

[Kahuna]

41. Why should anybody need to "remind" folks whose policies are

responsible for the mess or that voting for Nader (really screwed the whole country or many years to come - had to get that in)? They know full well how things got the way they are. If they want to have a tantrum every other day because Obama is doing the best he can to unravel the mess, I won't waste one moment trying to remind them of anything for they are being intellectually dishonest at the very least.

[WonderGrunion]

42. It's not my job to remind you how bad the Repukes are.

If your memory retention is so bad that you seriously need reminding how horrible things were under */CheneySatan and how much they have actually improved since President Obama has taken office than I can hardly take your criticism of the administration as credible.

[dionysus]

44. at least you tacitly admit you're not a supporter.

[depakid]

46. What excatly is "a supporter?"

If a person goes to a rally and buys a T-Shirt, does that make them a "supporter?" If one defends certain controversial (and less than popular) policies is that a supporter?

Or does one have to agree on most (or nearly all) matters of substance and process?

How about if one decides America is no longer capable of solving its problems- and hence, no longer worth the effort?

(one doesn't have to live abroad to have t"s attitude- it's remarkably prevalent in the domestic electorate). Can the be "supporters/"

[apocalypsehow]

47. Taibbi deserves to be "attacked" - he is a proven liar and myth-monger with zero credibility. n/t.

[Cha]

48. Oh, the administration has confronted taibbi on his propaganda..

fact challenged pieces? Good.

And, don't worry about it..the rw gets called out on their propaganda too.

Not impressed with your obvious try at distraction from taibbi's feeble attempts to discredit the President.

[Starbucks Anarchist]

50. When did the administration attack Taibbi?

If you can't prove it, your OP is bullshit.