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Home » Discuss » General Discussion: Presidency |
phleshdef (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Dec-18-10 04:35 PM Original message |
"Obamacare turns the insurers into public utilities, thus setting us on the road to single payer." |
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msongs (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Dec-18-10 04:40 PM Response to Original message |
1. we only wish lol nt |
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phleshdef (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Dec-18-10 04:41 PM Response to Reply #1 |
2. omg snarky gimmick reply lol nt |
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truedelphi (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Dec-18-10 06:19 PM Response to Reply #1 |
24. I'm with you on that one. |
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Sheepshank (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Dec-18-10 07:18 PM Response to Reply #24 |
28. Ahhh...but the start of cost containment is there.. |
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martymar64 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Dec-18-10 10:07 PM Response to Reply #28 |
33. How is that enforceable. Big Health will hide it all with Enron-style accounting |
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truedelphi (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Dec-19-10 05:29 PM Response to Reply #28 |
57. Martymar 64 understands what is going on |
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TheKentuckian (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 02:36 PM Response to Reply #28 |
79. MLR is not containment. It is likely to push cost higher. |
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egoclothes (110 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 04:11 PM Response to Reply #1 |
82. Yes. if only that were true. |
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truthspeak (212 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Dec-18-10 04:42 PM Response to Original message |
3. I'm sorry, but the left's blindness.... |
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girl gone mad (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Dec-18-10 05:38 PM Response to Reply #3 |
18. What's the long game here? |
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Recursion (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 10:54 AM Response to Reply #18 |
65. Exchange premiums in Mass are down 14% this year |
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mkultra (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Dec-19-10 11:34 AM Response to Reply #3 |
53. bingo. This lefty understands whats going on |
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niceypoo (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 11:39 AM Response to Reply #53 |
68. Sorry, not jumping on the RW bandwagon |
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mkultra (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 01:57 PM Response to Reply #68 |
72. oh, you mean the orchestrated effort to undermine Obama? |
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niceypoo (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-21-10 03:02 PM Response to Reply #72 |
97. No |
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niceypoo (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 11:38 AM Response to Reply #3 |
67. Obama has instutionalized the problem |
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ClarkUSA (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Dec-18-10 04:43 PM Response to Original message |
4. Obama and his advisors play the long game, which few understand. |
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vaberella (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Dec-18-10 04:47 PM Response to Reply #4 |
7. Admittedly they do play a their game in a rather complicated way. |
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mkultra (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Dec-19-10 11:35 AM Response to Reply #7 |
54. honestly, if he tried dumber strategies, he would have less detratctors here |
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Mimosa (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 02:03 PM Response to Reply #54 |
73. People are dying from lack of care while limping down the Yellow Brick Road. |
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mkultra (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 02:07 PM Response to Reply #73 |
76. yup. and HCR moves to help those people |
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Mimosa (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 02:22 PM Response to Reply #76 |
77. There are millions who can't afford premiums, hi deductibles, co-pays ... |
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mkultra (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 04:26 PM Response to Reply #77 |
83. Thats another gish galloping half truth |
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Mimosa (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 08:24 PM Response to Reply #83 |
86. It's all about 'him'? What about US? |
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mkultra (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-21-10 01:15 PM Response to Reply #86 |
95. reality disagrees with you |
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Mimosa (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 08:26 PM Response to Reply #83 |
87. You -god help you- are not a sick woman who can't get health care. |
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Hippo_Tron (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-21-10 02:20 PM Response to Reply #77 |
96. The public has a serious cognitive dissonance issue |
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TheKentuckian (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Dec-18-10 04:43 PM Response to Original message |
5. The insurance cartel has been rendered a utility in only the most deranged and conservative and |
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burning rain (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Dec-19-10 09:04 AM Response to Reply #5 |
48. Well, you know conservatives tend to be absolutists. |
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vaberella (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Dec-18-10 04:46 PM Response to Original message |
6. But what you're suggesting will take an extraordinarily long time. |
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phleshdef (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Dec-18-10 04:59 PM Response to Reply #6 |
10. I think thats why its called a struggle. |
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vaberella (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Dec-18-10 05:02 PM Response to Reply #10 |
12. True. |
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louis-t (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Dec-18-10 04:47 PM Response to Original message |
8. What "massive new stimulus"? |
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phleshdef (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Dec-18-10 05:00 PM Response to Reply #8 |
11. Middle class tax breaks and unemployment ins. are and always will be demand side stimulus. |
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martymar64 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Dec-18-10 10:09 PM Response to Reply #11 |
34. The tax cuts have not stimulated anything in the past 10 years. Quit spreading supply sider lies. |
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phleshdef (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Dec-18-10 11:56 PM Response to Reply #34 |
40. So middle class people never spent any of that over the past 10 years? |
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whosinpower (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Dec-19-10 11:07 AM Response to Reply #40 |
51. The wealthy do not use their tax cuts to create jobs |
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phleshdef (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 10:50 AM Response to Reply #51 |
64. My, what an unnecessary, foamy mouthed rant. |
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whosinpower (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 04:03 PM Response to Reply #64 |
81. Ah reduced to insult |
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phleshdef (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 08:39 PM Response to Reply #81 |
89. Distributing wealth into the hands of middle class people ALWAYS has a stimulative effect. |
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niceypoo (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 11:41 AM Response to Reply #11 |
69. You have absorbed the RW meme that 'tax cuts' are the answer to everything |
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underpants (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Dec-18-10 04:48 PM Response to Original message |
9. They should be public utilities - allowed a certain rate of return and then give it back to us... |
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David__77 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Dec-18-10 05:15 PM Response to Original message |
13. Under those terms, Bush was also a "man of the left." |
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treestar (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Dec-18-10 05:20 PM Response to Original message |
14. He might even have gotten public option with a Democratic Congress |
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martymar64 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Dec-18-10 10:14 PM Response to Reply #14 |
35. He had a Democratic Congress (BOTH Houses) and squandered it. |
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girl gone mad (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Dec-18-10 05:30 PM Response to Original message |
15. This hasn't been the case with Romneycare. |
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phleshdef (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Dec-18-10 05:33 PM Response to Reply #15 |
16. But if they are withdrawing from the marketplace at a national level.... |
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girl gone mad (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Dec-18-10 05:42 PM Response to Reply #16 |
19. They don't have to go anywhere. |
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phleshdef (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Dec-18-10 05:48 PM Response to Reply #19 |
21. Let them go out of business. The argument for a public system will increase 10 fold in power. |
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girl gone mad (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Dec-18-10 06:04 PM Response to Reply #21 |
23. And in the short term, how many will suffer? |
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martymar64 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Dec-18-10 10:16 PM Response to Reply #21 |
36. And the companies left become monopolies. You know, too big to fail. |
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shimmergal (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Dec-19-10 03:00 PM Response to Reply #16 |
56. If they would withdraw. . . |
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Enrique (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Dec-18-10 05:36 PM Response to Original message |
17. Krauthammer is lying |
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Sheepshank (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Dec-18-10 07:23 PM Response to Reply #17 |
29. Silly assumption here |
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martymar64 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Dec-18-10 10:23 PM Response to Reply #29 |
37. Difference is, in those othercountries, EVERYBODY gets health care. Not so here. |
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GreenPartyVoter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Dec-18-10 11:44 PM Response to Reply #37 |
39. +1,000,000 |
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Mimosa (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 02:24 PM Response to Reply #37 |
78. martymar64, true Dems agree with you. n/t |
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Exilednight (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Dec-18-10 05:46 PM Response to Original message |
20. If this were true, which it's not, then this bill would of included a provision |
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golfguru (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Dec-18-10 05:55 PM Response to Original message |
22. Main reasons why the HCR bill sucks... |
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dflprincess (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Dec-18-10 08:43 PM Response to Reply #22 |
30. The biggest reason the "health care" bill sucks is that |
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Chan790 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Dec-19-10 11:31 AM Response to Reply #22 |
52. Sorry, as soon as you advocated tort-reform 2nd paragraph from the bottom... |
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golfguru (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Dec-19-10 08:54 PM Response to Reply #52 |
60. US mal-practice suit cost is 25 times those in UK |
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Chan790 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 12:03 AM Response to Reply #60 |
61. "the trial-lawyer-lobby." |
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golfguru (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 02:04 PM Response to Reply #61 |
74. I am for doctors, you are for mal-practice trial lawyers |
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TheKentuckian (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 04:47 PM Response to Reply #60 |
84. No, it is probably very closely associated with having a NHS |
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BeFree (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Dec-18-10 06:27 PM Response to Original message |
25. The HCIRB may or may not work |
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whosinpower (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Dec-18-10 06:39 PM Response to Original message |
26. Krauthammer is an idiot |
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phleshdef (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Dec-18-10 07:11 PM Response to Reply #26 |
27. I all ready explained that, but you were too busy nearly choking to death on your own vitriol. |
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martymar64 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Dec-18-10 10:27 PM Response to Reply #27 |
38. Those are enormous leaps of faith you are making |
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phleshdef (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Dec-18-10 11:58 PM Response to Reply #38 |
41. Not nearly as many as those that are fantasizing about single payer coming anytime sooner. |
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martymar64 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Dec-19-10 02:54 AM Response to Reply #41 |
43. Especially since Obama would fight it will all his being |
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whosinpower (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Dec-19-10 09:02 AM Response to Reply #27 |
47. Keep drinking that kool aid |
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Monk06 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Dec-18-10 08:52 PM Response to Original message |
31. Krauthammer either does not understand the Canadian system or he is being disingenuous. |
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Crunchy Frog (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Dec-19-10 09:44 AM Response to Reply #31 |
50. Disingenuous is my vote. |
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martymar64 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Dec-18-10 10:04 PM Response to Original message |
32. Obama and the Democrats should begin the push for singlepayer now. |
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jmowreader (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Dec-19-10 12:40 AM Response to Original message |
42. The RW has a BIG problem concerning the stimulus |
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area51 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Dec-19-10 03:03 AM Response to Original message |
44. I'd suggest |
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harun (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Dec-19-10 08:29 AM Response to Original message |
45. Lies |
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old mark (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Dec-19-10 08:52 AM Response to Original message |
46. Now, there's a great idea!......nt |
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Crunchy Frog (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Dec-19-10 09:40 AM Response to Original message |
49. Krauthammer is so full of shit |
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ProudDad (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 12:36 PM Response to Reply #49 |
71. "Sick Around the World" is a good one to watch... |
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Crunchy Frog (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 07:07 PM Response to Reply #71 |
85. Yes, I've seen it. It's an excellent documentary. |
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Donnachaidh (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Dec-19-10 01:36 PM Response to Original message |
55. wow - what a pantload of spin |
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Unvanguard (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Dec-19-10 07:31 PM Response to Original message |
58. He has a point. Absent Republican success in the next four years or so |
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Milo_Bloom (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Dec-19-10 07:35 PM Response to Original message |
59. You mean like the utility companies that raped California a few years back? |
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and-justice-for-all (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 12:10 AM Response to Original message |
62. WooHoo!!! Single Payer Baby, bring it on!!! nt |
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ibegurpard (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 04:11 AM Response to Original message |
63. keep dreaming |
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niceypoo (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 11:37 AM Response to Original message |
66. It's called privatization |
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ProudDad (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 12:31 PM Response to Original message |
70. Krauthammer has been CONSISTENTLY WRONG forever |
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Mimosa (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 02:05 PM Response to Reply #70 |
75. ^ True! K-Hammer & Kristol are the same in that way: always wrong. ^ n/t |
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craigmatic (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 02:59 PM Response to Original message |
80. I see it this way, if the insurance companies have to cover everyone then they're |
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Mimosa (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 08:30 PM Response to Reply #80 |
88. What about the WOMEN? |
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ProudDad (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 09:33 PM Response to Reply #88 |
91. It's not even close to how it was in the early 2000s... |
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Mimosa (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-21-10 08:47 PM Response to Reply #91 |
99. ProudDad, that's considered GOOD! |
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ProudDad (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 09:32 PM Response to Reply #80 |
90. They will pick option #2... |
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Juche (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 09:45 PM Response to Original message |
92. Health reform moved the overton window to the left, so in the regards yeah |
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Marr (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-21-10 02:50 AM Response to Original message |
93. What a ridiculous argument. Since when is Charles fucking Krauthammer "perceptive"? |
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Mimosa (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-21-10 08:49 PM Response to Reply #93 |
100. Ugly truth: whatever Krauthammer wants, Democratic majority has delivered. |
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mmonk (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-21-10 06:51 AM Response to Original message |
94. Not unless the Republicans he borrowed from and insurance company |
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moondust (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-21-10 03:05 PM Response to Original message |
98. Not gonna happen in a plutocracy. n/t |
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