Which of these is the most significant achievement of year

[ProSense]

Poll question: Which of these is the most significant achievement of year

Number one achievement among the following

[femmocrat]

1. I voted for HC reform, because it took like 50 years to get anything done!

All of the above are significant, though. Certainly, the winding down of the war in Iraq is right up there.

[silverweb]

2. Isn't it wonderful to have such choices?

I can't make up my mind, which thrills me. :D

[grahamhgreen]

3. I think the admin called it "Health Insurance Reform", not "Health Care".

[harun]

38. It was Health Insurance Reform, not Health Care Reform.

[Warren Stupidity]

4. Extending the insane Bush Tax Cut for Billionaires.

Why is that not on the list?

[ProSense]

5. "Why is that not on the list?"

Why not start your own list?

Happy New Year!

[Name removed]

28. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[ProSense]

29. No, it's

because it's not a significant achievement relative to the OP list or any number of other achievements by this administration.

Still, feel free to make your own list, positive or negative. That would be more constructive than trying to assign bogus motives to other people.

[Warren Stupidity]

32. "not a significant achievement "

sure it is. You just don't want it on your list. Hint 'significant' is neutral with respect to 'good' or 'bad'.

[ProSense]

34. "sure it is. You just don't want it on your list. "

No, it's not. That's my opinion. If you consider it significant, that's your prerogative.

[frazzled]

30. Because it's not really that important

Look, even Dean Baker, the leftest of the lefty economists, said it isn't that big of a deal (I'll even give you the Counterpunch link to it, so you know I'm citing a sufficiently leftist site):

The short-run alternative is increased demand from the government -- yes, large deficits. In spite of the Bowles-Simpson clown show, for the foreseeable future the deficit is our friend. We need to get money into the economy to sustain demand and employment.

For this reason, extending the tax cuts to the richest 2 percent for another two years is not especially harmful. It will hand money to people who will spend at least some it, thereby creating demand and generating jobs.

Of course we would be much better off if the $50 billion going to the rich each year instead went to other purposes, such as preventing cutbacks by state and local governments or rebuilding infrastructure, but if the question is whether the economy will do better with the tax cuts or a smaller deficit in 2011 and 2012, the answer is that we will unambiguously do better with the tax cuts to the rich.

http://www.counterpunch.org/baker12102010.html

You can continue to think this was some kind of travesty that hurts people or the economy, but it's a blip. Of course we would prefer that they not get those tax cuts extended for two years, out of a simple sense of justice. But our greater sense of justice says it's more important to grow the economy (by--yes, as Baker explains--growing the deficit), extending unemployment insurance during a still-rocky jobs market, expand the earned income tax credit for the lowest wage workers, etc. than to have our sense of moral outrage justified.

[Warren Stupidity]

31. Right. It was 'drowning the baby in the bathtub' when Bush did it.

It was a deliberately ruinous and corrupt policy that depleted the treasury in advance of the payback demand from boomer retirees back in '01, and now it is insignificant.

Hmmm...

Bad policy is bad policy. The label attached to the policy is not important.

[frazzled]

33. Read the article again

and live historically. As Baker explains, we are in a recessionary mode right now in which it is DESIRABLE for the government to increase its deficit. So it's not as harmful as other things would be.

It never should have happened in the first place (although it's not the main reason for the deficits that Bush ran up). But compared to what we got in return and the various stimulative measures that were never going to come out of Congress, it wasn't a horrible thing to bargain away for two years.

[DutchLiberal]

41. The same as why 'Supporting the military dictatorship in Honduras' is not on the list...

[DCKit]

6. All of 'em are HUGH, but you won't hear it here.

Even after eight years of "Teh Moran in Cheef", so many seem unimpressed.

[lunasun]

22. you got that right !!

[boppers]

7. Sotomayor, Ledbetter, Federal Partner Benefits, Net Neutrality, Stem Cell Funding...

You could make a really big list, I suppose.

[Tx4obama]

43. Sotomayor, Ledbetter, Stem Cell bill, was in the Year 2009. n/t

[boppers]

8. Wait, what does:

"Repeal of ‘Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell’ Repeal" Mean? A repeal was repealed?

[ProSense]

9. Hmmmm?

Wait, what does: "Repeal of ‘Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell’ Repeal" Mean?

Too much wine.

:rofl:

[boppers]

11. It's a good night for that.

:toast:

[awoke_in_2003]

10. "End of combat operations in Iraq"...

thanks, and to quote Doctor Evil - "I haven't laughed like that since i was a little girl"

[ProSense]

14. Hey

it was a damn good start.

<...>

When President Obama took office in January 2009, there were 144,000 U.S. troops in Iraq. At his Camp Lejeune speech on February 27, 2009, President Obama announced that the United States would end its combat mission on August 31, 2010, and retain a transitional force of up to 50,000 U.S. troops to train and advise Iraqi Security Forces; conduct partnered and targeted counter-terrorism operations; and protect ongoing U.S. civilian and military efforts.

<...>

- In June 2009, U.S. Forces occupied 357 bases. U.S. Forces currently occupy 121 bases, and are expected to reduce that number to 94 bases by the end of August.

link

Happy New Year!

[awoke_in_2003]

15. okay, then when...

are the rest of them coming home? Maybe 10 years from now.

[Ter]

20. He just changed the name and called it a non-combat mission

They are still dying there.

[awoke_in_2003]

12. oh, and my vote...

repeal of DADT

[awoke_in_2003]

13. and the Matthew Shepard Act....

should be on this list (just knock off the bogus "health care reform" bullshit)

[ProSense]

16. Good one, but

"just knock off the bogus 'health care reform'"

...it belongs

[Tx4obama]

44. That one was the year before in 2009. n/t

[Number23]

17. I went with health care reform, but I gotta say

that the end of combat ops in Iraq is a very close second.

[Lorien]

18. Winning another one for the Gipper!

and all of his fat cat cronies.

[vaberella]

19. There's a 7 year ban on oil drilling? Shit...I didn't know that. That's my pick. n/t

[ThomCat]

21. Does Obama get credit for ending DADT?

I mean, he did sign it. But it is his job to sign bills. That's basically giving him credit for showing up. But meanwhile, he was in court fighting to Keep DADT in place, and he couldn't/didn't make any phone calls to put pressure on anyone to push repealing DADT. He was able to make phone calls to pressure people to support his tax bills, but DADT, nope, not a single reported phone call. So how can he get credit for something if he was on the other side in court and wasn't even making any effort on the phones?

Are people still pushing the idea that the insurance bill was some kind of victory? It was a republican bill, that moved further to the right through constant concessions, with liberals barred from the negotiations but corporate lobbyists helping to write the legislation in back room deals. They were promised from the very beginning that the role and profitability of insurance companies would be protected, and lowering costs wasn't a goal.

Increasing coverage was only theoretically achieved by mandating that everyone pay up to 22% of our income to private corporations as a new income tax payable directly to private corporations, but with no mandate that they actually deliver services. They can still deny services, limit services, or kick people off to medicare if they use "too much" health care to be profitable. Seriously, how can anyone sane consider that a victory?

That is like Bush strutting under his "Mission Accomplished" banner. Do something half-assed and declare that it means the goal was completely achieved, or will be completely soon. :eyes:

And ending combat in Iraq? We are still in Iraq, and combat is still happening. Our troops there are still in still in the middle of that combat. Tens of thousands of troops are not "advisers," especially when they are stationed in permanent military bases.

Obama has had some successes, but they aren't great liberal successes. He has successfully expanded free trade agreements, which will improve some economic numbers, but also send more jobs overseas. He has had some environmental successes, just not major ones, and matched by some environmental failures like his handling of the BP spill. His first stimulus was a minor success. Well, it was a major success for large businesses, it just wasn't a success for anyone who wasn't already wealthy, and he failed to follow it up with the necessary policies to create jobs and create recovery for small companies and for real people.

Going over one's successes is not a bad thing, but this idea of constantly insisting that everything Obama touches was somehow an overwhelming success of epic proportion is pure delusion.

[Clio the Leo]

24. Remember that survey everyone hated?

Everyone, of course, but the moderates in the Senate to whom it gave the political cover so they could vote for it (which was the whole point.)

Good grief. Happy New Year.

[Clio the Leo]

25. dupe

[stevenleser]

36. Do you really operate under the mischaracterizations you just wrote? Wow.

Talk about being determined not to give the President credit for anything. I thought I could spin with the best of them, but you, my friend, have just shown me a whole new level.

[JoePhilly]

37. I love the spin.

All he did was "sign" DADT, but he OWNS the HCR reform (because you don't like it).

And like it or not, reducing our troops presence in Iraq to 50k was EXACTLY what he promised to do as a candidate.

You've got him right ... worst President ever.

[Agent William]

23. A pretty short list, I recon...

I think Nixon had more positive achievements. Fuck me, LBJ had real land-mark reforms and he only had 55 senators. Also I'm looking at some of these accomplishments and I see that only a couple were really led by the president. DADT was the Senate, the 'end' of the Iraq war was scheduled to end in 2010 by the previous administration. Not surprisingly Wall Street 'Reform' didn't get any votes here since it really isn't worth very much... if anything.

HCR is more a less a series of coupons when compared with what needs to be done. Don't try and tell me that HCR was earth shaking or of any importance. The Obama administration actively campaigned against some of the strongest parts of the house bill, think Single-payer, Public Option and drug re-importation. The parts that did get passed could easily have been achieved in separate smaller bills, but the White House wanted to have its own 'Mission-Accomplished' banner in HCR.

So far I'm not really all that impressed with this White-House, I'm hoping that will change. I will give him credit for the fact that he's not Bush jr. and he did make two solid picks for the Supreme Court.

[ProSense]

26. Two things:

this isn't a full list and this:

"Fuck me, LBJ had real land-mark reforms and he only had 55 senators."

...is completely inaccurate because LBJ had 66 Democratic Senators.

[Agent William]

27. My bad

I looked it up..... My bad....

But I think my number may have come from an adjustment to include Southern Conservative Democrats; but that's still the case. My point is that this current president is somewhat lacking in the courage department. I say somewhat since he does quite often show flashes of zeal only to latter fold to right wing pressure.

Be that as it may, he Supreme Court picks are pretty solid and that is reason enough for me to support him, well once I get back to the US that is...

[harun]

39. Perfect summary, agree.

[Dawgs]

35. No achievement for job growth on your list?

Not something to be crowing about without it.

[DutchLiberal]

40. NOT getting a Public Option and letting insurance companies STILL run the show...

The bar has really been lowered since November '08.

[avaistheone1]

46. +100

[ProSense]

49. There were

a number of other really good things in the health care bill.

[quakerboy]

42. Remaining in 2 wars.

That would be the most significant achievement. After that, the current economy and its peculiar status. After that we get to the things on your list, where I would rank it roughly a tie between Kagan and DADT repeal

[DutchLiberal]

47. Don't forget the support for the coup and dictatorship in Honduras!

Or extrajudicial executions carried out by drones.

Or keeping Guántanamo Bay open.

Or continuing 'extraordinary rendition'.

Or not repealing the Patriot Act.

Or...

[ProSense]

48. Slight edit:

Withdrawing 100,000 troops from Iraq and reducing the number of bases from 357 to 94.

[quakerboy]

50. More accurate slight edit: Staying in 2 occupations

You asked the question. I saw fit to go for the unprovided other option. I feel that staying in Iraq and Afghanistan is the biggest single achievement of the year. Shifting focus between the two is not top 10 worthy material. If we had ended our participation, withdrawn from the occupation of Iraq, that would easily be the top of my list. I hope that we can still achieve that during the Obama administration.

[madamesilverspurs]

45. I remember

working really hard on a school project. When I got the grade I ran all the way home to show my folks that great big A. Dad looked at it and said, "If you'd worked a little harder, it could have been an A+". He probably thought it was constructive, I thought it totally sucked the joy out of my achievement.


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