Ed Schultz just said "Horrible" poll numbers coming tonight about Dems from an MSNBC poll

[KansasVoter]

They will release them on his show.

Not a surprise really with the Lieberman cave in.

And I can't wait to hear the "Big Ed is a GOP Supporter" posts from idiots who hate any comments against the Dems.

[dbonds]

1. Here is a preview of the numbers.

http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/archive/2009/12/16/2153563.aspx

Lots of RW idiots commenting that it proves the public doesn't want a public option and/or socialism.

[bbinacan]

4. Ouch. n/t

[dbonds]

8. The numbers have dropped because the bill is lame.

People wanted the public option for everyone.

[Mass]

20. Of course, still no break down between who want less and those who want more.

By now, you would think that honest polling institute would start asking the question, and my guess is that the results would be very enlightening.

[karynnj]

29. I think so too - both, the should do it and that it would be enlightening

[karynnj]

28. You can thank both the left and the right for those numbers

The plan has been slimed for months by the right and I doubt Dean et al have helped.

How many people voting either way likely know any of the details?

[Cali_Democrat]

2. Meh

Polls only matter in Novemeber every two years.

Who cares :boring:

[KansasVoter]

Keep thinking that. Brilliant!

[Cali_Democrat]

9. It's the truth

These poll numbers that come out almost every day are just plain stupid. Only political junkies follow them and they change very often.

Talk to me after the next election. The only poll that really matters.

[KansasVoter]

15. Sure, Bush sitting at 35% in 2005 didn't matter. Whoops, yes it did. We wiped them in 2006!

[Cali_Democrat]

16. You're saying Obama is in a similar situation compared to Bush?

I think not. Apples and oranges my dear.

[Guy Whitey Corngood]

3. Nobody can snatch defeat out of the jaws of victory like this bunch. nt

[kenny blankenship]

12. Truly they are made of Suck

I understand why many people are reluctant to identify as Democrats. They are born losers. Nobody wants hitch themselves to a group that takes a winning situation and invariably turns it into a fail-tacular fiasco.

[vi5]

5. The problem is....

..that the media and the democratic leadership are going to read this not as Dems abandoning ship or not supporting their third way "moderate" corporate centrism, but as a sign that they aren't being right wing enough. And as is their way they will continue to tack right to win support, approval and votes they will never, ever get.

[Armstead]

18. bingo

[Phx_Dem]

6. It's December. Who gives a shit about poll numbers.

And who would be surprised that poll numbers are dropping in the midst of an intense and ugly HCR battle.

I'll bet Ed is positively gleeful.

[Clio the Leo]

7. lol @ "who hate comments against the Dems...."

I'm sorry, I didn't realize I'd stumbled into Freeperville.

[BlueIdaho]

10. Not surprising

Health care reform became health insurance reform and now a desperate last gasp effort to get the president"a win." This stopped being bout helping the sick and the poor last August. Since then its been an exercise in moving the democratic party to the right.

[kenny blankenship]

11. I love how they put "Obama's Plan" in bold face - this IS NOT the plan Obama ran on

it's not even remotely similar.

[paulk]

13. if he signs it, it's his

I think he'll sign whatever piece of crap gets put in front of him.

[euphoria12leo]

19. What will happen if he doesn't sign it?

:cry:

[krawhitham]

22. This place will explode

Hell this place will explode if he does sign it


Damned it you do damned if you don't

[euphoria12leo]

26. Exactly

How can we move forward if we do nothing? This is :crazy:


:nuke:

[paulk]

27. not everyone thinks this bill means "moving forward"

:shrug:

[euphoria12leo]

32. So what's next

kill the bill? If the bill is dead so are Democrats. I'm just trying to figure this all out. If we're throwing in the towel the Dems should just say so. I'm not going to keep donating to help the DSCC, Progressives, MoveOn or anybody else. If the bill is not a first step to real reform after we weed out the blue dogs then it's over. Too many mixed messages. Now they say Rahm is pushing for the Medicare Buy In. An option he helped kill. Some DUers want the President out why don't they write emails and start with Rahm add attachments. Too many others to list.


:dilemma:

[paulk]

33. Democrats could be just as "dead" if the bill passes

Have you seen the latest polls on this piece of crap?

Maybe if the liberal wing of the party makes a big enough stink about this, a public option or medicare buy in will be reinserted. The Democratic Party needs to start listening to it's members, or else we are going to get our ass handed to us in 2010.

[euphoria12leo]

37. Believe it are not

yes I have seen the polls. I'm doing my part and so are a lot of others. The rest is up to those we elected to serve the people.

[tomm2thumbs]

23. and right afterward, he'll give a big sloppy wet kiss to Joe Lieberman (no breath mints)

someone needs to grow a pair - and this Democratic team of blue-balled, blue dogs should all be driven out for not making the most basic commitment to reasonably priced health care for Americans - the one issue that is so uncontroversial and that the GOP is in lock step to defeat.

[krawhitham]

24. signing statements :)

[janx]

14. TRUE. n/t

[Phoebe Loosinhouse]

17. It is Obama's plan in the sense that he backed no specific plan

and just let chaos ensue as all the various committees in the 2 Houses all attempted to re-invent the wheel from scratch.

Do you remember the big White House kick-off symposium for reform with the "stakeholders" all in attendence (except for single payer reps who were grudgingly allowed in at the last minute and had to sit at the children table and eat hotdogs)?

I actually plowed through all the many pages of nothingness, but sprinkled throughout here and there were various pleas for "guidance" from the White House.

The guidance that did come came rather furtively in meetings with Lobbyists at the White House, deals with Pharma, and working through Max Baucus in Finance.

This is a point that has been commented on many times. Usually people say he did it this way in order to be seen as a unificator and bi-partisan, and that he didn't want to repeat the Clinton error of just handing down legislation. I think this was his most major mistake. He had a plan and people approved of his plan and this IS NOT the Clinton era. People wanted, swift, sure fast reform.

I have come to think that he himself did not want the plan he campaigned on and that is why he jettisoned it as quickly as possible and did a number of things he SPECIFICALLY said he would not do - pander to lobbyists, make deals with Pharma, have secret White House meetings (they had to be sued, remember to release the names of who visited). He is probably wandering around the White House right now saying "I can't believe they actually believed all that s@#t." That may sound harsh, but cynicism is the remnants of hope gone bad.

I have every reason to believe Russ Feingold who came out in the open and said we ARE getting the reform the President wants. Can't be any clearer than that.

[ChairmanAgnostic]

34. then why did he also say,

the culprit here is not Lieberman, but Obama, for his failure to show any leadership on HCR?

Sorry, you are just plain wrong.

[Zodiak]

41. Nice post....you're like Yoda tonight

Without the strange diction, of course.

[BlueIdaho]

25. Its ObamaCare - get used to it.

It will forever be know as ObamaCare and folks won't say that with a tear in their voice - it will be a punchline.

[FiveGoodMen]

39. But according to Feingold, it IS the bill Obama WANTED.

And I'd trust Russ over Barack any day of the week and twice on Sunday.

[tomm2thumbs]

21. Dems who thought nothing of walking away from health care reform need to be replaced

I hope Firedoglake is accurate about starting the process of getting primary contenders of substance for each and every region where these turncoats played their nuclear game against their own party. There is no excuse for their self-inflicted wounds, but damn if I want to keep these brainless Dinos around for another run.

[RamboLiberal]

30. TPM: Poll: Loss Of Public Option Causes Big Increase In Opposition To Health Care Bill

The NBC/Wall Street Journal poll coming out later today will show opposition to the health care bill growing -- mainly from disappointed liberals, who are very much disappointed to see the public option getting thrown out.

The poll has 47% saying the Obama health care plan is a bad idea, to only 32% who say it's a good idea.

Chuck Todd writes on Twitter: "Most of the movement on the 'bad idea' comes from some of the president's core support groups, folks upset about lost public option." He also writes: "Still, large majorities of the president's core support groups believe his plan is a 'good idea,' but the margins have shrunk."

In addition, 44% now say it's better to not pass this bill -- seemingly a large bloc of conservatives, plus some liberals -- to 41% who say it's better that something pass: "First time NBC-WSJ poll had that upside down."

http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2009/12/poll-loss-of-public-option-causes-big-increase-in-opposition-to-health-care-bill.php?ref=fpblg

[depakid]

31. Now, if the wqhitehouse AND progressives had been out in front hammering the so called "centrists"

it would be they-- along with Republicans who bore the brunt of the onus. But nope- instead if fighting, we got pandering.

It's one thing to go down swinging- to fight the good fight- and quite another to be perceived as weak, uncertain and incapable of getting it done after so much talk.

American want to see results- or at least a call 'em out battle- not the same old excuse making.

[Robbins]

35. The Deal

Big revolt among the Obama supporters over the sellout to Lieberman and top DINO'S Ben Nelson,Blance
Lincoln,and the lying Bitch Landauru(sorry to female DU'S but no other words for her after her hardball
apperance)

Many are like me and consider reform dead.

Democrats need to get it throught their heads If they want to keep the House and maintain a decent
percentage(as Howard Dean said we can keep 55 seats and i consider Lieberman a Republican) In the senate they have to get the base out to vote.This was the lesson of the losses In 2009 In NJ and
Virginia.We have won house special elections because we got voters out.Angering the base like they
keep doing Is crazy.Surging In afghanstain,and not having stronger regulations Is one thing but the
sellout on Health Care Is going too far.Lieberman,and the top 3 DINO'S will do nothing to help
Democrats In 2010.Lincoln Is probally going to be voted out,and Lieberman will endorse and campagin
for Republicans and not a single Democrat.

[ShortnFiery]

36. When the Democratic Reps. find their spine in support of Economic and Social JUSTICE, then they will

enjoy the support of the Average American.

They have lost their way and many are nothing more than Whores for Big Business.

[budkin]

38. Good, many of us DO NOT APPROVE

And they need to know this.

[lifesbeautifulmagic]

40. mandated health insurance with no

public option or universal coverage will kill the Dems.

I am ready to be shunned now. :)