I cannot believe I live in a country where a person running

[efhmc]

for president is "wildly" applauded for his execution record. This disgusted me. Granted it was said in saint reagan land to a group of right wingers but it is still very shocking that this reaction is not look at with any degree of shame or guilt..

[potone]

1. I agree.

It is shocking and shameful. When did we sink so low?

[Tesha]

30. I'm not sure it's a question of whether we've sunk or whether things have just floated up.

Go read our gun forum -- there, they support the idea
of killing anyone who enters your house for any reason
including just being drunk and entering the wrong house.

It's a Helluva country!

Tesha

[saras]

65. Jee-zuz! I knew people in college for whom that was fully one-third of their social lives.

It might not deserve to get you into as many great parties as it does, but it sure as hell doesn't deserve a death sentence.

"If they ask about Charlemagne,
Be polite, and say something vague,
Like 'another lover lost in the restaurant raids'"...

[efhmc]

70. Someone once wondered past the fence and locked gate

onto our ranch. Must have climbed over the fence. My Texas husband was not happy with this person but he and the foreman escorted the miscreant off the property without any violence. I was elsewhere but I am know for sure that guns were drawn. I don't think he (husband) even called the sheriff. Not everyone who loves guns thinks one should be shot for being stupid or addicted. BTW, I hate the things (guns).

[aikoaiko]

77. Excellent mischaracterization of the guns forum, Tesha.

So called Castle Doctrine laws usually require a forcible felony and/or physical threat to justify using lethal force

And yes, there is a lot of support in the guns forum for Castle Doctrine laws and very little support for using lethal force against those who do not pose a threat.

[efhmc]

79. Once was told that if you shot someone on your property to

be sure to drag him across your threshold before calling the authorities. Is that what you are talking about?

[aikoaiko]

82. No, that's not what I'm talking about.

To tamper with evidence after a shooting would often be a crime.

[efhmc]

110. Of course you are correct but this info was given to me

by a friend. The "information" was told to her by her cousin/sheriff. I think he was not advocating this method but was in his own folksy way trying to show the legal distinction. Please explain what you mean. Thanks.

[Tesha]

120. Excuse me, but I didn't mischaracterize the conversation one iota.

In a very recent thread, I asked the question several ways
and there was no doubt at all in a number of the replies from
several posters: they had no qualms about shooting *ANY*
intruder under any set of circumstances, even if the circumstances
were simply a drunk climbing through the wrong house's window.

It astounded me, but unless the threads or posts have been
deleted, they are still there to be seen.

Tesha

[pscot]

128. Death to trespassers

The actual standard seems to be whether you feel your life is threatened. So if you're easily frightened, you can blast away with impunity.

[aikoaiko]

134. I missed that thread, but I've had a drunk walk in through an unlocked back door

I was 20, 6'4" and about 200 lbs and this guy was huge (couple of inches taller and at least 100 lbs bigger). My girlfriend was in the living room and I walked into the kitchen when he entered. He looked at me with a disturbed look and asked for Bertha (not my gf). I said there was no here by that name and to leave. He replied in a big loud angry voice, "Where's Bertha"? I realized at that point he was drunk, thought he at Bertha's house, and that we were in danger.

I did my best big voice "get the fuck out - you are in the wrong house" posture and he left.

If he kept coming in I would have had to stop him physically. I likely would have lost that fight but at least my gf could have gotten out the front door and to a neighbors. If I had a gun at the time, I think I would have been justified in threatening to shoot him if he didn't leave and shooting him if he tried to came at me or get past me.

My point is that not all drunks at the wrong house are benevolent or easily redirected. Furthermore, if someone was climbing in through a window I would have even more reason to be suspicious and on guard because they look like someone breaking and entering.

If pressed I would say that if it is fact that someone is unlawfully entering a house under unknown circumstances, I would not blame resident from protecting him or herself from a possible serious threat. On a personal level, I would probably wait until I was more certain that a serious threat existed (the drunk continued to come at me despite a warning or showed a weapon).

[Tesha]

135. Your position sounds fine but in that thread, at least some said they would shoot...

...rather than take any other action.

It was very impressive (but not in a good way).

Tesha

[crim son]

113. Gun forum comment aside (though I have read the same thoughts

posted there) you make an excellent point. All forms of vile behavior have become legitimized over the last decade and people feel free to act on their worst impulses. Indeed, they are applauded for it. Ironically, the religious right who would claim this is a consequence of the "absence of God" in our society, is one of the major perpetrators.

[woo me with science]

2. This country is changing in a very scary way.

I also can't believe I live in a country where masses are unemployed and they are now focused on slashing the safety nets for the poor and elderly.

[livetohike]

3. It seemed like a sci-fi movie

..... and frightening.

[Chipper Chat]

17. Movie? Like Quo Vadis?

when the Christians were eaten by lions? The crowd applauded each kill.
ancient Roman citizens = 21st century American republicans?

[livetohike]

19. Yes, exactly that

:-(.

[yurbud]

4. he would have gotten even louder applause if he said he didn't care if some were innocent

[MrDiaz]

23. if someone

raped and killed your sister, mother, daughter, brother, father, or son. Would you not agree with the penalty then? Or would you be fine that they were able to live their life even though your mother, sister, daughter, brother, father, or son could not?

[Lydia Leftcoast]

25. How many of those audience members actually had someone killed...

and how many of them were just bloodthirsty, the types who used to gather at public executions?

[Politicalboi]

27. If they live in Simi Valley

Probably none. I was raised there, it is one of the safest cities to live in. Low crime rate, although it was tainted with the Manson clan. But for the most part, not too many murders that I remember. Usually any murders were probably domestic disputes.

[Ken Burch]

28. A lot of the LAPD live there, don't they?

(...at least I remember that being one of the things we learned during the Rodney King era...)

[Bluenorthwest]

104. Yes it is very much LAPD bedroom land

nt

[Ken Burch]

29. If that happened to me, I'd be devastated and enraged.

But there are a lot of people who have lost loved ones to violence but DON'T support the death penalty. Nobody in the Kennedy family does, for example.

[efhmc]

58. I cannot say, thankfully, how I would react but the idea that

the number of executions you have sanctioned is something to be cheered is definitely not a measure of any kind of civilized society.

[me b zola]

67. I am one of those

I have been the victim of violent crimes and do not accept nor support the death penalty. I actually had a pro-authoritarian tell me they didn't believe i was violently raped cause i didn't spend every waking hour plotting the demise of my attacker. Just wow, that hurt almost as bad as the cops who treated me like crap while investigating. The hospital wouldn't even give me scrubs to leave the hospital in, my clothes were in evidence and I needed to go to cop shop. I had to wear a hospital gown, furthering the entire humiliation. The cops sat around and laughed at my expense cause i was young and good looking. Still, I moved on and didn't allow the rapist to have power over the rest of my life. I think i actually resent the fucked up cops and er fuck heads more than the pitiful rapist.

[Ken Burch]

68. Jesus! What the hell was wrong with that hospital!

That kind of Neanderthal shit from cops is one thing...but why would a hospital be such total bastards towards a RAPE victim? I hope you sued them. At the very least, you SHOULD reveal that hospital's name so that people can call them on it.

And the "pro-authoritarian" person who said that to you deserves a massive asswhupping of some sort-maybe not physically so, but at some cosmic level.

[me b zola]

73. It was from the same town that a local prison sent their inmates to the hospital

...years later i was doing my clincals as a nursing student and remember a man(prisoner) being taken into the secure area where i was not allowed. I remember him screaming in pain, and the nurses laughing at him saying he just wanted pain killers. He was dead the next day, his appendix ruptured. They neglected him because of their prejudices. I will never forget.

[efhmc]

78. This is so wrong. No person should be treated like this.

I believe that every time something like this happens that we are reduced as humans beings.

[me b zola]

85. I agree

We are all diminished when injustices like this happen. When "good" people make excuses for this stuff it diminishes us beyond words.

[MedicalAdmin]

102. I saw a way to document that once that was very effective.

I was working in a prison that was staffed by about 95% liberals (and was very safe - coincidence?). At any rate one of the 5 % of repub dipshits was ignoring a prisoner with documented health issues who had been taken to the hospital before claiming that the guy was faking it. He refused to call it in and I saw one of the older guards just say to him that the older guard was putting it in the log and covering his ass and what the repub guard did was his own "fucking" business.

Once an official light can be shined on them most assholes back off being cowards at heart.

Is there a similar nurses official logbook?

[bengalherder]

111. I nearly went into shock after surgery because a doctor

shared that predjudice. He would not give me pain killers because he was convinced my pain was not pain but withdrawal from opiates.

I am eternally lucky and here today because I had two friends and the wife of my boss working at the hospital as nurses who went to bat for me and got me the meds I needed.

[efhmc]

75. So sad that we live in place that treats humans with such

disrespect. What a wonderful kind of power you have that allows you to reclaim your life from such callousness and pain. Blessings.

[Enthusiast]

100. I understand your sentiments.

I hate this country.

[muffin1]

33. I would NOT agree in those circumstances. Neither should you.

DNA testing has resulted in the previously convicted being shown to be innocent. When someone is put to death, that cannot be rectified. Life in prison can be.

Even one innocent person put to death is one TOO MANY.

[efhmc]

59. We know for certain at least one person was innocent. Who

knows how many more were wrongfully killed.

[rpannier]

55. Mario Cuomo put it best when he talked about the difference between private and public justice

Of course I'd want to get even.
But the state has a more powerful obligation than the person does.
The state is supposed to deal with awful things in a rational way.
There is very little rational about executing someone because it's based on revenge
Revenge is not rational, it's emotional

[Hippo_Tron]

60. Ex ante probably, ex post probably not

People generally think that acts of vengeance will make them feel better. Then when they get their revenge it usually doesn't. That's aside from the fact that the feelings of a victim's family are an incredibly stupid means on which to base a justice system.

[IrishEyes]

62. I would never want my government to murder anyone.

Life in prison without the possibility of parole id a better alternative to the state murdering people. Innocent people have been executed in this country. The majority of countries have done anyway with the death penalty. I'm happy that I live in a state that doesn't have the death penalty.

[efhmc]

80. Lucky you. Mine kills them all the time and is proud of it.

At least the governor and his supporters are.

[sudopod]

86. The thing is that dozens of TX death row inmates have been found innocent through DNA evidence in

the last decade. That means that not only is it likely that innocent men and women are being killed by the state of Texas, but also that the true perpetrators are still free.

But hey, as long as we have a scalp, right?

[WiffenPoof]

89. This argument comes up all the time...

I honestly don't know how I would feel. However, I recall a mother who went to death row to confront the person that killed her son. No, it's not what you think. She went there to forgive him.

-P

[coalition_unwilling]

93. I think you forgot 'aunt' and 'uncle' and 'grandfather' and 'grandmother'

in your list of presumptive victims. :sarcasm:

You're perfectly OK, I see, with innocent people being put to death just so you can have some vicarious experience of vengeance.

Off to the Ignore list with you.

[yurbud]

116. I never said I oppose the death penalty, but I do oppose the lynch mob mentality of the right

to execute them fast before anyone asks too many questions about the details like whether they really did it or not.

The right seems to believe that an accusation is evidence enough of guilt, much like their support of torture and indefinite detention.

Have you read any of the stories of DNA exonerations of those on death row and even cases where defendants confessed or made plea bargains and it turned out they were innocent?

PBS FRONTLINE did a story on this years back, and in Illinois, the Republican governor was so disturbed by the number of people on death row who turned out to be innocent that he commuted everyone else's sentence to life in prison without parole because he didn't want to unknowingly sign the death warrant of an innocent man.

Also, your chances of getting the death penalty are astronomically higher if you are poor, black, or retarded. If you are all three, you might as well skip the trial and go sit in the electric chair and wait for them to pull the switch.

In principle, we do need the death penalty for some of the most heinous crimes, even if it is rarely used and isn't a deterrent. Otherwise, what would we do with guys already serving life in prison without parole if they kill a guard or fellow inmate, take away their dessert?

The problem is it is implemented by fallible humans, and the more fallible, the less they want checks and balances and review of their work.

[Proud Liberal Dem]

127. There is high likelihood that, in at least one case, Perry presided

over the execution of an innocent man and, from what I have heard, he actively prevented/stymied efforts to exonerate him. :puke:

[ZombieHorde]

129. I would be fine with not killing the murderer. What good would it do me? nt

[CaliforniaPeggy]

5. The rock has been turned over, and now we see the slime beneath...

Something has given them permission to come out so we can see them...

God knows what else they're hiding from us.

We must use the light of day to defeat them...

[glowing]

6. It doesn't' surprise me at all.. This board nearly melted down with

the Casey Anthony trial... People outright calling for her death or demise down a dark alley... People in this country tend to be more wild west, hang them up; than thoughtful and addressing societies ills before people commit heinous crimes. There are more than a few people within the criminal justice system that were physically or sexually abused while they were children... There's more than a few who have had some sort of break with reality from a crazy fundie parent.

[Whisp]

88. :shivers: couldn't believe the shit I heard here on that case.

still gives me the creeps

[Ken Burch]

7. Let's face it...in this country...when you say "I support the death penalty"

It's code for "Elect me, and I'll kill the n_____s!" And a large bloc who cheer for executions do so for that sickening reasons. Nobody really believes our murder rate is THAT far out of control, and it didn't exactly skyrocket in the four years(1972 to 1976)that executions were banned in this country.

[tblue]

11. I could cry. I'm sure you're right.

:cry: TROY DAVIS, right now!

[JohnnyRingo]

12. Exactly right.

The states with death penalties do not have a lower murder rate per capita than those without, or at least the rate doesn't decrease when capital punishment is at stake.

The reason is fundamental: No one expects to get caught.

[Jackpine Radical]

115. I analyzed that data once.

States with the death penalty have higher murder rates than ones without. I think there is a connection. The death penalty in essence amounts to a bunch of people ganging up on one and killing him. No matter that it's done in accordance with the law. The law promotes the idea that it is sometimes OK to kill. I believe it is never OK to kill, except in certain circumstances of self-defense. Certainly never "in cold blood." Not for an individual, not for the state. The state is in essence modeling the behavior that it wants to extinguish.

[JohnnyRingo]

133. I used to work with a guy....

I don't recall what we were talking about, but a recent execution came into the conversation.
My co-worker said he'd like to "pull the switch" on a murderer. Taken back a little, I asked if he meant for a victim he knew. He just kinda looked through me and said: "no".

There are a lot of spineless creepy people out there who just want to be responsible for a person's last breath.

[golfguru]

20. Not racial...Speck, Gacy, Green river serial killer were all white

and they all deserve the death penalty for torture killings of multiple human beings.

[Ken Burch]

21. It wasn't those guys who inspired the campaign to resume executions

Loathesome as they are(oh, and by the way, those who oppose the death penalty hate murderers and murderers just as much as death penalty supporters do...and you damn well know it...nobody who opposes the death penalty thinks that killing people is no big deal...) those guys weren't what inspired the massive support for the dp in places like Mississippi, Texas, Georgia, Florida and places like that.

[Recursion]

109. Well, ok, but the main systemic racial bias that has been demonstrated is about the victims

White victims yield death penalties, non-white victims don't. This actually leads to death row being whiter than the population of murderers in general.

[jberryhill]

84. Ah, well, that is a representative sample...

But it is surprising that Jewish voters tend not to support the death penalty, since most Jews are African Americans, like Sammy Davis Jr.

Kind of like how aviation was pioneered primarily by women like Amelia Earhardt.

[Recursion]

108. Oddly enough it's the opposite: white people end up "overrepresented" on death row

There's some serious racism in how the death penalty is applied, but it's this: the easiest way to get on death row is to kill a white person. Most murder victims are killed by someone of their own race. So we end up with a higher percentage of white murderers than black murderers being given the death penalty. I'm not sure what to do with that.

[tblue]

8. We got 2 countries here: one with a conscience and one without

I really believe that's the difference.

[patrice]

16. I'm afraid that's true. Whatever it is that "Christianity" gets tax exemption for, it has FAILED in

accomplishing it.

[Ken Burch]

22. As a person who still considers myself more or less Christian

it still amazes me that anyone from a faith whose central figure was executed could actually support the death penalty. Sort of makes me think of the old Lenny Bruce line about how, if Jesus had lived in the 20th Century, all the Catholic kids would be wearing little electric chairs around their necks.

[patrice]

32. That's the fact of it. Jesus never went anywhere; he's still here and he's still dying for our sins.

In our wars and in our prisons and in our economic ghettos.

Yes, people DO have responsibilities for their own behaviors AND that includes those of us who do things big and small, and perhaps most especially the "small" stuff, that make it harder and harder for others to be free enough to have a chance to choose goodness and light. If our responsibilities don't mean anything, their responsibilities don't mean anything either.

I'm a Christian too, just over the institutionalized church, now into the free church, the Church of No Walls, or the Church of the Open Sky as my late spouse used to say.

[Ken Burch]

34. I kind of like that church myself

And I think of the song I'm linking to below as asking as the one real question every person of any sort of faith should have, because if you live the way you'd live when you do ask that to yourself, over and over, you'd probably end up living a pretty freakin' moral life:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B4CRkpBGQzU

[patrice]

35. Funny you should post that. I listened to this song several years ago for about

2 weeks straight, nothing else, right after my man died. My/our daughter gave it to me.

I can't listen to it right now . . .

. . . but I will later, before I call it a night.

[Ken Burch]

37. Oh, my God. I had no idea. So sorry for bringing that back

Went through the death of a spouse myself several years ago. And if you listened to it that much, you probably don't need to hear it again. Be well.

:cry: :hug:

[patrice]

40. No, it's okay. It's a sweet pain now.

He was a truly fine man. I was lucky to have known him so long. O8)

:hug:

[Ken Burch]

41. I was lucky to share my life with her, as well.

I'm glad you're in something of a good place with it.

Have a good day.

[patrice]

45. Thanks. You probably know . . .

when your heart cracks like that, it changes you. You either REALLY grow for true certain sure, or you hide from it.

Goodness and light to you, Ken Burch.

[Ken Burch]

50. And to you

All any of us can do is to try to find meaning in it, somehow.

[MedicalAdmin]

103. Well said. Very well said

May I use that excellent argument?

[JohnnyRingo]

9. As the last three governors of Texas approached the record for the most executions

they relied more and more on rubber stamping approval as quickly as possible. in GW Bush's case, he began asking his attorney general if the person was guilty so he didn't have to waste time reading.

When they ignore contradicting evidence to become the killingest governor in history, it becomes a dangerous and morbid contest.

[efhmc]

31. The last three governors included Ann Richards. Was she

really s part of those stats?

[Ken Burch]

39. Yes. Her unsuccessful re-election campaign against Dubya

included a fight over who'd waste the most perps, essentially. I loved Ann Richards, but it's horrifying that she felt she had to do that to win. Just as it's horrifying that every elected Democratic governor in California in recent decades has felt obligate to be an execution junkie(even Moonbeam himself).

[efhmc]

43. Didn't remember that. Do remember her toting a gun hunting

birds.

[rpannier]

56. I remember that

After Dumbya shot a species on the endangered/threatened species list

[efhmc]

61. Yeap. To give credit where it is due. Carl Rove won baby

bush the governor's office and all offices afterwards. What an evil, but clever, little piece of slime he is.

[JohnnyRingo]

94. Records are made to be broken:

To quote:

Under state law, Texas governors do not have the power to commute death penalty sentences, only to briefly postpone an execution pending further review by the Texas Board of Pardons and Paroles (most members of which are appointed by the governor — including the chairman, who according to the Texas Administrative Code serves "at the pleasure of the governor".

Bowing to the reality of the pro-death penalty Texas legislature, Ann Richards was not a vocal critic of the Texas death penalty law while governor. While campaigning for governor, she was asked if she supported or opposed the death penalty. She said, "I will uphold the laws of the State of Texas." The reporter then asked, "But what would you do if the Legislature passed a bill repealing the death penalty?" to which she replied, "I would faint." Her stance disappointed various human rights groups including Amnesty International.

Ann Richards: 48 a record
GW Bush: 152 a record
Rick Perry: 234 a record

The next cowboy that wears the governor's boots may have to install cyanide showers at the state pen.

[Hawkowl]

10. Fascism

Those of us who pooh pooh the resemblance of today's Republican party to the German Nazi party of the 1930's run the risk of annihilation.

[lunatica]

13. they were applauding his John Wayne Macho Man Uberjingoism

He obviously believes people go to Texas to kill Texans since he kept saying "If you come to Texas and kill anyone you'll get the death penalty"

Stupid man.

[Ken Burch]

42. Now me, if I went to Texas, It'd just be for some music, a Lone Star tallboy

and a righteous bowl of chili. I guess I'd better stay the hell away from Rick Perry if I did make the trip.

I still don't understand how this idiot ever beat Jim Hightower in an election.

[efhmc]

57. I thought you might find this interesting.

Texas Gov. Rick Perry's big break in politics came in 1990, when he won a tight race against incumbent Jim Hightower, a progressive Democrat, to become State Agriculture Commissioner. It might not sound like much, but a statewide office is a statewide office, and Perry, who is now seriously thinking about running for president, won in a pretty rough electoral climate. (He had some help from campaign manager Karl Rove, who zeroed in on ethics lapses by a Hightower subordinate.*)

The gulf between Hightower, an organic-farming booster and later a Ralph Nader supporter, and Perry, an arch-conservative who supports criminalizing gay sex, is pretty wide. How wide? Well, in a 1991 Texas Monthly story, Dana Rubin explains that one Rick Perry's first orders of business was to cancel the agency's subscription to MoJo:

In early January, an employee armed with a video camera swept through the Austin headquarters of the Texas Department of Agriculture, making a record of every office: desks, bookshelves, computers, trash cans. Newly elected commissioner Rick Perry had ordered a top-to-bottom inventory, and his staff wanted to account for every item in the agency. Employees were asked to strip the posters, signs, and comic strips from their doors and hallways. Within days every vestige of the folksy, college dormitory atmosphere cultivated under former commissioner Jim Hightower had vanished. Gone was the rusty old plow from the lobby. Gone were the nostalgic Depression-era photographs from the walls. Gone were the agency's subscriptions to leftist periodicals such as Mother Jones, the Progressive, and the Utne Reader.

[eppur_se_muova]

14. Just imagine the audience wearing white hoods. Then it all makes sense. nt

[patrice]

15. I can believe it. Look at how "our" lust to prove ourselves as a nation blinded us to the LIES

that got us into war against an innocent sovereign nation known as Iraq.

[MADem]

18. Come on, now--not the real world. The audience was packed with idiot supporters.

You could fill an auditorium with the Klan in all their finery, but they'd still be a tiny minority of the larger society. Don't let that little tee vee make small things look bigger than they actually are.

A lot of people think his mindless executions-particularly the ones where the sentenced individual was mentally retarded, or there were questions about guilt--are reprehensible, and that view crosses party lines and is shared even by some who don't have a problem with the death penalty in certain circumstances.

[hamsterjill]

24. I can believe it.

I live amongst them. They think it would never be "them" or "theirs" in any kind of predicament. They refuse to believe that anyone who is in jail isn't deserving of being there.

This type of mindset would/will only change when this type of personality is directly affected by this. They are not capable of having empathy for anyone else's particular situation.

The "kill, kill, kill" mentality is very frightening. Especially when it's done quoting selective scripture to back it up.

[Phx_Dem]

26. +1. Brian Williams looked pretty disgusted too.

[GoCubsGo]

47. That just earned him a bit of respect in my book.

And, I generally don't have much use for him. Any halfway decent person would be disgusted by that.

[Marrah_G]

36. It's insane

[blkmusclmachine]

38. The wingers aren't right in the head:

And that's putting it charitably.

[efhmc]

44. They are also not right in the heart.

[Enthusiast]

101. It is putting it charitably.

Indoctrinated and dummed down.

[Name removed]

46. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. 
[link:www.democraticunderground.com/forums/rules.html|Click
here] to review the message board rules.

[NICO9000]

49. Kindly enjoy your brief stay here

:eyes:

[dash_bannon]

54. Get a life

You must be a real blast at parties.

[CBHagman]

48. Yes, that was shocking.

I'm curious to know what the make-up of the audience was and how people obtained entry to the event. Were they a studio audience who obtained free tickets on a first come, first served basis? Were they local Republican Party members? Patrons of the Reagan Library? College students? A combination of the above? None of the above?

[jkoehler]

51. It was very disturbing

But not unexpected. The politics have moved so far right that it's become reactionary to a scary degree. Reagan would be booed off the stage by these people. Reagan looks like FDR compared to the whackos running for the 2012 Republican nomination. Only Romney and Huntsman look somewhat sane. Most of the rest of them couldn't have been elected to a local park board 40 years ago let alone the President of the United States. Very sad what has happened to politics in the U.S.

[CBHagman]

81. I agree with you about the rightward trend and Reagan, but...

...must say that a conservative colleague of mine was also shocked and disturbed by the applause. Take that whatever way you will, but I believe that a good many people would have been appalled by the audience's reaction.

[Bluenorthwest]

105. Govenor Reagan on how to deal with campus protests:

"If it takes a bloodbath, let's get it over with. No more appeasement."
Would that crowd boo him for that? I think not.
So the revisionist 'FDR' crap is just something to say. For those who have no idea who and what Reagan was.

[duhneece]

52. Shameful. Shame on them. nt

[dash_bannon]

53. We've seriously regressed as a society

Seriously regressed...

I keep looking back at media from the 60s and 70s and I am amazed at how far to the right America has gone.

The 60s and 70s was all about challenging the establishment.

Today, we have to maintain the status quo and embrace fascism, er... corporatism.

[Richard D]

63. Truly disturbing.

I practically choked when I heard that.

[efhmc]

66. It is not only the lack of humanity and empathy that is so

disturbing but the actual glee at the idea of taking the lives of others, as horrible as those humans might be, that distresses me.

[blank space]

90. Its about seeing themselves as being righteous -

its a Taliban, Tribal, incredibly uneducated emotional position of self affirmation through rigorous and thorough adherence to the law and morality - the most strict and harsh, the more right you are, the more right you are the better you are - better than everyone, and anyone else.

It is classic low self esteem shit.


The glee is that same feeling of wining, of being right, vindicated, owning the truth, the secret - it is absolutely terrifying.

There is nothing more dangerous and scary than absolutes and people who deal in them - I do not think there is anything more absolute than the death penalty.

[Laelth]

131. Well said. n/t

-Laelth

[Major Hogwash]

64. It was sick, but then they were Republicans that were doing the applauding.

So, I don't know why you would be so surprised.
These are the same people that ran around wearing "purple heart band aids" at their convention in 2004 at the Republican National Convention to mock the medals that Senator Kerry had been awarded --- and they did that while we were engaged in fighting 2 wars in 2 separate countries.

I told my cousin back then that if that shit had happened when I was in the military, it would have caused me to end my career much sooner than I did.
To be taken "for granted" like that for serving in the military, is to belong to the GOP.
To root for more executions the way they did last night, is to belong to the GOP.
To be self-centered and say "I got mine, screw everyone else" and that social security is a ponzi scheme, is to belong to the GOP.

They are the party of "me, me, me".
They don't give a rat's fart about anyone else.

[Hayabusa]

69. Amen...

I'll all for capital punishment in select cases, but it still be something that's used as a last resort and should never, ever be celebrated. It's taking someone else's life. No matter what they did, have some respect for that.

[politicasista]

71. delete. wrong spot n/t

[MrMickeysMom]

72. Didn't that send chills up the ole spine?

I suppose that's what we're dealing with here.

Wanna bet he'll be out of the race soon?

[efhmc]

76. I have had him for a governor for 10 years and have watched

as he has sucked the lifeblood from the state and rewarded his cronies with contract after contract. He and his cohorts have endless amounts of cash to create lies and scenarios that will play on the tv 24/7. So, no I do not think he will be gone soon

[politicasista]

74. Gross and sick n/t

[Jim_Shorts]

83. Those applauding were Teavangelicals

They are trying to disprove evolution by being neanderthals.

This country needs an enema.

[WiffenPoof]

87. I was equally shocked...

I couldn't believe what I was hearing...people applauding executions. I don't understand our country anymore.

-P

[Name removed]

91. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[coalition_unwilling]

92. It's completely in keeping with an empire in fatal decline, as the

American empire is. Many of these same people applauding thought that those who stayed behind during Katrina 'deserved' what happened to them.

[defendandprotect]

95. kr -- agree!!

[radhika]

96. I harbor no illusions of America being somehow...

a 'better' nation than others. The collective consciousness of Mr amd Mrs USA contains a festering pool of racism, torture, faux religiosity, xenophobia and serf-like addiction to authoritarian overlords.

The only question I have is: has that pool reached the overflow point?

[urbuddha]

97. We should have compassion for all beings.

Happiness is not something ready made. It comes from your own actions.
-His Holiness the Dalai Lama

[JDPriestly]

98. Perry is a throwback to the Neanderthal age. Sorry but he is.

Oddly enough I have read different theories about what happened to the Neanderthals. Maybe he is proof that they did not completely become extinct.

[mother earth]

99. The "right" is completely shameless, incredible they think of

themselves as christian or god fearing, isn't it?

[tomp]

106. since there have been human beings...

....there have been human beings willing to kill or celebrate the killing of other human beings. nothing new here, especially not in america.

[Recursion]

107. Are you new to the US?

I don't find it remotely unbelievable.

[totodeinhere]

124. True, especially since many prominent Democratic office holders also support the death penalty. n/t

[xxqqqzme]

112. And this is the pro-life crowd

Rethuglicans in SoCa, generally, are rabid anti-choice (can't tell you how many times I've been called baby killer while staffing a voter registration table) but damn if they don't want government out of their lives!

[RoccoR5955]

114. They have a lot of nerve calling themselves "Christians." n/t

[Deep13]

118. They forget that their savior was a victim of capital punishment. nt

[RZM]

122. Hehe. Now that is funny :)

[Deep13]

117. At best, it should be seen as a reluctant necessity.

That's best possible light. What really makes me wonder apart of perverted values of the crowd is why any governor would proudly admit to having that many capital murders in his state. What the hell is going on down there?

[efhmc]

123. Unlimited corporate support and carl rove.

[femrap]

119. I wish TX

would secede. I can't imagine what Perry would do....well, yes I do. He would start WW3/Crusades 2. The groundwork is already being laid....ie Turkey v. Israel. All of the unrest in MENA. WW3 = Jobs.

Yep, I'm ashamed of what this nation is doing. Hopefully, Mother Nature will step in and put a stop to this f*cking man-made mess.

[RZM]

121. What the hell?

You want Texas to secede, you are predicting WW3 and strangely connecting it to the diplomatic flap between Turkey and Israel (as if such a thing is somehow unusual) and to top it all off, you are wishing for some sort of armageddon scenario because a bunch of overly stimulated Republicans cheered another Republican in the cathedral of Republicanism.

Okay then . . .

[femrap]

132. Since the beginning of this year

MENA has been extremely unstable. I wouldn't be surprised if TPTB aren't behind this uproar. Remember the revolution in Iran? That didn't end nicely, did it?

There are no jobs in many of these nations that are experiencing unrest. In Egypt, the Brotherhood at first didn't want to be part of the political power structure. Now they have changed their minds.

Do you have any Fundies in your family? I do. And they are very scary. They want to kill Muslims and they will defend Israel. It is a bunch of zealots on both sides that can spark a WW3/Crusades 2. They want a religious war....you've read about how Christianity has infiltrated the Air Force, haven't you??? Very scary.

And never mind that many of these wars are FOR RESOURCES! Too many people and not enough food, oil, and minerals. TPTB want to arm both sides and make lots of $$$$....as usual.

Turkey doesn't usually go after Israel....it is usually a stabilizing force in the ME.

But I still wouldn't mind if TX seceded...I believe some TXans have publicly discussed the idea. So has VT...but that would be a cool place to live.

And your reasoning for my 'prediction' is way off base. No Jobs = War. Simplification, but what do TPTB do with a growing population of people who are pissed?

[Joey Liberal]

125. It showed the true mentality of the GOP

How far the republicans have sunk........

[Proud Liberal Dem]

126. Some (presumedly) right-winger called into a talk show program yesterday

blaming NBC for the enthusiastic response that Perry received for the number of executions because it makes the Republicans look sick. My reaction was, "well, if the shoe fits......" :shrug:

[Lint Head]

130. Republicans love death. They love sending soldiers to dies for oil. They love it

when people save insurance companies money by dying for lack of health insurance. They love it when Presidents ignore emails saying we will be attacked by airplanes flying into buildings and people die because of it. They love it when people are tortured until they die. They think collateral damage, the killing of innocent civilians, is OK. They think everything should make a profit so why not death.
Cannon fodder, the killing of young soldiers sent to fight, is just the cost of war to a Republican.

Applauding execution is nothing to Republicans. Testosterone is their drug of choice.