Is Single Payer just around the corner?

[Pisces]

Here is an excerpt from a good article regarding the Obamacare bomb:


They know what we should all know – we are now on an inescapable path to a single-payer system for most Americans and thank goodness for it.

Whether you are a believer in the benefits of single-payer health coverage or an opponent, mark this day down on your calendar because this is the day seismic shifts in our health care system finally get under way.

If you thought that the Obama Administration chickened out on pushing the nation in the direction of universal health care for everyone, today is the day you begin to understand that the reality is quite the contrary.


If you believe that the end of private, for-profit health insurance is some type of nefarious step towards a socialist society, then you might want to attend church this Sunday to mourn the loss of health insurers being able to worm out of covering the bills of a cancer patient because she forgot to write down on her application that she had skin acne for three months when she was a teenager.

Of course, those of you who fear the inevitable arrival of universal health care really shouldn’t be too fretful. There will always be a for-profit health insurance industry for those who want to pay for it. The only difference will be that those who cannot afford private coverage will also have an opportunity to get their families the medical care that they need

Everyone wins-except the for-profit health insurers.
link: http://www.forbes.com/sites/rickungar/2011/12/02/the-bomb-buried-in-obamacare-explodes-today-halleluja/


For those that Obama was not strong enough on his healthcare law, maybe another look is deserved. Seems like the new rule of having to spend 85% of the amount taken in on actual medical care vs. advertisement etc. is going to put a huge damper on things.

[brewens]

1. I don't doubt the insurance companies have found a good workaround.

I'll believe this is effective when I see it.

One thing I've brought up to a few friends that work at a medical insurance company, is just where do they think big companies like theirs came from in the first place? They exist because, and only because of the labor movement. Big companies didn't just start paying for health care coverage because they wanted to be nice to their employees. That's the last thing they wanted to do. The workers organized and made them want to!

What do they think happens if things continue as they have been. Fewer and fewer people with affordable health care coverage can't be good for their company in the long run. It might be good for the people at the top but their jobs are in jeopardy.

My other shot is, if we're outsourcing everyone else's jobs, why can't some kid in India handle my health care coverage? If all I care about is getting it cheaper, what is good for me right now, I'd say bring it on! As long as the bills get paid, why not?

[MjolnirTime]

3. They can only keep 20% for profit. That is just not enough for them thrive as they have been.

[grantcart]

14. 20% for their overhead and profit. currently they average about 32%

[golfguru]

25. 20% of next years premiums = 30% profit

You see there is no restriction on premiums.
If they double our premiums, that 20% gives them 40% profit. Catching on pardner?

Do you know anybody whose premiums are gong down?
I know lots whose premiums are going up faster.

[joshcryer]

27. If they double the premiums then they must double the amount of health care that they're...

...providing for that.

So there's a potential for health care providers to collude with insurers, but it will be short lived if it happens.

[golfguru]

31. Check your doctor visits, dentist, hospital charges

All escalating faster now.

[joshcryer]

34. It will be short lived, and caps will likely come into play further down the road.

There's only one way this can end.

edit: and you shouldn't discount the burden uninsured people are placing on the overall system.

[MjolnirTime]

2. Obama's plan is to slowly strangle the insurance industry.

If had tried to go directly to single payer, it would have destroyed the Insurance Industry in one swoop and caused great damage to the Economy.

This is the only way to do it and make it last.

[Pisces]

5. The people who dream of living in utopia don't get the strategy. THey want a waive of a magic want

to change our system. The damage of immediate change is not important to them or have they even stopped to consider what this would do to our current economy. THis is only for the adults to ponder not the children who want their special pony.

[MjolnirTime]

8. Real Lasting Change takes Time. Cornerstones are more important than facades.

[johnaries]

21. THANK YOU! Well said!

:applause:

[Name removed]

9. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Enthusiast]

11. You........don't like ponies?

:cry:

[Pisces]

12. I guess you identify with the comments.

[ClassWarrior]

15. Do you identify with comments that you're a baby killer?

Or do you recognize them as the Radical RW dog whistle that they are?

NGU.

[MjolnirTime]

19. I see you identify as well.

[ClassWarrior]

20. I see you identify with...

...dog whistles.

NGU.

[Skittles]

36. CORRECT

[CakeGrrl]

17. Exactly. The foundation had to be laid to work up to Single Payer.

Anyone who thought that the pre-2010 Congressional makeup could've passed it were being too unrealistic about a Democratic "majority" actually existing.

As the President has tried to point out, the landmark social and economic policies people hold sacrosanct were not created in the form people hold so dear in the present day. They started as lesser incarnations and evolved to what they are today.

[DCKit]

24. By "strangle" do you mean they'll have to make do with only one yacht, and not two (or three)?

Fewer vacation homes in Vail, Cape Cod, Bermuda, Italy and Palm Springs?

I expect that most DUers could live with that kind of strangulation.

[vaberella]

29. Especially destroying the job of many people working for such corporations.

It would be a huge problem during the time of economic distress.

[tridim]

4. It's truly a miracle that the Dems got HCR passed.

There is genius in the details, with more to come in 2014.

I wonder if "Progressives" like Jane Hampshire will ever notice?

[Pisces]

7. No, they won't, it didn't happen like a miracle overnight. Funny that the ardent haters that accuse

the supporters of deifying Obama are the only ones who expect God like miracles from the man.

[Life Long Dem]

6. Obama is the worst president ever.

Kidding. Every Republican candidate has said they would end Obamacare "on day one". I wonder why?

[Whisp]

10. that should be a big fucking hint for some

if the Pugs hate it, it sure can't be as sinister and awful earth ending as some like the Hamstershits say

[CakeGrrl]

18. Gee, maybe the President ISN'T the best Republican evah.

:eyes:

[ClassWarrior]

13. One can only...

NGU.

[ClassWarrior]

22. .

[ClassWarrior]

30. .

[grantcart]

16. Its not just that the MLR is restricted to 80%. They also have to negotiate

their plans with OPM.

[joshcryer]

23. Yes, 5-10 years tops.

[Kablooie]

26. Only if SCOTUS lets it remain as law next year.

Around June of next year they will decide if the forced payment in the law is constitutional.
If they decide it is not, they can then decide whether the whole health plan can be eliminated or not.

We aren't out of the woods yet folks, by a long shot.

[joshcryer]

28. That's going to be an interesting one.

A lot of people bemoaning the mandate will claim that it was the right decision.

[Hutzpa]

32. This is why I'm thinking maybe the bomb was released too early.

nt.

[bornskeptic]

33. According to the GAO a substantial majority of insurers meet MLR requirements now.

2010, at least 64 percent of all credible insurers, covering at least 77 percent of
lives, would have met or exceeded the 2011 PPACA MLR standards (see
table 1).14,15 At the market level, a higher percentage of large and small group
insurers met or exceeded the 2011 standards compared to individual market
insurers. The percentage of insurers in the large and small group markets that met
or exceeded the standards were 77 and 70 percent, respectively, compared to
43 percent in the individual market. Because more lives were covered by large and
small group market insurers, most covered lives were associated with insurers that
would have met or exceeded the standards.
http://www.gao.gov/new.items/d1290r.pdf
(from p.6)
The MLR requirements are significant, but they are not going to crush the health insurance industry.They will make a big difference in the individual market, but that market will no longer exist in its current form after 2014. The creation of the insurance exchanges essentially makes group insurance available to everyone.

[joshcryer]

35. Note that the large group is 89.5 already. The low 80 MLR is to not completely suffocate...

...the industry immediately, but it will have an effect that the large group will drop a bit as it assimilates the individual and small groups that don't meet the MLR.

You could, with a bit of fantasy thinking, hope that further modifications raise the MLR to 85 and possibly even 90, and the "ultra-large group" that eventually materializes would be able to cope with it just fine.

So I agree that it essentially makes group insurance available to everyone, which was the point, but I think that ultimately that the low 80 MLR was not necessarily a bad thing (and in fact it may have only been able to pass with it being around 80).