He isn't 'celebrating', he isn't 'cheering', he isn't even 'smiling'

[kpete]

He isn't 'celebrating', he isn't 'cheering', he isn't even 'smiling'. He knows that this was a necessary outcome, that if Osama resisted capture, he might have to be killed. That the world would be a safer place once Osama was caught or killed.

A lot of his followers could learn a thing or two from the President.

I've seen the 'rabid dog' line a couple of times now. Yes, you kill a rabid dog. But you don't stand around cheering, waving flags, and chanting 'USA, USA' after you do it. You acknowledge having completed a necessary, but ugly task, and maybe take satisfaction if it was done cleanly, and that everyone else will now be safe from it.

If you're 'cheering', if you're 'celebrating', if you're 'jubilant', you might want to sit down and ask yourself whose ideas inform such feelings. Which side of the political spectrum celebrates death?

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2011/05/02/972227/-You-know-who-else-isnt-cheeringPresident-Obama

[WiffenPoof]

1. Thank You

I appreciate your post and I feel much the same way. However, I fear that those that don't get your point, never will.

-P

[kpete]

2. thank you

and neither of us need worry about the flamers (that will come)

peace, kpete

[Ship of Fools]

17. I see it this way as well

but you know this will be the next line of attack -- Obama wasn't all *exceptionalism*-y enough ...

[bvar22]

65. I'll add another "Thank You".

This is a time for sober reflection,
not Victory laps and High Fives.

We may have killed Bin Laden,
but he won the game.
(Patriot Act, over a Million killed, $Trillions wasted)

[firehorse]

80. agree 100%

[Gin Blossom]

100. Exactly. Thanks.

[TatonkaJames]

127. It can be put in simpler terms....

President Obama, you're no George Bush.

[cliffordu]

3. False equivalence.

Just because I'm glad the little motherfucker is carp snacks doesn't mean anything about political leanings.

And that asshole has no, and I mean absolutely no fucking business setting himself up as he arbiter of what's Liberal, Progressive, or as implied, right wing....

[socialist_n_TN]

12. But Obama isn't cheering...........

I think that was the point of the OP. He just did what needed to be done and went on about his business. I've been a FREQUENT critic of a LOT of Obama's policies, but I can't fault him here. He did EXACTLY what he should have done.

[bobbolink]

30. You took the words right out of my mouth. Thanks for saving me writing a post.

:hi:

[kpete]

34. me too

peace, kpete

[bobbolink]

43. I'm remembering the episode of West Wing, where President Bartlett debates giving the order

to kill that dictator (whose name and country escapes me).

At the very least, it ruined his day.

And, if I remember correctly, it resulted in him having sleep problems, and using the services of a shrink.

Of course, that is only a TV show, I will be told. Acknowledged. BUT, that is how true human beings would react, I do think.

:hi:

peace returned, bobbolink

[eqfan592]

81. We must be careful not to judge too harshly.

It's understandable for different people to experience very different emotions in a situation like this. Simply because you went one direction and others went another doesn't make them any less "human beings" and honestly, that sort of thinking is VERY dangerous IMHO.

[bobbolink]

84. BALDERDASH! I get laughed at and criticized and, yes, even threatened, because *I* disagree with

things sometimes, and sometimes feel differently about stuff. I get told to suck it up.

If they can dish it out, they can very well take it and suck it the fuck up.

Did I manage to make that clear enough?

PLUS, are you at all aware that I was speaking about a TV program, and really expressed no judgement?

Am I Not Allowed Now To Even Fucking Talk ABout A TV Program?

Talk about judging!

[fizzgig]

88. you're thinking of abdul shareef of qumar

and i think you're right that true human beings would wrestle with such a situation and react in a similar manner.

[bobbolink]

138. Ah, someone who still has functional brain cells. ^_^ Yes, that was the episodes... and the

storyline continued for a while, if I remember correctly. Danny the reporter kinda sniffed out what really went down. Oh, Danny Boy.... you were soooo bad. ^_^

Do you remember their flashy Sit Room? Sure was a lot more fancy that what we saw in the pictures released yesterday! I think We, The People got cheated on that... ^_^

[mckara]

95. Freedonia v. Sylvania?

Maybe, I'm thinking of Rufus T. Firefly?

[socialist_n_TN]

42. You're welcome. I thought that the point was pretty

obvious myself, but maybe not.

[bobbolink]

45. Sadly, we have passed the point where we, as a people, can reflect all that well.

I am not alone, sadly, in not liking what we have become.

Please see my reference to President Bartlett, in reply to kpete.

And, thanks again. ~~peace sign~~

[socialist_n_TN]

50. I saw that. I can relate. IF I had to kill someone

or order someone killed, NO MATTER HOW JUSTIFIED, I think it would probably fuck me up somewhat, emotionally.

Luckily I haven't had to face that to this point in my life.

[bobbolink]

53. AGain, your words are exactly it.

And, all the consultation, what ifs and planning in the sit room. To think that anyone, well, except the codpieced one, would take this lightly is absurd. No, it is fucked up.

And given that Obama, as much as I have disapproved of him, professes a faith life, I can't imagine secretly dancing in the white house now.

I am still pissed with him, but on this, he has my sincere sympathy. It can't be a decision he enjoys.

[creon]

126. agree

What needed to be done was done

[Plucketeer]

132. I'm an unabashed critic of Obama as well

And "his" victory in the matter hasn't wiped away any of those criticisms. That said: I'm regarding his actions in this incident with a positive slant. As president, he's where the buck stops in such matters. It's not a task I'd want.

ASIDE from the international and national repercussions of bin Laden's dispatching, this family man risks the chance of being asked by his daughters; what it's like to order another human's demise. How the hell could you cheer with that weight on your back?

[socialist_n_TN]

137. Agreed. Silly me, I hadn't even THOUGHT about

his daughters and I've got two that are about the same spacing. What WOULD I tell my kids?

[nonperson]

108. Birds of a feather

Flock together

[coalition_unwilling]

4. I predict in short order, based on my experiences here last night,

that you will be told to 'fuck off,' 'eat shit and die,' 'STFU' and\or have your thread locked for "being inflammatory."

FWIW, I think this thread should stay kicked near the top today. Thank you.

[Pamela Troy]

8. Actually, my experience is that that kind of reaction...

tends to come from people who think those of us who don't join in the cheering and chants are "sanctimonious asses."

[ScreamingMeemie]

9. No one has called me a "sanctimonious ass"...but then I haven't acted

like one. I just move along. Try it.

[Name removed]

18. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[ScreamingMeemie]

23. Really? Because I suggested that people be nice to each other?

Okay. Bye. :hug:

[Dr. Strange]

64. You dare post the hug smilie?!

Welcome to my Ignore list, you hug-mongerer!

[Gormy Cuss]

66. Add me to that list too.

It will save the moderators some time.

[bobbolink]

31. I agree with your suggestion, and I will help with the kicking.

:hi:

[Iggo]

5. Thanks.

I get that after killing 3000 innocent people his life was pretty much forfeit.

It's the celebrations that make me...:puke:

[DrDan]

6. hear hear - K&R

[ScreamingMeemie]

7. I am not chanting "USA...etc" but I am happy and I can understand

and appreciate that, from an emotional standpoint, people process things differently. For many, 9/11/01 is something they never truly got over, found closure, or *insert what ever psychological term you wish here*. For them Osama bin Laden represented supreme evil and I cannot help that many of these people walked around mentally holding their breath for 10 years. 3,000 people died and this man was still "out there". Now he isn't. I can get that, without flaming you for your opinion. I am somewhere in the middle...too tired to dance. That doesn't make me, or them, any less liberal than you.

[socialist_n_TN]

48. Funny you should mention that RE: processing

the events of 9/11. Although I understood the urge to anger, even at the time I never progressed beyond sadness. I still haven't.

[Chris_Texas]

10. An evil mass murderer whos actions resulted in the destruction of millions of lives...

Is now dead.

It really is THAT simple. Don't get caught up in some "every man's death diminishes me" silliness. Every man's death does NOT diminish you, every man's death does not diminish mankind. Some people's LIFE diminishes you. OBL made that the goal of his: to destroy the lives of as many people as he could.

[coalition_unwilling]

39. Gee, for a second there, I thought you might be referring to Henry

Kissinger or possibly Joseph Stalin. "Millions of lives"?? Seems a bit of hyperbole, imho.

[Chris_Texas]

62. His actions led directly to the Iraq and Afghan wars

For reference, Stalin did not personally pull the trigger millions of times in all those millions of murders, Kissenger arguably did not pull the trigger even once. The same can be said for OBL.

As I said elsewhere in this thread I am not celebrating. Mostly because I don't really care one way or the other. If someone else feels happy enough to celebrate I say go for it. If someone doesn't that's cool too. But know that you are not a superior liberal (whatever the hell that means these days), you are not "enlightened" or better, so get your nose out of the clouds and shut up about it.

[arikara]

74. I think those wars were planned already

Bin Laden or no Bin Laden. He was a convenient excuse for them.

[Puregonzo1188]

82. I can kind of see how bin Laden led to the Afghan war--kind of--but Iraq?

Really?

Is he retroactively responsible for Vietnam, East Timor, and the Contras as well?


He's a murderous thug, but there's a lot of those around if we want to open that door.

[Gregorian]

121. No he's not. He's still in Crawford.

[GodlessBiker]

11. You really don't think that within the confines of the White House, there were many many smiles, ...

high fives, and uncorked champaign bottles?

[socialist_n_TN]

15. If there were, it was obviously NOT for public display

Why is that do you think?

[GodlessBiker]

24. I guess they are more Victorian. Better to do things we all know everyone does behind closed doors..

then to be low-class about it and do it so people can see.

Which group of people were more honest about their feelings?

[socialist_n_TN]

57. Well if the WH is going for "honesty" in this......

As bobbolink said above, being a man of a professed Christian faith, I would think that his HONEST feelings would be sadness that the action had to be taken and satisfaction that it was done without (apparently) any more bloodshed than was necessary.

Celebration? Not so much.

[fishwax]

49. it wouldn't be presidential -- but, then, the general public isn't expected to appear presidential

[nadinbrzezinski]

102. Nope, I don't

I've seen those faces before in my past. People wearing those faces are not in for a celebration. Nor are they faked easily.

Just life experience.

I recommend, if you are truly curious... the Mask of Command by Keegan

[DevonRex]

13. "his followers?". Good lord. Author should take his own inventory.

[Amerigo Vespucci]

Yeah, whatever.

First, I view anyone who views another human being as their "moral compass"...whether that compass is President Obama or "Ezekial 23 20," author of the Daily Kos piece...as inherently weak. We need to own our feelings, our attitudes, our actions, and not because we'll gain approval from one person or society at large.

Of course President Obama "isn't 'celebrating', he isn't 'cheering', he isn't even 'smiling'"...he's a world leader. What the hell else would he be doing...running around in circles like Jerry Lewis and shouting "HEY, LADY?"

Gimme a break, for Christ's sake.

"Ezekial 23 20" felt the need to take the high moral ground here, to both teach and preach, and that's his right...just as it's the right of anyone else to let the cork out of the bottle knowing that the miserable motherfucker who orchestrated 9/11 won;t be around to celebrate the "ten year anniversary."

It's one person's opinion on an Internet blog. And when I read the following, I was even less impressed:

Update for the picky:

Of course I am only speaking about the President's public reaction, because those are the reactions he presents to the country, and I'm not psychic, nor a White House insider.

I'm also only speaking about the public reaction of everyone else. I don't know how anyone anywhere is reacting in private, and neither does anyone else. Nobody here is psychic or clairvoyant.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2011/05/02/972227/-You-know-who-else-isnt-cheeringPresident-Obama

[AlbertCat]

117. What the hell else would he be doing...

running around in circles like Jerry Lewis and shouting "HEY, LADY?"

No... Dubya woulda done that.

[emulatorloo]

14. UPDATE "I am only speaking of the public reactions, presented to the country live on TV."

So I hope you aren't trying to make some "comment" about DU

[blondeatlast]

16. And we know this how? Class is keeping one's messy emotions

at home.

I'm classless. Sue me.

[Gormy Cuss]

19. If the president was doing any of that in public I'd want him impeached.

I don't understand PUBLIC displays of celebration over this by anyone. That's not to say that I'd tell them to stop, just that it reminds me of all the times our media has shown us smiling, cheering celebrations in foreign streets over the deaths of Americans.


Besides, I can't help but feel that the death of bin Laden at this late date doesn't change squat on the world stage. It may bring some comfort to those who lost loved ones on 9/11 or on the battlefields of Afghanistan or Iraq, but I can't see how it matters to anyone else.

[DevonRex]

20. This is America. People get to feel and say whatever they want m

[Chris_Texas]

33. Yep. Personally I really don't care that the bastard is dead, but if people want to party okay

If they feel that strongly about it, then that's cool too.

And to anyone who feels they have the moral authority to challenge the appropriateness of someone else's emotions, that's less cool. You are not "elightened" or better because you don't feel as they do. You are just different. That's totally cool, but get your nose out of the clouds and shut up about it.

[DevonRex]

37. Excellent reply. Thank you. Nt

[peace13]

21. It is sad when anyone dies without a fair trial.

Makes it less certain that any of us will get a fair shake when needed.

[Shiver]

91. Yeah.. I want some of what you're smoking.

If you honestly think he could have gotten a FAIR trial anywhere. Bin Laden admitted to the deed and reveled in it on videos released to the world - or, as the prosecution would put it, 'exhibit A'.

If he had cared at all about a fair trial, he would have given himself up years ago. He chose to die.

[dkf]

22. I don't feel like cheering...I feel like crying in relief and catharsis.

It's really over now...not the turmoil we will see from Al Qaeda, but our need for closure.

I am grateful to our seals who risked their lives, to our military who have been through so much and put their lives on the line...

It's just so emotional.

[sammytko]

35. that is exactly how I felt last night.

I retired 6 years ago on 1 May. Did a couple of deployments. glad to see that this whole thing might be slowing down....

[bobbolink]

55. For once, I agree with your subject line.

[ProSense]

25. These guys are smiling

New York City firefighters gather in Times Square New York May 2, 2011 shortly after the announcement from the President Obama announced that Al-Qaida mastermind Osama bin Laden was dead and the United States has his body. Bin Laden was killed in a mansion close to Islamabad.



NEW YORK, NY - MAY 02: FDNY firefighters look on from atop their truck as people celebrate in Times Square after the death of accused 9-11 mastermind Osama bin Laden was announced by U.S. President Barack Obama May 2, 2011 in New York City. A special force led operation has killed Osama Bin Laden in a house outside Islamabad in Pakistan and his body is in U.S.âs custody.



Really didn't expect the President to come out and declare: Yeah, we got that MFer. Whoop! GO USA!

[Contrary1]

26. He's only "not cheering" in public...

For all we know, the president could be dancing and giving high-fives all around the White House.

How people feel and react about this news doesn't bother me one way or the other. And I don't have to sit down and ask myself anything.

Because the obvious answer is Everybody's different, and entitled to their own opinions.

[young but wise]

28. +100

[bobbolink]

36. No real human being dances and high-fives at ordering the death of another person.

Well, someone like * would, but............

[snooper2]

27. If the rabid dog has been killing your chickens for weeks on end..

and got a hold of a few of your rabbits you would throw a cheer...

You never grew up on a farm did you?

[kpete]

29. no

but i have PLENTY of rabbits.

peace, kpete

[sufrommich]

32. I'm willing to bet there was some serious celebrating off camera. nt

[ixion]

38. Giving a special press conference is reveling whether you want to admit it or not

he's making political book, and providing a distraction.

[Nye Bevan]

40. And he's not strutting around like an asshole in a stuffed-codpiece flight suit.

It's nice to have a real President.

[Hubert Flottz]

112. And he's not going to every military base in his leather flight jacket

like Dumbya did for eight years.

I think the president's reaction so far, has been presidential. My reaction is my bidness.

[MilesColtrane]

41. "Which side of the political spectrum celebrates death?"

Make sure you check in here when Cheney dies.

I think you'll find that political affiliation has little to do with the human desire for revenge or justice.

[Wednesdays]

90. You're assuming Cheney will ever die.

[GSLevel9]

44. behind the scenes I'm SURE he was smiling, laughing and high-fiving. nt

[Nye Bevan]

47. Actually, I am sure he was *not* "smiling, laughing and high-fiving" (nt)

[nadinbrzezinski]

85. Somehow I don't think so

he struck me as a serious man who gave an execute order and understood that people died.

He was happy. I am sure, that the butcher's bill did not include a US Troop... this case sailor....

[Jakes Progress]

120. And I'm sure you don't have the slightest idea what he was doing.

Your baser feelings may not be his.

[OneGrassRoot]

46. I don't think we really know what others are truly feeling....

in response to Bin Laden being killed. I think it's a very personal thing, and we can't assume we know another's innermost feelings and thoughts.

Some of the "celebration" may be indescribable relief, a sense of closure, a sense of freedom from nightmares that have haunted them since 9/11. It may not be grave dancing at all, but we're interpreting it as such.

Maybe after some time passes people can discuss how this really impacted us, and what we feel, and what we were most afraid of that led us to have the reaction we did. I think we as Americans exhibit a lot of false bravado to hide being afraid.

Everything is too raw right now, and encouraging others to "rise above" may be having the opposite effect, imho.

We are human, after all.

:grouphug:

[RainDog]

58. wise woman

that you are.

[Renew Deal]

51. This happened after the civil war ended.

Almost in the same way. http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=439&topic_id=1007918&mesg_id=1007918

[Vattel]

52. Who knows if the world is safer without OBL in it?

I don't know how much of a threat he still was. I don't know if his death will promote or deter terrorism. Hell, I don't even know whether killing OBL was justified or not. Were our military personnel trying to apprehend him and were then fired upon? If so, then his killing may well have been justified self-defense. If they killed him even though he could have been safely apprehended, then his killing was punishment, and I am opposed to punishment without a trial and due process.

Here's what bothers me about the celebrations. I suspect (and I could be wrong) that they reflect a naive division of the world into the few murderers like him and the people like us who don't murder. Personally (and I am not by any means equating us to OBL) I think we should worry more about how many of our actions around the world are murderous before we celebrate too much ridding the world of a murderer even as despicable as OBL.

[coalition_unwilling]

67. Very eloquent. Wish I could 'rec' your response. - n/t

[lonestarnot]

54. Death smeth, That fuckwad was doomed from the moment he took credit for World Trade Center collapse.

Dead man walking and I am fucking glad! Dancing to my own drummer and I don't give a fuck who criticizes me for it.

[lfairban]

56. K&R

nt

[DirkGently]

59. Astute.

[LanternWaste]

60. I imagine many of us feel we have the...

I imagine many of us feel we have the moral authority to decide when and to what degree a thing should be celebrated, eulogized, memorialized, etc. by everyone else.



As the benign reactions of others affect me little, my counter-reaction to that same is even less.

[Autumn]

61. Best of all, no smirk. n/t

[cottonseed]

63. It's the lens. Those bothered by it see "bloodlust", those "celebrating" are just happy...

that it seems a chapter has turned, that a boogeyman, manufactured or not was finally dispatched. The thing is, OBL wasn't even seen as a human being anymore, he was a symbol, and an evil symbol at that. That part of it is gone, and it's a relief.

[librechik]

68. the president conducted himself somberly and approprately.

So proud of him!

[cyberswede]

69. K & R

[badgerpup]

70. I caught a minute or two of him talking afterward...

...the expression on his face really struck me and made me think.

What must it be, the cold-blooded-yet-sane, carefully weighed and considered choice to take the life of another person (even somebody like Bin Laden)?

That's something that Obama will carry with him for the rest of his life. A very heavy burden and I do not envy him one little bit.

Justice? For some things, the crime is so heinous justice is impossible.
The only thing left is mercy.

I think this was mercy more than anything else.




I stand corrected, BTW. :blush:
I'd believed OBL died quite a while ago, according to Benazir Bhutto's assertion (shortly before she was assassinated) that he'd shuffled off the mortal coil quite some time ago.

[phleshdef]

71. This argument is annhililated by the fact that people would react the same way if he'd been captured

Bullshit argument made by bullshit people who have no damn business telling larger America hows its suppose to feel.

[MrSlayer]

72. I'll bet there was a whole lot of high fiving and back slapping going on behind the scenes.

But it's unseemly for the President to act like a buffoon in public.

[Bucky]

73. Emotions are bad things.

Bad, but inevitable.

[Modern_Matthew]

75. Let America have its moment. It's not often we have a chance to celebrate a death...

And rarely is anyone this deserving of it.

[tavalon]

76. Very appropriate!

I'm angry because I think we're getting another cynical politically motivate fairytale theatre, but jubilant at his death? Not particularly. I've quietly believed him dead for years. Nothing has changed my mind.

[lumberjack_jeff]

77. Captured alive wasn't a desired outcome. n/t

[Wind Dancer]

78. Beautifully written!

Thanks for posting. Wish I could recommend over and over and over.....


Kick!

[RegieRocker]

79. He was smart to do so but doubtful it will change anything. Celebrating

a death of a enemy is barbaric. Humility is needed in these situations. I am relieved it's over and done. Those that celebrate death (unless in regards to the release of pain suffering) care nothing for life. For those that lost loved ones, they have what they needed and deserved. Osama had a large bill to pay and we collected. It has been paid. I hope that brings them some peace. Had I been the one with Osama in my sights, would I have pulled the trigger? Yes, but with humility.

[LynneSin]

83. And I would suspect we won't see Obama doing a stupid act like this either...

He just shared the facts with us and then finished up his speech.

[nadinbrzezinski]

86. Butcher's bill... once you understand what that means

high fives and all that are unnecessary.

As much as I hate the high fives... I understand that 97% of Americans do not understand what a butcher's bill is. Those photos told me that this man did.

[LynneSin]

92. I know what the Butcher Bill is - learned that from "And the Band Played On...."

it was in both the book and the movie. Nice analogy

[ooglymoogly]

87. What has happened and Obama's role in it;

from all that is here written and all that is there written, indeed is highly admirable and commendable.

And that writing chronicles a class act and even I, who lost confidence from the first crossing of the Rubicon say bravo!!!! A thousand times bravo.

For those for whom this is a much needed catharsis, for my part, I wish that upon you, you deserve it. We have been led by the nosering into hell and have not; no where near, found our way out.

To those for whom the big bad boogie man's death is meaningless in the overall scheme of things, in that it really changes nothing; I empathize, for those are akin to my own feelings.

For me the symbolism and its importance is granted.

However we still live in a country where 2 elections were stolen by folks who caused this catastrophe for this country; who have brought wars upon us, have tortured, murdered, stolen and have crapped on the constitution and brought this country to ruin and who are still at large, unprosecuted, uncharged and and living large and still causing tremendous damage in their relentless charge toward oligarchy and fascism.

When they are brought to justice and honor is restored to this, the greatest country in the history of the world and our rights and democracy are restored. Then I will celebrate, for then we are in for a real and much needed catharsis of biblical proportions.

However this much needed catharsis is something we have all been hoping and aching for, for oh so long; it is none the less a false one.

And I am sad for that and I envy those for whom regardless, it is, however short lived that may be.

Perhaps a good dance around the maypole is a good thing for all of us, not for a death, but if nothing else, for the symbolism of the death of such unspeakable evil and the appearance of progress in ending that evil and the many wars being fought; before we come back to earth and take up the heavy yoke of putting our country back together.

[WhiteTara]

89. I also find it very interesting that so much of the nation's pysche

was depressed about the lack of his capture/kill. It seemed to have been even more of core issue than I could have imagined. Perhaps since I felt that our government was complicit in the affair, it was not so much of a festering wound. But the reaction makes it like pus was released from an old wound. I also thought he had died a long time ago; but, perhaps that was another Bush lie that has been exposed (dialysis.)

At any rate, I agree that his somber nature and solemn response to the terrible deed he caused to be done (killing humans) was appropriate. I saw chimpy tonight on the teevee. The difference between the men was stark. I'm glad the chimp/monster is gone. If only Barack would take him down too, I could celebrate, screaming USA USA.

[slay]

93. +1

n/t

[NOLALady]

94. +1000

Thanks.

[sheldon]

96. "I will mourn the loss of thousands of precious lives, but I will not rejoice in the death of one,

not even an enemy. Returning hate for hate multiplies hate, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness: only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate, only love can do that."
-Martin Luther King Jr

[alarimer]

97. PZ Myers of Pharyngula said it best for me:

http://scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/2011/05/osama_bin_laden_dead.php

While it's necessary to stop terrorists, sometimes with violence, it is barbarous to gloat over the execution of an enemy. I find the chanting crowds cheering over the corpse disturbing, and the triumphal tone of our leaders is misplaced. We killed hundreds of thousands of civilians and threw away trillions of dollars, and our trophy is the bloody corpse of one old man? There's no victory in that.

I'm also cynical. What was the point? Nothing will change. We live in Idiot America, which is also Fearful America, which is also Paranoid America, which is also Solve-Our-Problems-With-A-Gun America. One figurehead is dead, now the focus of our country's fear will shift to some amorphous mass of generic Muslims, and the troops will continue their destruction, and we'll still flag our cowardice with pointless color changes at our airports, and we'll continue to sacrifice our civil liberties at the altar of national security. Nothing was accomplished, our purpose is as vague and tyrannical as ever, we'll need to continue to kill more to feed our illusion of safety.

Oh, there is one thing we've got now. A few more politicians will cloak themselves in the blood of our enemies in the next election, and victory will be achieved for Blowing Shit Up in the name of Getting Things Done. And we'll perpetuate the violence because it appeals to our citizen savages.

[Agony]

111. A kick for kpete! _and_ Pharyngula

Thanks for being here, kpete.

Cheers,
Agony

[Myrina]

116. + innumerable ...

Best. Post. Ever.

Thank you.

[BrklynLiberal]

123. He said what I think, but could never say as well.....

[texpatriot2004]

98. I like that he's not doing any of those things. I'm not either. nm

[Shining Jack]

99. I'm not feeling safer at all.

Osama is dead, long live Osama. He was more of a symbol than anything and have been replaced by someone else. That being said the CIA, Homeland Security etc are giving me the creeps big time and far more than any terrorist organization. :scared:

[joshcryer]

101. It is so fucking refreshing to be able to be indifferent about this issue.

I don't care one way or another. And I'm fucking glad I don't care one way or another.

[eridani]

103. Maybe because he's an actual grown-up who actually takes these things seriously? n/t

[Boudica the Lyoness]

104. I had no urge to celebrate.

I was surprised and very turned off by the tree climbers, college cheerleaders etc celebrating outside the White House. I didn't understand it at all. Osama has been hiding for ten years. He got away with it for ten years. If it had taken any longer to get him he may have died from old age...then would there have been the cheerleaders standing on peoples shoulders and mindless chants of USA USA.

Peoples joyous reactions were completely alien to me. I got a call on my cell phone, it was a wrong number, the stranger was excited and telling me to put my TV on because Osama was dead. I thought 'good, about time' and that was that.

Osama killed about 3,000 people on 9/11 and because of that act we killed hundreds of thousands..including our own troops. I think it was a big cluster fuck myself.

[DeSwiss]

105. K&R!!! n/t

[democrank]

106. Thank you for posting this.

[trud]

107. in defense of rabid dogs

it's hardly the dog's fault he or she has rabies. Just had to add that. You are defaming dogs comparing them to bin Laden.

[AlbertCat]

109. The only thing I'm celebrating....

.... is the egg on the GOP's face.

[florida08]

110. have to say I'm glad the president

Didn't do the the aircraft carrier gig or say 'ladies and gentlemen..we got him'. It was a somber and surprising moment for me. But I did have mixed emotions. When I viewed the video of the baseball fans during the Phillies game in the 9th inning shouting USA upon learning the news..it brought a lump to my throat. In that moment the feeling was one of restored faith in our leaders. After the shrub saying he really wasn't concerned with OBL it was pure joy to learn this president was. Like another poster stated it was closure. I think you can cry and shout USA at the same time. The families of the victims I saw being interviewed were more pensive. Same feelings just different response.

We have been stuck in a state of depression since that tragic day. Some still feeling anger and some feeling abandon. But Sunday all that ended. The chapter on Bin Forgotten was finally closed. It was a huge sigh of relief for everyone regardless how they displayed it. I don't think it was joy of a death insomuch as it was joy of justice being served. At least that's how I felt.

[polmaven]

113. Thank you for this...

Some of those who were cheering will not like the statement I am about to post...but...here goes:

"I mourn the loss of thousands of precious lives, but I will not rejoice in the death of one, not even an enemy. Returning hate for hate multiplies hate, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness: only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate: only love can do that. ~ Martin Luther King, Jr.

Dr. King's wisdom is, in my opinion, inspirational and eternal. I cannot celebrate the death of this evil man, and I do not believe the president is celebrating it, either. You are spot on with your post.

[LaydeeBug]

114. That's all high-fallutin' and if the truth be told, I am not that fancy...

I screamed "Yippeeeeeeee" and meant it. I am glad we got him. The capture option was left in place, so that fucktard died the way that fucktard wanted to die. Maybe there will be a time for introspection...but it wasn't yesterday.

Oh, and I'm not sorry either.

[Butch350]

115. Do you jump for joy...and chant USA, USA

Everytime you TAKE OUT the TRASH?!

[sasha031]

118. I can not recommend this thread enough

[Jakes Progress]

119. K&R I wish the president's most ardent followers followed him more closely.

[BrklynLiberal]

122. Kristen Breitweiser: Today Is Not a Day of Celebration for Me

http://911truthnews.com/kristen-breitweiser-today-is-not-a-day-of-celebration-for-me/

When my husband was killed on the morning of 9/11, television stations around the world ran split-screen video. They showed the buildings still burning juxtaposed against young Arabs celebrating in the streets. That disturbing vision left me incredulous; it was forever emblazoned on my psyche.

Ten years later, now fully awake in the bright sunlight of the day, when I contemplate the definition of victory for our country when it comes to the death of Osama bin Laden, I can only think about the damage that has been done.

I think about the thousands of lives lost — American, Afghani, Iraqi. I know firsthand the sorrow those families have felt. I ponder how the billions — maybe trillions — of dollars could have been better spent. I remain alarmed about the continued expansion of absolute Executive power in the name of fighting this seemingly ongoing and never-ending “war on terror.” I worry about the further erosion of our constitutional rights. I wonder when our troops will ever be called home. I know all too well, that thousands of young American men and women soldiers will never have the opportunity to return home. And of course, I fear reprisal.

<snip>

{/div}

[creon]

124. Necessity

OBL had to go.
The Obama Admin. did what needed to be done.

[truckin]

125. Well said. I share your feelings. nt

[Deep13]

128. Oh fer gawd sake.

Feelings are morally nuetral, which is good because we generally can't control them anyway. Yeah, a lot of people are happy that an evil man was killed. So what?

[russspeakeasy]

129. Kpete...another sane, outstanding post.

[JustJess42]

130. This is just the same old tactics always used by Republicans .

This is the same tactic Republicans use every time Democrats do something that may get attention. Republicans can be disrespectful and down right treasonous when speaking of the President but let someone point it out and they scream how dare you defend yourself. This is the same situation. Taking Bin laden out was not accomplished when President Bush celebrated the deaths he ordered of Iraq people on the bridge of a aircraft carrier in full costume while knowing full well these were not the people that committed the murders of our people on 9/ll but still used our pain and suffering to get support, knowing how confused most Americans were on the facts of the Middle East. If you celebrated with the President at that moment then you may have some soul searching to do before pointing the finger at the rest of us, we are a country of people who have open wounds that continue to bleed without the closure we finally feel.

[deathrind]

131. Thank You

kpete, for posting what I have been thinking. There are those in the world who want nothing more than to burn everything to the ground and they must be dealt with with extreme prejudice at times but that should never be celebrated. I can't help but think about how people here reacted to seeing the "celebration" on TV when 4 contractors got lost and ambushed in Iraq, yet here we are doing the same thing.

[Hassin Bin Sober]

133. Before I was really aware of my own politics and politics of friends around me...

... I remember two friends of mine attending the "celebration" outside the John Wayne Gacey execution here in Illinois.

At the time, I thought it rather odd that my friends would bother to get in their car and drive an hour to Joliet to join in the "festivities"- outside the prison chanting "strap the clown down"

I chalked it up to a difference in opinion on the death penalty (I have always been against it).


Those two friends turned out to be the biggest mouth tea-baggers you ever want to meet. I can't even stand to be around them anymore.

[AtomicKitten]

134. I suspect "his followers" aren't particularly enamored with the Deather theory.

And the Deather theory that this was a hoax I first read right here on DU.

[JustJess42]

135. I wonder how many paid for bloggers are on boards across the world .

I wonder how many posters to this board right now are bought and paid for by the Republicans trying to do some damage control. They have the money to buy alot of them . Just wondering.

[blackspade]

136. Agree completely.

[Green_Lantern]

139. oh give me a break...

The people cheering aren't all a bunch of blood thirsty jingoists. Many are just letting off a basic human emotional response to bringing justice to a guy who declared war against us. No one said this will make us 100% safe but some here will complain about any show of patriotism.

I wonder if those criticizing this level the same criticism against the more fanatical Muslim Arabs who cheered on 9/11.

Obama didn't cheer and yell because Presidential speeches have a decorum street rallies don't have.