Just a reminder: Any references made to "72 virgins" in connection to the OBL death are bigotry.

[howard112211]

It is roughly comparable to, say, a situation where a Jewish terrorist was killed being commmented with references to "being chosen by god".

[rfranklin]

1. I liked the cartoon where he's being sodomized by pigs...

now that's as bigoted as you can get.

[guardian]

70. can you post a link?? n/t

[AngryAmish]

2. This is very strange.

[tritsofme]

3. It is nice that you think that. nt

[formernaderite]

4. come on

half the time people use that..they are referencing it in a humorous way. Then again, all religion is humorous to me...

[NYC_SKP]

5. There's likely to be quite a few bigoted editorial cartoons and commentaries, I fear.

Thank you for pointing this out, though.

I agree, the insensitivity is usually through carelessness or ignorance and not malice, IMHO.

:donut:

[blondeatlast]

10. I guess I need educated, then, How does this differ from

mocking, say, the Immaculate Conception or the Afterlife?

[Cid_B]

19. Honest answer?

The ratio of folks who believe in that who would like to kill you for talking about it vs those who believe who are irritated and might send a strongly worded letter are different.

IOW it is the threat of violence

[NYC_SKP]

21. IMHO, it differs only with respect to the POV of the dominant culture...

Absent that filter, very little difference if any.


:thumbsup:

[blondeatlast]

6. Disallowing mockery of one is bigotry to the rest, too. nt

[Wait Wut]

23. +1

It's okay if we make fun of Christians, though. You apparently haven't gotten the memo.

Honestly, I've found it does no good to point out hypocrisy here. Not to say that Howard hasn't pointed out the bigotry in DUs regular bashing of Christianity. When we preach religious tolerance, we really need to include all religions, even Christianity.

[Bonobo]

7. I agree. nt

[DCKit]

8. We give equal time to the TaliBaptists.

If nothing else, we're equal opportunity when it comes to religious fundamentalism.

[WildEyedLiberal]

9. Yes, because DU is typically so sensitive about religion

Let DU show OBL the same respect they show "Christians" on a daily basis.

:eyes:

[tammywammy]

11. +1 n/t

[blondeatlast]

12. It;s an all or nothing proposition here. Either everything is fair game or nothing is

unless I'm missing something.

I'm good with allowing the mockery even though I'm Christian--but if ain't cool for one, it ain't cool for any.

[WildEyedLiberal]

13. Exactly - if it's okay to say inflammatory shit about Christians, it's okay to make 72 virgins jokes

If it's not okay to make 72 virgins jokes, then it's not okay to make pedophile priest jokes. Make up your mind, DU - can't have it both ways.

[riderinthestorm]

15. Oh but that won't stop DUers from calling other DUers bigots.

It's some kind of daily occurrence here - finding the thread that triggers the bigotry alarms.

Threads on religion and/or religious practices are usually pretty rife with it because those who are believers expect "respect" for whichever religion or practice they think is getting picked on.

Its easier to just cry "bigot" than to hold a dialogue about it. It simultaneously slams the opposition while making the accuser feel all self-righteous.

edited for clarity

[WildEyedLiberal]

17. It'd be easier if DU were consistent in its handling of the issue

There either needs to be a blanket ban on disrespectful jokes and slams based on religion, or it needs to be a free-for-all with no special dispensations for any religion, Islam included. I've seen stuff posted about Christianity that was WAY worse than the 72 virgins meme, so the pearl-clutching outrage strikes me as very hollow. DU really needs to sort out how it moderates discussion of religion, because right now, it's broken as all get out.

[riderinthestorm]

24. From my observation of many years here, but not being a moderator

I think they allow the slams and critiques and the calls of bigotry as an open dialogue without censorship unless it gets personal. I think the mods are very consistent that way.

It's DUers who aren't.

[WildEyedLiberal]

26. Fair enough

It's not really the mods fault, although I do think that DU in general could make the rules a little clearer when it comes to what's acceptable to post about religion, since that seems to be a much finer line than what's acceptable to post about race, for instance, or sexual orientation. If it were made clear that the rules about religion would be enforced across the board without regard to which religion in question is being discussed, that might mitigate some of the hypocrisy. Then again, probably not.

[blondeatlast]

16. I posted the question in AtA even though I don't think the OP is

strictly referring to DU. Should be interesting.

[Wait Wut]

28. Agreed, but...

...pedophile priests are not off the table. I don't see them as truly religious. I don't make jokes about them, however, I just find them sickening. When I make comments about them, I'm not knocking an entire faith. The Catholic Church has done a lot for humanity (as well as murdered a lot of innocent people). I've sent many homeless folks and those without heat to our local Catholic Social Services.

I feel the same way about racist white people. I have no problem pointing out racist blacks or Hispanics. I'm an equal opportunity caller outer.

[Chris_Texas]

45. Stop blaming the priests!

What man hasn't caught himself staring at some tight bottomed alter boy from time to time. The way they prance around in their little dresses, all flirty and provocative, the little guys are just begging for communion.

And yes, that really is pretty much the defense the Catholic Church has gone with. The "It was bad, but... just look at the ass on that little guy!" defense.

[WildEyedLiberal]

49. Well, I'm talking more about referring to the entire Catholic Church with the pedophile priest brush

Of course pedophile priests and the bishops who cover for them are scum, but I see pedophile priest jokes every time the church is even mentioned. Which, if DU wants to allow religious jokes, is fine, but if that kind of thing is okay, then certainly so is a joke about Osama'a 72 virgins.

[snooper2]

47. What did the pedophile priest say when he died and was given 72 virgins?

.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
What, no boys :rofl:

[WildEyedLiberal]

50. Okay, you win the thread

:rofl:

[blondeatlast]

54. LOL! nt

[bumpyattacks65]

60. how is that funny

nothing funny about pedophile :(

[snooper2]

63. Thanks! your first post and you respond to me!!! Me special now :)

Oh, I guess you never like George Carlin eh?

[polmaven]

14. +2

:thumbsup:

[formernaderite]

18. lol

I agree.... there is certainly a lot of hypocrisy on this board... and I'm an atheist :)

[WatsonT]

32. Well see that's different

somehow. Christianity was really bad back in the day, witch burnings, crusades, etc.

Which means the entire religion and all it's followers are fair game.

Whereas Islam has never done any of that, ever, so it's entire group of followers are off limits.

[WatsonT]

35. Nobody do a search of DU for the phrase "zombie jesus"

that's offensive to Christians and you'll turn up about 6000 hits.

Which is odd since religious bigotry is forbidden here and in no way are some religions treated differently than others.

[Trajan]

20. Screw this ...

I haven't mentioned anything about it to this point, but I am certainly free to do so ....

(Similarly - NOBODY is allowed to criticize my turkey-bean stew .... OFF with their fucking heads ! .... )

No sorry ..... We are free thinkers who are allowed to say what we wish about inane theological precepts .....

[msongs]

22. the religious crowd pushing for international "blasphemy" laws is against 72 virgin jokes nt

[AngryAmish]

25. It is not that easy to assume bigotry

If one examines conceptualist deappropriation, one is faced with a choice: either reject dialectic rationalism or conclude that narrativity is part of the rubicon of language. The main theme of the works of Rushdie is the defining characteristic, and some would say the dialectic, of pretextual sexual identity.

Therefore, Foucault suggests the use of neotextual libertarianism to challenge and modify class. The characteristic theme of Humphrey’s model of dialectic capitalism is a postcultural paradox.

But Marx promotes the use of neotextual libertarianism to deconstruct hierarchy. Derrida’s critique of dialectic rationalism holds that sexual identity has intrinsic meaning.

[blondeatlast]

37. I read and write legalese for a career, but I don't use it on DU.

Translation, if you don't mind?

[frogmarch]

27. Any religion that offers men sex with 72 virgins

as a prize in the afterlife is asking for criticism. Oh, wait, I get it. The virgins volunteer to be raped.

[mysuzuki2]

33. here's the deal about the 72 virgins thing

they are PERPETUAL virgins. I personally, as a heterosexual man, would find it frustrating to be surrounded for eternity by 72 beautiful women who remain virgins forever.

[Name removed]

36. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[frogmarch]

39. Perpetual virgins until...

In them (heavenly abodes) will be maidens, good, beautiful;
Maidens restrained as to their glances, in goodly pavilions;
Who no man or Jinn before them has touched.

Translated from the Qu’ran

Ick.

[Chris_Texas]

42. They're women (okay, girls). I think pretty much all religions command them to be obedient to men

In heaven or paradise all is perfect. In the case of women and girls, they are perfectly silent and mindless.

I am pretty sure this is in the Bible and Koran somewhere, probably right next to the part where they make sandwiches without being told, giggle at all men's jokes no mater how lame, marvel at their man's towering intellect, and stare at him with doe-eyed adoration whenever they are not otherwise occupied making sandwiches or thinking of England. Like I said, it's in the holy books somewhere.

And if you are a woman and found the above less than funny, I would refer you again to the part about humor. Practice laughing at bad jokes now so you will be ready for an eternity of it. :)

Hope this helps.

[jaxx]

29. The thing I like least about DU is it's puritanical streak.

Whatever the subject, you can count on someone waltzing in with the word conjured up hoping to make others look like asses for not kowtowing to the purist.

Nothing around here is taken at face value, but must get on the comparison merry-go-round and be completely obliterated of any real meaning. Kind of dumbs down the place.

[guitar man]

30. Eh, doesn't matter anyway

Cause he wound up with 72 Sturgeons....and a few jellyfish! :D :spray: :rofl:

[WatsonT]

31. Just like it was really mean when actors here made fun of Hitlers accent

cry me a river. His whole schtick was heavily tied to his religion.

[JackRiddler]

34. True.

[Chris_Texas]

38. I am equal opportunity when it comes to mocking religions

Which means, obviously, that the angry invisible sky monsters (and their power hungry followers) of every faith dislike me.

[lame54]

40. isn't the promise of 72 virgins misogynistic to begin with?

[AngryAmish]

41. Of course fundamentalist Islam is renown for it's egalitarianism...

What with the burkas and the beheadings of the unbelievers...

[snooper2]

51. So is a woman being created from a dude's rib

:P

[shimmergal]

58. Actually my Indonesian Muslim ex-roomate,

who was definitely not a fundamentalist, says the same goes for women, in reverse. In heaven they get the attentions of a whole bunch of handsome and kind men.

At least for heterosexuals, this version of heaven appears to be an equal-opportunity place.

I do worry about the 72 virgins, though, if they have to, um, be nice to someone of Bin Ladin's ilk. Surely they're more like androids (wait, I know that term's kind of deceptive--anyway a construct who doesn't have human feelings.) But a just God wouldn't inflict such a fate on human women, would She?

[Nye Bevan]

43. And DON'T MAKE FUN OF OSAMA'S BEARD EITHER because that's *mean*.

Men with beards might get upset.

BTW, is it just me who thinks 72 cougars would be better?

[distantearlywarning]

46. +1

:evilgrin:

[DCKit]

56. That would only lead to a state of eternal sexual exhaustion... with no exit.

More a vision of Hell than Nirvana. Further, anyone who dreams of eternity with a bunch of virgins is consumed by sadistic, perverted rape fantasies - another example deviant behavior as a result of a puritanical society.

Thanks to the OP and other posters to allow me to think this through.

[Obamanaut]

68. And don't forget being outraged about the code name 'Geronimo'

as being disrespectful when it wasn't even his real name.

[philly_bob]

44. Needs link to discussion of Islamic conception of warrior's rewards in afterlife. (nt)

[Rowdyboy]

48. Taking pleasure in anyones death is morbid and immoral.....yet I am

enormously happy that OBL is dead and not the least bit bothered by my reaction. Perhaps others can be given the leeway to say what they please without being reproved as bigots.

When has anyone on DU given a shit about religious sensitivities anyway? As a Christian I've never gotten upset over the slurs I read here-its a message board, not the parson's parlor. It not personal, just people unloading anonymously. More power to them.

[distantearlywarning]

52. Bah. Who cares?

I'm a Christian, by the way, and I don't get too upset by the Christian-bashing either.

Everybody needs to have their firmly held beliefs made fun of on a regular basis or they start taking themselves too seriously (and that's how you end up with holy wars).

[Throd]

53. I am very bigoted toward violent jihadist fuckwarts

[cbdo2007]

55. If "heaven" and "hell" are created in our own consciousness....

how do we know the 72 virgins thing isn't real? He may be enjoying them as we speak.

[GSLevel9]

57. I betcha' someone threw a slice of bacon in that body bag. Nt

[FLPanhandle]

59. Stupid religious beliefs should be made fun of.

Rapture, 72 virgins, "being chosen by god", etc.

Religion is funny. If they want to make fun of atheists, I won't complain either.

[tammywammy]

61. 72 Virgins

Family Guy version:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5j0XxAtmeYQ

[glen123098]

62. I strongly disagree.

72 virgins is not a common muslim belief, but a belief among nutcases. Osama bin Laden was a nutcase. Believing in the 72 virgins is a nutcase thing to believe in. Therefore, it is perfectly acceptable to mock it, and it doesn't discredit mainstream muslims, who know its nonsense also.

[cottonseed]

64. If it's true. And you really do get 72 virgins, then I say it's a fair trade off.

[Hassin Bin Sober]

65. Yeah. God forbid we snicker at fanatics believing they get to rape virgins 'cause they ...

... killed a bunch of innocent, men, women, and children.

[Obamanaut]

66. Will he still get the virgins even though he was killed in a way that did not involve

blowing himself up?

[msanthrope]

67. Don't tell this atheist what religion I can't make fun of!!! Blasphemy is a victimless crime!!! nt

[lies and propaganda]

69. Mocking religion isnt bigotry

Especially when said religion has some pretty fucking insane beliefs. Next you're going to tell me i cant make fun of MAGIC UNDERPANTS