Obama doesn't deserve credit for what's happened in Vermont re health care

[cali]

Governor Shumlin, Deb Richter, Speaker Shap Smith and many others deserve that credit. Obama didn't support even the public option, let alone what Governor Shumlin signed into law. President Obama supports a waiver that will enable Vermont to implement the plan sooner, but that has to be voted on in Congress.

On health care reform, Obama hasn't exactly been a shining beacon.

[bigwillq]

1. K and R (nt)

[cleanhippie]

2. Agreed. K&R

[AlabamaLibrul]

3. Has anyone suggested he does?

Let me go ahead and tell them they are wrong wrong wrong.

[bigwillq]

10. In another thread someone did

To add link
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=439&topic_id=1178063&mesg_id=1180166

[MannyGoldstein]

35. I've been told this many times

And asked to prove that states could do single-payer before RomneyObamaCare became the law of the land. Which is silly.

[JVS]

39. yes

[HopeHoops]

4. Yeah. Who claimed he did? I hadn't heard that.

[ProSense]

5. Wait

was someone giving him credit?

"President Obama supports a waiver that will enable Vermont to implement the plan sooner, but that has to be voted on in Congres."

There is a waiver in the health care law that doesn't need to be voted on.

[tridim]

6. Obama has always supported the public option

The entire GOP and Holy-Joe Bluedog said no. Remember?

[Whisp]

8. minor detail

:sarcasm:

[Citizen Worker]

17. If Obama "has always supported the public option," why wasn't there a public option or better yet,

Medicare for all? Don't blame Lieberman because it was never part of the legislation in the first place. It was off the table before the proposal was even written.

[JuniperLea]

20. Because he's not A Magic Negro (TM)

Please tell me how he could do that on his own... thanks in advance.

[tridim]

25. Obama has always supported the public option.

Still does.

I blame the people who said no to Obama's plan, not Obama.

The common lie in the OP will not be tolerated.

[NashVegas]

46. You Keep Using That Word, "Support." I Don't Think It Means What You Think It Means

[BzaDem]

43. That is such a falsehood. The public option was in the Senate bill that was debated on the Senate

floor for weeks. It was in the bill right up until the first of the series of final cloture votes, after Lieberman said he wouldn't vote for cloture if it was in there.

[MannyGoldstein]

36. So he shut proponents out of the debate

And immediately made a secret deal with Pharma to remove it from consideration.

I guess http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w1lof5Ho1Jw">ya gotta be cruel to be kind.

[mopinko]

7. without the movement on the national level this never

would have happened. say what you want about the final bill, he put the issue in the spotlight.
he moved the ball. a lot.

[cali]

19. sure it would have. CA passed single payer twice- before Obama was even elected

[JuniperLea]

23. Where is it now? CA doesn't have single payer...

There is a bill in the works that is a work around citing the opt out from the HC bill.

I'm not sure what makes you think CA has single payer. If it did, I'd be on it instead of this behemoth of a health plan I'm paying through the nose for right now.

[slay]

9. Agreed

n/t

[PufPuf23]

11. POTUS Obama has not been a beacon on:

health care, education, war, justice, environment, economics, nor civil rights.

POTUS Obama's policies and results are worse than any of the GOP POTUSs during my life except GWB (Ike, Nixon, Reagan, and GHWB).

Hell, I still expect to vote for him is 2012 unless I die first. lol for gallows humor.

[Name removed]

12. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[MikeDE]

13. I think he deserves credit

Health reform would not even be talked about had not Obama started the discussion. You may not like The Health care bill passed by congress but you can't say that Obama doesn't deserve credit for starting the process.

[AlabamaLibrul]

14. We've been talking about Health Care Reform for a century -- he just happened to be President

at the time when we got an actual law calling itself "health care reform".

"In our day these economic truths have become accepted as self-evident. We have accepted, so to speak, a second Bill of Rights under which a new basis of security and prosperity can be established for all—regardless of station, race, or creed.

Among these are:

The right to a useful and remunerative job in the industries or shops or farms or mines of the nation;

The right to earn enough to provide adequate food and clothing and recreation;

The right of every farmer to raise and sell his products at a return which will give him and his family a decent living;

The right of every businessman, large and small, to trade in an atmosphere of freedom from unfair competition and domination by monopolies at home or abroad;

The right of every family to a decent home;

The right to adequate medical care and the opportunity to achieve and enjoy good health;

The right to adequate protection from the economic fears of old age, sickness, accident, and unemployment;

The right to a good education.

All of these rights spell security. And after this war is won we must be prepared to move forward, in the implementation of these rights, to new goals of human happiness and well-being."

President Roosevelt, 1944

[MikeDE]

15. True

But he is the only one to actually get it done. So credit where credit is due.

[pnwmom]

21. Wrong. It wouldn't have happened if he hadn't pushed hard.

There was nothing magic about 2009 or that Congress that would have given us a health care bill if we didn't have a President who was pushing for one.

[JuniperLea]

18. Obama doesn't even like the current HC bill...

He's always referred to it as a starting point with much more work remaining.

The one thing the HC bill does have that benefits all states is the opt out... which is what Vermont did.

I'm not sure where the disconnect is.

[cali]

22. Wrong.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Single-payer_health_care#State_proposals

[MikeDE]

28. Whatever

You are obviously delusional. I guess you think the Republicans started the process and got the bill passed and are the ones tring to improve the bill???

[AlabamaLibrul]

31. The ACA, actually is similar Romneycare.

Of course Republicans are now running from it, but really the situation is why are Democrats adopting Republican policies, and then claiming to try to improve them?

[dflprincess]

51. Obama said any bill he signed had to include a public option

and once upon a time he said he opposed mandated insurance. Yet, the bill he signed has no public option and requires we continue to support the for profit insurers who make their money by making finding ways to make it difficult to access care.

The "Affordable Care Act" that has been foisted on us has as much to do with Amercians having access to care as Bush's "Clear Skies Iniative" had to do with protecting air quality.

[pnwmom]

16. So? OTOH, the Affordable Care Act does provide for states

that want to do this.

[Tx4obama]

24. This thread is divisive and promotes unnecessary Obama bashing. UnRec. n/t

[madokie]

29. I agree with you and with the same results from me

unrec'd

[Pisces]

34. +1 for me.

[Blue-Jay]

26. You should start a thread about it.

[JonLP24]

27. Did states have the option

to enact single payer before HCR? IE No restrictions? (I was thinking of Hawaii but I don't think they have single payer, just requirements for employers to provide health insurance)

If so did HCR have restrictions for states to enact single payer?

If yes to both I don't think he deserves credit even with the waiver.

This does remind me when Kucinich attempted to get an Amendment merged with the bill at the time that would have allowed states to get single payer without fears from being sued by health insurance industries but it was stripped by Pelosi because she said it broke Obama's promise that people who like their health insurance can stay on the same plan.

[JTFrog]

30. Unrec.

n/t

[KittyWampus]

32. He didn't stand in the way.

[Welibs]

33. I don't recall Obama taking credit for it. He's not a beat your chest kind of guy!

[AtomicKitten]

37. "Vermont Delegation Hails Obama on Waiver"

Obama backs waivers needed for Vt.’s single-payer system:

link: http://vtdigger.org/2011/03/01/obama-backs-waivers-needed-for-vt-%E2%80%99s-single-payer-system/

President Barack Obama told the National Governors Association on Monday that he supports waivers for states that want the flexibility to pursue new health care programs.

The announcement could pave the way for congressional approval of changes to the health care reform law enacted last year.

Vermont’s Democratic Gov. Peter Shumlin was elated by the news, which he said would make it possible for Vermont to more effectively pursue a plan for a single-payer health care system. Shumlin, who took office in January, has made single-payer his No. 1 initiative.

The White House endorsed a bill, the bipartisan “Empowering States to Innovate Act,” which would enable states to obtain “state innovation waivers” in 2014. Under current law, the waivers aren’t available until 2017.

-- snip

VT delegation hails Obama on waiver:

link: http://www.necn.com/02/28/11/Vt-delegation-hails-Obama-on-waiver/landing_politics.html?&blockID=3&apID=6992ed0c391a4e58a7d0c6c538530842


MONTPELIER, Vt. (AP) — Vermont's congressional delegation is hailing President Obama's announcement saying he supports amending the federal health care law to let states to seek a federal waiver three years early.

At a meeting Monday with governors in Washington, D.C., Obama said state likes Vermont should be allowed to design plans that are as comprehensive and affordable as the federal law.

U.S. Sen. Patrick Leahy, U.S. Sen. Bernie Sanders, U.S. Rep. Peter Welch and Vermont Gov. Peter Shumlin welcomed the endorsement, calling it a wise decision to let states innovate on health care reform without waiting until 2017.

Shumlin, a Democrat, said legislation introduced last month by the independent Sanders and Democrats Leahy and Welch would give Vermont the flexibility it needs to adopt changes Shumlin wants.

So, there's that.

[wiggs]

38. Not that he needs to get credit, but if he signs waiver will you say he supports their effort? nt

[grahamhgreen]

40. Only in that it may have been a reaction against his crapsurance plan....

[Nye Bevan]

41. Disagree. Obama showed that it is possible to reform healthcare and not get politically destroyed.

Vermont has proved wrong the "public option or nothing" crowd.

[leftstreet]

45. Really? Then why didn't the mandate go into effect immediately?

:shrug:

Why not get that ball rolling so we could all start making those profit health insurance payments?

[AlabamaLibrul]

48. President Obama was a member of the "public option or nothing crowd" before he wasn't

Any plan I sign must include an insurance exchange: a one-stop shopping marketplace where you can compare the benefits, cost and track records of a variety of plans - including a public option to increase competition and keep insurance companies honest - and choose what's best for your family.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=83FvLjsUOJg

[WonderGrunion]

42. Jonas Salk's parents didn't cure polio either

I'm pretty grateful for what they did to make the cure of polio possible.

[BzaDem]

44. Why do you falsely state that Obama didn't support the public option? He supported it from the very

beginning, and it was in the bill that was being debated on the Senate floor (right up until the last minute, when Lieberman refused to vote for cloture with it in there).

[AlabamaLibrul]

47. Any plan I sign must include an insurance exchange [...] including a public option

Any plan I sign must include an insurance exchange: a one-stop shopping marketplace where you can compare the benefits, cost and track records of a variety of plans - including a public option to increase competition and keep insurance companies honest - and choose what's best for your family.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=83FvLjsUOJg&feature=player_embedded

Uploaded by whitehouse on Jul 17, 2009

What happened?

[BzaDem]

52. You just destroyed your own case.

Your quote proves he DID support a public option -- not that he didn't.

(You know very well what ultimately happened and why, but that has nothing to do with the original claim that he somehow did not support a public option.)

[AlabamaLibrul]

53. Well, my case is that he was demanding it... before he wasn't. Not that he never was. nt

[girl gone mad]

55. He was for it before he was against it.

That is to say, before he made backroom deals with insurance companies to kill it in exchange for the small political favor of not running too many negative ads.

[cherokeeprogressive]

49. I read "Obama hasn't exactly been shiny bacon." at first. Had to read that again LOL

rec

[Luciferous]

50. I hadn't heard that he was getting credit for it... but if he was, I would have to agree.

The credit should go to those in Vermont who worked to make it possible.

[mmonk]

54. I agree. I haven't forgotten Max Baucus, the lobbyists, and the arrest

of single payer supporters. But I'm sure many here have.