Sorry, Hoffa's comments were a media boon and just fit perfectly into

[cali]

their "unions and union members are thugs" meme. This was utterly predictable. There are better ways to say things.

[eShirl]

1. You say that like it's a bad thing.

[NNN0LHI]

2. Yes, we need to be sweeter with these rabid pieces of shit

Wouldn't want to hurt any feelings.

And what do you know about unions anyway? Ever belonged to one? Ever supported one?

Don

[cali]

5. Did I say we needed to be sweeter? No. I'm saying we need to

to be smarter- and playing into the hands of anti-Union, anti-worker folks is not smart. And yes, I've supported Unions. I tried and failed to organize one when I was working on an assembly line in Southie. So fucking there, buddy.

[NNN0LHI]

8. Why don't I recall any threads like this from you when unions were occupying the WI state capitol?

Did I miss them perhaps? Or did you not post anything comparable for that situation? And if you didn't what brings you out of the woodwork now?

Don

[cali]

41. like what? I supported the unions in Wisconsin and posted that support here, genius.

do a search.

[WinkyDink]

3. Well, he COULD have quoted Dick Cheney on the Senate floor....

http://articles.cnn.com/2004-06-24/politics/cheney.leahy_1_kevin-kellems-bush-judicial-nominee-senate-democrats?_s=PM:ALLPOLITICS

[UTUSN]

24. Yip, I was going to thread: Did media browbeat CHEENEE to apologize for words, deaths, deeds, shots?

[KharmaTrain]

4. It Wouldn't Matter...

As we saw Faux gladly took whatever they could and ran with it. And if they couldn't they'd make some shit up. This is the routine from now through the election. Get ready for massive "poutrage" as a tool to distract and distort. Of course Hoffa could have avoided the topic, but why? The teabaggers are the rushpublican's achillie's heel and watch the hate radio crowd rush (no pun intended) to condemn any and all that dare to say anything negative or try to use their negativity as a political issue.

The corporate media sucks this stuff up...and will continue to do so as the "controversy" is what draws eyeballs. Truth and fairness be damned, this is a propaganda war and the Democrats better be prepared to fight it.

[Warren Stupidity]

6. thank you for propagating the rightwing talking point

yes us lefties should be meek and passive and polite. We should leave the strong angry rhetoric to the other side. Fuck that shit. I stand with Hoffa.

[pintobean]

10. "The rhetoric of

these clowns has consequences, and one of those consequences is that it provides the ideological justification for nut jobs to do their nut jobbery."

It's a two way street.

[cali]

11. oh for fuck's sake. I'm not suggesting being meek or even polite

I'm suggesting using SMART angry rhetoric. Duh.

[eilen]

34. He knows who his enemies are--one thing in

which he has over the White House.

[Warren Stupidity]

47. I'll settle for angry. I am sick and tired of polite and civil.

We are getting our asses kicked on a daily basis while Fierce Advocate is out playing golf with a person who's publicly sworn mission is to destroy his presidency. The other side routinely portrays us as traitors deserving to be shot, to the extent of showing up armed and dangerous at public events while bragging about how they will use guns if ballots don't work for them. I've had it with keeping the gloves on. Fuck civility.

[Inuca]

12. Not meek and passive, but

yes, polite. Or civil if you prefer.

[pipi_k]

27. Too hard, I guess...

Apparently being civil is too much work. People actually have to stop and consult with a higher section of the brain. It's way easier to let the reptilian brain crawl out.

Vulgar language is right there. I found that out after my dad had a stroke some years ago. He was always a very articulate man. But after his stroke, the only words he could express were swear words. Damage a part of the higher functioning brain, and that's what you get.

I've always secretly admired people who, if they really wanted to be uncivil, could at least be WITTY about it.

Any 8 year old can spout off vulgarities. Which isn't to say I don't spout off a few myself from time to time. OK...a lot. At home. :+

But when it really counts, like out in public where you know your words will be recorded for posterity, why not use some wit...

[Warren Stupidity]

48. Let's take these son-of-a-bitches out and give America back to America where we belong,"

I nearly fainted. Such language!

[trumad]

7. utterly predictable

What---your post?

[woo me with science]

9. ...

[CarmanK]

13. OBAMA IS POLITE ENOUGH FOR ALL OF US!

I figure Hoffa was speaking a common language: from the WORKER thug to the Corporate Hustler's on Wall Street who did a hell of a job, mugging the American economy and the middle class. Hope Wall STREET got the message. And Rick Perry has been using this language all along. I thought the TBAGGERS only understand gangster, after all they have been doing the bidding of the banksters for 30 years.

[Modern_Matthew]

14. We should play as dirty as they do and then some. If the union member are going to be called thugs..

Then they should live up to the name their enemy has given them. Put the fear of God in those ignorant sons of bitches.

[The Wizard]

15. Never show up for a gun fight

wearing boxing gloves.

[OHdem10]

16. Thanks for assisting the Right in closing down Free Speech.

[pintobean]

20. Please explain how free speech is being closed down.

[pipi_k]

26. Huh?

Expecting maturity and civility isn't even close to assisting the right in closing down free speech.

A comment on an internet discussion board isn't going to make the evening news. It's not going to permeate the Right Wing and give them ammunition. It's not going to change the Constitution.

And the way I read it, the OP's opinion isn't that free speech should be abolished. It's that image counts for a lot in life, and if one doesn't want to be associated with a certain image, there are ways to express oneself that don't leave people associating one (and one's interests) with thuggery.

That's all.

[cali]

44. yes, of course. because expressing my opinion on DU is assisting the right in

shutting down free speech. More like your comment is meant to try and shut me up. Won't work, honey. And damn do I hate the fucking stupid.

[Broderick]

17. I loved it

Let's ratchet up the rhetoric and fight

[Broderick]

18. dupe

[Brickbat]

19. I'd like a little more thuggery, m'self.

The days workers made real gains were the ones when you could get your head bashed in trying to cross a picket line.

[TwilightGardener]

42. I am of the same mind.

[CTyankee]

21. A lot of people are saying worse things and in saltier language.

This economic crisis has people in state of helpless rage. I think Hoffa's remark mirrors that rage. Hoffa hasn't stoked anything that hasn't already gone over the edge of being stoked. It's a raging fire of anger out there. I know I feel it.

I would agree with you if these were normal times. The people who are hurting most are not to blame and feel unable to fight back. Hoffa was just reflecting that rage, IMO...

[madrchsod]

22. union thugs?

[Name removed]

23. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[pipi_k]

25. Whenever I hear people ask

if it was "right" or "OK" for someone to have said a particular thing (I think there was a thread around yesterday asking something like that) I always want to ask a question of my own...

Would it have been "right" or "OK" if the other side had said it?


So I'm thinking that if some anti-union guy had said the same thing, calling union members "son of a bitches", that wouldn't have gone over too well.

and if it's not OK for the other guys, then it certainly isn't OK for us.

[eilen]

35. War is not pretty. nt

[pipi_k]

45. ?

I really hate one-liners.

Would you please explain?

Thanks

[eilen]

49. You feel his language is too coarse and mean

well, war is not pretty. It is not won by pretty words.

[Bake]

28. I'm proud to be a union thug!

Take the bastards OUT! OUT OF OFFICE!

Bake

[MadHound]

29. God forbid that anybody dares to call it as it is,

Can't have the 'Pugs and 'Baggers see us as angry or something like that:eyes:

[lame54]

30. And then there's the perfect way to say things...

way to go Hoffa

these SOB's are going to complain no matter what

[JohnnyLib2]

31. The statement is being used by both sides, so yes on media boon.

I can see it as a plus if handled well this week--or a disadvantage if taken too far. Hope the "experts" monitor this one across the week.

I don't think it would be smart for Biden to tie into this too much; that could mobilize the religious right even more. Hoffa can stand alone.

[Odin2005]

32. The MSM will manipulate things to imply that anyway. Remember the Dean Scream?

They manipulated the volume to make Dean look like he was screaming.

[eilen]

33. Hoffa For President.

The guy sounds like he is willing to fight and is determined to win.

[Starry Messenger]

36. The right-wing think unions are socialist scum anyway, even if we are sweet as pie.

Anyone who is in a union really isn't going to care.

[otohara]

37. Yet Koch Calls POTUS - Saddam Hussein

and that's okay.

[in_cog_ni_to]

38. He spoke the truth and they ARE Sons-a-b*tches.

Enough of the play nice bullshit. It's about time the tables get turned on the Teabagger THUGS.

[TwilightGardener]

39. I liked it.

[Eric J in MN]

40. Anyone's words can be taken-out-of-context for intentional distortion by Fox News. NT

NT

[RadiationTherapy]

43. You are right. There was no need for the violent imagery of "taking" people "out".

He wasn't talking about a fucking date! ahahahahaha. If you want to vote someone out of office, there are dozens of ways to say it. But this is what Americans think of as "tough".

[Luminous Animal]

46. There are dozens of ways that sports players could say "taking people out"

and yet, that phrase (or similar) is used often in sports.

Not once did I take it to mean resorting to violence.

In a sports context and a voting context, it means what it means. Defeating your opponent.

[RadiationTherapy]

50. I don't watch much sports, but I know that in football

use of specific imagery like that - the notion of trying to "take someone out" as opposed to outperforming them - is very closely scrutinized.

I am not aware that these sorts of phrases are used "often" by athletes in the media.