Question about the death penalty

[Sarah Ibarruri]

Today I was having a discussion with someone about the fact that prisoners sentenced to die are put on suicide watch so they don't commit suicide and die before the day of the execution.

I said it was because the whole death penalty procedure in this country is based on Christianity, which claims that suicide is a sin, but killing for the state is not.

The guy I was discussing this with said it's a combination of sadism and a desire to humiliate.

Does anyone know what the real reason is?

[blogslut]

1. Sadly, I would imagine it's about liability

[Sarah Ibarruri]

4. I don't see how. If someone is going to die on X day why not X-1 day? nt

[blogslut]

9. The facility/state would be held liable for the "unauthorized" death

I know this sounds cold but I would imagine suicide among death row inmates is one hell of a mess when it comes to insurance rates and compliance with regulations.

It boils down to money.

[pitohui]

11. oh be real, what prisoner on death row has insurance?

i know you mean well but have you ever even met a prisoner???

[blogslut]

14. I'm not talking about the prisoners

I'm talking about the facilities. They have insurance and they have liabilities. I'm betting they get penalized when prisoners commit suicide.

[Sarah Ibarruri]

12. I don't see what kind of award would be given where a person lost 1 day

because he took his own life.

[Sarah Ibarruri]

17. I suppose so, but then why isn't there more litigation against prisons?

God knows people (death penalty and not) die and get murdered in them all the time due to conditions, and nothing gets done, people don't sue, etc.

[JVS]

18. It's a control issue.

[elleng]

2. Real reason for suicide watches?

I'm not aware that they exist frequently, and would doubt the Christianity/sin thing, but I really don't know.

[Warren Stupidity]

3. It is about the absolute authority of the state.

It isn't about christianity or liability, it is somewhat about humiliation, but mostly it is about the state asserting its absolute supremacy over the individual.

[Sarah Ibarruri]

5. I hadn't thought about that. nt

[JVS]

21. There's also the problem that a lot of suicide attempts are botched.

So if someone were inclined they could repeatedly do a half-assed job of cutting their wrists, thereby forcing medical attention, live beyond the date scheduled for execution, and require all the paperwork to be done over, rinse, repeat.

[rustydog]

6. It can't be based on Christianity because there is absolutely NO "except"

in Thou shall not commit murder.
State executions break Gods law.

[Sarah Ibarruri]

7. That's what I say, but more Christians than not prefer the 'eye for an eye' punishment nt

[pitohui]

10. rustydog is correct, jesus himself was executed and this was shown to be against gods will

state sponsored execution is against his experience and against the bible, but the bigots would rather run the risk of executing another jesus than showing kindness to a prisoner, heaven forbid, a prisoner might be black or a jew...kill em all and let god sort em out seems to be the current bigot meme

[Warren Stupidity]

16. actually it is thou shalt not kill, which is even a stronger prohibition

as murder is an illegal killing while an execution is a legal one. However many christian institutions support the death penalty, including the catholic church, which only opposes it in 'most cases'.

Since Constantine the integration of christianity with the state has included support for keeping the peasants in line with regular doses of state executions, torture, imprisonment, forfeitures, draconian laws of all sorts, slavery until quite recently, war of course - a whole lot of rendering unto caesar,
in short just about everything a proper state religion ought to do.

[Freddie Stubbs]

20. No, murder is the unlawful killing of someone

If it is legal, it is not murder.

[pitohui]

8. what all yall said

talk to your own preacher to be sure...but suicide is no longer a sin, it's a disease (caused by clinical depression) but a lot of these laws and procedures go back to when suicide was still a sin

however, it has been a few decades, maybe 30 or 40 years now in most states, where suicide is no longer a criminal offense/sin so...

i think it's what your friend said, there is a problem in this country with cruelty and the desire to crush/humiliate the unfortunate

suicide is private and under the control of the prisoner, therefore, if you wish to cause public shame to the person's family, then you take that away

similar to how in china it's said they charge the family for the bullet when they have to execute someone

at the end of the day, "the real reason" is just habit, a kind society would have a polite way for those who want to exit privately and quickly to do so

it would cost us nothing financially and in fact save money to offer this kindness but there is a lot of cruelty out there and also there may be financial benefits to some corporation from having expensive, years-delayed executions

[Name removed]

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[hunter]

15. My brand of Christianity opposes the death penalty.

But to death penalty supporters of all sorts, suicide is a violation of their ultimate authority. It's as if their prisoner gave them the finger and magically flew away to some faraway place they didn't have an extradition treaty with. In defiance of authority, heaven or hell never sends the prisoner back for a proper execution. In essence, the prisoner escapes.

[Sarah Ibarruri]

19. So you think it's an even harsher, more punitive aspect of the death penalty. nt

[hunter]

24. The state doesn't have any power over life and death even when they kill someone.

Authoritarians hate that. This the fundamental basis of Christianity, irregardless that many Christian sects choose to ignore it. While it's true a Christ, or a Ghandi, or a Martin Luther King can be killed, they don't go away.

The physical demonstration that a State can hold someone captive and arbitrarily decide if they live or die is the underlying reason for the death penalty. The death penalty is a raw demonstration of brute force and political power. Yet those who identify with state authority (however misguided they may be) don't tend to recognize this.

[Sarah Ibarruri]

25. You're right. I'd forgotten that it's about authoritarianism.

Authoritarianism is monstrous.

[JayhawkSD]

22. Think "pending appeal" and "clemency"

If the prisoner commits suicide he is denied the appeal process, and has no access to any chance for clemency. The imprisoning agency "failed to protect him" from losing access to those processes. I'm not necessarily agreeing with the concept, but it's not as wild as it might seem. The innocent, wrongly convicted, is the more likely suicide candidate.

[Sarah Ibarruri]

23. True. It still makes little sense because they do the watch after all appeals are exhausted and not

before.

They start a suicide watch once the execution process is on.