WOW! - This Is The COVER Of The Next - Marine Corps Times!

[kpete]

On Sept. 20, the “don’t ask, don’t tell” policy banning gays from serving openly will be stripped from the military’s rulebook. For gay Marines, official repeal will be a historic day, comparable to the moment 63 years ago when President Truman ordered the services to end racial segregation.

For straight Marines, this will bring changes, too. “That’s gay” — a pervasive phrase used throughout the Corps to express dislike for almost anything — will no longer be tolerated. Equal treatment will be a must. And yes, some gay Marines will bring dates to the Marine Corps Birthday Ball in November.

With the end of “don’t ask” just days away, this week’s cover story includes the stories of several gay Marines who wanted to share their views on repeal and the future of the Marine Corps. Gay Marines interviewed for the story include:

– A corporal in the infantry, based at Camp Pendleton, Calif.
– A major at Quantico, Va.
– An infantry officer and company commander at Pendleton.
– A former enlisted Marine now enrolled at the Naval Academy
– And a field grade officer in California

....................

http://militarytimes.com/blogs/battle-rattle/2011/09/13/behind-the-cover-were-gay-get-over-it/

[NYC_SKP]

1. Wow!

Recommended!

:kick:

[Auntie Bush]

81. Good move! Happy for everyone effected! nt

[dionysus]

2. neat.

[jannyk]

3. Double Wow! K&R!

[Modern_Matthew]

4. That's fucking awesome. nt

[nadinbrzezinski]

5. A field grade officer

Good.

[PavePusher]

52. Well, a Major is field-grade as well... so that makes two. n/t

[girl gone mad]

6. Progress! n/t

[nevergiveup]

7. Hot Damn! someone please pinch me.

[Name removed]

8. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[TheWraith]

19. Okay, how the fuck is that supposed to be either insightful or funny?

Or really, anything other than obnoxious or stereotyping?

[enlightenment]

9. Love it!

Have to admit that the subtitle: ". . . on roommates, showers & dates at the Birthday Ball" reminded me just a little of a "Teen Beat" cover!

:)

[DianaForRussFeingold]

42. Same here, it's great...

;-) This is so embarrassing, but I have to admit, that wording...? :blush:

I could have sworn this was ~from the onion...:hide:

[pinboy3niner]

10. Oorah!

K&R

[Skittles]

11. I am impressed

I knew I'd see it in my lifetime but this is sooner than expected :D

[swimboy]

115. All right!

:woohoo:

[gateley]

12. Semper Fi! K&R! I'm so happy for them! nt

[begin_within]

13. I take my Mom to the meetings of the Women Marine's Association, and there was a little discussion

The general subject of the discussion was sexual harrassment in the Marine Corps, but a side topic came up regarding gays and lesbians. The consensus at that meeting - including a lot of "old timers" like my Mom, who served in WWII and a current female married Colonel, who hosted the meeting, is that it's a non-issue any more. The Colonel mentioned one Marine who made a habit of telling nearly everyone that he is gay, and to quote her "nobody cared." From hearing this discussion I concluded that despite the persistent macho image of the Marine Corps, in reality they are as enlightened as the general public is, and much more much indifferent and blasé about sexual orientation than they used to be.

[TheWraith]

21. Slightly off topic, but it reminds me of a line from the HBO series "Generation Kill."

It follows a group of recon Marines and their embedded Rolling Stone reporter through the clusterfuck of the invasion of Iraq. Highly recommended.

One of the hilarious little scenes takes place a couple episodes in: the Marines have a habit of making all sorts of jokes and jibes referencing homosexuality ranging from jokes about fucking each other, to calling each other a bitch, to one of them talking tongue in cheek about the semi-nude gay bar he's going to open when he gets home to Wisconsin.

After one of the lead characters makes an offhand remark, one of the other Marines wandering by says to him "God DAMN the Marine Corps is homoerotic. Do you realize how homoerotic this is? It's all we talk about."

[PavePusher]

53. I'm not sure why "macho" and "gay" are considered to be mutually exclusive.

In my observation, that just isn't universal by a long shot.

[hedgehog]

59. I was just looking at the photo and thinking that that is an example

of mainstream homo-eroticism. As a straight woman, understanding same sex attraction is like being tone deaf at a concert; I just don't have the capacity to appreciate it. That's not a judgment of anything or anyone but my own lack. That photo goes a long way to helping me understand.

[Terry in Austin]

63. Not by a long shot, for sure

For instance, there's a gay bar near where I work called "The Iron Bear." These guys are papa-bear, man's-men in all ways -- including their preferences for intimate companionship. Great to see this can be part of the leatherneck world now!

[thesquanderer]

109. Lots of things aren't universal

but are still common enough to communicate something. Someone might say "mean as a pit bull" but of course there are plenty of very nice pit bulls. It's not that pit bulls have a bad rap (though they do), but that the percentage of pit bulls with "attitude problems" is probably greater than the percentage of, say, beagles.

There are gay guys who are macho, and straight guys who are not. But the percentage of "femme"-ish guys is probably greater among the gay population than the straight population. (And as the famous Seinfeld line goes, "not that there's anything wrong with it." ;-) )

[Wait Wut]

67. I'm proud of them.

I had the opportunity to hang out with my son and his buddies last summer and the subject came up. Okay...I brought it up. :P Despite a couple of them being far right, none of them had an issue with the repeal of DADT. Only one was on the fence because of his strict religious upbringing, but even he was more tolerant than the average Conservative.

They all pretty much said the same thing, as long as they do their job that's all that matters. They all claimed to know at least one gay Marine. None would ever consider "outing" them and seemed, in fact, pretty protective of them.

There's a story I'd like to tell, but I'll have to wait a few months. It made me incredibly proud of my son and his Marines.

[awoke_in_2003]

88. Marines tend to be very protective...

of their fellow Marines- it is drilled into them.

[roguevalley]

80. the corps commander requires marines to read and has a list of

books they want read. they aren't the jarheads many think. My uncle John was first marine at guadalcanal. he was no one's fool and even if they are brave and our frontliners they aren't stupid. Not like the pugs want everyone to think. That cover is a keeper.

[chill_wind]

14. K & R!

[midnight]

15. K&R

[patrice]

16. K!! & R!!

[RKP5637]

17. K&R!!! n/t

[mrmpa]

18. A few months ago I posted......

that with the repeal of DADT, the Marines would be the service branch that would do it right. The new Sergeant Major of the Corps, took that message to the ranks a few months ago.

Semper Fi

[Wait Wut]

77. I saw that...

...and made it my FB status. It was as beautiful a speech as any high-ranking Marine could give.

[awoke_in_2003]

89. They are the smallest...

and probably most tight-knit group in our armed forces.

[Behind the Aegis]

20. Awesome!

[Mortos]

22. Thank you President Obama

for bringing an end to DADT and bringing our armed forces into the 21 century.

[awoke_in_2003]

90. +1. nt

[Surya Gayatri]

96. +1,000

n/t

[dddem]

107. wait a minute -

Are you giving the President credit for something? Isn't that against the rules? ;)
Seriously, my first thought was, I knew he would do it, like he does everything - quietly, and efficiently. People need to have patience and faith in this president. Thanks for acknowledging his role in this (long overdue) decision.

[mikekohr]

112. Bingo! Accomplishment Instead of Cowboy Incompetance

Now that's change we can believe in!

[dddem]

113. I keep looking for a 'Like' button

I forget I'm not on facebook. But I like what you said!

[LadyHawkAZ]

23. K&R, never thought I'd see this day. n/t

[FrenchieCat]

24. That is a great cover! A historical keepsake, for sure!

[DianaForRussFeingold]

46. I love it! It's a keeper!

:patriot: If someone has an issue..we should just say to them: There are already gay people in the Military...
So, what's the big deal..?
Some of them are already dying, protecting your freedom and your homophobic butt, so...
GET OVER IT!

[Kennah]

25. Very surreal contrasting this with the psychosis that is the GOP

[Volaris]

33. No kidding...when is the next debate? I'm CERTAIN it will come up,

and then we get to watch Santorum's widdle bitty bwain fall out of his ears...

The level of Fear (of The GAY) and Hate (of The President) on display will be horrifyingly mesmerizing, methinks, this time maybe even more-so than in the past....

But Fuck the lot of 'em, I'm glad it's done, and good riddance, and it's about damn time. The Pres. gets a smiley face on his homework next week, and I for one, am DAMN PROUD of this man today.

[SnakeEyes]

73. If the Marine Corps Times were an official publication

then it would come up. I doubt this will

[Fire Walk With Me]

26. Wow. (This is how positive change occurs!)

[Recursion]

27. Always a good magazine

Remember they are completely independent of the military command; they've actually done several feature pieces on gays in the Corps before now. Plus they did some very hard-hitting coverage when things started getting bad in Iraq.

[deacon_sephiroth]

28. Wish I could be more optimistic

I'm in the Air Force. I'm proud of the Prez for realizing what century it is, but I know as well as the USMC Commandant that this is NOT going to be without incident. The last branch to oppose this thing was still the marines, the leadership told the prez they didn't have the time to deal with something like this while thye faught his wars. they said only about HALF of what they were thinking. Like me they also thought: "Marines are aweomse... but they still get drunk and do stupid stupid STUPID things damn near every signle day."

I celebrate the change, but I dread the reports that will herald it's passing. The adjustment period will likely be marked by trajedy, mostly form the marines and army. I wouldn't point fingers but I've been on bases with ALL services, and I'm speaking from track records here, I see the reports.

[Bluenorthwest]

37. I do not agree at all. The Marines are in fact, filled with gay

people and also a huge suicide rate. Also, lots of domestic violence. Plenty of tragedy pours out of the current Marine culture, and this is going to be a huge step in the right direction.
Of course, the military is filled with traumatized and otherwise unstable people, and such people might do anything at anytime, but man, your framing that 'tragedy will come' from this, when tragedy is the Marines middle name already, that just denies the facts in order to gas off on the current changes.

[Moonwalk]

49. Nice point and just what I was thinking. So long as people are people--

--there will be tragedies. Removal of DADT doesn't remove prejudice, and just as I'm sure there's still bigots against blacks, Jews, Muslims and women in the Marines even though all such are allowed to be Marines and by military fiat to be treated as Marines, doesn't mean there still aren't tragedies between individuals including abuse by superior officers with such bigotry.

Such is the military. Such is human nature. Such is life. The difference is whether such bigotry is institutionalized within the culture and, by being so, taught as acceptable by the culture. Tragedy can and will happen, but at least we can hope that it won't be condoned or participated in by everyone because the institution approves, expects and encourages it. If the institution doesn't condone it, that makes it harder for the individual to engage in it, and less likely for those entering into that institution to be able to maintain their personal prejudices.

[PavePusher]

55. Well said. n/t

[PavePusher]

54. "Of course, the military is filled with traumatized and otherwise unstable people..."

Uh... 'scuse me?

[Kennah]

98. I agree there are a lot of traumatized people in the military, mostly because of The Ten Year War

[hunter]

56. "I'm in the Air Force..."

There you go. The service with the darkest, deepest closet.

[deacon_sephiroth]

128. undoubtably true, but at the same time

We SEEM (I haven't seen any statistics, just news and blotters from bases I'm on) to have far less off-duty violence. My heart goes out to the victims and that's all I'm trying to say. I'm over-joyed at the change and applaud the president for ACTUALLY pushing through one of his promises despite heavy opposition and delay tactics by the upper echelon. However as someone else posted on here, people will be people, there will be tragedies. I merely posted to express how overshadowed this event is in my heart by the inevitably grief.

Sorry to harsh your mellow with my Air Forceness.

[kestrel91316]

85. My dad was a career USAF officer, but I am quite sure he would have loathed the

current USAF with its domination by fundie bible beaters and outright Dominionists. Just in case you were thinking how superior you boys and girls are to the Marines.......

I am thrilled to see intolerance being rejected by the military instead of human beings being rejected. I hope the fundies find it biblically necessary to leave. The only "tragedy" would be if they don't.

[deacon_sephiroth]

127. oh you should see it...

These days we've got this great resource that's often abused by the higher ups with too much time on their hands and not enough work. It's called the Air Force Portal. It has links to personnel resources, etc etc etc, but it also posts news and allows comments.

The Occasional story about the DADT repeal shows up and the comments are many and spiteful, and you will apparently get your wish, as it will cause MANY to leave. The amazing thing is the shameless bold-faced nature of the posts as it uses your ID card to log in, so your name, and rank are RIGHT THERE, no internet anonymity. Yet there's the officers and Senior NCOs touting how it's disgraceful, and they're SO GLAD the are able to retire because they're gonna drop the paperwork and run. Over and over again the same thing. So as I said, you nailed it, they SAY they'll leave, Retirement section should be busy next week.

I would actually re-post the replies here but I don't want to get put in solitary confinement and made to stand around with no clothes on for an indefinite period of time.

Oh, and if I sound like I feel superior to other services, I apologize. All due respect to others, whom NO DOUBT, have far more dangerous and stressful jobs than I do, I just get frustrated when dealing with other branches, invariably, I have to teach them their job before I can do mine.

[orbitalman]

29. K & R

[grahamhgreen]

30. LOL! Wonderful!

[zeemike]

31. That should grantee that at least a million bigots will vote in 12

And it won't be for anyone but Perry who they perceive will "bring their country back"
And then the democrats with issues about gay will just say fuck it and not vote at all...
Carl Rove wants more...

[Bluenorthwest]

40. Sounds like you need to start your GOTV efforts now!

Because if you think we are going to sit silently because it will upset the right wing, you have not been paying attention. Any 'Democrat' who does not vote because they have 'issues' with gay people are not Democrats anyway, they are right wing moralistic hypocrites of the first division, whose votes were never assured, and can never be assured. I say fuck them. And also, fuck the idea that we should be silent to please the bigots. Fuck the bigots.

[zeemike]

51. Not at all make all the noise you want to.

It is the noise that is important...it is more important than winning an election for sure.
Because I am sure Perry will give you what you want.

[TriMera]

84. By your logic, we will never have rights. Think about it. n/t

[zeemike]

102. And by not facing the facts of life in the USA you will loose them

You think Perry when he is elected will not think he has a mandate to roll back all the gains we have made?....do you think he will even hesitate?

[TriMera]

103. I guess people like Dr. King should should have just faced

the fact that the whole civil rights thing just wasn't gonna happen. With everything that is going on in this country, do you really think that "social issues" are going to be the deciding factor in this election? But, at least we make a great scapegoat, right?

[zeemike]

106. Yes I do and I see it happening already.

Weiner's district went to a rethug apparently for that reason....the community was fundamentalist Jews and the goper ran anti gay adds against his opponent.
So If I were a strategist I would organize as many gay pride parades in as many fundamentalist communities3s as possable...rub their noeses in it where ever possible.
And I think that is exactly what will happen.

[TriMera]

108. You have issues and I don't think they're political. eom

[zeemike]

114. Yes I have issues....with how easy it is to manipulate people.

And how the manipulated pretend it did not happen.

[TriMera]

123. Yes, how easy it is to manipulate the straight male

into voting republican. Maybe, you need to work on that and stop being so scared of "teh gay".

[zeemike]

126. Yep that is the divide part of divide and conquer.

divide us into groops....strait males who are the enemy because they are scared of the gays...But you know I am scared of them because I don't praise everything gay and pretend that it is unimportant when you make political mistakes...but worst of all point it out when I see it.
But the right wing could care less how you feel...there interest is to stir up anger...and it don't matter to them one way or the other because they know anger works.,,make people mad and they might push the red button....distruct.
so as far as they are concerned they would have you have a gay pride parade right down main street of fundamentalist christians or jewish neighborhoods.

Here is a little snippet of what they are working on...you might see it soon...

Rumors about Obama and his former Chief of Staff Rahm “Dead Fish” Emanuel having lifetime memberships at the same gay bathhouse in uptown Chicago keep getting easier to believe.

[Name removed]

64. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Doctor_J]

69. When the Repuke candidate starts in on this, the president

should fire back. In fact, he should be sure to goad the Repuke into discussing DADT. There is much to be gained from contrasting the Repukes & Dems' positions on gays defending the country.

[awoke_in_2003]

91. Making a stand for what is right...

should NEVER be dependent on the election cycle.

[Jamastiene]

119. It is not always the gays' fault when Democrats lose elections.

You need to get over yourself. It sounds to me like YOU are the one with a problem with gay people here.

[zeemike]

121. No it is not their fault because they are manipulated into an issue

It is the manipulators fault.
But we must never say anything that does not agree with gay people that they are being used....or you will defiantly be accused of being a homophobe...well so be it....believe what you will....but I see no advantage to your purity test and see it as only increasing the divide.
Which will serve the purpose of a Perry president.

[Kind of Blue]

32. Kudos to the Corps. This will make many

members of my family, young and old, even prouder to call themselves Marines.
KnR and thanks for the headsup!

[TygrBright]

34. I wish my Marine Dad were around to see this.

He'd be so proud of his Corps.

He believed in civil rights all his life.

happily,
Bright

[donquijoterocket]

57. now that

Would be a Marine I could really respect,other than the couple true ex-marines of my acquaintance and Smedley D. Butler. I wish he were around as well. Sounds like the sort of citizen this country needs badly.

[myrna minx]

35. K&R n/t

[Joe Fields]

36. Wow, what a bold and emphatic move. K&R...

[w8liftinglady]

38. Even though my dad was AF, this would have made him proud!

way to go! Semper Fi!

[bongbong]

39. Amazing reversal

That's like a 180.00000000000 degree turn. They didn't just say "DADT is over, deal with it", they said "DADT IS OVER AND WE NOW ARE FULLY OK WITH GAYS!!!". Amazing.

[pinto]

41. Kick

:kick:

[Overseas]

43. K&R.

[blackspade]

44. Excellent.

[AtheistCrusader]

45. Very cool.

A step in the right direction.

[Smilo]

47. About bloody time!!!!

[tpsbmam]

48. Huge K & RRRRR! (I wish!) What a welcome sight. nt

[valerief]

50. Great cover. nt

[bertman]

58. OOOOHHH RAH!!!

Or whatever it is the jarheads say.

But I say AIRBORNE!! ALL THE WAY!! WHO GIVES A FUCK IF MY MACHINE GUNNER'S GAY.

Now, let's see a similar cover on the Army's Stars and Stripes.

REC.

[Hosnon]

60. EXCELLENT! I've talked to a number of enlisted men and women who are about to

jump out of their skin because they are so anxious to finally be out.

[treestar]

61. K&R

:kick:

[Uncle Joe]

62. Semper Fi and well done.

Thanks for the thread, kpete.:thumbsup:

[lucca18]

65. This is great!!

[Vidar]

66. Thanks for the great news, kpete.

[Wait Wut]

68. Heh...

This is a rare rec from me for one of your threads. ;)

Nice catch and thanks, Kpete.

[SoapBox]

70. K & R

[harmonicon]

71. That poor bear!! nt.

[Enrique]

104. lol

gmta. ;-)

[SnakeEyes]

72. It's great and all

But the Marine Corps Times has a history of being controversial at times, going against military grain, since it's not an official publication of the military but rather a Gannett publication. Don't let this fool you. Hopefully official military publications will print such things some day.

[NightWatcher]

74. They're right, those holsters suck (Blackhawk CQC).

Also, congrats

[Lone_Star_Dem]

75. What a beautiful sight!

:kick: and R !!

[Oceansaway]

76. K&R...n/t

[SpankMe]

78. Very gutsy. n/t

[young but wise]

79. Awesome.

[kestrel91316]

82. Oh wow. This sure ain't my dad's military!!!

[penndragon69]

83. Semper Fi !

[awoke_in_2003]

86. Wow, this is great. nt

[Kurska]

87. WOW 10k to fly reserve instead of active duty?

Absolutely amazing.

[Nothing Without Hope]

92. Made my day! thanks for this. K & R (n/t)

[Ikonoklast]

93. I wonder how many Marines who were gay only found equality

...here.



So, yes, finally, Get Over It.

[demigoddess]

94. As an old military brat, I am happy to see it

From the halls of Montezuma......

[ceile]

95. K&R!

[lunatica]

97. Love it! No more pussyfooting around avoiding the obvious

[Swede Atlanta]

99. That's pretty powerful............

especially for the one branch of the service that seemed the most uncomfortable with the change. If you recall the Marine Corps Commandant opposed the change. So for this to be on the front page of the Marine Times is pretty strong.

[Bigmack]

100. Several thoughts from an ex-grunt....

We knew there were gay Marines. Didn't much care. After all, some of the guys I served with were from Texas and were proud of their sexual relationships with sheep and melons. Gay... hell.. that's tame!

Our company clerk got a BCD for one gay incident that he foolishly wrote in a diary. Got caught in a shakedown.

Marines may be the best chance for integration of gays.... "You people WILL accept gays!" That would actually go along pretty well with the basic philosophy.

[pinboy3niner]

105. These say it pretty well...

Can you spot the gay soldier?

[Robb]

124. Well put, especially the last bit.

[Taverner]

101. Awesome!

Granted, my sample size is small, but every Marine I know (seven of them) was in favor of repealing DADT

One said "If someone wants to do this godforsaken job, no one should stop them"

[Quixote1818]

110. Done in a most effective way! Quite impressive. nt

[WillyT]

111. GOOD !!! - K & R !!!

:bounce:

:kick:

[lonestarnot]

Whoa! Excellent!

[pinboy3niner]

117. Worth saying twice! :)

[lonestarnot]

122. tEE HEE!

[lonestarnot]

116. Whoa! Excellent!

[Jamastiene]

118. K&R

Fuckin' A!

:thumbsup:

[Nevernose]

120. "Eh...Got more important things to worry about" -- quote

One of my former students (class of 2010) is still in close contact with my wife and I. He was one of those "street kids" who was desperate for positive role models. He latched onto me, saw that my relationship was not totally dysfunctional, and my wife and I essentially adopted him.

He talked crazy smack about gays until one day I said, "You know, there'd plenty of people who hate you because you're Mexican. Would you expect me to put up with that?". He never said anything homophobic again, at least as far as I know. He even volunteered to be the photographer for the yearbook spread for GSA. He even had a couple of friends who were gay by the time he graduated.

He was home on leave a couple of months ago and I asked him about it. "I'm going to Afghanistan in a few months," he said, "I've got way more important things to worry about than who might suck someone's dick later.". Perhaps not the most eloquent way of putting it, but I thought it was a pretty good sentiment for a PFC.

[Jefferson23]

125. Could that cover be more perfect? I don't think so...excellent. K&R