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Renew Deal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-14-11 10:29 PM
Original message
Need advice re: Roberts Rules
Edited on Wed Sep-14-11 10:30 PM by Renew Deal
I was at an organizations meeting tonight. This organization renominates the president every other year. The announcement of his willingness to run again must take place before the 4th meeting of the organization in that year. The announcement wasn't made in time. Tonight it was announced and someone who hates the president claimed the he was ineligible to run since the announcement wasn't made in time. People started talking about amending by-laws and suspending rules. Does anyone know what the proper procedure is according to roberts rules to give us the ability to renominate the president? The organizations attorneys are involved, but I know I can get a quick answer from my fellow DUers. Thanks!!! and let me know if you have questions.
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KittyWampus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-14-11 10:31 PM
Response to Original message
1. Committee Chair is the first step I think. They'd have to bring it up.
Edited on Wed Sep-14-11 10:38 PM by KittyWampus
If you don't have specific committees, then the group's Chair is the one to target.

That's the only way it gets onto the Agenda.
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Renew Deal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-14-11 11:38 PM
Response to Reply #1
6. The nominating chair was running that part of the meeting.
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OhioBlue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-14-11 10:38 PM
Response to Original message
2. I am no expert by far.. but the groups that I deal with
would handle it in one of the following two ways:

make a motion and have it recorded in the minutes to forgive the requirement of announcement by the fourth meeting and make the timing of his announcement acceptable for nomination.

Or pass a resolution with all the whereases on why the group is accepting nominations and forgiving the time requirement and therefore be it resolved that we accept the nomination .... etc. etc. etc.

good luck!!! :)
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Renew Deal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-14-11 11:38 PM
Response to Reply #2
7. I suspect you're right.
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Divernan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-14-11 10:42 PM
Response to Original message
3. Since that rule goes to procedure, it likely can be suspended. The question is what type of vote
Edited on Wed Sep-14-11 11:11 PM by Divernan
is required to suspend it. That would/should be laid out in your organization's bylaws, which are separate from Roberts Rules. There can be different types(percentages) of "majorities" required. Bottom line: no one can answer this definitively without reading the organization's by-laws in para materia (Latin for "in conjunction with") with Roberts Rules, or whatever parliamentary authority the bylaws have incorporated by reference. There are at least three possible such authorities: Roberts, Demeter's or The Standard Code of Parliamentary Procedure.

On edit: You do know, I hope, that Roberts Rules or any other code of parliamentary procedure do NOT apply to your organization unless said rules have been specifically incorporated into your organization's by-laws.

From Wikipedia:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suspension_of_the_rules
"When not permitted

Rules which embody fundamental principles of parliamentary law and rules protecting absentees or a basic right of the individual cannot be suspended, even by unanimous vote.<3><4> Thus, it would be illegal to suspend the rules to allow non-members to vote; to authorize absentee or cumulative voting; to waive the requirement of a quorum; or to waive the requirement for previous notice for a bylaws amendment. Moreover, the rules cannot be suspended to take away a particular member's right to attend meetings, make motions, speak in debate, and vote; these can only be curtailed through disciplinary procedures.<3>

Three of the major parliamentary authorities - Robert's Rules of Order Newly Revised, The Standard Code of Parliamentary Procedure, and Demeter's Manual - agree that provisions in the bylaws that do not relate to parliamentary procedure may not be suspended.<4><5> Demeter notes how this plays into the reality of parliamentary situations:<6>
“ Bylaws cannot be suspended even by unanimous vote. But sometimes circumstances, expediency or strong assembly determination in behalf of a cause or proposition make violations necessary. In all such cases of violations, the action taken is illegal per se; but if no one objects at the time, or never challenges it at any time thereafter, a violation never challenged is never a violation. ”

Similarly, Mason states:<7>
“ It has been held that public bodies can adopt rules, even by majority vote, that cannot be suspended or amended without a two-thirds vote, but it is also held by the courts that actions, taken in violation of procedural rules of parliamentary law and of adopted rules, are valid nevertheless, since failure to conform to the rules of this class suspended them by implication. ”

The action is still illegal if it violated a mandatory constitutional provision, since a legislature cannot suspend the constitution.<8>
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Renew Deal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-14-11 11:43 PM
Response to Reply #3
8. Roberts Rules apply to my group
It's in the by-laws. The by-laws don't deal with this specific problem, so it goes to RR.

Part of the discussion was how to go about this and the necessary quorum. The president eventually gave up and said he wouldn't run. The meeting was then adjourned. I have a feeling this isn't over. Thanks for the info. It's very helpful.
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LiberalFighter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-14-11 10:57 PM
Response to Original message
4. What type of organization?
Government related?
Organization with paid board members?
Organization that receives funding from govt agencies or other groups?
Organization with dues paying members?
Low or high profile organization in the community?

Is there a notice requirement to members of an election and deadlines?
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Renew Deal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-14-11 11:44 PM
Response to Reply #4
9. Non government
Edited on Wed Sep-14-11 11:45 PM by Renew Deal
Non-paid board. Volunteers.
No gov't money.
Yes, there are dues paying members.
I'd say low, but it is possible to get press.

Yes, there is a notice requirement and that's where this seems to be caught up.
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ashling Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-14-11 11:07 PM
Response to Original message
5. Check here
It's been a few years since I've used it, but as I recall they have a rally good message board with experts

http://robertsrules.com/
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Renew Deal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-14-11 11:45 PM
Response to Reply #5
10. Thanks!
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Renew Deal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-15-11 09:49 AM
Response to Original message
11. kick
:kick:
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JNelson6563 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-15-11 10:30 AM
Response to Original message
12. Hold open nominations
and then open elections.

Julie
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