Anyone ever buy a new car from a dealership online?

[Dover]

Sorry to be off topic, but I thought it was late enough...

My sister needs a new car but can't really take off a lot of time to hunt down the best price.
She wants me to help her but I'm in a similar situation and have never been very good at these
kinds of negotiations anyway. I'm wondering if it's a better use of time, less painful and more straight forward to just purchase something online from dealerships within 150 mile radius or so. I've been reading a little bit online about online car buying and about businesses like Carwoo who collects the dealer data for you and operates something like an online auction for car dealerships (trying to underbid one another for the sale). If we did it online ourselves, I'm still unclear how the negotiations should go and how to close a deal and hold them to it. She knows the car she wants (she'd driven one), so really it's just about the money at this point.

So anyone have experience with this? Your advice would be so appreciated. :hi:

[Drew Richards]

1. for new and used try autotrade and carmax...

autotrader includes much more than carmax but carmax only sells certified new and used...

yes used and NEW can be found on both sites and you can set your travel radius from your home...awesome now you have a fairly complete phone and address list of everywhere in a radius you can contact to begin negotiations and to FIND your car ONSITE in the LOT rather than having to order a car delivered to a dealership and pay more...

Then it is a question of calling the listed dealerships...

and negotiating the price...

BUT...online and over the phone is NOT an agreed price!

You have to go to the dealership to then finish the negotiation.

Many dealers will give you an internet discount if you bring their listing from carmax or autotrader with you to a negotiation also...

[Tunkamerica]

2. just as an aside, carmax tried to sell me a 2000 sentra for

more than a 2001 honda accord with less miles (still barely under warranty) a few years ago. It was the first car I'd ever bought and I think the guy saw me coming a mile away. Maybe not indicative of carmax as a whole, but I will stay away. I still have the honda.

[Dover]

dupe post

[Dover]

dupe post

[Dover]

3. Thanks! Have you purchased a car this way?

I was looking closer at that Carwoo site and it sounds like they (or maybe you) choose 4-5 dealers in your area and they get them to bidding against one another without knowing who you are. All they know is that you are a serious buyer (since you paid a fee for Carwoo's service). You can watch the bidding and compare offers and the dealers can see when someone has underbid them. You can anonymously respond to any of the dealers and make a counter offer.
But I wonder how well this works if only 1 or 2 of the dealers actually have the car you want on their lot. (I guess the others would be required to order it or you could accept whatever they have if you like their price). The one dealer my sister went to to test drive had only one car of the kind she wanted on their lot and it wasn't the package or color she wanted. So I wonder how common that is? Seems like that would affect the bidding if the car is scarce/ie. popular and there are fewer bidders.

BTW, a friend who was giving us some advice said that it shouldn't cost you more for a car if the dealer orders it. It doesn't cost them a thing to put it on their order list and shouldn't cost you more than time.

[TwilightGardener]

53. We ordered our last two cars through the dealership, since we

wanted very specific options (we have a hard time finding exactly what we want on the lot). It takes a month or two, but I don't feel that we got a bad deal. The second time, my husband worked with the internet sales guy.

[pinboy3niner]

4. That's a good question

I'll be doing it that way fairly soon. With all the dealer competition online, it's a good place to start. But I'll also visit the dealers to negotiate and make the final deal.

[Dover]

5. Do you have experience negotiating? If so can you share some advice?

For instance, how does one find the real cost of the car to the dealership? Someone told me I should start from there and work up as opposed to working down from the sticker price.

[pinboy3niner]

9. Info on dealer cost is available online

I've used that to negotiate in person, as well as using the best offer from a competitor.

The last car I bought was from a dealer who cried that I was killing him, but I paid $100 more to buy it there than from a competitor because I had seen and driven both cars and chose the one I thought was the better of them.

I also declined all the add-ons, including their anti-theft security (which involved an I.D. number engraved on all the car's windows). They lied outrageously, telling me they'd have to replace all the windows--which, of course, they didn't have to do. If you don't agree to pay etra for that option, you're simply not enrolled and the numbers stay on.

That reminded me of the old days, when they'd try to sell your their special undercoating to add extra profit to the deal. If you're a good negotiator, they'll also try to tell you that you're screwing the salesperson out of his/her commission--which is just more BS.

Nowadays, online sites will give you dealer cost and reasonable dealer profit to add, making your negotiation pretty simple. With very little homework, both you and your sister should be satisfied with the result.

And consider the comment about buying 'Made in U.S.A.'--as hard as that may be to tell these days. If you can, try to support American workers and unions.

Best of luck to both of you! :hi:


ETA: My experience includes buying: a '53 Olds for $100 from a private party, a used '65 Pontiac Bonneville convertible from an off-base dealer while in the service, a brand new '70 E-type Jag, a couple of new Dodge vans, a couple of new Ford T-birds and three new Ford economy cars. I got better at negotiating with experience. :)

[Dover]

12. Thanks for the info and encouragement. Maybe there's a niche market for

a service where you hire someone to negotiate for you. Are you available?. ;-)

I don't think I'm going to be much help to my sister.
The blind leading the blind.

BTW, if the add-ons come with the vehicle (written on the sticker) can you refuse them?
I'm not talking about a package, but rather things like wheel locks, mats, etc.? Will they
remove them?

I'm guessing that wouldn't work if, for instance, the windows had tinting as an add on.
I'm sure the car makers load them up, especially if the model is popular (a seller's market).

[pinboy3niner]

14. Don't put yourself down

The internet will give you all the tools you need. Just watch out for any extras they push--and remember, 'Just say NO.' :)

Don't be intimidated--you'll do just fine. And you know we all have your back here.

ETA: The sticker only applies to the vehicle the sticker is on. There may be other vehicles in stock at that dealer or another one that don't have a particular feature you don't want. You can also order a vehicle to your specifications, though you'll have to wait longer for delivery.

[Dover]

15. Awww....you're a good doobie. Thanks. BTW I added a little something to

my last post to you about add ons, which I'll bet you missed.

[pinboy3niner]

17. I added on to reply to your add-on

Of course, there will be an extra charge for that. :)

[Dover]

18. A charge? Well I'm sorry, but I've been instructed to just say NO!...lol...n/t

[pinboy3niner]

19. LOL!

By Jove, I think you've got it! See, you're becoming an expert already. :)

[Dover]

20. So I guess the answer is that if it's on the sticker it can't be removed?

What incentive does the car maker have to leave them off if you can't negotiate?

I thought add ons were there to 'add on' by choice. I'm guessing they make quite
a profit off those 'little' add ons.

[pinboy3niner]

21. If it's on the sticker, it's already installed

The sticker shows how that particular vehicle is already equipped.

"Add-ons by choice" are if you're ordering a new vehicle from the factory, not buying one off the lot.

Buying off the lot, you're picking the best option that meets your needs--as already equipped by the factory, which may include things you don't really want, and may lack something you might wish were included.

It's a trade-off. Most people buying off the lot don't want to wait for a custom-ordered vehicle from the factory, so they pick whatever is already available from a local dealer that comes closest to what they want.

[Dover]

23. Thanks for explaining that so clearly. That makes sense...n/t

[FarCenter]

52. Distinguish between options and add-ons

Options are optional equipment on the car shown on the sticker and may be either factory installed or dealer installed. An option like an upgraded engine or transmission comes from the factory and can't be removed. Something like fancy wheels comes from the factory and can be removed by the dealer, who can reuse them on another car. There may be other stuff on the sticker like dealer installed pin striping, roof rack, floor mats, etc.

Once you get to a contract price on the car, the office manager will try to sell you a bunch of add-ons, like extended warranty, anti-theft etching on the windows, various lease or loan arrangements, etc. Dealers make a lot of money between the time they agree on a price for the car and the time you actually have bought it. In the old days it used to be dealer installed rustproofing and undercoating, but these days they have to rely on a lot of other dubious add ons.

[FLAprogressive]

6. Please suggest to her that she buy a union-made vehicle, as well.

[Dover]

7. How would she know that? I don't think she would be swayed away from

her choice if she discovered it wasn't union made. It's an expensive endeavor and one
she'll have to live with for several years.

[msongs]

8. go to edmunds.com and enter the car make etc u want, they give you price guides based

on features. dealer costs etc.

[pnwmom]

10. We had good luck with them. The dealership was a couple hours away, but it was worth it. n/t

[Dover]

13. Thanks! I'll check it out...n/t

[REP]

11. Sort of

Knew what I wanted; it was one of 3 in California at the time. Went to a nearby dealer and had if transferred to there. The car I got is a limited production car, so not much negotiating on price.

[Dover]

16. One of three? Wow, talk about a seller's market...

I think many of the new, low cost, low mpg cars are also popular right now. My sister said that the dealer told her they only had one on the lot because they sell them so fast. I'm guessing there is probably at least some truth to that although I wonder if the turnover is that fast.

[REP]

22. Yeah. My car isn't one of those.

It's a sportscar with upgraded everything and a limited color. I got mine literally right off the boat :-) I've only seen one other like mine, four years after I got it (my model year was the last year for that model).

[Dover]

27. Yes, from your description it sounds pretty special...nt

[Sedona]

24. AAA offers a car buying service

if you are a member. It might be worth the membership fee. They have professional negtiators.

[Dover]

25. Really? I've never heard of that! I wonder how well it works?

Thanks, I'll look into it.

[GoCubsGo]

32. That's how I bought my car.

It is how I will buy my next car, if I ever get the means to do so. Just tell them what make, model, color and options, and they'll find it for you at the best price you'll probably find. They get them at fleet rate. Then, they'll drive it to your doorstep. They'll even finance it for you, if you'd like. And, it's a good deal. The best part is that you don't have to deal with car salesmen. No having some jackass insisting that I test-drive the car with the electric seat adjustment to prove that it drives the same as the one with the manual seat adjuster. (Yes, I walked out at that point...)

The service also includes used cars.

[Dover]

43. That really does sound great. How did you know you got a good deal?

Had you collected dealer costs/pricing and other info first?

[closeupready]

35. Thanks - I'm a member but didn't know that.

:hi:

[MADem]

26. I bought one from my insurance company's buying service.

Got a good price, too--way better than the dealers were offering (I shopped them, as well). They delivered it to the nearest dealership to my home.

That was EONS ago, though--before computers! I had to pay ten dollars each for packets of information about the cars I was interested in, they were sent to me, and the money was applied to my vehicle payment when I made my choice.

The dealer was a bit snippy when I went to pick up the car, though--I cut into his profit!

Isn't purchasing a car ASININE? I hate the process--it's not the bazaar, after all. Why do we put up with that shit, I wonder? If you went to the store to buy Cheerios, no one would put up with wildly varying prices and a need for the person ringing you up to "talk to my supervisor" when negotiating a price!

[Dover]

28. I've never heard of insurance companies doing that. Were they replacing

a car that was in an accident or what? Anyway, it sounds great. There are apparently some online companies that do something similar for a fee like FightingChance.com. They send you a package that walks you through the process and tells you the dealer price, any current info you need to know about like rebates, dealer incentives, etc. But I don't think they do the actual
negotiations for you.

I agree, the process is crazy and ass backwards. I hold out some hope that the internet sales will change the way business is done, both online and at the dealership, for the better.

[MADem]

36. No--it was a perk via USAA.

They are accustomed to making accomodations for military people coming off deployments or overseas tours. Usually, if you've been gone for a few years, you've sometimes gotten rid of your car, and when you return to the stateside grind, you need a new one, so they set up the service to make it less painful...and of course, the thing is insured by them the second you drive it off the lot!

The USAA vehicles all had a fixed price...if you wanted the electric windows, you paid "X" dollars for that; if you had to have the moon roof, add on a set price. Everything was itemized in the little packet they sent to you, and you knew how much--precisely--you were going to pay after you checked off all your options and added up the total and factored in the tax. It took the mystery and agita out of the process, and I did better (by several hundred dollars) than the best deal I could get blabbing to salesmen on car lots. The salesman-blabbing was helpful, though, as I was able to examine the vehicles up close and personal, so it wasn't entirely wasted time.

[Drew Richards]

39. Yep I have done that a couple times too but I hesitated to mention USAA not everyone has access

[MADem]

57. Others do it as well.

GEICO, AAA, a few other outfits...people like the hassle-free aspect of it, and they also like not having to deal with the attempts by sales personnel to bamboozle them with options and services they don't want or need.

[Hassin Bin Sober]

50. Maybe you should pay sticker price like you do with Cheerios?

Or pay a 300% mark up like they have on Cheerios.

I get that buying a car is a pain in the ass. But some of that pain is self-inflicted and it goes both ways. Running around town making yourself crazy over $50 dollars on a $30k purchase is, to me, asinine.

Car buying and selling, like horse trading, is a dirty business. But it's not rocket science.


pinboy3niner has some good info in this thread.

[MADem]

56. Well, I think you didn't really take my points.

I "ran all over town" looking at the cars I was interested in purchasing. How am I to know what I like without taking its measure?

There's nothing quite like putting paws on the merchandise--a picture doesn't convey the full experience.

The car I was talking about was purchased many DECADES ago, well before personal computers were a common feature in homes. If you had one, it had an "A" drive that took a five-and-a-quarter-inch floppy.


I used a car buying service my insurance provider offered. It made the process very simple and economical for me.

I didn't save fifty bucks, I saved over five hundred; on a purchase of around fifteen grand (if that), not thirty.

I never said car buying WAS rocket science. Why are you suggesting that I think it is?

I know that other places (AAA, Carwoo, Geico) also offer this sort of assistance to consumers in this day and age; all I was doing was imparting my (acknowledged, and plainly stated) ancient anecdotal experience doing precisely this sort of thing.

If I ever decided to buy a new car, I'd do it again. It was quite painless and I got what I wanted at a very good price.

[proud2BlibKansan]

29. Yep

Bought the car online, got the financing online. Went and picked it up at the dealer. Easiest car purchase I've ever done. I'd do it again in a heartbeat.

[Dover]

40. Would you mind sharing a little bit about your process and steps taken?

What information did you gather before going online and then how did you negotiate a price (and with how many dealers?). Also how did you close the deal? I'd really appreciate hearing about it.
:hi:

[proud2BlibKansan]

54. Found the car I wanted and surfed the net for local dealers

No deal. It was new and the price was set, as many new cars are.

The best part is it was quick and easy. Financing was approved quickly and I was able to go pick up the car in just a few days.

[trumad]

30. my wife just bought a new 2011 Chrysler 200 convertible

at the dealer. You'll find online pricing and dealer pricing...but they will always match pricing at the dealership.

If you buy new right time is perfect for it. The 2012 cars are being delivered and the 2011 prices are being slashed dramatically.

[pinboy3niner]

31. GREAT point

Last year's models--still new--can be had at a very good price when they want to clear them out for the new models. I've bought cars that way, and was very happy. :)

[Dover]

41. "..they will always match pricing at the dealership". Not sure what you're saying?

Are you saying if I got a quote from a particular dealership online they would honor it
when I showed up?

[trumad]

49. 9 out of 10 times yes...

Think about it...it's the same car and they want to push it out the door.

The online thing is just a gimmick in mho.

[LWolf]

33. No, but

my current vehicle was bought without seeing it.

A (then) local credit union had a program for members. I called the number they gave me, and the woman at the other end of the line asked me what I wanted. I told her; she then looked in her database and found me the closest match. I got it for dealer cost, and it was delivered to my front door. That was 7 years ago in CA.

[GoCubsGo]

34. That sounds like the AAA program.

Same deal. I bought my car that way. I'd do it again in a heartbeat.

[LWolf]

48. I don't remember where it came from.

I had to join that specific credit union to be eligible.

I'd do it again in a heartbeat, as well. The easiest car I ever bought. No haggling. Financed it through the credit union, told them what I wanted, got a clean, uncomplicated loan and didn't have to fight about the price.

[Sancho]

37. yep...but get the Consumer Reports printouts before you buy...

you have to pay a small fee, but it's worth it...you get the price the deal paid, advice on negotiating, and extras to buy or avoid. I've hunted for the car I wanted on the internet and it showed me what dealers have which models in stock. I also have gotten dealers to sell for less, exactly as the Consumer Reports suggested.

I have the loan pre-approved by my credit union before I walk in...and I know what I want and how much I'll pay for it. I've had dealers simply look at my CR printout and take my offer on the spot.

[Sancho]

38. Here's a link with good advice...

http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/cars/car-buying-advice/index.htm

[Dover]

46. Thanks! n/t

[CanonRay]

42. I bought a Subaru in 04 online from a dealer about 50 miles away

after a lot of reasearch. You have to be very sure of what you want, and scope out pricing. They even delivered it, and I still have it.

[Dover]

44. '04? You're practically an online car buying pioneer! A veteran.

I don't know how long the online buying option has been around but I'll bet not too long.

[Contrary1]

45. Haven't bought , but did look around online for a used car...

Here's what we found out, though I'm not sure it would apply to new cars also.

We found the exact same vehicle on several different websites, and discovered that in every case, they were priced differently. When we went in person to the dealership to see one in particular, we were asked where online we had seen it. We responded with the site that we had seen it advertised the cheapest. We were then given that price as the starting point.

Not sure why they would do this, but there was a $2,600 difference between the cheapest and highest price online for the same car. :shrug:

[Dover]

47. I'm guessing one advantage the dealer has with online sales is

that he can do a search and find out what other dealers have the car/package/color you're looking for. If they've got the only one in the area then they know they have a bargaining advantage.

[Gold Metal Flake]

51. I purchased through a dealership's internet sales department.

I used Edmonds.com to send inquiries to the internet sales division of four local dealerships. I received a response from one that was one thousand dollars lower than we were being quoted by the floor salesmen that we had talked to. We then met with the internet salesman in person and made a deal.

Just because you contact the internet sales rep of a dealership does not mean that the entire transaction has to take place online.

If you expand your search into surrounding cities you may increase your chances of getting a better deal.

If you buy a car out of town (or 40 miles away, as we did) you can have it serviced at your local dealer (as we do).

Finally, it does not hurt to ask. So shoot off those emails.

[avaistheone1]

55. Yes, I used Autobytel once and

so did my best friend; we both had good results.

I checked out several other online services first, and I felt autobytel was the best deal.

http://www.autobytel.com/