SWAT Team Kills Marine Veteran, shot 20 times searching for brother who didn't live there.

[Ichingcarpenter]

TUCSON (CN) - A widow says a regional SWAT team killed her husband, a Marine veteran, in a botched raid not even aimed at him, riddling their house with 72 bullets while she and their 4-year-old son were in it.
Vanessa Guerena says police refused to allow paramedics to help her husband, 26-year-old Jose Guerena, after the SWAT team shot him repeatedly while serving a search warrant on May 5.

"No shots were ever fired at members of the Pima Regional SWAT Team from inside the Guerena home," the widow says in her Pima County Court complaint. She says her husband was "peacefully sleeping in his bed" after returning home from the night shift at a mine when the police killed him.


"After the shooting, the Pima Regional SWAT Team denied entry to anyone, including paramedics, into the Guerena home for over an hour."
The raid apparently was aimed at her husband's brother, who did not live with them. Guerena says that the affidavit in support of the search warrant "misrepresented and failed to include complete and material information about Joseph Guerena."


The complaint states

:http://www.courthousenews.com/2011/11/03/41176.htm

[Kurmudgeon]

1. I'm so very tired of public executions.

[ellisonz]

2. Some more background:

The Pima County Sheriff's department claimed that this was not a no-knock search, which was supported by video evidence showing that the SWAT team attempted to make its presence known for 7 seconds before knocking down the door. Audio notifications included claims of the sounding a siren in the driveway of the Guerena's residence for 8 seconds, as well as shouting "Police!" and "Search Warrant!" at the front door; although interviews with neighbors and Mrs. Guerena reported they did not hear anything. The SWAT team also was listening to music from one of the cars and possibly could not hear voices from house over it.<2><17> Guerena's widow states that she had no knowledge that the man she saw pointing a gun at her through the window was a police officer, and thought that he was part of a home invasion group. She has stated that two members of her sister-in-law's family were killed previously in a home invasion.<18> As of May 2011, that case, in which Cynthia and Manny Orozco were killed and their 2-year-old daughter seriously injured, remains unsolved.<19>

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jose_Guerena_shooting

[renate]

24. I don't answer knocks at the door, and I would NEVER answer a pounding on the door

And this woman, who has a personal reason to fear a home invasion, probably wouldn't have done so either. Whether or not this was a no-knock search shouldn't be relevant. And seven seconds of knocking or eight seconds of sirens? WTH? Sometimes people go to the bathroom, are in the middle of cooking or doing laundry and can't get to the door right away, have mobility issues... sheesh.

Although I think a few seconds is too short a wait, I do understand why sometimes SWAT teams have to bust down a door, and that a horrible mistake was made here (nobody meant for an innocent man to be killed), but there should be an automatic No to that if there are kids in the house.

[truedelphi]

26. And I think they use google maps to determine whose house is whose -

Which is a terrible policy, as the maps are about 600 feet off in any direction.

A reporter who tried to figure all of this out discovered that in a ten year period, 400 "mistaken" entries had occurred. And these were just the ones he could find out about. These "mis-entries" are hard to determine - small rural papers and TV stations don't like to broadcast that their brave SWAt forces make mistakes.

And of course, in these mistaken cases, people watch their dogs being killed. Older people died of heart attacks and strokes. Several times, someone in the house, being woken in the middle of the night, grabbed their gun, and that meant they were sent to their heavenly reward before they were fully awake.

In addition to kicking in your doorway, the SWAT teams use grenades that set off small explosive charges, which often burn a house to the ground!

And these households had nothing to do with the culprits that the SWAT people were actually looking for! I guess after your kids are terrified, your pets killed, and your elderly parent dies, you do get some sort of apology from the local regional commander.

[midnight]

59. Good god yes.... Can you imagine being on the toliet....

[frylock]

27. they gave him a whole 8 seconds to respond..

that's the excuse they're going with.

[ellisonz]

32. Pretty bad isn't it...

[Hassin Bin Sober]

31. I can't get to the door in seven seconds when I'm EXPECTING someone.

[frylock]

65. ^ THIS ^

[DreamSmoker]

38. Another Death by COP

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jose_Guerena_shooting

The Sheriff's Department initially claimed Guerena had fired on officers..

Other versions of this story claim that officers started shooting after Guerena pointed the gun at them, though under questioning they were initially unsure whether he had actually moved to target them..

An investigation revealed that Jose had not fired his weapon. The AR-15 rifle Guerena pointed toward officers was found loaded, but with the safety engaged.

[boppers]

70. He pointed a gun in the direction of a cop.

That's not a mystery with a lot of outcomes.

[Laluchacontinua]

75. If you're in bed & suddenly someone's in your bedroom what would you do?

The cops shouldn't have been there in the first place. *They* were in the wrong, why do you make the victim to be in the wrong?

[boppers]

79. Well, I wouldn't grab my weapon.

I'd probably try to make a threat assessment, identify possible targets, and then decide if I was willing to die over the particular threat, if there was even a threat to start with.

Unfortunately, this guy was trained to not think, and go for his weapon first and foremost. This is effective military training, but shitty training for civil society.

....and now he's dead, as a result.

Yet another reason why ex-military folks should not be allowed to own weapons, under any circumstances, until they can "train down".

[w4rma]

78. You have some serious authoritarian issues, boppers. Every time you take the side of authority.

Every time authority destroys a life you make excuses for their emissaries. You need to rethink your follower status.

[boppers]

82. Not a follower.

There are those who run into guns.

There are those who run away from guns.

I am the latter.

The former are brave, and often dead.

Bully for them throwing a life away.

The latter are left to make changes, to reduce the former.

[Bonobo]

3. That is essentially how US foreign policy operates.

Why would any American that supports Obama's and Bush's recent foreign policy "behavior" expect that domestic authorities too act any better.

[FreakinDJ]

4. The Iraq Invasion has come home

[The Doctor.]

47. No, these were steroid yahoos jacked up and afraid of their own shadows.

Not that they'd ever fucking admit it, but these 'big tough guys' who get off on bullying civvies were too stupid and cowardly to take the .7 seconds to make a tactical assessment and give the guy a chance to surrender.

I'll bet Guerrena figured it out and already had his gun at left shoulder arms when they opened fire.

[malaise]

6. Eventually

it all comes home

[Capitalocracy]

37. Profound statement.

Very true.

[FiveGoodMen]

18. Which raises the question

How can ANYONE -- EVEN ONE SINGLE PERSON -- here at DU support Obama's and Bush's recent foreign policy "behavior"?

[pasto76]

30. So over you ultra libs lumping Bush and President Obama together

wah, he's not liberal enough. He never ran as a liberal. Liberals WILL cost DEMOCRATS this election. Which is maybe what you all want, since you love to bitch and moan from behind a computer screen.

President Obama's FP is leaps and bounds better than Bush. I left the army under bush, and re-enlisted under Obama. What exactly have you done for this world?

[RaleighNCDUer]

44. I haven't killed any innocents. I think that's a plus in my column. nt

[Bonobo]

60. Now THAT is a great response.

I am sick of pretending that working in military industry is doing something POSITIVE for the country.

I wonder if the poster above you ever considered that his "serving" was actually a minus for the country? It IS possible you know.

Imagine a world where soldiers armed to the teeth DON'T invade a foreign country.

[Dutchmaster]

63. I'm a Social Worker, I do a lot for this world.

And I don't carry a gun to do it. And some of the neighborhoods I go to are indeed war zones.

[walerosco]

66. because no matter how bad Obama

is on foreign policy, it is going to get worse with a republican

[Cali_Democrat]

33. So true. n/t

[TorchTheWitch]

5. the widow is full of shit

He was shot in the hallway because he was brandishing a rifle at police. Video and audio evidence shows that they blew off a siren for a full seven seconds before breaking down the door, they blew off flash bangs in the back yard beforehand, etc. Claiming they didn't hear anything is ridiculous. It's also ridiculous to claim they thought it was a home invasion (ie: robbers). A SWAT team looks like a damn SWAT team, and there's no possible way for them to be mistaken for a group of thugs bent on robbing the house. He didn't receive medical attention because he was dead. The autopsy revealed he was shot 22 times and could not have lived longer than about 3 or 4 minutes after being shot.

Further, he had five previous felony drug charges against him, and in a storage unit rented by his mother and three other houses they searched (all covered under the same warrant) they found an arsenal of guns, drugs, a stolen car, and account ledgers revealing the details of their drug operation (several members of the family were being investigated).

[fasttense]

7. Do you have a link to support your information?

I'm have a tough time believing that the SWAT team shot him 22 times because the family didn't respond to their noises.

[indepat]

19. Yeah, especially when 18-20 shots would seem sufficient to the task. Thankfully these

are just garden-variety black-shirts killers, not the brown-shirt variety for we don't need no totalitarian tactics being used in the land of the free and home of the brave. :patriot:

[Name removed]

8. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[NYC_SKP]

9. Wikipedia isn't really a source. I did some searching....

Wikipedia is whatever writers of wikipedia articles want for it to be.

I'm not taking sides but a different source included this information, true or not:

SWAT officers searched all four homes on May 5. They seized a small amount of marijuana, $100,000 in cash, more than 20 cellphones, an AK-47 rifle, lists with names next to dollar amounts in Celaya's home and a stolen vehicle at his other home, documents show.

The third home, owned by Jose Guerena's mother, had most of the furniture wrapped in plastic, documents show, and detectives seized cellphones and paperwork.

Jose Guerena's home was searched that morning after his death, and officials found body armor, guns, a rifle, a dozen cellphones and a hat with the U.S. Border Patrol logo.

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=e63_1307308064

So, there are different sources and tidbits of info out there.

:patriot:

[jeff47]

10. So...he was shot because he had cell phones?

I didn't realize having multiple cell phones was an imminent, deadly threat to police. Yes, clearly he should have been shot 20 times for that.

[NYC_SKP]

11. Did I say that?

My point really was to indicate that there are multiple sources of information and that Wikipedia isn't a primary or reliable source.

It never fails on a discussion board, however, that such a post is taken as some form of position defending a particular action.

I loathe SWAT actions and home invasions, it's ridiculous and tragic.

[jeff47]

12. Why make your post claiming other sources are wrong then?

Fundamentally, it's a question of whether or not lethal force was necessary. According to Wikipedia, it was not. According to your new source....it was not.

So why bring it up? Your post claimed to contradict the Wikipedia entry. Yet it does not. So according to your source, wikipedia got it right, yet you are claiming they got it wrong.

[AtheistCrusader]

35. If he had felony convictions, he couldn't even legally possess the ballistic armor

let alone the guns. Many federal felonies piling up fast in that inventory list.

[jeff47]

48. The deleted post above said those convictions were for a different man w/ the same name (nt)

[AtheistCrusader]

64. Damn. I should have fact checked it, instead of taking his word for it.

Thanks for the correction.

[bl968]

41. ikipedia is whatever writers of wikipedia articles want for it to be.

If you think that is any different from the media you are mistaken. Every writer, reporter or not makes their writings into what they want it to be.

[The Doctor.]

51. Actually, Wikipedia has more checks, balances, and diligence than Fox 'News'.

Get familiar with http://www.pcworld.com/article/170826/wikipedia_changes_editing_policy.html">their methods.

[TheEuclideanOne]

54. More dilligence than Fox?

While I appreciate your attempt to educate people on Wikipedia, using Fox news as the comparison for dilligence is maybe setting the bar just a little too low. There is just way too much that can seem dilligent, credible, forthright, honest, etc, if you are using Fox news as a reference point.

[The Doctor.]

62. Yeah, I thought of that after I posted.

Just didn't bother to edit in 'CNN' or 'MSNBC'.

Any would have been appropriate.

[boppers]

71. There's a wikipedia article about it...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reliability_of_Wikipedia

[janet118]

50. I also read that Jose Guerena worked the night shift . . .

He was fast asleep when the police came. He was awakened by his frightened wife telling him that their home was being attacked. He told her and their child to get in the closet and grabbed his gun.

This happened a while back so I don't know if I can find the link but it was an Arizona paper.

[Incitatus]

55. I guess they couldn't have grabbed him as he was leaving work.

Instead they had to play cowboy and bust into a house where a woman and child were and fire their guns.

[pinboy3niner]

57. Link:

http://azstarnet.com/news/local/crime/article_b3177522-baa0-5c9e-9f0d-d3d7da6e9e4b.html

[janet118]

83. thanx n/t

[uncle ray]

15. it only took one bullet to kill Khadaffi.

the guy may be a criminal, but the SWAT teams inability to get him into custody safely demonstrates that they are at a minimum incompetent, more likely criminals as well. state sponsored criminals with guns and the right to kill are far worse than a mid-level drug dealer.

[redqueen]

16. So very very very well said. (nt)

[frylock]

28. oh, well in that case..

are you fucking shitting me?!

[sulphurdunn]

36. I don't care if the guy was

Hannibal Lector. Cops don't get to declare anyone dead, only a coroner is legally empowered to do that. Police failure to administer aid after shooting this man and then their failure to call for it for nearly an hour constitutes a gross dereliction of duty and criminal malfeasance.

[zeemike]

45. Oh well then it's ok then.

Why spend all that money on jail and trials and stuff when the police know he is guilty....just send in the swat team and riddle him with led...I'll bet they get a kick our of doing that.
:sarcasm:

[EFerrari]

52. And yet her husband, against whom there was no warrant, is dead.

No, *she* is not full of shit.

[Matariki]

61. You really should back up a post like this with a link

It's pretty disgusting making apologies for police action like that. But of course there is always someone here who will do just that, no matter how far the police go, no matter how utterly disgusting and murderous their behavior is.

[L0oniX]

13. Spring time for Hitler.

[tuckessee]

14. He's simply collateral damage in the war on drugs.

A marine or a marine wife should know all about collateral damage. A search warrant based on lies is little different than a war based on lies. The irony is rich.

[redqueen]

17. Ouch. (nt)

[Carolina]

20. ooohhhh

hammer meet nail.

Touche, tuckessee, how true!

[Liberal_in_LA]

21. k&r

[Liberal_in_LA]

22. he was reaching for his waistband, or so the cops ALWAYS say.

[lpbk2713]

23. Nothing to worry about.

I'm sure there will be a full scale Internal Affairs investigation. (cough - cough)




:rofl:

[geardaddy]

25. Arizona? He must not have had his papers ready to hand to the police.

Fuckwads.

[louslobbs]

29. Does this really surprise anyone? We recently saw a man in Oakland shot in the head with a

projectile for simply standing still unarmed by riot police with black tape covering their names and badge numbers. I don't know all the facts here, but I don't give more weight to the story the police tell over that of the average citizen. I'll wait until all of the evidence comes in, but just how many bullets does it take before you are sure the person you are firing at is no longer a perceived "threat."
Lou

[valerief]

34. Who will pay for this other than the executed innocent man and his family? This is an outrage!!!! nt

[grantcart]

39. In Thailand police do not have the authority to enter a home after the sun has set

unless the search warrant has been specifically authorized by the national Chief of Police.

[Stainless]

40. Criminals with badges.......

killed my step-grandsons biological father. The murderous thugs (Weber County, Utah swat team) served a no-knock warrant and shot him as soon as he appeared in an internal doorway of his house. He had a golf club raised over his head in defense of his home and a murderous bastard cop dropped him with several rapid fire killing shots. As usual, it was ruled justifiable by their butt buddies in the review system. Most cops truley are criminals with badges. The video the cops took of the incident clearly showed that they were not in eminent danger.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WV6Bq8xeQrU

[ellisonz]

42. My condolences.

That was cold blooded murder.

A handgun versus a golf club at a distance of over 6 feet is a no match.

Has there been any attempt to take civil action?

[ellisonz]

46. Welcome to DU!

Good luck with the civil suit! If the criminal courts won't do anything - maybe the civil courts will.

[qanda]

49. OMG!!!

That was awful. They ruled that justifiable? What were they watching? This is not a free country.

[Lorien]

68. Agreed. They shot an artist friend of mine in front of his three young children

two years ago. The vast majority are just thugs with a license to kill whenever they feel like it.

[midnight]

72. So sorry to hear this... So awful..

[DaveJ]

43. In the U.S. we just have to cross our fingers and hope the police don't murder us.

It could easily happen to anyone. And as the cops always say "it's our word versus yours." Even the video evidence makes no difference.

They can kill anyone and get away with it. Plain and simple.

But this must change.

[Lorien]

69. Yep. It's gotten f*cking old.

[ChazII]

53. Yet another take

http://reason.com/blog/2011/05/22/jose-guerena-evidence-dont-buy

[frylock]

67. thanks. good read..

recommended.

[d_r]

56. Tuttle/Buttle

[99th_Monkey]

74. EXACTLY => that movie BRAZIL needs to be required viewing for all police/swat goons. nt

[midnight]

58. This is what a police state looks like.....

[DiehardLiberal]

76. I was just going to post that then saw yours - it really is!!! NT

[99th_Monkey]

73. This is so fucking WRONG WRONG WRONG!! Same day 2nd Iraq/Aphg. vet is brutalized

and hospitalized by Oakland porkers .. ah .. I mean police officers.

[janet118]

84. This happened in May . . . n/t

[99th_Monkey]

85. Ah - thanx 4 letting me know. nt

[toymachines]

77. Biggest gang in america

I hate cops more everyday. It's sad really. I don't want to... the same with everything these days

[RedCloud]

80. I favor the death penalty for the SWAT members who murdered.

[ZombieHorde]

81. Brazil.

Earth is a mad house.