The Greek people would have voted “no” on the bailout

[KansDem]

...but Wall Street wouldn't let them.

The comments Michael Hudson,* interviewed by Amy Goodman of "DemocracyNow!"

...Europe has to cut its own throat in order to save the United States hedge funds and banks from taking a loss on the Greek bonds that they’ve insured. One of the reasons that people have been willing to buy Greek bonds is they bought credit insurance. And the European banks, mostly—maybe not Barclays or Deutsche Bank, but most banks—are not willing to write credit insurance, because everybody at the conference here in Berlin, at the Böckler Foundation conference, every single economist says there is no conceivable way in which Greece can pay its debts. But the Americans, hedge funds and bankers and—have come in and said, "We’ll write a guarantee." And then they lean on President Obama and Tim Geithner to tell the Europeans, "You have to make Greece pay, so that we win the bets that we’ve made, because if we lose the bets, then we go under, and the stock market crashes, and a lot of people can’t collect on their money market funds." So, this is just the naked, brute force that Mr. Obama is doing. He’s basically telling Europe, "Don’t go the democratic route. Support Wall Street."

http://www.democracynow.org/2011/11/3/wall_street_v_gre...

We've bailed out Wall Street once before...we shouldn't do it again.
_______
*Michael Hudson is president of the Institute for the Study of Long-Term Economic Trends, distinguished research professor of economics at the University of Missouri, Kansas City, and author of Super Imperialism: The Economic Strategy of American Empire. His website is Michael-Hudson.com.

[baldguy]

1. Can't have democracy get in the way of a good looting.

[DCKit]

2. The people are going to get in the way.

They know they've been fucked.

Payback it going to be a total cunt.

I can't wait to see this show.

[Jackpine Radical]

3. Sadly, I think you re entirely right.

This is not going to end well. The people will now take their "referendum" to the streets.

[Poll_Blind]

6. They are. They do. And it definitely is. nt

PB

[pampango]

4. I've seen polls that showed 60% of Greeks want to keep the euro.

If the bailout and eurozone membership were linked in a referendum, it would be very interesting.

If Greeks chose to reject the bailout, ditch the euro, default and go it alone, that would be their democratic choice. If they chose that keeping the euro was worth the pain of the bailout, that would be their democratic choice. Either way, it is the democratic solution and would give legitimacy to whichever side won (even if it wasn't the decision I thought they should make).

[DCKit]

10. What you said. nt

[sabrina 1]

27. Actually the polls showed the Greek people by 60% did not

agree with this bailout. So, the Bankers could not allow that vote to be cast. What all of this doing is showing the world the true nature of the EU, the taking away of the sovereignty of most of the countries who thought they were uniting with other European countries for entirely different reasons than have been revealed.

The authoritarian commands from the 'leaders' of the EU to other countries, the forcing on them of policies that they never agreed to, will eventually bring down the EU itself.

Many of those countries value their sovereignty and as long as there was a pretext that it was respected, they were content to remain in the EU. But the total collapse of their House of Cards by the Banks and Financial Institutions has made them so desperate they cannot hide their sense of entitlement to take the pensions and social program money from ordinary people there to pay off their gambling debts.

This will not end well. They cannot solve the disaster they created, they just keep pushing it down the road, as predicted last year eg, but pretty soon it's all going to collapse, and people in the US will also be affected.

This should have been ended in 2008 by nationalizing the Banks here and elsewhere, but arresting and prosecuting the culprits, and by breaking up this 'too big to fail' (what does that stupid phrase mean anyhow?) institutions and ending the greed with strict regulations on all of these institutions.

Instead, they bullied their bought and paid for governments to bail them out, and like any criminals, went right back to their old ways as soon as they got their hands on the money.

Merkel issues a vague threat last week, similar to the one Henry Paulson issued here (martial law if we don't get our money), she said that there could be 'no guarantee of another 50 years of peace in Europe' if they did not get their way.

These people have to go, they are at war with the world's people now trying to hang on to as much of their stolen goods as they can.

[TBF]

5. Good for them - power to the people of Greece! No more bailouts for the wealthy

here either. Enough is enough.

[Avalux]

7. I was listening to an economist on NPR (sorry, can't recall name)....

He said that if left to default; Greece would recover FASTER than with the bailout. The bailout will only prolong their problems and eventually they will default.

[tsuki]

9. I have heard others say that. Also, they can be bailed out by one

government, but successive governments cannot be held to the terms.

[dixiegrrrrl]

14. which is/was also true of US.

Or any country that allowed IMF to indebt it. See Iceland for example.

[leveymg]

8. The Greek people have every right to dissolve their present government and kick out Wall St

creditors. So do the American people, come to think of it.

[TBF]

26. Great post and I completely agree!! nt

[CoffeeCat]

11. K&R...This is very important

Obama is on the tee vee, right now, justifying the continued mafia-like control that the banks
have around the world.

The right thing--would have been to allow democracy to happen. Let the people of Greece decide. The Greek
people are revolting right now. Just like OWS, they are protesting and their protests have been amped up
and have turned into riots. They are not happy. Why not let them vote?

The Greek Prime Minister tried to make that happen. We can see how efficient the banksters are at squashing
anything that looks like democracy--in an effort to keep countries and their citizens underneath the weight of
their tyranny.

Iceland did it. They said "no thank you" to these banksters. They're recovering, and even better--THEY'RE FREE.

Obama is perpetuating the continued abuse and power of the banks---and he continues the public-relations campaign
that props up the banks and screws over the people.

[randome]

12. Yeah, well, let's keep this thread focused on Greece.

Not Obama, okay? Just my friendly suggesion.

[CoffeeCat]

13. Obama is a central part of the original post...

Here is a quote from the post. Perhaps you overlooked it:

"And then they lean on President Obama and Tim Geithner to tell the Europeans, "You have to make Greece pay,
so that we win the bets that we’ve made, because if we lose the bets, then we go under, and the stock market crashes,
and a lot of people can’t collect on their money market funds." So, this is just the naked, brute force that Mr. Obama is doing.
He’s basically telling Europe, "Don’t go the democratic route. Support Wall Street."

Obama is most certainly a part of this story--and a part of the story that needs to be told. He's subverting democracy and propping up the continued power and abuse of these banks.

These banks are so damn powerful. Obama's administration is full of former banksters, Goldman guys
and other assorted Wall Street toadies.

These banks have infiltrated our government. They dictate, to our politicians, how the banks will be
run--how they will be regulated (or not) and how many billions in tax-payer dollars they get to steal
when their criminal enterprises blow up in their faces.

It's important to note which side Obama is on and how he reacts when any country is at a crossroads--with an opportunity to choose
democracy over continued tyranny from criminal banks. Don't you think?

The leaders of Iceland told the banks to go to hell--and now the people of Iceland are free and out from under these wretched banks that are destroying economies. It's worth noting
that Obama touts the banks and that he uses the power of the Presidency to prop them up--when it doesn't have to be that way.

He just finished giving a speech--making the case that the world must support these criminal banks--and keep them in power.

This is about Greece--but the leader of the free world's role in all of this--sure is relevant too.

[dixiegrrrrl]

15. yep.

[randome]

16. That's a quote from the article.

Not from Obama or anyone else in America. It's speculation.

We are all dependant on the banks to provide us funds for houses and cars. If that needs to change, we should have a system in line to replace it, not just let Greece refuse to pay its debts and hope for the best.

[Kaleko]

18. For starters, that quote is from an American in America.

Michael Hudson is president of the Institute for the Study of Long-Term Economic Trends,
distinguished research professor of economics at the University of Missouri, Kansas City,
and author of Super Imperialism: The Economic Strategy of American Empire.
His website is Michael-Hudson.com.


Secondly, it is not speculation when Hudson characterizes the overall situation thusly:
(from the OP article)

"So the Americans are putting immense pressure on Europe, saying, "We will wreck your economy, if you don’t wreck Greece’s economy."

This is a factual reading of what is going on!

Regarding your last two assertions... one doesn't know where to begin with your education.
They demonstrate a cluelessness so widespread in the US, it makes me abandon all hope,
because there is no help for a populace that welcomes the hands that tie the noose around its collective neck
before that neck is finally broken.

[randome]

19. Again...

...if you want to change the system, what is your plan for replacing it?

I am not at all defending unchecked greed. But I am glad I have a roof over my head for myself and my 2 daughters. Do you have a system in mind (that has a chance of being implemented) that would accomplish the same thing for millions of other people?

I still put the blame for our current ills on the shoulders of our legislators who failed to do their jobs and regulate the economy. It's difficult for me to see corporations and banks as the problem when our system essentially says, "Here. Take what you want."

[blindpig]

20. There is a plan....

KKE knows what to do when the time comes.

[randome]

22. You guys never let me in on the GOOD plans.

[Kaleko]

23. You are moving the goalposts, even in this brief exchange.

Before talking about how the existing global financial system can be replaced, a sufficient number of people need to understand what is so fundamentally wrong with the one that is in place.

You cannot change what you don't acknowledge.

You cannot cure what you refuse to diagnose correctly in the first place, you see.

[randome]

24. I think my diagnosis is spot on.

The system has worked well. But letting the regulatory environment wither on the vine increases the likelihood of abuse and that is what has happened in both America and Greece.

Put better regulations in place that will benefit more than just the top 1%. That's my 'cure'.

[Kaleko]

25. The system has indeed worked well for the 0.1 percent.

But now it is cannibalizing its own base and collapsing.

(from a previous post that I think bears repeating)

World bankers have waged economic warfare for a very long time but in secret until now.
This quote from David Rockefeller should leave no doubt about who has been in power since the creation of the FED.

We are grateful to the Washington Post, the New York Times, Time magazine and other great publications whose directors have attended our meetings and respected the promises of discretion for almost forty years.

It would have been impossible for us to develop our plan for the world if we had been subject to the bright lights of publicity during those years. But the world is now more sophisticated and prepared to march towards a world-government.

The supranational sovereignty of an intellectual elite and world bankers is surely preferable to the national auto-determination practiced in past centuries.

- David Rockefeller in an address to the Trilateral Commission, 1991

* "respected the promises of discretion" = the media who kept lying and deceiving the populace on our behalf.

* "auto-determination" = self-determination of the people of independent nations.

Also noteworthy: "austerity" is a euphemism for social genocide so as to reduce any given population to wage slavery and a manageable size for the elite.

[Tsiyu]

17. Just heard a Greek woman on NPR

say 10 years down the road they would have a debt/GDP ratio of 120%...right back where they started. So she would vote no to the bailout but yes to remaining part of Euro-economy.


Don't know the accuracy of her comment, just adding to the discussion...

[gratuitous]

21. The U.S. doesn't really believe in democracy

We spend a great deal of effort making sure only the "right" people vote in the "right" way. Witness what's going on to denying the franchise to voters in Florida, Ohio, and other states. Yes, these efforts are Republicans trying to rig the system, but since the Republicans killed ACORN, there's no concomitant organization on the liberal side, and the Democratic party seems content to allow the Republicans to go ahead with their suppression efforts without interference.

When the Palestinians didn't elect the right leaders for themselves, we began a program of punitive little measures, despite our promises beforehand that we would recognize their duly elected leaders chosen in a free and fair election. Too bad for the Palestinians they believed us.

And the Greeks had the temerity to think that as the birthplace of democracy they'd somehow get a special dispensation to order their own national affairs with a vote. Who do they think is running their country? The people? Get real!