Officials hope to realign sidewalk benches so pedestrians can avoid encounters with the homeless

[The Straight Story]

Santa Barbara seeks to turn the tables on the homeless

Officials hope to realign sidewalk benches so that pedestrians can avoid encounters with the homeless. Some say the money would be better spent on aiding the needy.

...


Cities have tried many ways to move panhandlers and vagrants out of prime shopping districts, but Santa Barbara believes it has a new angle — 90 degrees.

Using $50,000 in redevelopment funds, the city is planning to turn 14 benches perpendicular to the State Street storefronts they now face. The idea is to make it more difficult for beggars to establish contact with passersby, officials said.

"They'll be sitting with their backs to half the people coming and going on the sidewalk," said Marck Aguilar, a supervisor for the city's redevelopment agency. "They'll have half the potential contacts with the public. It might not be financially beneficial for them."

To discourage prolonged stays, Aguilar said, workers will also remove the backs from several benches on a two-block stretch of the city's most vibrant commercial thoroughfare. If the pilot program succeeds, it may be extended the length of the street, where crowds of students and well-heeled tourists from around the world amble into upscale stores and restaurants.

The idea, which originated with the Santa Barbara Downtown Organization, a business group, has again focused attention on Santa Barbara's efforts to deal with its sizable homeless population.

http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-santa-barbara-benches-20110121,0,7575749.story

[zaj]

1. What % of the homeless panhandlers are drug addicts or alcoholics?

This story doesn't really bother me at all. I almost never give panhandlers money. I will offer to buy them food often, and a lot of time that just pisses them off.

My sense is that they are a large (if not majority) % of them. I don't have a lot of sympathy.

[Dappleganger]

2. I'm sorry you feel that way.

I'm sorry to see these kinds of comments on a democratic forum.

[zaj]

4. That's why I asked if there is any data...

I don't doubt for a minute that there are plenty of homeless people who aren't capable of working and can't find work, can't afford a home and need support. I strongly support social safety nets. But when it comes down to aggressive panhandling, my experience isn't needy people, as much as drunk, high people.

[Dappleganger]

5. Drunk, high people who desperately need rehab

and mental health services. Until they get that, they need a place to sleep.

[zaj]

8. I agree... stronger social safety net...

Better funding for addiction services. But a drug addict is going to choose another hit and a night in the park, over a motel and a night without their drug. They need to have services available to them at no cost... and until they are willing to take them, they need to be left to hit bottom.

If you've ever watched intervention, or similar shows. The families are told to cut the money off and stop enabling the addiction. Giving a drug addict money just feeds that addiction.

I'm just curious what the numbers are, and if I'm on-point in my judgement that more than 1/2 of the people panhandling are addicts of some sort.

[LoZoccolo]

7. I felt conflicted about this, so I called about it.

I can't remember if it was a charity or just the Chicago city information line, and they said that homeless people should go to a hospital or a police station and they will find food and shelter for them, and that that's what you should tell panhandlers. I've done that when approached by panhandlers and they either just go on to someone else or act like I told them something crazy (without explaining why it's crazy).

[Luminous Animal]

9. That is bullshit. No police station or hospital is equipped to provide food and shelter

to the homeless.

Go ahead and try it.

[LoZoccolo]

22. If you read carefully enough, you'll see that neither I nor they made that literal claim. n/t

[Sen. Walter Sobchak]

10. my girlfriend has been assaulted twice by cracked out vagrants

While minding her own business in the fine city of San Francisco, my patience has worn thin.

[leftstreet]

3. What % of Congress R drug addicts and alcoholics?

:shrug:

[zaj]

6. I have no sympathy if you are a drug addict and homeless...

I'm not going to give you money to buy drugs or beer. Honestly, I'd rather you get desperate and either get help or get arrested and get clean in jail.

At the same time, we need a much stronger social safety net to help people who need help and are ready for help.

[Luminous Animal]

11. Me, on the other hand, have no problem giving money to a an addict or alcoholic.

There are plenty of addicts and alcoholics that are CEOs, and CFOs, and and so on and so on, and I give them money all of the time when I buy their products.

Nobody expects them to be treated like shit.

[zaj]

12. They need to have their enablers stopped too...

[zaj]

13. From what Google Says...

Numbers are hard to come by in part because information reported can be unreliable.

One report was that 90% of the people a caseworker saw was an addict or alcoholic. Others studies said 30-40% of all homeless, but that "Chronic Homeless" rates are much higher (naturally).

My guess is that there is a statistical difference between "homeless" people and "panhandlers" too. Not all homeless people panhandle. Also, I'd guess that people who panhandle have a higher chance rate of being among the chronically homeless. Panhandling seems like a last resort even among the homeless.

Gut feeling is that more than 1/2 of the people who hit you up for money on the street are using the money for drugs or alcohol. Maybe up to 75%.

Still not happy with these numbers. I'd like to see a real study on this.

[rpannier]

16. You do realize that many homeless people become alcholoics after they move to the streets

Many of them drink so they can fall asleep at night
Try sleeping when it's below freezing
Here in Korea they found that many poor (that aren't homeless) keep a bottle or two of alcohol available in the winter so they can sleep
The causes of alcoholism are many

[MadHound]

21. There have been real studies,

"Thirty-eight percent of homeless individuals have a mental health concern. Nearly one-half of homeless men (47%) and 16% of homeless women also experience alcohol use disorders.

Furthermore, the combined chances of alcohol, drug, and mental health problems anytime in a homeless person's life are estimated at 30%."

<http://pubs.niaaa.nih.gov/publications/Social/Module10DHomeless/Module10D.html>

Some further stats.
"Approximately 40% of homeless men are veterans, although veterans comprise only 34% of the general adult male population."

<http://www.nationalhomeless.org/factsheets/veterans.html>

And let's not forget that 1.5 million kids are homeless, making up approximately 42% of the homeless population.
<http://articles.cnn.com/2009-03-10/us/homeless.children_1_homeless-children-family-homelessness-child-homelessness?_s=PM:US>

Now that we've got some basic numbers out of the way, let's get into the meat of your posting, namely your disgust with the homeless who are using drugs or alcohol.

First of all, please recognize that the mentally ill, who are prevalent among the homeless population, have been sadly underserved in this country. They can't get adequate help, and their illness can, and does, drive them into homelessness. Many of these people take to self medicating, meaning alcohol or drugs. Our society has let these people down.

We are having more and more children wind up on the streets, through no fault of their own. Once there, they are generally exposed to alcohol and drugs. No kid should be homeless, period. We have let these kids down.

Veterans have been a staple of the homeless population for generations now. These proud people who have served their country come home, and attempt to slide back into civilian life. But some simply can't, usually because of undiagnosed PTSD or other such like problems. Again, they start self medicating with alcohol and drugs. Our society has let down those who have served our country.

Your display of righteous, Calvinistic disgust at the homeless is also part of the problem with our society. You look at a homeless person, and you don't see a person. You see an addict, a bum, somebody who wants something that you have, a bit of cash. What you don't see is a person, a human being, somebody who has been let down by our society. You think that since somebody is an alcoholic now, that it is the alcoholism which drove them into homelessness. What you fail to recognize is that it is, in most cases, either the previous mental illness, or the condition of being homeless, which drives the person towards alcohol.

In this country we do a huge disservice to our poor, and mentally ill. If you are poor, living from paycheck to paycheck, you are, at all times, one unexpected calamity away from being homeless. Lose your job, lose your house, you are out on the streets. Once you are out on the streets, it becomes infinitely more difficult to make it back off the streets. If you are homeless, the stress and tension in your life skyrocket, worrying about finding food everyday, a place to sleep, how to stay safe, blaming yourself, despising yourself for having to do the unspeakable simply to survive. Is it any wonder that people turn to alcohol or drugs to find relief? You're certainly not going to find relief from your fellow citizens in this country, since the vast majority are like you, Calvinistic puritans who despise the homeless instead of help them.

If you are mentally ill, you're even worse off. Ever since Reagan loosened the standards in the eighties, the mentally ill have been getting kicked out of hospitals and treatment shelters straight on to the street. With no social safety net, no capacity to hold down a job, the mentally ill slide into homelessness. Not only that, since they either can't get, or can't afford to get the medication that they need, they start to self medicate with drugs and alcohol.

For far too long we have treated the homeless as a failing of the individual. It is part of that Calvinistic ethic this country was founded upon. But homelessness is a failing of our society. In the richest country in the world, there should be nobody without a home, nobody whose mental illness goes untreated, no veteran who isn't looked after when they come home, no child who has to sleep on a grate or in a door. But in this "pull yourself up by the bootstrap" society of ours, we are more than willing to put the blame, the onus, the shame of homelessness on the victims of it. And once a person is homeless, we make it exceedingly difficult for them to escape their plight. Our society creates a permanent underclass, but blames that underclass for causing their own plight. This is exemplified by attitudes like yours, and others, who refuse to help those who are down and out, no matter why they got there.

My suggestion for you, sit down and talk to the homeless, get to know them, find out their story, discover their humanity. But be warned, that is a dangerous path to take, for once you discover their common humanity, it will be infinitely harder for you to dismiss them as alcoholic bums. You will find that they are your brothers and sisters. Oh the horror, discovering your own humanity.

[Dappleganger]

23. Excellent post.

[Desertrose]

27. This should be an OP!

Well said, Mad Hound!


"In the richest country in the world, there should be nobody without a home, nobody whose mental illness goes untreated, no veteran who isn't looked after when they come home, no child who has to sleep on a grate or in a door. But in this "pull yourself up by the bootstrap" society of ours, we are more than willing to put the blame, the onus, the shame of homelessness on the victims of it. And once a person is homeless, we make it exceedingly difficult for them to escape their plight. Our society creates a permanent underclass, but blames that underclass for causing their own plight."

[ipaint]

17. Bigotry.

Enlighten yourself instead of spouting lies about people our cruel society, including you, have decided are throw aways.

http://www.nationalhomeless.org/factsheets/who.html

[eShirl]

18. can't say as I blame them

If I were homeless I'd want to kill the pain, too

[datasuspect]

20. we have a homeless drug addict who comes by in the afternoon to clean stuff at the shop

fridays, we get pizza.

our guy came through around 4:30 to do his thing.

we offered him some leftover pizza, told him to take the whole thing.

he ate what he was going to eat, let us know he was gonna take the rest so he could give it to "some of the homeless guys." his words.

it wasn't like we gave him anything special, but it touched me that he thought of others when he has absolutely nothing material himself.

but he has something money can't buy: humanity.

which is more than your post reveals about the condition of your soul.

[zaj]

26. Interesting collection of responses...

So my view is that about 1/2 or more of panhandling people are drug or alcoholics who will use the money I give them to first buy drugs and alcohol. And from what I can gather, that number is at least in the right ballpark.

Further, I make clear that my personal view is that I choose not to give my money to these people because more often than not, it's going to go to drugs or booze. Instead, I offer to buy them food. Because I I recognize their plight, but I don't want to be an enabler of the addiction, which giving them money most certainly does.

At the same time, I state clearly that I recognize that the social safety-net and mental health system need to be improved.

And in response to this collection of stated beliefs, I'm told that I display "righteous" "disgust", that I don't see a "person" but a "bum", and that I lack "humanity". That I'm a "bigot()", a "li(ar)", "cruel", with no "soul" or "humanity".

Holy crap.

I'm hardly doing any of the things ascribed to me. We disagree not on the substance of the issue, but on what the best technique is for solving the issue (and in truth, we barely disagree on that).

The hyperbolic reaction to my view is disappointing to say the least.

[Edweird]

14. They've done stuff like that here. They've 'improved' the benches so much nobody sits on them.

They suck. Metal mesh with no back and metal hoop dividers. Some of the ones in Dade are crappy 'swoopy' concrete monstrosities. Bus shelters are constantly being taken down and put back up. It's ridiculous.

[LooseWilly]

15. Obviously Santa Barbara just doesn't have the balls to just make all its benches face grim walls...

preferably grim cinderblock walls covered in rodent feces.

There is always the possibility that the poor or the homeless might use anything that is free... so it is the responsibility, clearly, of all municipalities to make everything free as uncomfortable as possible, lest the homeless or the poor should find a way to take advantage.

In fact, I think the rodent feces covered walls that all benches in every municipality in this Fine Upstanding God-Fearing Nation should also be covered in Huge Images of Graphic Pornography... but, because drug addicted homeless sinners might also be fans of pornography, all of the Graphic Public Pornography should be redacted with big black boxes... though, black might be too suggestive for the Redaction Boxes... perhaps with big fuschia boxes?

Anyway, the important thing, obviously, is that the poor and homeless should be made to suffer as horribly as possible, so, just to be sure, Santa Barbara should have its police force patrol the city benches facing the Fuschia redacted Pornography laden rodent feces covered walls... so that they can periodically and randomly billy club anyone sitting on a city bench from behind... though, upon further reflection, simply studding the benches with the spikes currently used to keep birds off of ledges might be enough to keep the homeless off the benches as well.

The important thing, obviously, is that those disposing of their excess wealth not be bothered by those who are in need of any wealth that can be spared.

[lostnfound]

19. Degrade public facilities..ho hum. That's the American solution. In a Paris park..

they had hundreds of the most lovely and comfortable chairs spread around a pond in a public park. I thought it was so civilized.

[Lucian]

24. Turning the benches isn't going to solve the homeless problem.

Those who came up with this idea are a bunch of idiots.

[Capitalocracy]

25. It's so stupid I find it hard to believe it's not money laundering.

Seriously, spending a bunch of money just to make homeless people slightly less comfortable? Guess what, take out all the benches, and the homeless people will sit on the floor, or stand. If people have no other income than begging, they'll beg no matter what direction you put the benches in. And this is so obvious that I can't believe anyone could possibly think this would help anything.

But hey, any expenditure other than actually helping the homeless is perfectly acceptable.