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whathehell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 07:06 AM Original message |
Morning Joe: Everyone talking and laughing openly about "need to cut Social Security and Medicare" |
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old mark (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 07:13 AM Response to Original message |
1. The "BIG LIE" - repeated over and over till it is believed by most people. |
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whathehell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 07:57 AM Response to Reply #1 |
16. Yes...and it's no accident that Raising the Cap |
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old mark (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 08:08 AM Response to Reply #16 |
19. I just found that organization last week, and joined it, too - |
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Capitalocracy (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 08:14 AM Response to Reply #16 |
22. Of course they never mention it! |
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Creative (831 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 07:43 PM Response to Reply #16 |
78. "Raising the Cap" has occurred on many occasions. |
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dkf (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 07:14 AM Response to Original message |
2. When you look at the budget that is where most of our spendng will be. |
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whathehell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 07:33 AM Response to Reply #2 |
4. Yes, and that's where it should be... |
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dkf (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 07:40 AM Response to Reply #4 |
7. That surplus was a gimmick to fund the Federal Government. |
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starroute (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 08:11 AM Response to Reply #7 |
21. These are Republican arguments that I'm really surprised to see at DU |
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whathehell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 08:30 AM Response to Reply #21 |
26. Thank you...My thoughts exactly. n/t |
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dkf (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 09:03 AM Response to Reply #21 |
35. You take a look at the returns of the bond market lately? |
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dkf (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 09:05 AM Response to Reply #21 |
36. You do realize that the Social security surplus was engineered by Reagan? |
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Divernan (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 02:27 PM Response to Reply #21 |
49. Agreed! That is why the soc. sec. program has been the 3rd rail all these years. |
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whathehell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 08:18 AM Response to Reply #7 |
23. Social Security is supposed to be a floor - not an investment fund |
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Divernan (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 02:21 PM Response to Reply #7 |
46. If Social Security owned stocks & bonds it would have been wiped out |
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Hannah Bell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 02:22 PM Response to Reply #7 |
47. why are you at DU? |
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Divernan (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 02:28 PM Response to Reply #47 |
50. My thoughts exactly. |
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bobbolink (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 02:39 PM Response to Reply #47 |
53. Because this attitude is now a strong element of the Democratic Party. |
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shanti (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 05:13 PM Response to Reply #47 |
70. she must be young |
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eridani (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 10:51 PM Response to Reply #7 |
86. Why do we need this Repuke horseshit on a Dem board? n/t |
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stray cat (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 07:44 AM Response to Reply #4 |
9. Is it wrong to have trump pay more for Medicare than someone at the poverty level? |
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whathehell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 10:45 AM Response to Reply #9 |
45. No and hell no. |
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Imajika (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 08:10 AM Response to Reply #4 |
20. You know there is no actual "surplus" right? |
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whathehell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 08:29 AM Response to Reply #20 |
25. IOUs that those who "borrowed" don't want to pay back?... |
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Imajika (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 08:47 AM Response to Reply #25 |
33. For decades now... |
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Divernan (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 02:35 PM Response to Reply #33 |
51. It has NOT been mixed with the general revenue. |
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Imajika (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 02:55 PM Response to Reply #51 |
54. Sure, they are legally binding... |
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Hosnon (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 03:34 PM Response to Reply #51 |
61. Franklin, not Teddy. nt. |
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Hannah Bell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 02:24 PM Response to Reply #20 |
48. there's just iou's in any kind of debt instrument. it doesn't prevent billionaires from "investing" |
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ljm2002 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 03:23 PM Response to Reply #20 |
59. "just IOU's"... |
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Hosnon (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 03:37 PM Response to Reply #59 |
62. But what's the practical difference? |
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ljm2002 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 04:37 PM Response to Reply #62 |
68. The difference is... |
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Hosnon (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 05:08 PM Response to Reply #68 |
69. Of course I'm not arguing that. But it is not at all like owing China or any other country. |
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ljm2002 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 05:20 PM Response to Reply #69 |
72. "The debt is to ourselves, which is really just an accounting trick." |
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Hosnon (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 05:27 PM Response to Reply #72 |
73. If I loan myself $100,000 by going into debt with myself for $100,000, and then |
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ljm2002 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 07:43 PM Response to Reply #73 |
77. So all that money that we sent in... |
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CTyankee (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 09:13 AM Response to Reply #4 |
39. And Joe and Mika KNOW BETTER! They have had many panelists on |
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whathehell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 09:17 AM Response to Reply #39 |
43. Yes....They and others like them are probably "part of the plan" |
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ljm2002 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 03:18 PM Response to Reply #4 |
58. "Social Security is NOT part of the Deficit!" |
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bobbolink (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 02:37 PM Response to Reply #2 |
52. Then be fucking honest about, it and provide easy and painless "exits" for those you would do |
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CTyankee (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 03:39 PM Response to Reply #2 |
63. But look at it this way: if the younger workers are saddled with taking care of |
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shanti (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 05:14 PM Response to Reply #63 |
71. divide and conquer |
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CTyankee (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 07:49 PM Response to Reply #71 |
79. but you really don't because the young will be saddled with their elderly |
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shanti (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 08:17 PM Response to Reply #79 |
80. oh i agree |
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CTyankee (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-21-10 01:54 AM Response to Reply #80 |
91. good question! I really don't know... |
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eridani (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 10:50 PM Response to Reply #2 |
85. So what? Productivity has gone up by a factor of FOUR since 1947 |
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redirish28 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 07:19 AM Response to Original message |
3. I told you people this was going to happen. That the Republicans |
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dkf (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 07:36 AM Response to Reply #3 |
5. Maybe they will make cola adjustments but that is about it. |
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madrchsod (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 07:37 AM Response to Reply #3 |
6. nope...you are right. |
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bluethruandthru (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 07:40 AM Response to Original message |
8. The repugs have worked hard to plant in the minds of most Americans |
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redirish28 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 07:47 AM Response to Reply #8 |
10. It is the Baby Boomers who will fight for social security. We are seeing |
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SoCalDem (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 07:55 AM Response to Reply #10 |
15. Be sure to remind them to not get old |
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whathehell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 08:25 AM Response to Reply #10 |
24. You are correct, Sir... |
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dkf (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 07:48 AM Response to Reply #8 |
11. My high school economics teacher told us this. |
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whathehell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 08:48 AM Response to Reply #11 |
34. Your high school economics teacher may have been a repuke |
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jtown1123 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 03:42 PM Response to Reply #34 |
64. Yeah, that teacher drank the CATO, Pete Peterson Koolaid. |
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YvonneCa (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 03:46 PM Response to Reply #11 |
65. Mine too. 1968. I grew up believing it 'could' become... |
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whathehell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 09:14 AM Response to Reply #8 |
41. It's true...but it seems to work better on generations younger than the Boomers |
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jtown1123 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 03:48 PM Response to Reply #41 |
66. I've always believed Social Security is the one issue that will get pple rioting on the streets. |
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whathehell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 08:39 PM Response to Reply #66 |
81. I think so...It's the "Third rail" in more ways than one. |
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former9thward (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 08:44 PM Response to Reply #66 |
82. Congress raised SS age from 65 to 67 in 1983. |
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whathehell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 09:45 PM Response to Reply #82 |
84. I think I speak for many when I say that... |
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former9thward (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-21-10 01:28 AM Response to Reply #84 |
90. I know, except one thing..., the Congress that raised it was our party..not Reagan. |
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whathehell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-21-10 02:51 AM Response to Reply #90 |
93. My understanding was that it was done to keep it solvent. n/t |
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former9thward (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-21-10 02:54 PM Response to Reply #93 |
95. Yes but that is exact same argument that will be used this time. |
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progressoid (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 07:49 AM Response to Original message |
12. There goes that darn liberal media again. |
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City Lights (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 07:53 AM Response to Original message |
13. Corporate masters manipulating their viewers. |
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whathehell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 08:36 AM Response to Reply #13 |
29. Yes....this is the second time I've seen it social security (in its present form) so openly attacked |
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SoCalDem (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 07:53 AM Response to Original message |
14. Zack Wamp (now there's a name for you) wants spending to go back to 2008 levels |
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CTyankee (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 08:42 AM Response to Reply #14 |
31. Zack revealed his true colors when he called Medicare and SS the "entitlement beast." |
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NNN0LHI (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 07:59 AM Response to Original message |
17. Andrew Sorkin a liberal? Lol |
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whathehell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 08:31 AM Response to Reply #17 |
27. You're point is taken. n/t |
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Vinca (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 07:59 AM Response to Original message |
18. Peggy Noonan ruined my breakfast with her cackling over cutting |
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whathehell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 08:38 AM Response to Reply #18 |
30. I would imagine they are getting a Huge influx of protest emails right now.. |
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The Wizard (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 08:34 AM Response to Original message |
28. Republicans ought to be careful |
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Skidmore (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 08:45 AM Response to Original message |
32. My response is as follows |
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whathehell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 09:07 AM Response to Reply #32 |
37. You betcha... |
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whathehell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 09:11 AM Response to Original message |
38. Important: Link to National Committee to Preserve Social Security & Medicare |
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Skidmore (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 09:13 AM Response to Reply #38 |
40. And the sooner the better. |
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jtown1123 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 03:03 PM Response to Reply #38 |
56. Thanks for sharing. They have a really active Facebook page too... |
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whathehell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 07:37 PM Response to Reply #56 |
76. Sure...and thanks for the FB page. |
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bullwinkle428 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 09:17 AM Response to Original message |
42. One only has to go back to Ike's famous letter to his brother, in which he states |
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whathehell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 10:31 AM Response to Reply #42 |
44. Love that quote.... |
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bobbolink (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 03:12 PM Response to Reply #44 |
57. You think it would matter if he heard it? |
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whathehell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 05:27 PM Response to Reply #57 |
74. Umm...... |
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eridani (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 11:41 PM Response to Reply #44 |
87. He doesn't give a shit. He'd jsut as soon that old sick people without money |
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whathehell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-21-10 02:49 AM Response to Reply #87 |
92. You're being sarcastic, right? |
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eridani (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-21-10 02:59 AM Response to Reply #92 |
94. Yes and no. Sarcasm re the prez. However, he is perfectly willing to "compromise" |
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zalinda (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 03:03 PM Response to Original message |
55. Not Andrew, but Aaron Sorkin (West Wing) is the liberal. n/t |
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CTyankee (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 03:49 PM Response to Reply #55 |
67. I dunno...Andrew got a scathing remark aimed at him by Peggy Noonan this a.m. |
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marew (854 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 08:58 PM Response to Reply #67 |
83. You've got that right. |
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whathehell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 05:29 PM Response to Reply #55 |
75. Yep....I see the point of confusion. Thanks. n/t |
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librechik (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Dec-20-10 03:23 PM Response to Original message |
60. Play out? The rich will be stepping over the lame &dead in the streets as they step into their limos |
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JamesA1102 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-21-10 12:02 AM Response to Original message |
88. Joey was talking about "Middle class" entitlements |
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whathehell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Dec-21-10 01:13 AM Response to Reply #88 |
89. I like your quote "you can't maintain a middle class democracy with a millionaire press corps". n/t |
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