Report: Unit Killed Hundreds in Vietnam

[Rose Siding]

TOLEDO, Ohio -- An elite unit of American soldiers mutilated and killed hundreds of unarmed villagers over seven months in 1967 during the Vietnam War, and an Army investigation was closed with no charges filed, The Blade reported Sunday.

Soldiers of the Tiger Force unit of the Army's 101st Airborne Division dropped grenades into bunkers where villagers -- including women and children -- hid, and shot farmers without warning, the newspaper reported. Soldiers told The Blade that they severed ears from the dead and strung them on shoelaces to wear around their necks.

The Army's 4 1/2-year investigation, never before made public, was initiated by a soldier outraged at the killings. The probe substantiated 20 war crimes by 18 soldiers and reached the Pentagon and White House before it was closed in 1975, The Blade said.

William Doyle, a former Tiger Force sergeant now living in Willow Springs, Mo., said he killed so many civilians in 1967 he lost count.

"We didn't expect to live. Nobody out there with any brains expected to live," he told the newspaper. "The way to live is to kill because you don't have to worry about anybody who's dead."

more....................................

http://www.newsday.com/news/nationworld/wire/sns-ap-vietnam-soldiers-rampage,0,834097.story?coll=sns-ap-nationworld-headlines

[Barrett808]

1. And we have the chance to go back the good old days in Iraq

We've already started the collective punishment dance...mass detentions and the destruction of whole villages to follow.

[IndianaGreen]

2. I would like to know who the commander was

and I also want to know if Colin Powell was involved in this coverup as he was in the My Lai massacre.

It almost reads like one of the stories coming out of Iraq nowadays.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

8. Former Commanders, 101st Airborne Division...

<http://www.campbell.army.mil/formercdrs.htm>

[Media_Lies_Daily]

10. Speaking of Colin Powell, here's an article by David Corn on My Lai...

Colin Powell's Vietnam Fog
<http://www.thenation.com/doc.mhtml?i=20010514&s=corn20010502>

Excerpts:

"...In reviewing Colin Powell's military service recently, I found that Powell had his own trouble in setting the record straight on his involvement--tangential as it was--in one of the war's more traumatic episodes."

...snip...

"As Powell notes in his 1995 autobiography, My American Journal, in 1969 he was an Army major, the deputy operations officer of the Americal Division, stationed at division headquarters in Chu Lai."

The Americal Division was the 23rd Infantry Division:

23rd Infantry Division (Americal)
<http://www.vietnamvetcontacts.com/gpage12.html>

Excerpts continued from Corn's article:

"Powell flipped through the records and came upon an entry from March 16, 1968. The journal noted that a unit of the division had reported a body count of 128 enemy dead on the Batangan Peninsula."

...snip...

"It would not be until two years later (according to the orginal version of Powell's book) or six months later (according to the paperbck version of the book) that Powell figured out that the IG official had been probing what was then a secret, the My Lai massacre. Not until the fall of 1969 did the world learned that on March 16, 1968, troops from the Americal Division, under the command of Lieut. William Calley, killed scores of men, women and children in that hamlet. 'Subsequent investigation revealed that Calley and his men killed 347 people,' Powell writes. 'The 128 enemy -kills- I had found in the journal formed part of the total.'

Though he does not say so expressly, Powell leaves the impression that the IG investigation, using information provided by Powell, uncovered the massacre, for which Calley was later court-martialed. That is not accurate.

The transcript of the tape-recorded interview between the IG man--Lieut. Col. William Sheehan--and Powell tells a different story."

...snip...

"Powell did not find in the journals any evidence suggesting something terribly amiss had happened in My Lai. No suspicious numbers of enemy killed, such as the 128 figure he recounts in his memoirs. The official records merely reflected what Powell had referred to as "a hot combat assault" during the IG interview. Seven weeks later, the MACV IG recommended that the case be closed, but a Pentagon IG investigation was already under way, and the Army's Criminal Investigation Division was soon pursuing an inquiry. The matter could not be smothered, and in November of 1969, journalist Seymour Hersh exposed C Company's massacre of civilians at My Lai.

There had been attempts at cover-up. Prior to Ridenhour's letter, the Army promoted the story that C Company had killed 128 VC and captured three weapons in the March 16 action. (Note the 128 figure--which Powell, in his memoirs, uses in describing the number of enemy kills he supposedly found in the journals. In his book, he is repeating the cover story, not recalling what was actually in the journal.) And information pertaining to My Lai disappeared from the Americal Division's files. A military review panel--convened after the Hersh stories to determine why the initial investigations did not uncover the truth of My Lai--found that senior officers of the Americal Division had destroyed evidence to protect their comrades. Powell keeps that out of his account.

Powell has never been implicated in any of the wrongdoing involving My Lai. No evidence ties him to the attempted cover-up. But he was part of an institution (and a division) that tried hard to keep the story of My Lai hidden--a point unacknowledged in his autobiography. Moreover, several months before he was interviewed by Sheehan, Powell was ordered to look into allegations made by another former GI that US troops had "without provocation or justification" killed civilians. (These charges did not mention My Lai specifically.) Powell mounted a most cursory examination. He did not ask the accuser for more specific information. He interviewed a few officers and reported to his superiors that there was nothing to the allegations . This exercise is not mentioned in his memoirs."

[methinks2]

3. No excuses

for this type of behaviour.

[proud patriot]

4. I'm glad it's being talked about

My uncle has similar stories of WAR ..

[TahitiNut]

5. That was scuttlebutt when I was there in '69.

We'd occasionally see a 101st-er with (what looked like) ears tied on his belt. Welcome to a mere echo of 'nam. :eyes:

[DemoTex]

12. The 'Nam ... oh, the 'Nam.

Keeps on giving. Ruining. Propping up. Fucking up. If you were in the 'Nam as a young man or woman, good chance is that thoughts of the place still dominate your life. If they don't, you are lucky. Believe me. These stories of the 101st have haunted me for years. I have seen pictures of the young troops with VC/NVA ears - or maybe they were monkey ears, I don't know - as TahitiNut described. But I also recognize the thousand yard stare on their faces. However, one doesn't usually get the thousand yard stare from offing monkeys.

[coralrf]

16. I killed many...

what are you speaking of?

[saigon68]

19. Still haunts me to this day

I remember the smell mostly--- 95 friggin degrees and dozens of bloated decomposing cong and NVA bodies covered with lime in the drainage ditches of the French Foreign Legion cemetery in Cholon in May 1968. The May offensive or mini-Tet. They took weeks to clean up the bodies. During this time the souvenir hunters stripped belts, cartridge belts, map cases, ears, etc from the bodies, It was a sweet sickly smell.

[TahitiNut]

22. Fur sure ...

... some of these guys were the ones who manned the inner perimeter around the Generals' compound adjacent to our (HQ) unit at Long Binh. That stare creeped out every one of us ... until we'd been there through a few rocket attacks and seen barracks get blown up. After a while, it made a surreal sense. Some of us found ourselves crossing that great divide.

One of the reasons "Grand Canyon" is one of my favorite movies is my experience in 'Nam and afterwards. Such canyons still divide us.

[Bandit]

28. Haven't seen you around for a while ~ Glad you are still here

:thumbsup:

[Bandit]

27. It wasn't just 101st ~ 1st Cav was pretty barbaric also

I actually witnessed ears being cut off and bodies being booby-trapped so when they came to claim their dead they were blown to bits. Americans are a very Barbaric People. I know no one wishes to believe their countrymen could behave in such a manner but it was not rare by any means. War truly is hell.

[soupkitchen]

6. God Bless America

[dfong63]

7. but wait!

just think of how many of that "elite unit" took FOUR BULLETS FOR THEIR COUNTRY. that makes it all ok, right?

[NNN0LHI]

9. Why do they hate us? n/t

[RamboLiberal]

11. I posted link on editorials to the first of 4 part series on this

The first section is extensive, took up several pages of the sister newspaper to Toledo Blade - Pittsburgh Post Gazette this morning. My posting go no reply from you DU'ers. Go read the links here and reply please.

I'll post each day's links over there.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=103&topic_id=17068

[coralrf]

13. This is probably bullshit...

authored by a guy that filled out forms during his tour.

Yes the American soldier can be a pig and a brute but this is apocalypse now shit. None of this is believable to a veteran of that war as we know the flavor is all wrong.

Ears were cut off VC to instill horror. Usually the ears were nailed up to a tree..NEVER worn or advertised. The Vietnamese have a strong belief that a body not buried whole is doomed to an after life similar to that Christians see in Limbo. The idea was to put the ear on a tree somewhere so that the shock value could be had. A Viet Cong that saw it might have strong religious beliefs and hence be weakened by the fear of such a thing happening to him. As we found out...it does not work like that.

If a soldier was taken with ears around his neck or belt he could be assured a horrible death. The VC knew well how to do that. You would probably spend months dying of repeated amputation or slowly be skinned alive. You would probably be forced to watch a friend die such a death first.

Let me give you some examples of what a good old American do.

IN 1971 the US base at Chu Lai had suffered a huge decimation from a typhoon and was shortly overrun by the VC. I had been on a 30 day recon outing and returned to what was left. I found some old ARVN hooches still standing and while trying to find a place to rest heard the sounds of a woman screaming. It was late and dark but I followed the noise to a hooch that was in good shape. In it an American GI had a Vietnamese girl pinned to the ground with his knees on her shoulders. Women were not allowed in bases at night but often came under the wire to make money as prostitutes. Chu Lai was ransacked and no rules were being enforced. This girl, probably 16 or so was screaming as the asshole on her was trying to force her to perform oral sex on her. The Vietnamese are not into that at all.

I approached the guy from the rear and cracked him on the top of his head with the flash suppressor of my M16. When he turned I stuck the weapon in his face and made him suck the barrel. I kept taunting him with “I am going to pull the trigger fucker" crap for a few minutes then pushed the weapon into his mouth so hard he went unconscious. I took the girl to SSgt Johnson, the hooch maid honcho and he cleaned her up and got her back to her family.

I saw a 70 year old woman raped in Da Naang, an old man's Water Buffalo killed just for the fun of it. You must remember that animal is his life. I saw an old woman used for target practice with a LAWS rocket and so on and so on.

The crap you usually hear , like this, seems bullshit to me.

[DemoTex]

14. Old CoralReef?

Otherwise, were you there?

[coralrf]

15. I was there...

nt

[DemoTex]

17. Welcome home

nt

[NNN0LHI]

18. I don't want to believe people can do that shit n/t

[DemoTex]

20. Nor do I, Don

I think there were individual soldiers and rogue units doing these things. Unfortunately, the 101st and the Americal (My Lai) Divisions came out looking bad. 'Course the Americal looked pretty good while Maj. Colin Powell was doing the damage control. What a guy. What a study. What a talent. The magic worked again with Iran/Contra. Will it ever turn to shit on the liar?

[TahitiNut]

24. That's one of the reasons it wasn't "the world".

A sane mind has great difficulty assimilating the surreal.

[dArKeR]

21. 'Vietnam was 30 years ago' - Sunday refused to reopen an investigation

Washington - The US defence department on Sunday refused to reopen an investigation into suspected atrocities committed in Vietnam by a special US Army reconnaissance unit, despite new allegations of war crimes, including ghastly killings and torture of Vietnamese civilians.

"Absent new and compelling evidence, there are no plans to reopen the case," a Pentagon official told reporters. "The case is more than 30 years old."

The statement came in response to an independent probe of the activities of so-called Tiger Force undertaken by The Toledo Blade newspaper both in the United States and Vietnam over the past eight months.

http://www.news24.com/News24/World/News/0,,2-10-1462_1432889,00.html

[bobthedrummer]

23. It wasn't just that unit, my cousin brought back ear necklaces and scalps

from his two tours {26 months} as a Marine 1966-68. He shared this with me in an influential way to convince me not to go and I didn't serve. This was not an isolated practice among US combat units, not many prisoners were taken by either side and mutilation was common to both sides.

[TahitiNut]

25. Anyone caught bringing back such souven-ears ...

... would (allegedly) be spending a great deal of time at Ft. Leavenworth.

[bobthedrummer]

29. Marines are resourceful, they can improvise

and I assure you I saw my cousin's trophies, the ears had a lot of salt and stuff on them to preserve them, they were in an ammo box.

[TahitiNut]

30. Oh I don't doubt a lot of guys got 'contraband' back home.

Although I never opened my footlocker ever again once it was shipped home (it was discarded by my family, with my blessing, back around 1981), I vaguely recall I had a few things in it that'd be considered "questionable".

[saigon68]

31. Earlier in the war it was easier

Then they decided to start the WAR on drugs.

I remember the first Drug test in 1969-- it was degrading. 3 people had to watch you urinate in a bottle, the neck of which was very tiny.

I wondered at the time what kind of freedom was I fighting for--so i could piss in a bottle?

Needless to say I got the fuck out--- leaving them with the thought ---- they could take the bottle and shove it up their ass.

[kayell]

26. Author removed

[peacetalksforall]

32. Everything about Vietnam makes me cry...

Everything about Iraq makes me cry...

When ill-intentioned 'leaders' send previously innocent youth to do their killing, death is the great equalizer of the human race. Anyone who calls themselves superior to anyone else sharing this earth is a joke.

Lime, sand, or box...it's all the same.