NYT: Fissures Grow on Eve of Bush Speech on Iraq

[laststeamtrain]

Fissures Grow on Eve of Bush Speech on Iraq
By DAVID STOUT

WASHINGTON, Jan. 9 -- On the eve of President Bush’s planned speech on Iraq, both the White House and a prominent Democratic critic of the president said the United States was at a decisive moment, not just in Iraq but in American history.

“Iraq is the central front in the war on terror,” the White House spokesman, Tony Snow, said today. “Why is it important? What does it mean? What can success breed? What does failure mean?”

These are not just political questions, Mr. Snow said, but ones that will bear on America’s security and its image of itself for years to come.

But Senator Edward M. Kennedy of Massachusetts, long one of the most outspoken critics of the administration’s Iraq policy, said it was time for Congress to reclaim its rightful power to decide whether the United States goes to war.

“That war is the overarching issue of our time, and American lives, American values and America’s role in the world are all at stake,” Mr. Kennedy said today in a speech at the National Press Club, where he called his vote against the war in 2002 “the best vote I’ve cast in my 44 years in the United States Senate.”

The new Democratic Congressional leaders, Senator Harry Reid of Nevada and House Speaker Nancy Pelosi of California, have already voiced their opposition to sending more combat troops to Iraq.

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http://www.nytimes.com/2007/01/09/washington/10speechcnd.html?ei=5089&en=06bfbae5da5633ee&ex=1325998800&partner=rssyahoo&emc=rss&pagewanted=print

[monmouth]

1. Was glad to hear the Senator received a standing ovation..

[midnight]

11. HE DID? THATS FABULOUS.

LET US CONTINUE THOSE STANDING OVATIONS FOR ALL THE COURAGES PATRIOTS THAT STAND UP AND SAY-HELL NO. BRING THEM HOME-NOW!!!!!!!!!!

[Bitwit1234]

2. Why are Americans all of a sudden supposed to be

so damn scared. I am 74 years old...and I remember vividly during the second world war how patriotic and BRAVE Americans were. Pearl Harbor had been attacked and there was all that destruction. We did not know if the Japanese were capable of attacking us. We had blackouts. Were we covered our windows and turned out the lights. We had rationing were we had only a pitance of meat. No sugar, no butter and the women didn't even get silk stockings. We survived. We pitched in and we did not quake in our boots.

What in the hell is wrong with the people today. I know..We have an administration that lambasts us daily with the terrorist will get you. The terrorist are coming. Terror alert. Bomb Alert.

DURING THE SECOND WORLD WAR WE HAD A PRESIDENT WHO TOLD US"""THE ONLY THING TO FEAR IS FEAR ITSELF"..This crap who stole the white house is telling us BE AFRAID...BE AFRAID BE AFRAID OF EVERYTHING. WHAT'S THE DIFFERENCE...THE SCAREDY CAT IS A REPUBLICAN WHO RAN AND HID WHEN HE WAS SUPPOSED TO BE FIGHTING TO DEFEND HIS COUNTRY.

[La_Fourmi_Rouge]

4. Yes!

These people have been promoting the climate of fear since 9/11 and unfortunately alot of people have allowed themselves to be influenced. The propaganda machine worked very, very well leading into the IWR. Will it work now? Only time will tell...

[Catch22Dem]

7. RIGHT ON!

Would love to buy you a beer!

[Hekate]

12. Absolutely right. After 9-11 I was aghast at Bush's message of fear and shopping

All fear all the time, and for a change of pace, selling Hummers at a discount. It made me sick to watch it.

My country had been attacked! I wanted to know what to do that made sense, I wanted a sense of participation, and I wanted my leaders to buck up my courage. The country got none of this.

What with crimes by Bushco too numerous to mention here, I am now a good deal more afraid of my own government than I am of the terrorists. And the lies about the air quality in New York after 9-11 plus the abandonment of New Orleans after Katrina, the message I get from Bushco is "You're on your own, suckers."

Bush-Cheney-Gonzales-Ashcroft-Rummy-Rove -- what a loathsome bunch.

Hekate

[colorado_ufo]

40. Well said!

This has been my feeling from the start. And the ones who sing, "the land of the free and the home of the brave" the loudest are the same ones who would sell their freedom and their Bill of Rights for a pittance of imaginary protection.

[Tracer]

42. It's my belief that the fear-mongerers ....

... only expanded on the pervasive "fear" of everything that dominates newscasts.

Every day we get bombarded with stories on obesity, smoking, seat-belts, trans fats, bike helmets, sexual predators, air pollution, drunk driving, kidnappers, child safety seats, disease ---- on and on and on.

These have had an enormous effect on 'murkins and their propensity for believing themselves at risk for just about everything.

[ninkasi]

3. The power mad monkey

will clearly ignore the will of the people, common sense, and anything else that challenges his will. It's absurd to say that Iraq was such a threat to our country, that unless Bush was given his war, our democracy would collapse. If that had been the case, then we were a much weaker country than I thought.

Now, after years of this ill-advised occupation, we are developing cracks in our democracy. The chimperor has used the threat of terrorism to remove many of our Constitutional rights, and to go to a place I never thought I'd see...an America that tortures people deemed by Chimp as "enemies". He has claimed for himself the right to have people picked up from anywhere in the world, sent to secret prisons, tortured, and all of this can happen without any charges being brought, or even for the person imprisoned to know what they were supposed to have done.

He is a power-mad sociopath, who has taken for himself the role of dictator. His "surge" will consist of more loss of life on both sides, and for our troops to come home, maimed in body, or mind, or both. He is grinding our military into the dust, and spending our treasury to further enrich his cronies. This whole thing is illegal, immoral, and inexcusable. No surge! Get our troops home now. Impeach Bush and Cheney for starters, and take it from there.

[Xipe Totec]

5. What does failure mean?!!

Failure means Dubya screwed up big time.

Failure means he put our country in harm's way.

Failure means he needs to resign, or be impeached if necessary.

Failure means he is not God's chosen one.

Failure means God really wasn't coaching him as he claims.

Failure means he lied.

[Harper_is_Bush]

6. "he does understand that it's important to bring the public back to this war"

I can't even imagine what that means. Bring the public back to the war?

Does he mean dumb people down, again?

[Straight Shooter]

8. Why does Snow talk to us like we're children? Why is he so patronizing? Why is he such an idiot?

I can't tell Snow what success can breed, but I would be happy to advise Snow that his parents bred failure when they conceived him.

I enjoyed watching "Scotty-Mouth" McClellan lie, he had the good sense to appear humble and he spoke intelligently, but Snow is downright insufferable.

[EFerrari]

9. And that's a good thing for us. Let him be as tone deaf as possible.

It only makes the WH lack of regard for the American people more and more clear.

[Rosa Luxemburg]

10. Pulling out from Iraq will make America gain support from other countries

The US will gain more support and respect from other countries to fight terrorists if it pulls out from Iraq. Bush increased the amount of terrorists/insurgents a thousandfold! Does he want to create more?

[Heidi]

13. Kick. (nt)

[DeepModem Mom]

14. CNN: Tony Snow: Democrats "have to make a choice" about Iraq success and support for troops

Snow: Dems 'have to make a choice'

WASHINGTON (CNN) -- As congressional Democrats consider various responses to President Bush's prime-time address on the way forward in Iraq, White House Press Secretary Tony Snow said Tuesday they must decide how they foresee Iraq succeeding and how they will express their support for U.S. forces in the war-torn country.

"Democrats are going to have to make a choice here," Snow told reporters during the White House daily briefing. "They're going to have to decide where they stand in terms of two issues. No. 1: do you want Iraq to succeed and if so what does that mean, and No. 2: do you believe in supporting the troops, as you say, and how do you express that support."

Snow also said the president will acknowledge the conditions in Iraq have significantly declined in the last year.

"In early 2006 there was a sense of optimism, but guess what?," Snow said. "The terrorists did succeed in unleashing sectarian violence, and now that has created a new set of realities that one must contend with. And the president will talk about that."

http://www.cnn.com/POLITICS/blogs/politicalticker/2007/01/snow-dems-have-to-make-choice.html

[powergirl]

15. Choose this, Tony

geeez. I thought the war was going GREAT and it was the mean ole' media only reporting the bad times. BUH BYE!:wtf:

[aquart]

16. Aww, he's trying to frame the debate. Too late.

Winning in Iraq is not an option. It is not one of the choices. Do we throw good money after bad? Do we sacrifice more our soldiers? To do what? There is no other mission but to kill Iraqi citizens. Is that what we want our army to be doing?

[mike_c]

17. more "terrorist" bullshit....

I hope congressional dems don't buy into this BS.

[opiate69]

18. WTF??

"The Terrorists have succeeded in unleashing sectarian violence" What. The.Fuck??? I'm not sure what scares me the most.. that Snowjob believes this, or that a considerable portion of our population will.

[mallard]

33. Re: WTF - no kidding

"'The Terrorists have succeeded in unleashing sectarian violence...'"

Big T for Terrorist:

These People were definitely NOT all 'Terrorists' before a foreign military invasion and occupation were conducted by miscue and complete calculated deception.

Disbanding the Iraqi forces was an easy formula for fueling a dedicated resistance. Without this fabricated (though real) enemy, Bushwar-Iraq, Inc would practically be out of business. They've toatally compelled the war strategy form (and even before) 9/11.

How the world's changed in the W years and not coincidentally now that the Islamist Terrorists are there to (for sure) keep this Neocon team running our 'show'. Makes it almost seem like a symbiotic relationship or something going on between the two radical and violence-prone sides.

Deciding to go right downtown to Haifa Street with a sweep right after the Saddam execution is more violent than necessary, seems racist, definitely bloody and even more barbaric right on cue with those accusations coming in from around the world.

Barbaric Bush!

TY

[MannyGoldstein]

19. Tony Snow is A Really, Really Awful Person

Sorry, I'm not feeling clever tonight - nothing clever to say, other than he's an evil prick.

[lovuian]

20. I think we chose get out of Iraq talk about NOT GETTING IT

Tony the choice has been made but your not listening to the American people


just doing your agenda

[Solly Mack]

21. How is sending the troops to die and kill for lies on top of lies

and trumped up evidence "supporting the troops" exactly?

Spare me the bullshit, Snow.

Sending troops to die for lies is NOT supporting the troops.

[provis99]

22. Snow makes me miss Scott McClellan

because at least McClellan gave me the impression when he was behind the podium that he new what he was spouting was just bullshit; he was just Bush's interference runner and knew it. Snow seems to think he's some kind of superstar, not the Bush lackey that he really is. Oh well, he's still better than that arrogant prick Ari Fleischer (met Fleischer in person, and he's a bigger dick in person than he was at press briefings)

[Straight Shooter]

23. CNN panders to bush's new slogan, "the way forward"

Snow is pathetic. He actually uses childish phrases like, "but guess what?"

Good gawd. He really does believe the American public is as dumb as his boss.

[Cha]

24. Quit Lying, tony mcsnowjob.

And the Dems don't have to do a goddamn thing you say.

[Lucky Luciano]

25. We made our choice asshole (Snow)! nt

[HuffleClaw]

26. 'the terrorists' BAH.

from the same press conference: "...If you have an Iraq, with the world's second largest oil reserves, capable of generating incredible amounts of revenue that terrorists can use both to blackmail the West and also to purchase weapons that can be used against anybody else, that creates a situation that's a direct threat to us..."


so... ...it IS about the oil.

[valerief]

27. I am so sick of that SnowTurd. nt

[yellowcanine]

28. Haven't they played this tune several times already? It's getting old, Tony. Find a new song.

[rodeodance]

39. I had the sence yest. as I listen to Snow that lots of what he

said would be in the speech

[ShockediSay]

29. &#3-Do you want to aid Terrorists by disagreeing w/ our [incompetent,

chicken hawk]President?

That's what called begging a question, if not outright buggery.

PS Bush couldn't lead a one-car motorcade

[cascadiance]

30. NO! Snow and Bush NEED to define what "succeeding" in Iraq means!

We've already said on many occasions how we want to support the troops.

1) Bring them home!
2) Take care of them with VA benefits and the like!

But as far as we are concerned, there IS NO success to be obtained staying in Iraq. Snow, why the hell do you think we KEEP TELLING YOU ALL that we should never have been there to start with if we though there was any room for "success"!

YOU are the ones that are saying we should stay there to "succeed" or "win"! It's up to YOU to define what that means if you are the ones that are advocating that there is something to "win" over there! Not Us! Quit shirking your responsibilities, jerks! Go back and take salesmanship 101! We don't live deciding things Hobson's way like you all do!

[Erika]

31. Snow's a freeper blow hard

His credibility has taken a nose dive since he became the spokesliar for W.

[Grateful for Hope]

32. Extreme desperation n/t

[JawJaw]

34. "Guess What?" Tony Snow

The lies ain't workin' anymore.

You know it.
We know it.
The rest of the world knows it.

(in fact we've all known it was BS since day one, but President Cheney just had to have his war didn't he)?

Like all the other Neocon rats, your choice is "do you jump now, or later"?

[Clyde39]

35. It's difficult watching his very arrogant "performance"

More than any other press secretary in my lifetime, I find him by far, the most "poisonous".

[and-justice-for-all]

36. Give it a rest Snow....

..DEMS have to decide my ass! His has no power here and neither does ShrubCo's. fearmongering bullshit.

DEMS better cut that funding off at the knees.

[OneBlueSky]

37. send Cheney to Baghdad with a shotgun . . . n/t

.

[rodeodance]

38. I wonder if he realizes how LOW he gone since taking over the

parrot job???

[donkeyotay]

43. False choices, and no, bush is the one who needs to define terms.

False choice #1: Do you want Iraq to succeed? Oh hell, yeah. Remember when bush was going to give them health care and jobs and everything but library cards? I want Iraq to all live happily ever after. I want them to all have swimming pools and drive big cars. How's that for a definition?

False choice #2: "Do you believe in supporting the troops, as you say", said the snotty spin mister from FOX, "and how do you express that support." Meaning, let us keep waging this incredible fiasco for as long as we like or we'll beat you with the dems-are-soft-on-terra stick. I expressed the deepest form of support for our troops when I demanded that the president make his factual case for sending them to "defend" us. Why warmongering and incompetence are defined as support, I do not know.

[indepat]

41. All I ask is W be neither duplicitous, reichous nor mendacious and neither sound delusional

nor megalomaniacal. :D