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inanna Donating Member (672 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 08:43 AM
Original message
AP study finds $1.6B went to bailed-out bank execs
Source: AP

Banks that are getting taxpayer bailouts awarded their top executives nearly $1.6 billion in salaries, bonuses, and other benefits last year, an Associated Press analysis reveals.

The rewards came even at banks where poor results last year foretold the economic crisis that sent them to Washington for a government rescue. Some trimmed their executive compensation due to lagging bank performance, but still forked over multimillion-dollar executive pay packages.

Benefits included cash bonuses, stock options, personal use of company jets and chauffeurs, home security, country club memberships and professional money management, the AP review of federal securities documents found.

The total amount given to nearly 600 executives would cover bailout costs for many of the 116 banks that have so far accepted tax dollars to boost their bottom lines.


Read more: http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/E/EXECUTIVE_BAILOUTS?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2008-12-21-08-26-26
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BR_Parkway Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 08:47 AM
Response to Original message
1. If we can't take it back from them, can we pass a law and tax it at 110%?
Edited on Sun Dec-21-08 08:48 AM by BR_Parkway
This is so outrageous

Give them the toxic mortgage products as a bonus like CreditSuisse did - pays their bonuses so there's no contract default, gets it off the banks books as bad money and puts it right back in the hands of those who felt no risk from the decisions they made. Let them pay for it, not us.

On edit - 10 times that much protected how many millions of auto industry jobs? not just 6,000 bankers - I can understand why they're increasing spending on personal security
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Thor_MN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 10:30 AM
Response to Reply #1
22. No, give it to them as their entire compensation.
Not just as a bonus, pay them their regular salary in mortgage derivatives and dirivatives of derivatives.
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Callalily Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 08:47 AM
Response to Original message
2. Huh . . . what happened to
the checks and balances, to avoid such practices.

I'm not surprised though.
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DogPoundPup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 09:34 AM
Response to Reply #2
11. Loophole guts bailout restrictions on executive pay
Dec. 15, 2008, 4:55AM http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/front/6165162.html

~~~But at the last minute, the Bush administration insisted on a one-sentence change to the provision, congressional aides said. The change stipulated that the penalty would apply only to firms that received bailout funds by selling troubled assets to the government in an auction, which was the way the Treasury Department had said it planned to use the money.

Now, however, the small change looks more like a giant loophole, according to lawmakers and legal experts. In a reversal, the Bush administration has not used auctions for any of the $335 billion committed so far from the rescue package, nor does it plan to use them in the future. Lawmakers and legal experts say the change has effectively repealed the only enforcement mechanism in the law dealing with lavish pay for top executives.
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Deny and Shred Donating Member (453 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 11:07 AM
Response to Reply #11
31. Thanks for the article, DogPP. Confirmation of a pure rip-off.
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sarcasmo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 10:19 AM
Response to Reply #2
17. It will go down as the biggest swindle in American History, they never wanted any
Checks and balances, so the top dogs could still get paid.
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RUMMYisFROSTED Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 10:26 AM
Response to Reply #17
19. Check that...
It will go down as the biggest swindle in American World History...
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slipslidingaway Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 11:07 AM
Response to Reply #17
30. "...they never wanted any checks and balances..."
yet to some people it sounded good while they were talking.

:(







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sarcasmo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 11:11 AM
Response to Reply #30
32. You won't see "Thank God it passed" reply to this thread.
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slipslidingaway Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 12:05 PM
Response to Reply #32
37. Here it is, posted below...
"Thank GOD it passed!!!! Dumb fucks."

:)
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Callalily Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 11:18 AM
Response to Reply #17
33. Sad to say, but I think
that you are right. Those of us that work our bums off, try to do the right thing, continually get screwed.
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FreakinDJ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 08:48 AM
Response to Original message
3. No Reward for Corrupt Bankers
That money needs to be returned immediately

Write Congress and Senate NOW and DEMAND they return that money NOW
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natrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 09:05 AM
Response to Reply #3
8. r u serious? write the congress that enabled all this-this is class war and we are losing badly
hard to accept but being in denial is kind of stupid
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FreakinDJ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 09:07 AM
Response to Reply #8
9. Did not the Bill have provisions to reduce Exec pay
are they being enforced?

I don't think apathy is the answer
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RUMMYisFROSTED Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 10:27 AM
Response to Reply #9
21. See #11
Edited on Sun Dec-21-08 10:28 AM by RUMMYisFROSTED
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polichick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 08:50 AM
Response to Original message
4. Rachel has been having the Harvard professor who's on the brand new oversight...
...committee on her show ~ she is shocked and disturbed about the fact that there are so few records of what has been done with the money, and zero strategy.

Exactly how the voters called it.
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soothsayer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 08:56 AM
Response to Reply #4
5. ...and exactly how paulson intended it
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polichick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 10:37 AM
Response to Reply #5
25. Yep - it was criminal, and our Congresscritters sold us out.
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depakid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 08:57 AM
Response to Original message
6. Not the brightest moves...
Thumbing their noses at the incoming Obama administration and a large Democratic majority in Congress.
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awoke_in_2003 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 10:59 AM
Response to Reply #6
29. a democratically controlled congress...
let them do this in the first place. Face it, there are maybe 5 people in DC that actually do the job they are elected to. The rest are bought and paid for.
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depakid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 06:38 PM
Response to Reply #29
51. Completely different with 58-9 Senators and a Dem president
controlling the administartive agencies (including the Justice Department and the IRS).

Actions like these are golden goose killers- and going after the callous execs is worth too much political capital to simply let pass.

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awoke_in_2003 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-22-08 03:20 PM
Response to Reply #51
61. I don't buy it...
Edited on Mon Dec-22-08 03:21 PM by awoke_in_2003
for 6 years democrats claimed they couldn't do anything because they wree the minority party. 2 years ago they gained control, and what have they done? Don't want to hear about need a fillibuster proof majority, even if they get it they will still be intimidated by the republicans. Why does it seem that only the GOP is cabable of pushing its agenda whether in power or as the minority?

on edit: the GOP was able to repeatedly squash fillibuster talk, yet we can't?
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pattmarty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 08:59 AM
Response to Original message
7. Ya know, I blame the Dems in this also. They have the majorities.......
......in the house and senate and SHOULD HAVE put a lot more oversight in the bill. I really like Barney Frank, but on this bailout thing I fault him and Dodd. Look at the "auto bailout" and they want the UAW members to give up their first born, wives, houses AND jobs.
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natrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 09:08 AM
Response to Reply #7
10. come on face it they are crooks almost worse than republicans
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ThisThreadIsSatire Donating Member (697 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 10:11 AM
Response to Reply #10
15. Semantic Nit-Picking
How many of them do you think are democrats? O.K. maybe a couple, but for the vast majority, they're not 'worse than Republicans', they're 'the worst of the Republicans'.

Sorry if the thought causes nightmares.
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slipslidingaway Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 10:02 AM
Response to Reply #7
12. I do as well...and in the end more Republicans voted against the
financial bill.

What was demanded of the auto companies and workers vs. the financial companies was
telling.


Senate vote
http://www.govtrack.us/congress/vote.xpd?vote=s2008-213

House vote
http://www.govtrack.us/congress/vote.xpd?vote=h2008-681

Bill summary
http://www.govtrack.us/congress/bill.xpd?bill=h110-1424



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acmavm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 10:38 AM
Response to Reply #7
26. You're absolutely right. The dems are right there participating in the biggest,
most blatant theft of a nation's assets probably since the beginning of civilized society began. Our representatives opened the doors to the Treasury and to our government to the lying bastards who cheated and gambled everyone into this mess. And the current administration sat on the news and let the sitution worsen until we got to where we are today.

I was canvassing for Obama at that time. His support of the bailout almost made me say fuck it, who cares. I wrote my reps not to vote for it, I have since written Ben Nelson asking how the bail out was working for him, but I got no answer.

A fence should be erected around Washington D.C. and guards stationed all around it. And if those clowns tried to get out, they need to find out what it's like being in GITMO, another obscene crime that they've allowed to go on in our countries name for years.
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ThisThreadIsSatire Donating Member (697 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 10:06 AM
Response to Original message
13. I've Never Been a Supporter of Mob Rule, but...
From TheDesperateBlogger.com

What Recession? Tourists Swarm Big Apple
November 25, 2008

Is it possible that the much ballyhooed recession has yet to arrive?

Travel industry insiders report "unprecedented" numbers of Americans flocking to New York City for the long holiday weekend. Bookings for large groups are reported to have reached numbers tripling the previous high set during the Shriners' 75th Anniversary celebration in 1997. Hotels from Harlem to the Financial District are sold out, and tent cities have reportedly sprung up in city parks and even vacant lots.

Many are apparently bargain hunters taking advantage not only of New York's diverse marketplace but also the multitude of retailers discounting everything from sporting goods to plumbing supplies in order to get an early jump on their holiday shopping. "We were expecting a slowdown," said Liam Toomey, manager of The Home Depot on West 23rd Street. "Not only did we not get one, but I'm predicting record numbers for this location." A variety of items from many areas of the store are flying off the shelves faster than workers can re-stock them -- items as diverse as crowbars, chain saws, plumbing pipe, shovels, hatchets, butcher's utensils, rags, glass bottles and jars, flashlights and "every flammable liquid we carry," according to Mr. Toomey, "and Sterno -- lots and lots of Sterno."

His sentiments were echoed by Richard Polyn of The Sports Authority. "We've had to send to other areas for many popular items," he said. "Most of our city locations are totally out of things like baseball bats, hockey sticks, helmets of every kind, and various camping supplies -- especially lanterns, fire wood, and tent spikes and mallets. I don't recall ever seeing so many people buying tent spikes without buying tents. I guess it's something a lot of campers forget to pack. There's also not a slingshot, golf club, or bow and arrow to be had."

And many tourists plan to do some sightseeing as well. Mary Travers, head of the City Tourism Board, reported that the Board's offices have literally been flooded with calls in recent days by tourists seeking travel directions to places like the stock exchanges and even various corporate headquarters.

City Hall spokesperson Eileen O'Sullivan said the Mayor and other city officials "couldn't be happier to see such renewed interest by so many of our friends from around the country in coming back to New York. This will be our biggest weekend since before the September 11 attacks, and with all the jobs being lost here, it couldn't have come at a more opportune time." Ms. O'Sullivan added that she is "extremely disappointed" that she won't be around to "share the love that always seems to shine through at times like this," but added that many friends and family from other parts of the country "literally were pleading with me to get out of town for the weekend."
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Doctor_J Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 12:41 PM
Response to Reply #13
41. A bunch of people in India grabbed and beat the daylights out of a
corrupt executive a few months ago. I don't see the ripoff in the US ending until we start to show some gumption.
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ThisThreadIsSatire Donating Member (697 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 01:01 PM
Response to Reply #41
43. 'Trading Places' had the right idea
The best way to punish rich people is to turn them into poor people...
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Incitatus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 10:07 AM
Response to Original message
14. professional money management? Um, can someone elaborate on this?
The people running these banks aren't capable of managing their own money?
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ThisThreadIsSatire Donating Member (697 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 10:21 AM
Response to Reply #14
18. They're too busy scheming...
They are the ones responsible for formulating strategy -- the generals of the 'Fuck-the-Poor Army" as it were.

They have foot soldiers, who, if not yet unemployed, didn't get bonuses this year 'because of the economy', who do the actual work.

Hope this clarifies things for you...

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nradisic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 10:12 AM
Response to Original message
16. I just wrote to both of my Senators...
Edited on Sun Dec-21-08 10:20 AM by nradisic
This is a crime. Period. The banks are getting bailed out and they are hosing the people and tax payers. No mas. That's it. E-mail, call or write your Senators and Representatives NOW. We have to claw back every fucking penny we gave these scumbags. Fuck the banks. The way they are behaving, we don't need them. Let the criminals go to jail and insolvent banks go under. They are primarilly responsible for this mess and the pain we are all suffering and will be paying for years to come.

I really think it is time to grab the pitch forks and man the barricades...
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Raschel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 10:57 AM
Response to Reply #16
28. I think the only thing that would work is if everyone decided to not pay income tax and demanded
that congress be replaced. And with term limits immediately in place.
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GoddessOfGuinness Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 10:26 AM
Response to Original message
20. All those people who have lost their pensions...
and these SOBs will be riding in limos. :grr::grr::grr:
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DFW Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 10:31 AM
Response to Original message
23. My favorite was the Merrill Lynch guy
He got "$57,692 in salary, a $15 million signing bonus" among other things.

Hell, give me a $15 million signing bonus, and I'll forego the salary altogether.
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politicalmajority Donating Member (78 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 10:37 AM
Response to Original message
24. American CEOs v. Japanese CEOs
See http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WYSZ8TUa3Vg

Americans CEOs don't know how to take the personal responsibility upon themselves. Remember conservatives including Dr. Laura crying about the personal responsibilities and all that? That was all joke. Now that it's the top wealthy corporate executives and the Republicans refusing to take the personal responsibilities upon themselves for their own actions and inactions, Dr. Laura and her types of big mouths are all silent.

Too many Americans CEOs nowadays are welfare kings and queens driving Cadillac and flying on corporate jets. How fitting it is to see now defunct American corporate executives driving the luxury car from a near-bankrupt American automaker.
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chimpymustgo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 10:41 AM
Response to Original message
27. Thank GOD it passed!!!! Dumb fucks.
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The Stranger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-22-08 03:36 PM
Response to Reply #27
63. The GOP-infested Wall Streeters showed up with yet another crisis plan, and the Democratic "leaders"
kept their powder dry to try to stick it to the auto industry and the UAW.

Great job, Pelosi Traitor!
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Aviation Pro Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 11:24 AM
Response to Original message
34. Fine, I'll just go out and fuck up my work and see if my employer...
...rewards me.

I've said it once, and I'll say it again. Most CEOs of the companies that went hat-in-hand to the federal trough came up through sales and always seek to reward themselves first with thick steaks and fine wine. It's about time we jettison these third-tier thieves and put in place engineers and other critical thinkers with real skills instead of these lying sacks of shit.
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ThisThreadIsSatire Donating Member (697 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 11:40 AM
Response to Original message
35. BAILEY A SUICIDE AFTER FED REJECTS BAILOUT FOR BUILDING & LOAN
BAILEY A SUICIDE AFTER FED REJECTS BAILOUT FOR BUILDING & LOAN
December 13, 2008 TheDesperateBlogger.com

Paulson, Bernanke Deflect Criticism

The sudden, tragic end of a banking icon sent shudders through a shocked nation yesterday as the depth of the current mortgage crisis hit home, even to millions who have so far been unaffected.

George Bailey was, for over 60 years, the ‘kind face’ of the mortgage industry. His story inspired three generations following the success of the 1946 Frank Capra movie “It’s A Wonderful Life”, the bio-pic that told the story of Bailey’s early life and his struggle, against seemingly insurmountable odds, to save his beloved Building & Loan during a much more localized lending crisis in the small town where his father had founded the bank when Bailey was a small child.

After receiving the news that the Building & Loan would not be allocated any emergency funding from the $700 billion set aside by the Federal government, Mr. Bailey reportedly jumped off of a local bridge into the frigid river below. His lifeless body was discovered some time later, ironically by local sheriff Bert Steward, III whose grandfather, ‘Officer Bert’ Steward (portrayed by Ward Bond in the Capra film) once helped to rescue Bailey from a similar attempt.

“Unfortunately, nobody was there to intervene this time,” Bailey’s daughter Zuzu told reporters through a family spokesman. “This time, the bell will be ringing for daddy.”

Even before the news of Bailey’s death became known, Federal Reserve Chairman Ben Bernanke and Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson came under heavy fire from all quarters when they announced that there would be no lifeline for the struggling Building & Loan.

“George Bailey was a hero to millions,” an emotional Paulson told reporters upon hearing of the suicide, “And for me, his loss is a particularly personal one. George was also my best imaginary childhood friend. While his presence will be missed, I am comforted by the fact that our friendship will always endure. Of course at a time like this our thoughts and prayers go out to his family and all those who were close to him - especially the ones who are about to lose their homes.”

“Of course I was shocked and saddened to learn the fate of George Bailey,” Bernanke said in a prepared statement, “But it is my duty, even under these most tragic of circumstances, to defend the actions of the Fed. First, I cannot state strongly enough, it was the desire not only of myself but also of everyone involved to find some way to save the Building & Loan. Anyone who has ever met George Bailey would want to help him. That’s not just my opinion, but a fact well documented on film. But the harsh reality of the situation was that the Building & Loan operated in a manner that is no longer viable in today’s culture. As much as I always admired Mr. Bailey, his business practices - by today’s standards - were at best irresponsible, and at worst, criminal. The bank’s records, or more to the point its lack of responsible accounting records is appalling. You just can’t go around making loans based on ‘a handshake’ or ‘the word’ of your friends and neighbors and expect Uncle Sam to bail you out. We’re not anybody’s neighbor and we’re not anybody’s friend — we’re the United States Government.”

Funeral arrangements have not been announced.

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grantcart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 09:33 PM
Response to Reply #35
55. welcome to DU
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DarleenMB Donating Member (189 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 11:44 AM
Response to Original message
36. why is everyone so surprised?
Seriously. didn't EVERYone know that this "bailout" was a last minute effort for the bankers to "get theirs" just like the oil barons and war contractors did?
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progressoid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 10:05 PM
Response to Reply #36
56. I don't think there are many here that are surprised by it.
Sadly most of us saw this coming.

Personally, I'm surprised it didn't get suppressed longer. Usu sally the media is a little more apathetic and sluggish.
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antimatter98 Donating Member (537 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 12:13 PM
Response to Original message
38. Please let's push this story into the MSM and alt. media. n/t
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FreeStateDemocrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 12:35 PM
Response to Reply #38
40. Right, I don't want this story to just go away and be forgotten.
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brentspeak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 12:35 PM
Response to Original message
39. Here's, by name, one of the banking shills who praises huge bonuses:


http://www.waaytv.com/Global/story.asp?S=9557461

Banking insiders argue that bonuses are part of their business model -- an accepted part of basic compensation and a key to the banks' viability.

"Why be pennywise and pound foolish. You want your good people, you want them motivated. And that is why they are paying bonuses," said Steve Kaplan, professor of finance at the University of Chicago.


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Phred42 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 12:44 PM
Response to Original message
42. The Democrats OWN this MESS - THEY voted FOR it !

The Democratic cowards that allowed this to happen are as guilty of this crime as the people that set it up and receive the money.

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ohio2007 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 01:12 PM
Response to Reply #42
44. My congressman voted NO to the bail out. but the majority sheeple congresman voted YES
but.... lets overlook the details and spend the next two years finger pointing
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Phred42 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 01:18 PM
Response to Reply #44
45. Let's spend the next 2 years acknowledging reality, not makeing excuses
and weeding out those that have betrayed us. Gulp - even it they are Democrats.

Lets stop sweeping this crap under the rug and pretending we can move on.
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Lucky Luciano Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 02:02 PM
Response to Original message
46. My friend works at Deutsche Bank and he used to work with me
Edited on Sun Dec-21-08 02:03 PM by Lucky Luciano
at a Swiss bank. Of course, Deutsche, not being American, has nothing to do with the TARP. However, DB has its issues like everyone else. My friend left the bank I was at because they would not allow him to put on bets of the size he demanded - main reason being that he was far more quantitative, technical, and an extreme math geek as opposed to the fundamental analysis/Analyst deifiers that my desk was like (I am also that quanty type of guy which made it hard for me to advance my career at the rapid rate I demanded). My friend generated $10MM in profits in the 9 months that he was with my bank in 2006. In Sep 2007, he went to Deutsche where he quickly impressed people. This year, because he trades volatility (read: options/variance swaps etc) like a champ and the volatility of volatility has been so high and he is so smart, he has generated over $150MM in profits this year for DB. He made huge profits from the huge volatility in the markets around MLK day, around Bear Stearns collapse, from the slowdown in volatility in April and May (ie he was short vol here), and being heavily long vol at the end of August, just a couple weeks before Fannie, Freddie, Lehman, and AIG all collapsed - a bloody fortune he has made. Usually, people trading proprietary positions get a pay out of about 10% of their profits.

Should my friend be totally fucked out of his bonus even though the bank overall has performed poorly with all the other banks? I think not - though it is unlikely that the payout will be 10%. Unfortunately for him, it was a bad year to have a good year!
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sasquuatch55 Donating Member (701 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 02:28 PM
Response to Original message
47. Our society sucks!
The more we're shit on, it seems, the better we like it. After all we keep letting this kind of shit happen. Revolution, I tells thee!
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Acadia Blue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-22-08 03:19 PM
Response to Reply #47
60. Capitalism sucks when the middle class and working class are
oppressed by the parasites at the top.
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Baby Snooks Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 02:31 PM
Response to Original message
48. You mean "bailed-out crooks"
What's the difference between these crooks and Bernie Madoff? These crooks stole from the taxpayers. Aided and abetted by the White House and Congress. The investors made a choice to take a risk with Bernie Madoff the way they do with everyone on Wall Street. The taxpayers were not given a choice. This country is going down the tubes. And the crooks are shooting the bird at us. Especially the crooks in the White House and Congress. And of course the Democratic Party will blame the Republican Party and the Republican Party will blame the Democratic Party. While both continue to steal from the taxpayers.

And the Democrats will wave their little flags and blame the Republicans. And the Republicans will wave their little flags and blame the Democrats.

The only Democrats and Republicans in this country are the fools who believe there are Democrats and Republicans on the ballots. The vast majority are Republicrats. And do not care about the American people.

But, hey, if it makes you feel good to blame the Republicans, go right ahead.

But do ask yourself who kept this administration in office the past two years and ensured that no one will be prosecuted. The Empress. Serving the Emperor. And HIS table. In the end, it was HIS table she kept impeachment off of.

Maybe some of you have nice jobs and professions or trust funds that have survived the economic collapse and can pay your bills and can buy whatever you want to buy for Christmas and think everything is just fine but a growing number of the rest of us can't pay the bills, have no money to buy anything for Christmas and worry that we may be out on the streets after the New Year.

Including some very generous people who lost everything last week. As did the various causes they supported. Which in turn can no longer help us. They like the rest of us go back to the greed of the Republicans but also realize that it was a Democrat who signed it into law. Bubba of Arabia. Who left office and made around $100 million for himself and took in almost $500 million for his "foundation."

We blame the Democrats as well as the Republicans. Maybe if you lose it all, including hope, you will as well.
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DeepModem Mom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 02:40 PM
Response to Original message
49. K&R
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droidamus2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 03:03 PM
Response to Original message
50. Maybe?
Maybe this is why after the Great Depression the income tax rates were set so high on the wealthy. The Repugs and neo-cons try to sell everybody on the idea that by taxing the wealthy at a high rate it is a disincentive for investment and 'job creation'. The problem is that the investments being made are not in the business and jobs but in financial tools that just suck more money out of the system and into the pockets of those who don't really need more money. I posit that by allowing accumulation of large amounts of wealth with what amounts to minimal tax compared to what they get to keep that the government is encouraging greed. If these CEO's and money grabbers knew that over a certain amount they would be taxed in lets say the 80 or 90% range basically capping the amount they could make and including high taxes on deferred payments, stock options and golden parachutes and any other trick they can come up with these people would have to start taking a more realistic look at what they are worth and what they deserve for their job 'performance'. If the CEO's were not allowed to suck out the profits from the companies they run maybe that would be an incentive to reinvest the money in the company and jobs. It is obvious that these people are not worried about anybody but themselves.

Another part of my many theories is that one of our big problems is that many of the people in high management these days did not work their way up to the positions from doing the real work of the business. I believe that many of them probably went from college straight into management positions and many may never have had to do an 'honest days work' in their lives and therefore don't identify with the labor part of the business. These are a bunch of people with high powered MBAs that see 'management' as the do all and end all of business and that managers really do deserve all the benefits of the business. Labor is a cost nothing else, not people, not families just a cost of doing business. That is one reason why many corporations frown on fraternization between management and labor they don't want the managers to make those kind of connections and friendships with their workers. They have no loyalty because they are taught that as a manager you don't have to know anything about your business per se you just have to know how to manage. Yes I am generalizing and I am sure their are many conscientious managers and executives out there but their are too many out there just looking to make the big bucks no matter what it takes or who it hurts.
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glinda Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 08:31 PM
Response to Reply #50
52. I am so fuming mad
The money needs to come back period. This is bulls#%*t.
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KakistocracyHater Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 08:51 PM
Response to Original message
53. get rid of ceo positions altogether-they'l kill us otherwise
now you see why I've been saying this? They are not needed. Pass a law to force bailout money to workers-they are America, for the good of the many NOT the few. Restaurants perhaps now understand this & vacation spots, & merchants, & others-do politicians?
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SomeGuyInEagan Donating Member (872 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 09:27 PM
Response to Original message
54. "In other headlines, sun to rise in the east tomorrow ..."
... back to you, katie.
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Veruca Salt Donating Member (846 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-22-08 02:53 PM
Response to Original message
57. So, when do we have our Bastille Day?
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Acadia Blue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-22-08 03:17 PM
Response to Reply #57
59. They are as obscene as the French aristocracy.
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Acadia Blue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-22-08 03:17 PM
Response to Original message
58. This is intolerable. These people are parasites on the backs of
real working people who are paying for their obscene Czar lifestyle with taxes.
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RCinBrooklyn Donating Member (421 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-22-08 03:29 PM
Response to Original message
62. At some point, we'll call it what it is: class warfare. Sooner or later it is coming to violence.
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