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Biden Not Ruling Out Prosecuting Bush Officials For Prisoner Abuse

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BlueJessamine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 11:51 AM
Original message
Biden Not Ruling Out Prosecuting Bush Officials For Prisoner Abuse
Source: ABC

The Senate Armed Services Committee last week released a unanimous report that said that the prisoner abuse at Abu Ghraib, at Guantanamo, at prisons around the world, is a direct and indirect result of decisions made by Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld and other high-level Bush administration officials.

So I asked the future vice president: Should they be prosecuted for that?

"That's a judgment, remember, four years ago on your program I made, so I haven't changed my mind. And this confirms," Biden told me.

"But the questions of whether or not a criminal act has been committed or a very, very, very bad judgment has been engaged in is -- is something the Justice Department decides.Barack Obama and I are -- President-elect Obama and I are not sitting thinking about the past. We're focusing on the future," he said.

Biden argued it's up to the Justice Department, under Attorney General-designate Eric Holder, to determine whether the case should be reviewed.



Read more: http://blogs.abcnews.com/george/2008/12/biden-not-rulin.html
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Dennis Donovan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 11:52 AM
Response to Original message
1. Good news! Recommended!
:thumbsup:
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BlueJessamine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 12:00 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. Good news indeed!
and thank you for the k&r!

To The Hague!!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Criminal_Court
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balantz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 12:11 PM
Response to Original message
3. So then,
Edited on Sun Dec-21-08 12:21 PM by balantz
If as Biden says "President-elect Obama and I are not sitting thinking about the past. We're focusing on the future," then we have to look into whether or not Holder would move this forward or let it languish.

From Holder's past statements it looks like there is a fair chance that he might pursue this thing.
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Donnachaidh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 12:32 PM
Response to Original message
4. err, this line gives him an OUT in terms of real prosecution
"President-elect Obama and I are not sitting thinking about the past. We're focusing on the future," he said."

I wouldn't be doing handsprings about the possibility of prosecution YET. That line sounds like an all purpose "We don't want to touch this, so we'll toss it off to someone else to make those decisions" line used by politicians tiptoeing through shit.

Personally, I've yet to see ANY of the incoming administration showing any REAL inclination towards handing out justice to the Bush Cabal. That's going to take REAL courage, and frankly, I'm not seeing it.

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acmavm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 12:45 PM
Response to Reply #4
5. Yeah, I just copied that line myself. No one will ever be prosecuted.
No one. Not ever.
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Lorien Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 02:54 PM
Response to Reply #4
14. Yep. If that's really their phlosophy, then why not turn out every person
who is now in prison? After all, their crimes are all in the past.
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Phred42 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 12:46 PM
Response to Original message
6. You actually beleive that eh?
:spray:
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Leftest Donating Member (232 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 12:50 PM
Response to Original message
7. Lip Service
How many times are we going to fall for lip service? I no longer believe one freakin word that comes out of any politician's mouth. I'll believe when I see it.

n/t
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acmavm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 01:04 PM
Response to Original message
8. Hey Joe, how about going after the credit card companies for usury? Oh
Edited on Sun Dec-21-08 01:04 PM by acmavm
wait, you helped them along every step of the way, didn't you?

edit: punctuation

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Mark Twain Girl Donating Member (410 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 01:16 PM
Response to Original message
9. "or a very, very, very bad judgment" ... are you kidding me Joe? Oh wait, of course you aren't. nt
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hootinholler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 01:16 PM
Response to Original message
10. So is Holden on the side of Justice or JustUs?
:shrug:

No clue here.

-Hoot
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Phred42 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 02:24 PM
Response to Original message
11. Like HELL he is! - ‘I think we should be looking forwards, not backwards.’
Like some of Obama's nebulous statements - you can interpret them any way you want


Biden on prosecuting Bush officials for torture: ‘I think we should be looking forwards, not backwards.’
http://thinkprogress.org/2008/12/21/biden-prosecuting-torture/

On ABC’s This Week, host George Stephanopoulos asked Vice President-elect Joe Biden whether high-level Bush administration officials should be prosecuted for prisoner abuse. “The questions of whether or not a criminal act has been committed…is something the Justice Department decides,” Biden responded. “That’s a decision I’d look to the Justice Department to make.” While stating he was “not ruling it in and not ruling it out,” Biden underscored that he and Obama are are “focusing on the future.” “I think we should be looking forward, not backwards,” he argued.
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DeepModem Mom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 02:45 PM
Response to Original message
12. K&R
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ejbr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 02:52 PM
Response to Original message
13. I'll believe it when I see it
I have gotten used to politicians spitting on the rule of law.
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Synicus Maximus Donating Member (828 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 02:54 PM
Response to Original message
15. There is a world of difference
between not ruling out prosecution and saying that prosecution will be pursued. It ain't going to happen folks.
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Dangerously Amused Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 03:01 PM
Response to Original message
16. Good.
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LynneSin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 03:10 PM
Response to Original message
17. I always thought it would be easier going after Bush once he was out of office
and we have a congress and white house filled with people who would support this move
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balantz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 03:36 PM
Response to Reply #17
19. We tried that before.
Pelosi and crew stuck up for their criminal masters, not for us.
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LynneSin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 03:39 PM
Response to Reply #19
20. no I meant not having Bush in the White House
technically he's still there

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balantz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 03:42 PM
Response to Reply #20
23. We'll soon see what happens with this issue when he is out of office. n/t
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gblady Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 03:40 PM
Response to Reply #17
21. I agree.....
with Bush still holding all the power...
I wouldn't be making any threatening gestures
at this juncture.

Remember the analogies to Obama being a poker player...
you certainly don't want to be hinting at your cards.
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Donnachaidh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 03:40 PM
Response to Reply #17
22. that's the rub
"white house filled with people who would support this move"

DO WE?

So far, Biden is *looking forward, not back* -- I'll bet we'll get an equally nebulous and open for interpretation blow off from Obama, if anyone gets the nerve to ask him directly.

Don't hold your breath folks -- AIN'T happening in your lifetime. :shrug:
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LynneSin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 03:51 PM
Response to Reply #22
24. I hate to say it but #1 priority is this economy - it's trumped everything
people are going to be upset if Obama's first focus isn't about jobs & the economy. I still think there is much to be discussed about what criminal acts Bush has done these past 8 years but will be in the shadow of the economy.
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Wizard777 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 03:31 PM
Response to Original message
18. Give 'em hell Joe!
:applause: :headbang: :yourock: :headbang: :applause:
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Belial Donating Member (503 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 03:56 PM
Response to Original message
25. Same ol.. same ol...
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pacalo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 04:24 PM
Response to Original message
26. It's one thing for Obama & Biden to "look forward, not backwards" & it's another
for the Justice Dept. to be allowed to "look backwards" (all crimes, without exception, were done in the "past" tense). If Biden is part of an administration that won't allow investigations into "the past", I can no longer admire him.

One of my favorite Biden quotes was when he questioned Ashcroft at a hearing, & he said this with clenched teeth: "There's a reason why we sign these treaties: to protect my son in the military. That's why we have these treaties, so when Americans are captured they are not tortured. That's the reason in case anybody forgets it."

So this issue is something Biden has shown to feel strongly about, & hopefully, he recognizes that the world needs to be shown that those who ordered the torture will not get away with it. We'll see.
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Muttocracy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 06:25 PM
Response to Original message
27. I recommend watching the actual interview, not George S's take on it...
Part of what he was saying was related to the whole discussion of the powers and responsibilities of the VP - and it's not the VP's job to do this. It's up to the Justice dept. And if they are planning any prosecution, I don't think Biden is going to lay it out for George S. :shrug:

video link of whole show - http://abcnews.go.com/Video/playerIndex?id=6505143

clips and summaries
http://abcnews.go.com/thisweek

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StudsT Donating Member (310 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 06:27 PM
Response to Original message
28. now that some change i can get behind
:bounce:

If these thugs are allowed to skate america doesn't stand a chance, imho.

StudsT
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burrowowl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 08:30 PM
Response to Original message
29. A murdered kills someone because he wants to
knows it is a crime and Biden can call this very, very, bad judgment!?
The Geneva Convention, ratified by the USA says torture is a CRIME!
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classysassy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-21-08 09:00 PM
Response to Original message
30. Food for
the fools,don't hold your breath,all of those congress critters are in the same league.
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vssmith Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-22-08 05:28 AM
Response to Original message
31. The past shapes the future
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bdamomma Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-22-08 08:42 AM
Response to Original message
32. this upcoming administration must hold these thugs accountable
if not, we are all accomplices to the Bush crimes, or the international community will step in, I am hoping.
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