Canadians lead longer, healthier lives than Americans

[DavidDvorkin]

Source: EurekAlert

Compared to their neighbours south of the border, Canadians live longer, healthier lives. Research published in BioMed Central's open access journal Population Health Metrics has found this disparity between the two countries, suggesting that America's lack of universal health care and lower levels of social and economic equality are to blame.

Read more: http://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/2010-04/bc-cll042710.php

---

Curse you, evil socialists of the North! Don't you know that the USA is Number One?!

[ZeitgeistObserver]

1. Sorry about that eh?

:)

[DavidDvorkin]

2. If it were feasible

I'd get my revenge on you evil people by moving there and becoming one of you.

Instead, I'll just stay down here and snarl enviously in your general direction.

[Oregone]

4. Why isn't it feasible?

[DavidDvorkin]

11. Age, money, and

my wife's reluctance to leave Denver at the moment.

[ZeitgeistObserver]

5. It's just a short hop away.

And we'd love to have you.

[defendandprotect]

21. Who is Canada looking for -- ages? Youth? Professions?

And do they really want Americans?

Your climate is also changing? Evidently, some Canadians are "illegal" in Arizona????

How available is housing, generally -- ??

[Oregone]

22. They want young, healthy professionals

My wife and I, in our 20s, both had bach degrees and we barely passed their metric. Housing in not that availible in the larger cities. We landed in Victoria, and they had under a 1% vacancy at the time. Average Candian home is $320K ($500K in Victoria).

There will be a housing crash soon though.

[RedSock]

26. we moved in 2005 at ages 44 and 42

and all we had saved was roughly $25 K.

[DavidDvorkin]

27. That's young compared to me and my wife.

[defendandprotect]

36. Five years . . .

have you adjusted as well as you thought you might?

[Darth_Kitten]

29. Well, that's Victoria......

prices on the coast are obviously obscene. Move inland.....cost of living is pretty reasonable. :)

[defendandprotect]

35. Have your wages stagnated as American wages have?

I've long been trying to get my daughter to visit Canada -- thinking it might

be an option at some future point. She's in Boston and married now, tho, so I'd

have to push two of them now.

Why a housing crash? Anything to do with our problems?

[Oregone]

38. Depends on the field, but basically, yes

They haven't kept pace with the rise in housing and goods. But some sectors there are simply more lucrative (like education/aid positions). My wife was making $20 bucks an hour for a position that would of paid $10 to $12 in the US. This makes dual income families in Canada maybe a bit more mobile. Then to top it off, the social net helps too (health care and paid maternity were a big help this year to us).


"Why a housing crash? Anything to do with our problems?"

Anytime you give away almost free money w/ only 5% down, then you create bubbles. And when Canada increases housing prices 15% in the year of the "Great Recession", its a perfect illustration (Hm...makes something Marx said about credit quite relevant).

Canada doesn't really do full 30 year loans like in the states. They amoratize to 25 to 35 schedules, but do 2-5 year balloons. So here is the deal...you lock a bunch of young kids into 400K homes with 2% interest loans, then you tell them in a few years their new loan is at the new 6% prime rate, you are going to have a lot of problems. To qualify a 2%, you don't have to show a lot of income, so some of those people are going to be up shit creek when their loan resets. Canada's system is very advantageous if you are *SMART* (you pay off principle early and always buy less than you can afford when rates are low), but it a serious problem when you have a lot of dumb people and accelerating housing prices.

On average, all their loans float at the prime rate, so if people's incomes do not increase in accordance with the prime rate, there will be mass defaulting. Canada is in the position for a perfect storm because of what they have done (lowered rates in a recession, required little downpayment, and let people qualify on the terms they are borrowing, rather than on a 5+ year rate). Its fine with me. Im in a small town and I can't find a 3 bedroom under $300 K

[defendandprotect]

39. Was interesting recently to hear that a $70,000 government salary . . .

vs a $40,000 private sector salary for the same work/job happened because private

salaries were kept stagnant -- and government salaries were based on COLA's for

inflation.


In other words, anyone making $40,000 should have been making $70,000!

And that effects not only salaries, but Social Security, retirement benefits.



(Hm...makes something Marx said about credit quite relevant).

Don't think I've ever really read Karl Marx, but those who have keep pointing out how

right he was on almost any issue re economy/capitalism.


Overall, am gathering that where you are dependent upon capitalism is where the problems are --

and IMO it's a suicidal system of exploitaton of everything!

Thanks for the info!

:)

[Oregone]

40. "Don't think I've ever really read Karl Marx"

Start breifly with the Communist Manifest (simply because its entertaining and lays out a lot of ideas). Then move to some of his less provocative work (I got a decent handbook of most his writings and correspondences on economics and life)

http://books.google.ca/books?id=rRf56dMiudAC&printsec=frontcover&dq=karl+marx+communist+manifesto&source=bl&ots=d6OjfUggQd&sig=2un8EeE9DM0SyT9aOgdbefgHt90&hl=en&ei=qCXbS8mdMJKyswOoq727DQ&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=2&ved=0CBMQ6AEwAQ#v=onepage&q&f=false

Maybe his "solution" wasn't spot on, or maybe its been misinterpreted in its various applications, etc, but his ability to look at the system of Capitalism and break down its impact is amazing. He called stuff spot on at a very early point in history and his writings are relevant today.

[defendandprotect]

41. Happen to have that here somewhere in my bookcase . . .

but never got to it --

Meanwhile, I don't think I hold any higher feeling for capitalism that he had --

Captialism is a ridiculous "King-of-the-Hill" system intended to move the wealth and

natural resources from the many to the few.

Unregulated capitalism is merely organized crime.

IMO, it's over and we need to move to Democratic Socialism --

As soon as we can explain to T-baggers that's not what they think it is!



Thank you -- some day I will try to catch up with your recommendations!



:)

[TrogL]

43. WTF?

What bank are you dealing with? There's no way mine would put up with that.

Also, I'm in a big city and housing prices are nowheres near that.

If you're within driving distance of Toronto or on the route for the train (forgotten what it's called - it's been awhile) or in the outskirts of Vancouver (eg. Burnaby) that might account for it.

[OnlinePoker]

42. No...it's greed

BC allows us to look at the provincial property assessment rolls for a couple of months each year. Our neighbour put their house on the market in February. We looked up the assessment and it was valued at $420k. It is a 1912 house that has had some improvements done since this couple bought it 4 years ago. They put it on the market a $550k. They've reduced it recently to $520k, but still no takers. B.C. has the lowest (or second lowest) minimum wage in the country. We seem to count on people coming from other parts of Canada (or overseas) to keep our house prices propped up because the weather is generally fine (we get half the rain that Vancouver does). At some point, though, this outside money will realise there just aren't any bargains here and the market will correct to a more realistic level (I keep seeing $400k homes listed as "starter"). Canada has also just implemented a more stringent mortgage and downpayment standard which will keep a lot of people who were marginal before from getting into the market. This will also drive prices down somewhat. It may not be a crash...more of a correction.

[Canuckistanian]

3. We don't have high blood pressure from worrying about our health

In fact, going to the doctor is an entirely stress-free experience, knowing that there's NO BILL in the future. Or ever.

[dchill]

34. Don't you need some kind of liniment...

to rub it in? 'Cause you ARE rubbing it in!

:hi:

[gateley]

6. Why, I find that a bit unbelievable seeing as how the U.S. has the BEST

health care in the WORLD! :banghead:

I'm very very happy for our Canadian friends, though. :hi:

[Thor_MN]

7. Since I live in MN, I don't feel bad in saying "Cryogenics"

:hi:

[polly7]

8. The rural clinic I've gone to for years just lost both our doctors,

one due to a family crisis in SA and the other wanting to practice in the city. Two other doctors in the next mumicipality have had to take over the care of thousands affected, so I was told the wait list would be up to a week, but my name was added. The next morning I got a phone call to go in that afternoon .... so relieved! My new doc spent time with me, was very thorough and referred me for every test possible, within the last week I've received 3 phone calls from the specialists and diagnostic centres he wants me to see. What impresses me most about this system is the level of communication between these physicians. They work together so well on a case by case basis and the pt. is left feeling more hopeful, because they have a 'team' on their side. We have our faults, but our physicians have and always will be our greatest advocates. They just ....... care.

[defendandprotect]

37. Interesting info -- thank you!

[MrMickeysMom]

9. They also seem to be less stessed and angry...

That's got to matter.

[applegrove]

10. There is more of a culture of "I got mine" in the usa rather than the "we are all in this together"

feeling we have in Canada. feeling connected to all the people in your country is a healthy - happy way to be.

[Rozlee]

15. That's it in a nutshell!

Since Reaganomics, our country's decended down to an "I got mine" mentality. With Teabaggers running all over the place with their "Don't Tax My Wealth!" signs, it's even more evident. It's too disheartening at times. In the U.S., millionaires fight to become multi-millionaires. Multi-millionaires fight to become billionaires. Billionaires fight become multi-billionaires. Everyone else just fights to keep from losing their underwater mortagage and to keep their jobs from being shipped overseas. Meanwhile, the guy holding up the "Don't Tax My Wealth" sign probably just makes $35,000 a year and has a family of four and doesn't realize he qualifies for food stamps. He's just out there because Glenn Beck told him to be. Hell, I'm retired, what the hell am I still doing here? Canada, here I come! Sigh! If my kids weren't here, I'd go in a heartbeat.

[applegrove]

16. Right. You can either grow your middle class or grow your rich and your poor.

The USA does the second. I will say that I have been mighty impressed with the Americans I have met on the DU. You are all good eggs.

[raccoon]

25. Canada doesn't want retired people. Not if you intend to become a Canadian citizen, that is. nt

[Bigmack]

30. Alas, we tried to emigrate and move to Canada

after George II was elected. We're both retired, and often visit up north. Went to talk to the consulate, and he told us, very politely, NOT in these exact words, "Sorry, you're too old and would be a drag on the health care system! But you're welcome to stay in Canada 5 months and 29 days in any year....." We were still sorely tempted, but the logistics and costs of trying to have two places in two countries canceled THAT little dream. Oh well. It's still a WONDERFUL place to visit. Ms Bigmack

[krabigirl]

31. I agree, but not all of us here are like that :)

[applegrove]

33. Of course not. I've said before I am mighty impressed with the Americans I have met on

the DU.

[DavidDvorkin]

12. Yes, I always have that feeling when I'm in Canada

An air of calm.

Or maybe I'm projecting that feeling because, when I'm in Canada, I'm on vacation from everything that stresses me. It's hard to judge other places realistically when you're in vacation mode.

[Libertas1776]

13. Interesting...

considering Canadians consume the most doughnuts per capita in the whole world.

[MrMickeysMom]

14. Yeah, but they're also likely to be...

Tim Horton's :-)

[MellowDem]

17. I would like to have what Canada has...

but it will be much harder to implement it in a nation of 300 million compared to 30 million, with much more poverty. Actually, I think the single-payer system would work best here, at least at first.

But it will require reversing the almost universally accepted idea here that government is bad and can never do anything right. Unfortunately, incompetent Republican governments have just reinforced that faulty theory.

[HappyCynic]

19. True...

The conversion would be much harder but the system, once implemented, might actually work better in some ways. The population density of the US would result in better access to specialists. Also, the US is already spending more per capita so even if it's efficiency was anywhere close to the Canadian system, costs should go down. If it's much less efficient (possibly due to higher prices), it might still be no more expensive than it currently is.

You're definitely right in that the major hurdle is the will and perception of the general populace rather than the actual implementation of system.

[daleo]

18. Lower Gini coefficient

Equals better health, all things considered.

[defendandprotect]

20. Mentally healthier, as well, I'd imagine . . .???

[CreekDog]

23. And seem to be a lot less mad at crap than we are

And I think there's a connection. :rofl:

[raccoon]

24. No shit, Sherlock. Rec'd. nt

[Uncle Joe]

28. Kicked and recommended.

Thanks for the thread, DavidDvorkin.

[eppur_se_muova]

32. Even with poutine? nt

:wow: