What would it take to change your mind about the existence of god?

[Beaker]

for those of you who don't believe- what would it take to convince you...?

and for those that do believe, what would it take to change your mind- about either the existence, or nature of god.

I'm one of the former, and what it would take to convince me that he's/she's there, would be sometype of unambiguous otherwise unexplainable action- How about " I AM HERE" carved into the face of the moon that faces earth, so that you could read it from earth with the naked eye...

[KG]

1. " I AM HERE" carved into the face of the moon

that would work for me! :)

[librechik]

6. nah, that's Cheney's undisclosed location

unless...well, Cheney thinks he's god, why not everybody else!!

seriously, my husband is god. Some aliens in a flying saucer told him that back in the 60s. He says he knows he doesn't deserve the honor and he does a really bad job, and he doesn't want anyone to worship him; he's just never found a reason to disbelieve them.

So I'm God's Old Lady, so watch it!

[arwalden]

44. Or A Simple SMILEY-FACE Would Convince Me

You'd think that after all this time, and with his declining popularity, he would do something, anything. Perhaps god is dead.

-- Allen

[seethrougheyes]

52. Miracles....

There are miracles everyday that God is showing to you, that God is showing to everyone. People are usually just 'asleep' and don't notice. When I say asleep, I don't necessarily mean in your bed with your eyes closed. I mean asleep mentally and spiritually. There are very few people on this earth who are truly awake. If you allow yourself to truly be awake and see and look carefully, all the evidence of his existence will be seen and unquestioned. It's there, right in front of you, right in front of everyone. People just refuse to see it......why I have no idea!

[Az]

53. Please provide an example

It would be marvelous to see such a thing. Or are you suggesting that the laws of nature are the miracle. It that is the case perhaps you are simply placing your lack of understanding of things as the argument for god. I would take as a miracle a thing behaving in a way it should not. Evidence of god's will changing the course of events. If you are going to suggest that things which happen as a course of nature are god's miracles then you are not going to convince many skeptics.

[sangh0]

68. It's a "miracle" that things work as they should

I would take as a miracle a thing behaving in a way it should not.

In an often chaotic world, it's a miracle that things work they way they should, time after time. Why assume that predictability is a given law of nature and unpredictable behavior a sign of a supernatural force. IMO, it takes a supernatural force to tame chaos and create order.

[Beaker]

59. oh, yeah.....right-

:eyes:

[radwriter0555]

63. A personal appearance and audience and some miracles would be nice.

That's not a lot to ask for.

Ending suffering, world hunger, racism, discrimination and hatred... silly things like that.

[Rabrrrrrr]

2. How about a rumbling, deep, very loud voice saying "I'm sorry,

I just can't let this go on any more!" and a HUGE Godly hand sweeping out from the sky and nailing Shrub, wiping that smirk right off during a press conference, and then saying, "Now tell the truth, you jackass."

Would that work?

[KCDem]

37. lol, this Christian is laughing her ass off!

That would totally make my day!!!

[Rabrrrrrr]

39. Me, too, and thanks!

And then stand sternly behind Shrub for the rest of his term, making sure that Shrub didn't do anything else stupid, lying, and hateful.

[Endangered Specie]

45. About a hundred certain people all get stuck by lightning at once.

[carolinayellowdog]

3. Two simultaneous lightning strikes in Washington...

that are fatal to two prominent Republican (s)elected officials.

[KCDem]

38. why limit it to two?

I can think of about two dozen to smite. :evilgrin:

[gmoney]

4. A Babelfish would be a nice start...

But it's all about faith, isn't it? And hard proof negates the need for faith.

It all seems like such superstitious mumbo jumbo, but I sometimes wonder if I'M the one being contrary.

Let me know if you find an answer.

[DarkPhenyx]

8. well, if you want a logical argument to it.

yes, that would definately help.

[Beaker]

13. the babelfish of the 'hitchhiker's guide to the galaxy' variety?

"I refuse to prove that I exist," says God, "for proof denies faith, and without faith I am nothing."

"But," says Man, "the Babel fish is a dead giveaway isn't it? It could not have evolved by chance. It proves that you exist, and so therefore, by your own arguments, you don't. Q.E.D.."

"Oh dear," says God, "I hadn't thought of that," and promptly vanishes in a puff of logic.

"Oh, that was easy," says Man, and for an encore goes on to prove that black is white and gets himself killed on the next zebra crossing...

[arcane1]

16. beat me to it

:evilgrin:

[DarkPhenyx]

5. God telling me...

...he dosen't exist

[pinkpops]

7. he would have to choose me to be president.

[lovedems]

9. I was never much of a believer. Especially in college

being a philosophy major and all. That all changed when I had kids. For some reason, it changed. I am not fanatical nor do I follow all of the rules of the catholic church but having my kids made a believer out of me. Don't ask me to explain it because I can't but my life changed when I laid eyes on my first born for the first time.

Edit: A very close friend of mine lost her son when he 4 to a brain tumor. She always believed in God but when that happened she lost her faith and said if there was a God, she was pissed as hell for taking her son. My heart still breaks for her. I hope that kind of answers both of your questions.

[qwertyMike]

10. I believe in God

Like Tom Stoppard
Rough paraphrase:
"Half the world's in love with itself, and so's the other half.
The is no sad laughter and few happy tears.
After the funeral the mortician impregnates he prettiest mourner.
Hell's bell' and all's well"

Can we hope for better?

GOD

[PragMantisT]

11. Shake his/her/its hand

I don't think that's asking too mush.

[SOteric]

12. If I die, and absolutely nothing happens,

no brilliant light, no choirs of angels, no incredible order in the midst of unsurpassingly beautiful chaos, ...if all that happens is that the energy that is me is gone and my corpse rots, I'll be convinced. Dead. But convinced.

[VOX]

17. How could you know that nothing happened if you're all gone?

You would have to have some kind of consciousness to know that you've been cosmically short-changed.

Sorry, I bug the hell out of friends with sh** like this.
:hi:

[SOteric]

23. It won't matter much rez...

If I'm dead and nothing happens, I won't care that I was wrong about God. I'll be dead. And anyone warming up an "I told you so," won't know to launch it until they're dead too, in which case the victory dance will be subdued to say the least.

If I'm right about God, then it's all good. Either way, it works for me.

[VOX]

27. A subdued victory dance...what a great image!

Good one, SO, as usual. And I like your win-win outlook. Or is that more like "pleased-not disappointed?"

Cheers!

[qwertyMike]

18. Be kinda neat if we entered another realm?

But of course I'm thinking of a better one.

Thought this one was a 'Slice'


Ready to GO. Seen it all here.

Ford Prefect

[arcane1]

14. I liked Carl Sagan's "Artist's signature" from "Contact" (the book)

they calculate the value of pi to the 5-billionth decimal place, at which point the numbers become a string of 1's and 0's. They plot those on a graph and it produces a picture of a circle.

I always thought that was pretty cool. I doubt it would make me a 'believer' per se, but it would be a good start...

[qwertyMike]

21. REALLY?

Ones and Zeroes?

Do you have a link?


This could change my whole Deology!!

[arcane1]

33. well, the book was fiction

and they left that part out of the movie (it was an epilogue in the book, IIRC), so I don't know if anyone has actually calculated pi that far

[scottcsmith]

15. I believe now

But in 1986 I wasn't much of a believer. That was the year that Oral Roberts said God was going to strike him dead unless he raised a bunch of money. I was sort of hoping that he'd fail and we'd see Roberts taken up to Heaven. That would have been cool (the God part).

[DarkPhenyx]

19. A more important question is...

...can God, being omnipitent, create a rock which he cannot lift?

[northzax]

65. yes, of course

the only problem is, once the rock is created, God can lift it. But in that instance of creation, when the heavy rock is just coming into being, God has created something that God cannot lift.

and the number of angles on a pin? 62, if it's a regulation size pin, and the angels aren't being punished for obesity, in which case, it's only 61.

[ButterflyBlood]

20. I just would have to lose faith

I don't think any single event could do so, nor do I know what series of events would. Basically for whatever reason I would just start to cease believing in God anymore.

[Room101]

22. I will let Aldous Huxley answer this.....................

"All gods are homemade, and it is we who pull their strings, and so, give them the power to pull ours." - Aldous Huxley

:smoke:

[qwertyMike]

24. Aldous was wasted . .

on acid, then Valium for a long time.

I knew his nephew in Ireland.. Briilliant man. Doctor.

Thw other Huxlees were a pompouus lot. Occasionally brilliant. Enough to get ont TV and sell a few books.
Muggeridge was like that.
And Koestler
Bronowski - now THERE was a brain.

[VOX]

25. If the universe lost its intelligent energy, I'd stop believing in "god"

I've never believed in some celestial puppeteer in flowing robes who pulls all the strings.

Rather, when one views the universe, one sees the cycle of life and death, the pinwheeling of far-off galaxies, the colors of trees in the fall, the silliness of a playful puppy. All this stuff is jazzing about in a very wiggly, squishy fashion, yet it makes a kind of beautiful sense.

If the laws of gravity suddenly failed us, or if the planets flew out of orbit, or if I had to mentally concentrate on my heart to beat it, I would believe that there was no ultimate ground of being -- no "god."

[demosincebirth]

26. Order

I've been a liberal all of my life. It seems that the older I get, the deeper my catholic faith. I don't walk in lock step with Rome, but I don't think I really have to.

I just have to look around me, any where I am, and think, this just didn't happen without a plan...the order of our universe. It, just "didn't" happen.

[Beaker]

55. if it's all a product of "intelligent design"...

they must have farmed out the Human Spine Project to a non-omniscient subcontractor...

[kalian]

28. What's the point...? What's in it for me?

:shrug:
Seriously. Why would I NEED to change my mind about something that
does not exist?
Why is there this "need" to believe in something "more" than us
humans?

[DoctorBombay]

29. A face-to-face meeting

preferably over coffee and biscotti or something.

[SWPAdem]

30. A winning powerball ticket

Easy, ain't I? :evilgrin:

[starroute]

31. That's like asking how long it would take to count to infinity

If you can count to it, it obviously isn't infinity.

In the same way, if you can prove its existence, it isn't God.


There might be superpowered aliens running around the Galaxy mucking with evolution. But they wouldn't be God.

There could be a world-soul of which we are all part, benevolently overseeing life on earth. But that wouldn't be God either.

There could even be an afterlife, whereby our brain-patterns are transferred after we die to a realm of pure energy. That still wouldn't prove the existence of a God.


Do you know the saying, "If you meet the Buddha on the road, kill him"? It's the same thing -- any Buddha you find wandering along the road can't be the real Buddha.

It's all in how you look at things.

[Solomon]

50. I've always pissed off my fundie family by pointing out to them that

god must be evolving, because if he/she were finite, it wouldn't be god. This naturally means that god does not know he/she is god. They believe in the bible literally so I asked them if god can change his mind, and they said "no" because if he did, he would be lying. My response: If he/she can't change it's mind, then it can't be god.
Besides, the bible itself shows his/her mind changed numerous times.
How do you account for that?

I won't say I DON'T believe in god, but I certainly don't believe there's a white man in the sky with a long white beard sporting a long white robe with nothing better to do for all eternity than to watch us assholes down here. What a disrespect for god this idea is, and when you think about it, it's overly narcisistic for us to believe that all of this was created for us only. Does that not elevate man above god? God's got to spend all of eternity watching and worrying about us.

[Az]

54. Evidence vs Proof

In reality we really cannot prove anything in the absolute sense of the word. We can however provide evidence for things and if it is sufficient evidence we can accept it as a valid argument for the thing until refutation is found. Absolute proof for god is not necissary. Unfortunately there is not even minor evidence for god that stands up to scrutiny.

[NightTrain]

32. It would help immensely...

...if the fucker actually showed himself once in a while!

[sampsonblk]

34. I Believe

It will take a miracle to change my mind.

[Squeegee]

35. All he would have to do for me is...

1. Create everlasting world peace.
2. Bestow ultimate understanding of the nature of existence on humanity.

[silverlib]

36. If I found out

that He caused bad things to happen and that He hides from me and tests me.

Kinda right the opposite of the fundies. I can handle a non-virgin birth and the debunking of all the stories of the Bible. I came to this conclusion at a young age when the theory of evolution first came around. I think there is a place for the merging of all religions and I think there is a place for the merging of science and religion. He never hides and He never tests. He is the greatest counselor and the strong point of every great counselor is the ability to listen.

[maveric]

40. If bu$h, Cheney,Rummy, Condi, Colin, Wolfiwitz....

all went on TV and told the real TRUTH about how they lied about Iraq and stole the election. And then Asscroft would tell us all that he is really a hate mongering, racist phoney. Then they would all apologize to the world and turn themselves into the proper authorities.
That would make me a true believer.

[Wonco_the_Sane]

41. A BURNING G.W. BUSH

Sorry..kidding, just kidding.

I don't know really. I'm agnostic with hope, but not belief.

[AlFrankenFan]

42. It would take a lot to convince me

And my religious friends certainly don't help.

[Mobius]

43. A Plague like the green mist...

in The Ten Commandments. But instead of first born it only kills republicans.

[RebelOne]

46. If I had a few million dollars dropped in my lap.

That may convince me to believe.

[Gadave]

47. Severe and irreversable brain damage

[kodi]

48. the raising of the dead

in all human societies, the issue of human death is a critical feature of the culture.

whoever shall be able to raise the dead would be looked upon as a god.

[Beaker]

56. unless...

the newly risen deceased went around eating people's brains to ease the pain of being dead-

then the guy responsible would be pretty much be seen as a total jerk.

[Vernunft II]

49. Nothing

If I´d hear his voice I´d admit myself to a hospital and ask for Solian...

[Az]

51. Evidence

Freewill is not denied by information. The argument is often made that if god provided evidence of his existance that would deny freewill. However even the bible has incidents where evidence was provided upon request. The famous doubting Thomas was provided with evidence by Jesus that he was in fact risen. All I ask is for the same level of evidence provided for Thomas. If one of the disciples can be provided with evidence then why should anyone else be expected to grant absolute belief in its absense.

Consider this. Before you stands two doors. You are informed by someone standing nearby that one of the doors leads to eternal bliss and the other door leads to eternal damnation. You have only that person's word on which door is which. There are no labels. And anyone that has gone through either door has never come back except one guy 1000s of years ago according to the guy standing near the door. Which door do you go through? Some evidence would be nice wouldn't it?

[LWolf]

57. Nothing.

I am open. Open enough not to require a black and white

"Yes there is, and his/her name is <fill in the blank> and all his/her laws are written in this book <fill in the blank> and everyone must follow this path or <fill in the blank>."

Or,

"No, there isn't, all those myths have been debunked by good science, and there is no scientific evidence to prove <fill in the blank>."

I'm not convincable, or inconvincable. And no, those words are not in my Webster's collegiate. ;-)

[Az]

58. Actually I have a challenge that has been running for some years now

According to the bible the power of prayer is real. Here are two verses detailing the kind of power behind prayer.

Matt 17:21 Jesus replied, "I tell you the truth, if you have faith and do not doubt, not only can you do what was done to the fig tree, but also you can say to this mountain, 'Go, throw yourself into the sea,' and it will be done. 22If you believe, you will receive whatever you ask for in prayer."

Matt 18:19 Again, I tell you that if two of you on earth agree about anything you ask for, it will be done for you by my Father in heaven.

I have a small wind up toy called Darwin's Dog sitting on my monitors at home and at the office. Its a small green fish like critter with legs. My challenge is nothing so grand as asking for a mountain to jump in the ocean or anything like that. It is quite simple. You need only pray for one of these fish to move on its own. That is ask god to move them in a way that I will readily recognise as a miracle. If this transpires I will gladdly accept this as evidence for god.

I do not consider someone bumping the monitor or moving the fish themself to be evidence. It has to be clearly a miraculous movement devoid of any human intervention (other than the prayer itself). More than one Christian is allowed to pray for this. In fact you may include as many as you want. This would be a very real means of bringing a none believer into the "light" so it is not a selfish prayer on your part. God has provided evidence to doubters within the bible so asking god for evidence may not be the prefered route but it is not a forbidden route.

Incidently this challenge has been going on for 5 years now and still no motion from the wind up fishies.

[JNelson6563]

60. how about an end to senseless slaughter

or even something about the imbalance of resources? We've got nations on the brink of starvation while obesity is a major blight in America?

I see proof all over the place that a.) there is no god or b.) god is one cruel, hateful being.

Julie

[CanuckAmok]

61. Adam Ant shares my philosophy:

"I could be religious,
If I didn't have to kneel d-o-o-o-wn,
I could be religious,
If a God would say "Hello!",
I could be religious,
If an angel touched my shoulder,
I could be religious,
If they set the hymns to Dis-co..."

[Heyo]

62. Not sure...

But, all the recent reading I've been doing on cosmology and string theory has reinforced my faith in some sort of a creator or a grand design of some form or another......

It's cause and effect.. each event that takes place has to be caused by a previous event... how far can you go back on the chain?? Events cannot spontneously happen without cause.

Steven Hawking put it pretty well... "Why would the universe go through all the bother of existing?"

Heyo

[FDRrocks]

64. I would have to witness God...

to believe in him, personally. I'm not exactly overflowing with faith in anything these days.

[truthspeaker]

66. miraculous evidence

and lots of it.

But believing wouldn't necessarily get me to worship. I see no reason to assume that if a god exists, he is benevolent. He could just as easily be malevolent or indifferent. Indifference seems the most likely to me, if he exists at all, which I'm pretty sure he doesn't.

[Zomby Woof]

67. a donut would have to magically appear

Right here, on my desk, now.

[Rabrrrrrr]

69. One did apear, but an anti-donut appeared right there with it,

and they immediately annihilated each other leaving only a neutrino stream and a few bosons and a few crumbs that a very happy cockroch will get later.

You're lucky you didn't get burned - or should I say, it was GOD who saved you from being burned.

[Zomby Woof]

70. hahahahahahaha

:bounce: The ANTI-DONUT! :scared:

Don't even suggest the existence of anti-coffee, or I will smite thee!

[Az]

71. Mmmmm bosons

mmmmmm forbidden neutrinoes

[ronnykmarshall]

72. Jan Crouch's wig explodes.

[Az]

73. Actually a gravitational implosion is more likely

That thing must pull in small asteroids on its own. The density of her skull must be incredible to keep from being crushed by the forces involved.

[Mr. McD]

74. Credible evidence