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snoochie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-04 10:10 PM
Original message
I need to rant about religion
With all the crap being slung about whether a certain segment of our population will necessitate the changing of the English language with respect to referring to permanent or semi-permanent relationships, I have been teetering on the edge of self-control. It seems like at all times I'm just seconds away from launching into tirades. God help the next person who makes the mistake of broaching the subject with me.

SO I decided to vent a little steam here, so that whenever that does happen I don't explode too violently.

See, here's the thing... all these people are getting all wound up over marriage, and it just absolutely blows my mind that this is happening. I guess these people don't feel the same sense of outrage over little things like millions of children in the world who are: dying of easily curable diseases; losing their parents to AIDS, prison, or WHATEVER reason; losing hope for the future and largely giving up on life; joining the ranks of the homeless or uninsured; living in poverty; etc, etc, etc, etc...

And THESE jokers get riled about GAY MARRIAGE?!

Do they even freaking READ the GD bible? Or the Torah, Koran, or whatever? Ever do an ethical / moral inventory on their priorities these days?

I swear to God I want to set up a soap box on a corner and start screaming at these lost souls as they file out of 'church'! What would Jesus do, they ask, but they don't seem to know or want to know.

I was born and raised in Texas and religion and going to church are seemingly important down here. But WTF is up with these people that they just seem to not recognize what's happening in the world is directly related to MONEY!

How much worse can that be? We accept that people are dying for lack of funds to set up systems for clean drinking water, but our government somehow places a higher priority on lobbying UN members to help us in WAR rather than use our clout to lobby support for and implementation of water and sewage infrastructure so that children won't die of freaking DIARRHEA!!!!

I think I'm more frustrated because of the news of the Pentagon report addressing global warming. It drives me nuts that there is so little attention to THAT grave and gathering threat.

Money for bombs, but not enough for education, infrastructure, healthcare, VA... and it just stays that way and gets worse. That's one thing I did like about Clinton, he had the balls to cut the defense budget. Now it's out of control again and it couldn't possibly be happening at a worse time as our environment starts to change in ways we can only estimate.

There are so many serious problems that must be faced. But day after day too many people seem to just use religion as some kind of excuse for their actions, something to make them feel better about themselves and the world as it is - rather than as a guide for their actions. Being in the South where values are supposedly so important... I look at people around me and just don't know what to do. It seems so basic, so simple.
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salinen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-04 10:15 PM
Response to Original message
1. Your rant is my rant.
Nice rant.
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Dob Bole Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-04 10:18 PM
Response to Original message
2. Wow...that was a rant
With big words. I live in the South...Koran...Diahhrea...mpeh!

Congratulations on a successful rant!
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camero Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-04 10:24 PM
Response to Reply #2
6. Like your sig
That must be the new Secretary of Commerce. :)
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Dob Bole Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-04 11:07 PM
Response to Reply #6
13. Thanks...
Mayor McCheese is the Bomb-Diggity, no matter what company he keeps :)
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PVnRT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-04 10:19 PM
Response to Original message
3. We need another 99 Theses
to be nailed into Pat Robertson's forehead.
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youngred Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-04 10:20 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. 97 eom
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camero Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-04 10:23 PM
Response to Original message
5. I just gave a form of this rant to my mom yesterday verbally
It's just rediculous. But you know what, we now have another one on our side. My mom just switched over. That's 5 for me now.
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democratreformed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-04 10:26 PM
Response to Original message
7. Rant seconded n/t
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Indiana_Dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-04 10:29 PM
Response to Original message
8. I hear ya loud and clear!!!!
It is so refreshing to hear someone say what I feel ALL the time. I am a born-again Christian but for life of me cannot figure out where people's hearts are that claim to know God and His will and continue to support the kinds of things this country is doing!!

I am so glad you said these things. I know there are a lot of people here like you and me. That's why I come to this board. I definitely can't find too many around me physically that really actually give a hoot about what is going on except in their little corner of the world. Then they can't understand when something happens to them and how much events are related to them, mostly because of their apathy or their world view. I guess the Bible is right when it says the endtime will come like in the days of Noah where people were marrying and giving in marriage and partying until the day when the flood came and swept them away. I just feel like chicken little.....

Thanks for spurring my rant!!! lol It feels good!:crazy: :grr: ;)
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Skittles Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-04 10:33 PM
Response to Original message
9. I am sick of religion too
absolutely f***ing sick of it.
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snoochie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-04 10:44 PM
Response to Reply #9
11. It's really aggravating
But I must admit that there were many churches that did try to tell bush not to invade Iraq.

I don't know if you're an atheist or what, but as for me personally (very spiritual) it sickens me that the kind of fraud and prostitution shown by people like Pat Robertson helps to turn people away from anything spiritual at all.

I pray often that young people aren't all made cynical about everything because of the widespread corruption of all things spiritual. There couldn't be a better way of ensuring an environment where people are more likely to be only concerned with themselves and what effects them directly.
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Skittles Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-29-04 10:02 AM
Response to Reply #11
33. I consider myself Agnostic
I'm just tired of constantly hearing and seeing about religion. I think your religion should be between you and whatever you worship; just leave me the f*** OUT of it.
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Az Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-04 10:42 PM
Response to Original message
10. Right and Wrong
You and I and many others form our opinions of right and wrong from a combination of factors. The fanatical followers of some religions believe themself to be incapable of determining right and wrong. They believe that these are defined by god and set down in the bible. Right and wrong for them are carved in stone. The idea that we determine our own right and wrong is an anethema to them.

Unfortunately it is often their own prejudices and biases that they rationalize into their interpretations from their texts. Finding verses to justify their biases within massive works. Like finding patterns in the clouds they find what they want in the weave of their religion.
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muffin_man Donating Member (128 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-04 10:46 PM
Response to Original message
12. I think it goes deeper than religion.
Do you think w/out the bible or Christ we would have less suffering or hypocrisy? If it was not Christ/Mohammad it would be Zeus or Ra that the evil was done in honor of, hell maybe even the sun! I think it just relaxes their conscious if they believe they are divine in their atrocity. I think any good that men try to do will become. hijacked by people with their own motives.(Think Greenpeace)Every major horror of history was committed in the name of an altruistic motive.(wolf in sheep's clothing) The worst butchers were the most sincere. They believed in the perfect society reached through the quill tine and the firing squad. No one questioned their right to murder since they were murdering for an altruistic purpose. It was accepted that man must be sacrificed for other men. A humanitarian who starts with declarations of love for mankind ends in a sea of blood. It will go on as long as men believe that an action is good solely because it is unselfish. That permits the altruist to act and forces his victims to bear it. I am not religious and yes religion has caused many problems but I believe Christians/Buddhist/Muslims/Jews etc have done more good than harm. Just saying if you were to ever fight the power start at the cause of it not the effect.
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snoochie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-04 11:19 PM
Response to Reply #12
18. Agreed
You're certainly right about any group being hijacked. Any of them. It's an inevitable tendency that needs to be guarded against. Maybe the problem is that those that seek power are more likely to be those who might be more easily corrupted. Is it possible that it is mainly a particular personality type that is drawn towards seeking positions of power (have to be extroverted, willful, etc.), and that those personalities may be more the type to behave in a self-serving manner?

Whatever it is you're right - power corrupts and those holding a lot of power, those heading the group, are likely to at one time or another to be corrupted.

I still have to hope we'll start recognizing the inevitability and seriousness of the situation and work on a method of avoiding the situation or at least making it easier to spot and remedy.
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Lalena Donating Member (45 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-04 11:09 PM
Response to Original message
14. Er...a.....Amen!
Between the hoopla over Mel Gibsons movie and the thinly veiled gay-bashing focused on denying couples the same recognition and protection that the majority of couples enjoy, I feel I am in the middle of a poorly scripted Twilight Zone. I read comments that the Passion of Christ is as it was rather than a movie with an agenda. Honestly, I think some people believe Mel videotaped those last hours of Jesus life. And the fundamentalists want to protect my marriage with a constitutional amendment that will permanently deny rights to a minority group. Hmmmwhat is going on? You would think we were in the middle of an election year.
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POed_Ex_Repub Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-04 11:13 PM
Response to Reply #14
15. Welcome to DU Lalena!
:hi:
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Lalena Donating Member (45 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-04 11:17 PM
Response to Reply #15
16. Thank you, it's good to be here.
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snoochie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-04 11:26 PM
Response to Reply #14
20. Yes not surprisingly it's being politicized to death
Edited on Sat Feb-28-04 11:27 PM by snoochie
What saddens and frustrates me is the flock's failure to notice or care.

It's predictable that the corrupt church leaders and pseudo-religious politicians would act this way. Those listening and following, though -- them I don't get. If they really believe they must be in deep, deep denial.

Oops on edit -- Welcome to DU! :hi:
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AWC Donating Member (4 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-04 11:18 PM
Response to Original message
17. Your rant on religion
Why is your obvious frustration focused on religion when the subject seems to actually be gay marriage and the fact that we don't live in a perfect world.
The purpose of marriage is to provide a familial bond and legal standing for the natural by-product of male/female relations. Many people (religious and otherwise) believe that it trivializes the institution to turn it into a vehicle for insurance benefits.
I also find it a little hard to believe that religious people don't care about issues such as children dying, AIDS, etc., as you seem to be implying. I'm not at all religious myself, but know many people who are, and based on my experiences they are very concerned about all the same issues you've touched on.
I'll reserve comment on your assertion that all the problems in the world are based on money. Mainly because I don't know what you mean by that, perhaps it's just another misplaced rant.
I'm betting that you're a fairly young person as you don't seem to remember that our last significant increase in the defense budget succeeded in turning thousands of nuclear warheads away from our cities, which is the primary purpose of government "To provide for the common defense".
I'd love to discuss all the points you listed, but time does not permit. I hope you feel better after venting, although you should consider dealing with the root cause.
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snoochie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-04 11:24 PM
Response to Reply #17
19. Welcome to DU
:hi:

But you are totally off base. My beef is not with gay marriage.

What is making me so irate is that it's a sin for a government / party / organized religion to be so FALSELY 'concerned' about marriage while they don't even MENTION these other, much more fundamental affronts against the way Jesus told us to live are going on.

It's not enough to be concerned. If these people were truly concerned they would not be voting for a man who makes a stink about marriage while God's children are DYING for lack of CHEAP MEDICINE. (I live in BUSH country.)

If you don't realize that the reason that children in third-world countries don't have access to potable water or affordable lifesaving medicines then I don't even know what to say to you about that. *sigh*

And yeah if 34 is young, I'm young. :)
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AWC Donating Member (4 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-04 11:51 PM
Response to Reply #19
21. Thanks for the welcome
I see now that the vocalization of your malaise is not against religion or governments current attention to gay marriage. It is actually because they haven't prioritized properly.
Here's a tip for you, you'll feel better if you try to look on the bright side once in a while.
Infant mortality rates have declined dramatically in my lifetime. Polio, measles and smallpox have been eradicated. Living conditions and average life expectancies throughout the world have greatly improved.
Is there more that can be done to improve the world? Yes
Will things get better? Yes
Will it happen on a timetable that you find acceptable? No
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Lars39 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-04 11:56 PM
Response to Reply #21
22. Riiiight.
Millions without jobs or unemployment benefits, losing their homes, not being able to afford insurance, infrastructure crumbling....yes, things have really improved under Bush. :eyes:
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AWC Donating Member (4 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-29-04 12:00 AM
Response to Reply #22
24. Bush????
I'm sorry, did I mention anything about Bush? I was talking from the perspective of the past 50 years. Everything you mentioned was even more true then than now.
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camero Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-29-04 12:03 AM
Response to Reply #24
26. Well
The current increase in defense spending has only gotten more nukes pointed at us. So it's counter-productive.

And welcome to DU. One more thing. Usually when people say it's a dog eat dog world, it's usually because they like it that way.
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AWC Donating Member (4 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-29-04 12:16 AM
Response to Reply #26
27. ??
More nukes pointed at us? I'd love to see your facts on that one.
Thanks for the welcome, I just recently discovered this forum and have been extremely entertained reading all the posts of gloom, doom, sorrow and misplaced frustrations.
I'm not sure what you're getting at with that 'dog eat dog world' statement, although I guess as long as you get it, it's probably quite clever.
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nini Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-29-04 12:29 AM
Response to Reply #27
28. You're entertained ?
I'm confused .. why are you here? Do you agree with the Dem point of view? If you do you would understand the frustrations, posts of gloom etc..


We're a frustrated pissed off group of people to see our country going to hell under the current administration. If this frustration is amusing I believe you are either a disruptor or much too judgmental for those who may not see things the way you do.

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camero Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-29-04 01:07 AM
Response to Reply #27
31. Oh dang
I missed it. Another one bites the dust. Dum dum.
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ScreamingMeemie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-28-04 11:59 PM
Response to Original message
23. An interesting conversation I had with a Catholic parent today.
He is completely against an ammendment to the Constitution. State constitutions or otherwise. When we begin to label all people as believing in one thing...this is where we begin to cause even more problems. The problem is not with religion, but with mindset. It always makes me sad to see this kind of thing. Don't label everyone.

Disclaimer: I am a hypocritical almost but not really Catholic. :hi:
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nini Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-29-04 12:03 AM
Response to Original message
25. I went to mass tonight and the sermon was about this - sort of.
Edited on Sun Feb-29-04 12:03 AM by nini
the priest went around the marriage issue a bit, but said we are to be judged on what we do for those who need help and if we ignore social issues such as poverty, sickness etc.. in the world we are missing the point of Christ's message. I took it as in other words worry about helping the poor, the sick, the persecuted and quit trying to tell others what to do in their lives.

As I have said before TRULY religious people who really GET the message don't judge others and will spend their energies helping others instead of trying to dictate the fundie side of religion down people's throats.

on edit: not all of us who are religious are bigots and freakshows like those you speak of. I can't stand those people either.
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AliceWonderland Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-29-04 12:35 AM
Response to Original message
29. I validate your rant
and was delivering the exact same rant earlier tonight, to SO. SO was delivering the exact same rant back at me. We were like a ranting echo chamber. There's so much crap coming down on our heads and I'm supposed to be morally outraged because someone wants to get *married*? It's absurd. This is what legislators are wasting their time on, preventing adults from getting *married*? They can set up a commission on people getting *married* double quick, but they can't have a rational investigation of 9-11 or drag Cheney's unaccountable ass in front of a hearing on energy policies? It's insane. These cretins better not lay a hand on MY constitution, I tell you what.

But it is more than religion. It's sleight of hand...and a calculated political ploy to attract those 70 million Left Behind readers who will head to the polls en masse, if they can break away from their discussions about whether your contact lenses and gold fillings go with you when the Rapture comes. It's religion as an aspect of politics, as opposed to any real religious doctrine.
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muffin_man Donating Member (128 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-29-04 01:01 AM
Response to Reply #29
30. You are correct.
The reason they force their beliefs is that they feel it is their responsibility to "save " everyone else and are compelled to act.Really not much different from being active politically! I mean you want people to go along w/your ideas because you believe them to be the correct way to do things.You want to enlighten people to universal health care/living wage and so on.You inform others, attempt to convert undecided/repub voters to your candidate.You want religion to stay in the background just as some want sexual orientation to stay in the background.Don't you find these similarities interesting? I just think political activist and religous zealots are sooo much alike.BTW I am not Christian, more of a anarchist/socialist if anything. Weird? I know its either all or nothing with me!
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Ladyhawk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-29-04 03:46 AM
Response to Original message
32. Rant Away
You've spoken a lot of things I'd like to say to certain people.
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