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Clark supporter here. I am backing Kerry now. Here is why.

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FDRLincoln Donating Member (947 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-14-04 06:53 PM
Original message
Clark supporter here. I am backing Kerry now. Here is why.
Well, the curse of FDRLincoln hits again. Since 1988, the candidate I decide to endorse in the primary always loses. I really liked Wes Clark this year, so of course as soon as I gave my formal endorsement last fall, he started dropping in the polls. :)

Anyhow, I've been trying to decide who to throw my support to. For those who might care about my thought process, here goes.

1) I am a moderate Democrat. I am socially liberal on most issues (gay rights), conservative on a few (gun control), and fiscally somewhat conservative (the huge deficit is really driving me nuts). I am not against capitalism and don't assume that all corporations are bad. At the same time, it is clear that government regulation of things like the environment and health care is necessary to ameliorate the failures of the free market in those departments. I had very mixed feelings about the Iraq war, but ultimately decided that it was morally questionable and strategically flawed, and that the Chimp Administration would botch the peace, which is exactly what has happened. I supported NAFTA in theory, but didn't like the treaty as written due to inadequate labor and environmental safeguards. I opposed MFN for China, and I believe we need to go slower with free trade.

In general, I am pragmatic and am suspicious of all ideology, left or right.

Looking at the candidates:

Dean: I appreciate his anger at Bush, but Dean has never really clicked with me. I've never quite understood why so many Dean supporters see him as such a man of the people...his family background is as blueblood as Kerry or Bush. Of course, being a blueblood does NOT mean that someone can't understand the problems of the underclass...look at FDR. Anyway, I think Dean's best service has been to remind the Democrats how to fight Bush. But I never really saw him as presidential or particularly electable.

Kerry: I originally supported Kerry until Clark got in. I was concerned that he wasn't fighting Bush hard enough. Well, he has been lately. I don't agree with all of Kerry's votes, but his voting record in general over the years is solid liberal, perhaps more liberal than i am in some respects. I've always seen him as someone with a measure of gravitas, and an aggressive Kerry should destroy Bush in a debate. Whearas some DUers think that Kerry's position on the war has been inconsistent and erratic, I give him some slack for this because in a real way it has mirrored mine: getting rid of Saddam was a good idea in theory, but it had to be done right, with lots of international support, with a ton of planning, with the right timing, and after AQ had been dealt with, not this neocon screw-the-world bullshit that we got stuck with.

Kucinich: This is the guy that I'd most like to sit down and have a conversation with. Unfortunately, he can't win, and too many of his policies are in the "sounds good on paper but impossible to put into effect given political reality" category. But on a personal level I really respect him.

Edwards: Like Dean, he's just never really clicked with me. I do find him more compelling than Dean, though, and do understand that other people see him as a great communicator.

Put it all together, and I'm going with Kerry. I think he has the best combination of gravitas, intellect, and political acumen. No disrespect is intended to anyone here who backs other candidates, and ALL of these guys would be better than Chimp.

I think Kerry will make an excellent president, and he'll make a fine candidate, too, IF he maintains his aggressive stance and doesn't back down in the face of Rovian attacks. I think Dean has done Kerry, the party, and the nation a great service by reminding people what it means to be a Democrat.

Flame if you wish, but I wanted to lay this out in case anyone else has had similar thoughts. I will support our nominee whoever it is.
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Momof1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-14-04 06:57 PM
Response to Original message
1. I am still voting for Clark
The media has annointed Kerry as the nominee, and I am fine with that. My vote will go to show Kerry that he needs Clark as VP. I don't care if he quit the race. He is the only one that I can vote for in the primary. And in November ABB.
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FDRLincoln Donating Member (947 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-14-04 06:58 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. no primary in my state
They cancelled the primary in my state, and I will be out of town during the district caucuses, so I couldn't vote for Clark anyhow. :(
But I'm sending my money to Kerry now. He will need it to fight Rove.
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Adelante Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-14-04 06:58 PM
Response to Original message
2. Kerry has Wes Clark watching his back
Good enough for me.

:toast:
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krkaufman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-14-04 07:21 PM
Response to Reply #2
14. Them boys make a heckuva photogenic pair. Nice pice. n/t
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mmonk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-14-04 07:01 PM
Response to Original message
4. Good choice
I've already made the transition.:toast:
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cdninRI Donating Member (13 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-14-04 07:02 PM
Response to Original message
5. Supporting Kerry
I,too, have been a supporter of Clark and due to the respect that I have for him will follow his lead and vote for Kerry. Ordinarily endorsements don't mean much to me but I do believe that Clark is endorsing the person he really believes will be able to beat *
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BootinUp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-14-04 07:03 PM
Response to Original message
6. We've been looking for you ;)
So you are the one :D

Well, I am alos pulling for Kerry. He is the most qualified of the remaining candidates. I will do what I can to help him win against Bush.
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PsychoDad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-14-04 07:04 PM
Response to Original message
7. Sorry...
I made a pledge to myself sometime back, after the Patriot act was passed, not to vote for any politician who had voted for the patriot act. Irregardless of supposed party.

Maybe if the VP is someone I can respect, who has not voted for the PA, then I will vote for the ticket.

But as I see it, Kerry voted for both the Patriot Act and the IWR. He was just a rubber stamp for the 2 most henious acts of legislation to come from the bush regeme :(

Just my opinion, go ahead and flame .
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poskonig Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-14-04 07:05 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. We'll forgive your inconsistency.
What would you rather have? Inconsistency or Bush? :pals:
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FDRLincoln Donating Member (947 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-14-04 07:08 PM
Response to Reply #7
11. i understand
I understand your concerns. I forgive Kerry for IWR...I might have voted for it too given the apparent lies that the admin told Congress.

Patriot I have a lot more problems with. There are some aspects of that legistlation that are OK, but much of it is open to massive abuse, and Ashcroft cannot be trusted.
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1monster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-14-04 07:23 PM
Response to Reply #11
16. Just remember, very few of our legislators in the House and the Senate
knew what was in that Patriot Act. Some of it was legitimate and was written by Senators and Representatives. But Ashcroft and his band of unmerry men threw in loads more, and the Patriot Act vote was pushed on to both the House and the Senate just after 9/11 and only a handful got to actually see the bill before it was passed.

While I believe that all of the memebers of the House and Senate should have insisted on holding out on a vote until they had time to review the bill, the reality of the situation was that after 9/11, to have insisted on that with the Bush Administration and the media hyping the immediate need for the Patriot Act, that bird had no wings to fly, didn't even have legs to hop....
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cdninRI Donating Member (13 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-14-04 07:09 PM
Response to Reply #7
12. Sorry ...
While agreeing with you regarding the Patriot Act, I am more concerned about the totality of someone's policies as opposed to a voting record on one or two bills. If you want to see the Patriot Act repealed do you truly think that will happen if * is voted back in?
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PsychoDad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-14-04 07:20 PM
Response to Reply #12
13. Will it be repealed if Kerry is voted in?
If Kerry would call for the repeal of the PA, or the Democratic Party were to make the repeal/Major overhaul of the PA part of it's platform, I would vote for Kerry.

But honestly, I don't know if the Democratic Party even wants to repeal the PA. Where does Kerry/The Democrats stand on this? Think it will be part of the platform ?

You can be assured I won't vote for bush. :(

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DjTj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-14-04 07:27 PM
Response to Reply #13
17. The sunset provision repeals the worst parts of the Patriot Act in 2005.
Bush wants to renew them and any Democrat will allow them to expire.

The platform is simply to follow the law and let those provisions expire. Nobody needs to do anything.
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PsychoDad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-14-04 07:43 PM
Response to Reply #17
19. Ah, ok, I see...
Edited on Sat Feb-14-04 07:50 PM by PsychoDad
(Edited to add a question)
Thanks for clearing that up.

Can a Repug controled House/Senate move to make it perminant? Would there be any or enough Dem opposition to prevent it, and if not, Do we know it would be veto'd by Kerry?
Some sort of assurance from Kerry or the Party would be nice ...
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NNN0LHI Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-14-04 08:34 PM
Response to Reply #19
21. Let me give my thoughts on your concern
If a Dem wins in November and is the one appointing the Attorney General who would be enforcing the PA even a Republican controlled Congress will be all for allowing it to sunset. But as long as they have their own AG (Ashcroft) who is appointed by Bush using this act against you and me they will want to keep it. That is the truth too. So my advice would be to make your vote count this November.

Don

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Tinoire Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-14-04 07:40 PM
Response to Reply #7
18. I remember the time when most DUers made that same pledge
after having been very active phoning & faxing & writing & begging and pleading with them to represent us on those issues.

They laughed in our faces and voted anyway.

Kerry's vote is particularly unforgivable because Scott Ritter personally sent him information on NO WMDs in Iraq. Kerry was not misled. No more than Bush & Cheney are trying to claim that they were.

I am sorry and penitent that I had forgotten that pledge for a moment and considered Kerry. I plead temporary insanity.

You will get no flames from me.
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MrSlayer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-14-04 07:06 PM
Response to Original message
9. I'm with you on this.
I'm behind Kerry too and am hoping for Kerry/Clark.
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Piperay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-14-04 07:06 PM
Response to Original message
10. I'm supporting Kerry now too
but I'm still voting for Clark in the CA primary because I would feel disloyal to him if I didn't. I would vote for Kerry in the primary if I thought he really need the vote but I think he has the nomination all but sewn up. :-)
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mot78 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-14-04 07:23 PM
Response to Original message
15. My primary vote is non-transferable
I'll either vote for Clark in my state (NY) or stay home. But I will vote for the eventual nominee.
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Bread and Circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-14-04 07:53 PM
Response to Original message
20. Thanks for cursing Clark :P
Just kiddin'

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