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Nader's running. His long response to The Nation and their reply.

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flpoljunkie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 08:54 AM
Original message
Nader's running. His long response to The Nation and their reply.
http://www.thenation.com/doc.mhtml?i=20040308&s=exchange

Read it all, if you can stand it. The man is a bitter, egomaniacal loser who refuses to see the damage he did in 2000--97,488 votes for Nader in Florida, after his own organization implored him not to go to states where the election was too close to call on the eve of the voting.

There are no issues he could bring to the fore that are not already being discussed by our own Democratic candidates. This is totally disingenuous, Ralph Nader.
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Mari333 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 08:58 AM
Response to Original message
1. God, he must be living a comfotable life and doesnt have a kid in Iraq
if he does.


ABB or you are GOP.
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onebigbadwulf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 09:02 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. Blame the democrats for betraying their base
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Guava Jelly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 09:04 AM
Response to Reply #2
3. How by reselecting bush in 04
masochism at its finest.
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onebigbadwulf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 09:12 AM
Response to Reply #3
5. There has to be some punishment for betrayal
and this is it.
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Dookus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 09:18 AM
Response to Reply #5
9. Nonsense
there's no evidence that pandering to the far left fringe gets more votes than it loses.

The notion that we deserve punishment above and beyond the current Bush administration is also laughable.
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nightperson Donating Member (550 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 10:08 AM
Response to Reply #9
20. Some people are more into "punishment" than others.
Edited on Sat Feb-21-04 10:09 AM by secondtermdenier
Not my cup of tea, but hey, different strokes...:P . Who am I to cast stones? Oh wait, we're talking about politics!
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snippy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 09:38 AM
Response to Reply #5
13. Is that a Stalin quote?
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Kahuna Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 09:47 AM
Response to Reply #5
15. You are not the entire base. You don't speak for the base.
The base is speaking right now during the primary process. THAT'S the "base."
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nightperson Donating Member (550 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 10:11 AM
Response to Reply #15
21. Kerry has refuckingclaimed
the hijacked words "base" and "grassroots".
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snippy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 09:06 AM
Response to Original message
4. Nader appears to be almost on a par with Bush when it comes to lying.
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mhr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 09:12 AM
Response to Original message
6. I Disagree, There Is Only One Candidate Speaking To These Issues
That is Representative Dennis Kucinich.

The DLC has marginalized Kucinich, Sharpton, and now Dean.

Politics is dirty business.

The sooner the DLC is ousted the sooner average working Americans are represented properly by the supposed party of the people.
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LandOLincoln Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 09:57 AM
Response to Reply #6
17. And that would be the Republican Party, I assume?
"The sooner the DLC is ousted the sooner average working Americans are represented properly by the supposed party of the people."


Do me a favor. Look up the word "megalomania" and then get back to us. Thanks.
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patricia92243 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 09:13 AM
Response to Original message
7. He was not even on the ballot in NC - all he could do was make other state
lose to Bush.

If he loved his country as much as he loves himself - he would do everything within his power to see Bush out of office.

Wonder how much "under the table" money and votes he will get from Pubs to ensure he runs?

Disgusting, utterly disgusting!!

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snippy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 09:24 AM
Response to Reply #7
10. Nader loves his money more than he loves his country.
Nader always has used his position to amass and protect his personal fortune. When questioned about the apparent hypocrisy of owning a porfolio worth millions while complaining of coporate abuses Nader responded by saying that the question should be why aren't his stocks worth even more.
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The Zanti Regent Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 09:29 AM
Response to Reply #10
11. Here's the proof that Phony Ralph Love$ hi$ money!
Edited on Sat Feb-21-04 09:29 AM by The Zanti Regent
http://www.realchange.org/nader.htm#money

Amassing millions of dollars and playing the stock market with it:
Unlike almost every other nonprofit organization, Nader's various groups often amass a nontaxable profit of several hundred thousand dollars per year, and have rapidly build up impressive net worth's -- which Ralph refuses to reveal in his annual reports. (His lame reply is that people who are interested can get the information by getting every year's annual report and doing the math. So much for openness.)

The book "Abuse of Trust" carefully documents the money amassed and stocks played for 6 major groups, including Public Citizen, Inc. and the Center for the Study of Responsive Law, his two largest groups. Public Citizen, Inc., in particular, amassed money so quickly that it bought an old FBI building for $1.25 million IN CASH in 1980, only its eighth year of existence.

One reason he may hide his ample cash reserves -- besides the fact that people may not want to give him more money -- is that he is fond of playing the stock market with that green. (He also uses surpluses from his most flush organizations, usually the tax deductible ones, to give grants to his other groups.) Some of these transactions appear reckless for a nonprofit, "public interest" group; others skirt the edges of insider trading and conflict of interest. Mostly, it seems that all this money was a toy that Nader enjoyed playing with, especially as his winnings increased his power, fame and influence.

For example, the Nader is the president and treasurer of the Public Safety Research Institute. In 1970 alone, PSRI traded on the stock market 67 times, buying and selling $750,000 worth of stock, though the organization only had $150,000 worth of assets. These trades included a number of short sales, high risk and tricky transactions. Some worked, some lost money. In later years, PSRI traded less, for a good reason -- the IRS audited them after 1970 and charged the organization with "churning", excessive stock trades whose risk threatens the charitable purposes of the organization. It paid a fine and did not contest the charge. Thereafter, PSRI continued to play the market with fewer, generally long positions. Likewise, the Safety Systems Foundation (SSF) -- run by Nader's sister, and entirely funded by him personally -- engaged in a number of stock and bond transactions in the late 1960s and early 1970s. It was also fined by the IRS and paid without contest.

Several of these trades were poised to take advantage of Nader's activities, by selling short the stock of companies Nader's groups attacked, or buying stock of their competitors. In 1973, PSRI bought stock in Allied Chemical, the primary manufacturer of airbags, on the very day before GM announced they would offer optional airbags on 1974 models. PSRI made a 12.5% profit in 3 and a half months. In 1976, PSRI and the SSF bought stock in Goodyear just as the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration -- then run by former top Nader aide Joan Claybrook -- announced an investigation of the Firestone 500 series of steel-belted radials. The 2 organizations held onto the stock for 2 years until there was a recall, and Firestone -- Goodyear's major competitor -- suffered.

In 1970, IT&T attempted to merge with the Hartford Fire Insurance Company. Nader filed a 50 page brief attacking the merger, then SSF sold IT&T stock short. It made almost 10% on its money in 6 DAYS, then closed its position two days before the merger was approved. When pressed by a reporter, Nader said the timing was "mere coincidence" and said he had no control over the investment. However, his sister Laura Nader Millerson was the sole trustee of SSF throughout its existence, and Nader was the sole contributor.

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charlie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 09:14 AM
Response to Original message
8. He didn't say he was running n/t
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leftwingpunkrocker Donating Member (24 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 09:33 AM
Response to Reply #8
12. Hey I have an idea
Let's make him one of the top 10 conservative idiots, just for the fact that he's gonna help the Bash cartel win reelection
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snippy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 09:41 AM
Response to Reply #12
14. Nader will have very little, if any, impact on the election.
Nearly every election involving an incumbent is a referendum on the incumbent. This election will be no different. It definitely will be a referendum on Bush. The three main issues will be the economy, the invasion and occupation of Iraq, and Bush's incessant and compulsive lying. These issues will determine 10 to 15 million votes. Nader's vote totals will be much lower than in 2000 and insignificant.

Since 9/11 Bush has been in a steady down trend with the occasional bump. Bush's decline in the polls is nothing other than the American people looking at and listening to Bush and realizing that he is an incompetent liar. Day by day and voter by voter, Bush himself is convincing the American people that he should not be president. If the trend since 9/11 continues, Bush will lose badly. If the trend reverses soon enough, Bush will win easily. Nader will not be a factor in voters' perceptions of Bush.

Between now and November Bush will continue to lie at every opportunity about every subject on which he speaks. Between now and November, Bush will continue to demonstrate his incompetence. Between now and November Bush will continue to demonstrate his Fecal Midas Touch. Bush can benefit only from what happens to the economy and Iraq between now and November. Those issues, not Nader, may or may not change the trend for Bush.
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LandOLincoln Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 10:02 AM
Response to Reply #14
18. I hope you're right, but I've always believed it prudent to
hope for the best while preparing for the worst. In another close election--and I'm afraid this one will be very close--Nader could very well tip it to BushCo.

Again.

Deliberately.

Again.
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Iverson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 09:53 AM
Response to Original message
16. Why bother with that silly reading and thinking!
It only impedes unquestioning loyalty.

:eyes:
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charlie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 10:05 AM
Response to Reply #16
19. Shaddup
You WILL cherish your right to vote for whom you're told to. Don't punk out on us.

I've got my eye on you.
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fishnfla Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 10:13 AM
Response to Original message
22. He's running to prove the validity of a thrid party candidate
that seems to be his only issue.

I wonder what his stand is on education, because I learned in 6th grade an educated writer does not split a prepositional phrase.
"To so walk" Jaysus, whats that, valleygirl speak?
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OneBlueSky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 03:10 PM
Response to Original message
23. why get bent out of shape about Nader?
no one with half a brain is going to vote for him this time around, and his showing in November will be miniscule . . . whatever influence he has will be so diminished by this stunt that he'll never be taken seriously again . . . just ignore him . . . I know the voters will . . .
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Skidmore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-21-04 03:16 PM
Response to Reply #23
24. Unfortunately, some with half a brain will vote for him
this time.
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