House Dems to rebrand the Public Option as Medicare Part E

[denem]

The Hill: “Say hello to 'Medicare Part E'... Medicare for Everyone", following up LBN:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=4112740&mesg_id=4112740.

One of the consequences of Pelosi's robust 'Public Option' is a scalpel to cut through the 'Public Option' fog. From The Hill-

Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) planned to unveil a proposal to her caucus Tuesday night that would include the public option favored by liberals in the healthcare bill Democrats want to bring to the floor, according to two House sources.

The plan, called the “robust” option or “Medicare Plus 5” in the jargon that has emerged on Capitol Hill, ties provider reimbursement rates to Medicare, adding 5 percent. Leaders are planning to roll the bill out next week, and are hoping to vote the first week in November. http://thehill.com/homenews/house/64029-medicare-for-everyone.

It's a small leap from “Medicare Plus 5” to Medicare Part E but a bigger step politically towards keeping the Public Option, such as it is, intact.

The idea has bubbled up among House Democrats and leaders in the past week, most prominently in a caucus meeting last Thursday.

Rep. Mike Ross (D-Ark.) spoke out last week in favor of re-branding the public option as Medicare, startling many because he has loudly proclaimed his opposition to a public option.

Rep. Jim Oberstar (D-Minn.), the veteran chairman of the House Transportation Committee, also voiced his support, as did House Majority Whip James Clyburn (D-S.C.).

The rebranding does not alter the limitations of the Public Option, but changes the game. How long until the electorate demands that Medicare Part E truly becomes available to anyone who wants it?

And, BTW, just how long have DUers been talking about 'Part E'?

[mikelgb]

1. Wow Dennis Kucinich talking points gaining ground?

yippie!

I guess I shouldn't have said anything, if people realized it is Dennis' idea they will immediately realize it is unelectable.

[ProSense]

2. Remember when he said the public option was doomed?

Reminder

[Cha]

27. Yes, and I'm sure he brought more

than a few people down with that.

[vaberella]

49. Not really from what I know. But it does sound like the words of Dean on this. Link below:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=385x391530

[slipslidingaway]

51. Kucincih 2004 - calling for "a new Medicare, Part E (for Everyone)

but he actually wants it for everyone.

:)

http://www.gwu.edu/~action/2004/kucinich.html

"...He advocates universal health care, calling for "a new Medicare, Part E (for Everyone) which will relieve the suffering and uncertainty of 44,000,000 Americans who currently have no health coverage and the economic pain of those who are paying exorbitant rates for their health insurance."

[tk2kewl]

3. K&R

this thread should become the most recommended

[mopinko]

4. that's so smart.

way to go.

[NRaleighLiberal]

5. Thom Hartmann must be having a chuckle on this one...heard this idea on his show months ago

[DrToast]

17. That term has been around a while

I don't think Thom Hartmann has any special connection to it.

[Lochloosa]

30. He has been pushing it for a while.

[denem]

6. Who's pulling the plug on Grandma now? heh.

(again from LBN)

[Beetwasher]

7. *Snicker* The Boom Comes Down

Suck on that Repubs. :rofl:

[zulchzulu]

8. Didn't I say this a month ago?

Rebranding the Public Option has been a necessity for months.

Here:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=132&topic_id=8677934

[uponit7771]

32. Yes you did, I remember reading it. Do you work for the WH? :-)

[TheCoxwain]

9. Brilliant stroke !!!!

[high density]

10. That's great

Now we just have to hope that this "Part E" option lives up to the Medicare name.

[ipaint]

11. They are lying.

That is manipulative and dishonest.

The public option is not anything like medicare.

Extremely limited enrollment. No subsidies. Competes directly with private ins on their terms. Will be expected to serve the sickest people (most unprofitable people) that the ins. co's dump into it and be self sustaining.

Lying for the ins. companies.

[denem]

12. As I said it "does not alter the limitations of the Public Option"

but transforms the political dynamics.

[ProSense]

13. No

they are not

"Extremely limited enrollment"?

Medicare started with limited enrollment and is still limited.

[ipaint]

21. Another lie

Medicare was open from day one to all of the elderly 65 and above exactly the population it was designed for. It wasn't limited to a small percentage of those 65 and over too broke to buy private ins. It did not subsidize private insurance in direct competition with it nor did it require the program to be self sustaining with no government subsidies.

Today we have a public option which is supposed to be designed to be a government option to private insurance for anyone. What we get is enrollment limited to approx 10 million after 10 years, no subsidies and direct cutthroat competition form private insurers.

And now they have the balls to lie and call it medicare part e to somehow fool the dlc to vote for it. People believe this crap? It's to fool us, americans, people who believe this whole clusterfuck is actually about health care reform, people who bought the hope meme hook line and sinker, people who believe obama is on "their" side.

The truth is a real robust public option looks nothing like what is any of the current bills. If it did the stock market and our representative's health industry investments would reflect the massive hit it would be taking as a result of the government putting collective citizen health above profit.

[denem]

23. Medicare rates + 5% cuts throats all by itself.

[ProSense]

24. " Medicare was open from day one to all of the elderly...the population it was designed for."

Hacker mentions holes, note: Kerry Pushes to End Discrimination in Medicare

And the difference between the current plan and Medicare is that the current bills specifically include expanding availability, and this will be the first time ever that the U.S. has a national health care plan.

[ipaint]

28. I am referring to how many people were included in the program on day one

which you compared to the extremely limited public option now proposed.
And as far as the promised expanded availability. Do it now because none of them can be trusted to do it later.
Put up or shut up.

[ProSense]

33. Your claim is nonsensical. Medicare was a limited program no matter how you slice it.

It's completely ridiculous to claim that Medicare was a more open program than the current reform. It was limited to those over a certain age, and the current bill will provide health care coverage as much as 97 percent of the population.

Comparison: Medicare day one was limited to about 19 million Americans. A public option, at mininum, will be available to more than 16 million Americans in the first year, expanding to more Americans in subsequent years.

There is no comparison. Saying medicare should be open to all doesn't mean that was ever the case.

Bottom line: American will for the first time have universal health care.

Period.

[ipaint]

36. That's because it was designed for 19 million americans and unless you can show

me it was designed to cover everyone from day one by first just covering 19 million your argument is shit.

The 16 million number is the people the current proposed public options leave uninsured (hr 3200), the help bill leaves 34 million uninsured.


How many uninsured 65 year olds and up did medicare leave behind in 1965?

[ProSense]

44. "the help bill leaves 34 million uninsured. " What?

The other 30 million plus will not be uninsured. They are people who work and cannot afford insurance. They will be receive credits and subsidies up to as much as 400% of the FPL. At the low end, some will pay nothing.

[ipaint]

46. cbo estimate of uninsured in 2019 with HELP bill 34 million.

The CBO score says that the HELP bill will cover 21 million more people. But in 2019, CBO estimates that we'll have 34 million uninsured.

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/ezra-klein/2009/07/the_congressional_budget_offic_1.html

[bvar22]

29. +1 for the TRUTH.

This "rebranding" is deliberately deceptive.


To hear the House Leadership supporting this idea only makes me trust them LESS.
The "Public Option" the House has put together in HR 3200 in no way resembles Medicare.
To "borrow" the Medicare label and out it on their plan to transfer BILLIONS of PUBLIC DOLLARS to the For Profit Health Insurance Industry is shameful.


Thom Hartmann HAS written an editorial calling for Medicare Part E.
Only Hartmann's plan is Medicare for Everybody.

Of course, the low information voters WILL be fooled by the deceptive change in packaging.
Too bad The Democratic Leadership isn't interested in changing the contents of the package so that the "Medicare" label would be more appropriate.


http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x6809439

[slipslidingaway]

56. Excellent points! n/t

[inna]

58. thank you for making these critically important points,

i wish i could rec this post!

[Garam_Masala]

72. The best post of the day.......+1

You are absolutely correct that medicare did not leave a single person over 65 behind.
Even those in very high income brackets!

To call it medicare part E with 34 million UNinsured per CBO is an insult to the
term MEDICARE.

[Kermitt Gribble]

15. I agree.

The purpose of this is nothing more than to make people think the public option = Medicare. Instead of trying to re-brand the 'public option' as Medicare, why not just make Medicare the public option?

[denem]

16. The purpose of the rebranding is to get the bill through Congress.

Why not get on the phone and have a word with Lieberman, for example.

[Kermitt Gribble]

19. That's what they want you to think.

The current versions of the 'public option' are just a place for the ins cos to dump their unprofitable clients. Once the dog and pony show has gone on long enough, all the good little blue doggies will jump on board the public option illusion - classic good cop/bad cop routine to make us think they are actually doing something for us. Don't you question why they won't open enrollment to the public option to everyone?

[denem]

20. I already said "How long until the electorate demands that Medicare Part E" is available to all?

You and I know 'why they won't open enrollment to the public option to everyone?'. There not the votes for it, and indeed, many 'no' votes have been bought and paid for in full.

[slipslidingaway]

55. Polls going back to the 80's have suggested that the public wants...

a national health care system, but the Dems keep ignoring the people.

[phleshdef]

22. Get the damn program established, thats the hard part, make it better later.

Worked for social security. God people need to be rational and realistic.

[slipslidingaway]

52. I agree, it was a bad idea when Olbermann suggested it and a ...

bad idea today.

What happens when the people find out they have been fooled by a slogan.

:shrug:

[change_notfinetuning]

66. They realize that "Morning in America" (Reagan's slogan) should have been

MOURNING for America.

[slipslidingaway]

68. Yes, mourning for the 122 people who died today while they...

fool around trying to deceive the people with a new name.

:grr:

[Arkana]

14. Hah. Rebranding it as Medicare?

If it gets the Blue Dogs on board, I don't care if they call it "Pink Bagel Electric Boogaloo."

[Engineer4Obama]

54. Keep your guberment hands off my Pink Bagel Electric Boogaloo!

[Clio the Leo]

18. Someone needs to tell Nancy that the President hates PO.....

.... WHY OH WHY cant we get a Speaker and a President who can actually GET ALONG with one another!!!!



CLEARLY their personal battles are bringing the country down!!! lol


(I think they're performing a duet for "West Side Story" in this one)

If ONLY she would be more supportive of the President ....


And maybe if they could see eye to eye....


.... THEN she would know that that President doesn't want a PO in the final bill. Right? I mean, why else would she be openly trying to fight against the President's PO-hating agenda?

(major :sarcasm: )

No, the REAL problem is that Rahm and Nancy dont get along.

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_okSIvb7zcQE/SOdf-4nehVI/AAAAAAAACtk/coVg-c9lHTQ/s400/Rahm+Emanuel+.jpg

;)

[Enrique]

34. or she might be willing to fight him

or she might be trying to get him on board.

Or it's also possible that he's already on board. That would be the best scenario.

[Clio the Leo]

35. We're like babies playing peekaboo sometimes aren't we?

If we cant SEE it, then we presume it's not happening.

[ipaint]

37. Your right.

Babies have no knowledge of history. They can't see the mistakes in the past, learn from them and avoid them. They don't have a clue as to the number of unfullfilled promises have been made "just to get something passed" that never get a backward glance post vote.

Babies trust authority. Some eventually learn some don't.

[Clio the Leo]

40. But even the youngest baby knows.....

..... there's no practical way to get more progressive health care legislation passed in Congress. Again and again and again I've asked for an explanation as to how that could possibly happen. All I get are idealistic responses that the President, Sen Reid, whomever should "man up." I cant even begin to imagine how one might "man up" under the rules of parliamentary procedure. I get a lot of rhetoric, not much practical application.

But I'm an open minded sort .... and like the President, I'm all ears.

[ipaint]

43. At some point if it ever happens it will be because we collectively demand it.

It's as simple as that. I was hoping obama would be the type of leader who understood that power comes from us not corporations in a real democracy and use it to force change.
That wasn't the case. We are left on the sidelines with confusing, impossibly complicated policies that change daily.
Convince folks their perpetual victims of corporate control and they act like it.

We have no farther right to go. How can you negotiate when you already are conservatives as a result of 40 years of bipartisanship and concessions. We will get a conservative bill because we will settle for a conservative bill.

And we will continue to make the same conservative mistakes that will hurt/punish the same lower classes of people.

Until we learn.

[Clio the Leo]

53. So you think the guy who was elected using $50 campaign donations....

..... doesn't understand that power comes from the people? The one who said on election night, "this was never about me." huh?

Ok, lets try this again ..... regardless of why we're in this current condidtion, we have members of Congress who, despite what some national poll says, truly believe that if they support a public option they will be out of a job next year. That's a basic human motivator. It doesn't matter that people in New York and California are DEMANDING a public option, because the population of Hooterville, the people who elect them, thinks that it's a "socialistic" program. They dont like the President because they think he MAY be a government operative from another country. So you have that person on the phone and YOU want them to vote in favor of single payer or a "robust" public option or whatever. How do you convince them?

Go.......... ;)

[ipaint]

60. The guy who was elected was $upported by goldman sachs.

and the financial industry. Our support was great PR.


As far as your what if exercise, a version of this question was asked a few months ago by another fervent obama fan. Having watched this whole fiasco play out exactly as I thought it would I am more convinced than ever that if Obama had come out in the beginning and used his considerable organization in every community and turned office space into community health care reform information and education locations and set out to specifically educate the public with weekly televised comparisons of each country currently offering universal care, including experts and citizens from each country, exploring the pros and cons, ending with our current private health insurance system (let them sell their own product to us) and then what he feels is the best approach to reform, set up a website and telephones to educate and answer folks questions and concerns on different plans and approaches, had involved all of us in our health care future instead of having us sit on the sidelines sick, desperate and scared, waiting for the elite and ins. co's to decide our futures, we would have a very different outcome.

The majority of people want some kind of universal system now, with info, education and a look at other countries and a call to be involved, to participate we could have demanded true reform. the politicians would have no choice. The 18-20% of the lunatic fringe would just get dragged along kicking and screaming. They'll shut up as soon as they start benefiting because it is all being selfish for them. And if politicians decided to block reform what opportunity and momentum to get rid of them. We just can't afford to hide the rot behind faux reform any longer.

I thought Obama was about involving us, calling us to participate, and most of all after listening to the horror stories from folks for 2 years on the campaign trail I thought he was about NOT leaving 34 million uninsured americans by the wayside.


I was wrong.

[Clio the Leo]

62. Well, I dont work for Goldman Sachs.....

..... neither do all the people I know who scraped their loose change together and gave a little each week. The total number of individual donors was unprecedented, period.

As for your health care info offices ..... if they could have withstood the wingnut outrage ("Obama is settin' up indoctrination centers!!!"), they would have been a good idea ...... but he would have paid for it how exactly?

[ipaint]

67. By looking at the different option's in other countries and pricing them

if they were implemented in this country. Other countries have single payer. We already know how to pay for that. Canada does quite well covering everyone for about $50.00 a month per person. We could have found out exactly how the swiss control private ins. and how the netherlands redistributes the profits of private ins to plans that cover more sick people. We could have educated people about the amount and strength of regulations to keep private ins. in line and we could have told everyone about taiwan and how they instituted universal care in 6 years by comparing all countries and choosing the best of the plans as their own.
Most importantly people would feel involved, committed and invested in getting the best plan possible for everyone. My guess is 34 million uninsured would never be an acceptable result of reform ever again.

And the wingnut outrage was minor, and completely blown up for the benefit of tv ratings. Plus you give people something to fight for the wingnuts wouldn't have had a chance. The wingnuts took over because intelligently and effectively fighting for a 1500+ page reform bill with a constantly reframed and redefined, now you see it now you don't public option is impossible.

If you mean how do they pay for for the community outreach, how do they pay for the websites they have now, use some stimulus money and invest in educating everyone about healthcare, invest in people as if they are worth more than what they do for a living.

[Clio the Leo]

70. Yes, I was asking about the community outreach.....

.... the cost of running a website are microscopic compared to what you seem to be proposing (which was a good idea in and of itself.) .... I also think he'd have a hard time justifying spending federal $$ on what was, essentially, a policy lobbying effort. I'm certainly not away of any other government agency, supervised by the executive branch that LOBBIES for the President's policy ideas.

It could be done under OFA, but that gets us back to those campaign contributions, doesn't it. ;)

[riderinthestorm]

65. I gave a practical application on another thread to you.

The Admin has to start putting pressure on the hold-outs.

Obama sits down with Blanche Lincoln (for example) and tells her that if she doesn't support his health care reform measures including a public option he will campaign against her. He will direct all funds to her opponent. He will tell Harry Reid to quietly work behind the scenes to make Blanche Lincoln into a nobody with no clout. He can do this over a lovely luncheon if you prefer him to be nice.

But he needs to make it clear to her that she WILL be out of office, and he will make it happen if she doesn't support him on this.He can do this. He has the political ability to direct the DLC to channel the funds exactly where they need to go. Furthermore, he could go all "Rove" and use whatever dark shit has been dug up by his oppo team. Obama knows how to do that. He's done it before with Jack Ryan to get his Senate seat and he's not above going to the dark side to do it.

See, that's not a "Rove" tactic. Chicagoans know that as politics as usual. Frankly, it doesn't even have to be Obama who does this. I suspect Rahm Emmanual channels George HW Bush's advance man, James Baker - a truly scary dude, in intensity and fear factor.

[Clio the Leo]

71. Good grief....

.... I'm glad he's not using that tactic with Iran.

There'd be a big irradiated hole in the Earth where the middle east used to be.

[Enrique]

38. I hope Obama is committed to the PO behind the scenes

there have been a couple of reports that this is the case.

[denem]

39. Obama is avoiding the specter of 'HillaryCare'

IMO. He actually believes the Legislature should legislate, and expressed his preferences.

[Clio the Leo]

42. Axelrod seems to think so.....

“I think his time is better spent on this particular issue in conversation with members and in talking to his own advisers and instructing them on how to proceed,” David Axelrod, senior adviser to the president, said in an interview Tuesday. “That’s the phase that we’re in.”


http://www.nytimes.com/2009/10/21/us/21memo.html?hpw

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

25. They don't need to re-brand anything. The public option is already popular among the American public

They need to re-brand themselves by getting some balls!!

[denem]

26. "Medicare won't pull the plug on granny" - particularly popular amongst LIV

[riderinthestorm]

31. Heh. Thom Hartmann's gonna have a field day with this. nt

[lunatica]

41. He's been advocating Medicare part E for a long time.

I immediately thought of him!

[emulatorloo]

45. very good strategy. n/t

[grantcart]

47. Part E = for everyone.

[ipaint]

61. Link? n/t

[denem]

63. Link

http://thehill.com/homenews/house/64029-medicare-for-everyone

It's still just the public option, with all it's well flagged limitations, except that it ties reimbursement rates to Medicare.

[polichick]

48. Gosh, it took 'em long enough - but it's a good thing! nt

[Hekate]

50. I called my Rep's office and chatted to an aide about it; also one Sen.'s aide...

... never could get through to the other Senator's office. Neither had heard the term yet, so I filled them in like a good DUer.

It's just a great reframing and long overdue.

Hekate

[1776Forever]

57. Finally someone has woke up the truth seekers! I will believe it when it passes but WOW!

The time is Now!
:fistbump:

[JNelson6563]

59. Excellent strategy.

Call it what is needed to get it passed. If it happens to infer it covers everyone, all the better. If if says it will cover all and all expect it, imagine how fast it will happen. Ok, big fanfare, bill passes, signed into law. People start finding out they aren't covered, the shit hits the fan, Congress ponies up lickety split or they will be sorry and they know it.

Brilliant.

Julie

[eridani]

64. I don't give a flying fuck what they call it--just let us have it in 2010

Voluntary enrollment in existing Medicare, period.

[David Zephyr]

69. Kucinich said this was how to do it and Harman is on the radio saying this is how to do it.

And Pelosi may just pull this off.